why guns help

**cjp85** · 04-15-2005, 10:45 PM

Originally Posted by Lozgod

Criminals will always be here, why arm them?

So will people who desire freedom, why deprive them for something they are not guilty of?

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 10:45 PM

Originally Posted by Juddman

Point is, he wanted to hurt you and he was willing to use a weapon. It could have been a bow and arrow, that better?

I doubt he could walk the streets with a bow and arrow without concealing it. I have nothing against shotguns for instance because they are used in sigfigantly less crimes because they are hard to conceal.

**BARLOW** · 04-15-2005, 10:45 PM

or maybe a spiked club or a sock with a padlock in it...... its not the guns fault.....

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 10:45 PM

Originally Posted by cjp85

So will people who desire freedom, why deprive them for something they are not guilty of?

Because human life is more important than a right that is ultimately causing more harm than good.

**BARLOW** · 04-15-2005, 10:46 PM

people always gotta have something to blame, why cant they just accept the fact humans do everything.........

**juicehoe** · 04-15-2005, 10:46 PM

That has everything to do with it... its the point that without a land border the logistics of moving large quantities of objects is very hard undetected. What does shooting someone or being shot have anything to do with the law? Your making your account a personal one and making it apply to everyone.

Originally Posted by Lozgod

Well that has nothing to do with it, but I will entertain it for you anyway. It is a FACT that most guns involved in gun related crime are once legally registered guns. You can talk about all the borders you want. Doesn't change the fact. Ever been shot? Ever shoot anyone?

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 10:47 PM

Originally Posted by BARLOW

or maybe a spiked club or a sock with a padlock in it...... its not the guns fault.....

I would rather get hit with a lock in a sock that shot.

**Juddman** · 04-15-2005, 10:47 PM

Originally Posted by Lozgod

I doubt he could walk the streets with a bow and arrow without concealing it. I have nothing against shotguns for instance because they are used in sigfigantly less crimes because they are hard to conceal.

For God's sake man, my point is the weapon can be found and used, regardless of what the weapon is. A taser gun, a cattle prodder, a poison pen...you know what I'm trying to say.

**cjp85** · 04-15-2005, 10:47 PM

Originally Posted by Lozgod

Because human life is more important than a right that is ultimately causing more harm than good.

What good is life if you are a sheep?

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 10:48 PM

Originally Posted by juicehoe

That has everything to do with it... its the point that without a land border the logistics of moving large quantities of objects is very hard undetected. What does shooting someone or being shot have anything to do with the law? Your making your account a personal one and making it apply to everyone.

Explain the lack of gun violence in Sweden, Holland, Japan, etc. etc., there are plenty of countries that lack gun crime that are connected to each other.

**BARLOW** · 04-15-2005, 10:49 PM

people kill people
a coyote eats a rabbit, dont see people bitchin about that!
its nature's circle.........

**BARLOW** · 04-15-2005, 10:49 PM

Originally Posted by Lozgod

Explain the lack of gun violence in Sweden, Holland, Japan, etc. etc., there are plenty of countries that lack gun crime that are connected to each other.

explain the rise in assault and people being beat to death without a firearm?

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 10:50 PM

Originally Posted by cjp85

What good is life if you are a sheep?

Not having a gun makes you feel like a sheep? Guns aren't your problem.

So is the government controlling child molesters too by making that illegal?

**juicehoe** · 04-15-2005, 10:50 PM

Ever hear of bonny and clyde? They used shot guns and had them under their coats? Guess u never heard of a pistol grip and a sawed off shotgun either as they can be rather small

Originally Posted by Lozgod

I doubt he could walk the streets with a bow and arrow without concealing it. I have nothing against shotguns for instance because they are used in sigfigantly less crimes because they are hard to conceal.

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 10:51 PM

Originally Posted by juicehoe

Ever hear of bonny and clyde? They used shot guns and had them under their coats? Guess u never heard of a pistol grip and a sawed off shotgun either as they can be rather small

Yeah, and Capone used Tommy Guns, and cavemen used spears.

Have any recent references.

**cjp85** · 04-15-2005, 10:53 PM

Originally Posted by Lozgod

Not having a gun makes you feel like a sheep? Guns aren't your problem.

So is the government controlling child molesters too by making that illegal?

WTF are you talking about? The gov asuming that everyone is a criminal is my problem. Child mollesters shouldn't have to be controled, they should be in prison or worse.

**juicehoe** · 04-15-2005, 10:53 PM

ahh japan is an island as well

Originally Posted by Lozgod

Explain the lack of gun violence in Sweden, Holland, Japan, etc. etc., there are plenty of countries that lack gun crime that are connected to each other.

**BARLOW** · 04-15-2005, 10:54 PM

god ****, i started a good thread for once....... almost 100 posts.....

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 10:55 PM

Originally Posted by cjp85

WTF are you talking about? The gov asuming that everyone is a criminal is my problem. Child mollesters shouldn't have to be controled, they should be in prison or worse.

The problem is too many guns fall in to criminal hands. How many people have to die so you don't feel like a sheep.

**BARLOW** · 04-15-2005, 10:57 PM

How many people have to die before the world has peace..... as many as it takes....

**juicehoe** · 04-15-2005, 10:58 PM

Yea turn on the news... i lived in miami for awhile. Sawed off shotguns do much damage to a wide area. I think gang members like them... the classic double barrel sawed off with wood stock cut down

Originally Posted by Lozgod

Yeah, and Capone used Tommy Guns, and cavemen used spears.

Have any recent references.

**BARLOW** · 04-15-2005, 10:59 PM

buckshot......

**cjp85** · 04-15-2005, 11:02 PM

Originally Posted by Lozgod

The problem is too many guns fall in to criminal hands. How many people have to die so you don't feel like a sheep.

Honestly, I couldn't care less. Freedom is more important to me than your statistics.

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 11:03 PM

Last year, about 500 yards from my house, there was a hardware store. It has been there for 3 generations. A 13 yo kid went in there and trued to steal a screwdriver. The 54 yo owner caught him, took the screwdriver and threw him out of the store and went about his business. The kid rode his bike home, got HIS gun. Came back and killed the father of 3 that worked hard and was the neighborhood hardware store guy.

That kid could of had a knife, a lock in a sock, and all these other weapons you guys say criminals could use in place of guns, but he could of defended his self with those. He was in a hardware store, he could of grabbed a sledge hammer if it was necassary. However a 13yo took his life. Without the gun that man would probaly still be alive.

These types of things happen everyday in America. Way way more often than people actually defending themselves with a gun. You can say whatever you want, but the facts don't lie.

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 11:04 PM

Originally Posted by cjp85

Honestly, I couldn't care less. Freedom is more important to me than your statistics.

Children are behind those statistics. Sorry to hear you feel that way. I guess it makes it easier for your kind to call them statistics. Very sick IMO.

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 11:05 PM

Originally Posted by juicehoe

Yea turn on the news... i lived in miami for awhile. Sawed off shotguns do much damage to a wide area. I think gang members like them... the classic double barrel sawed off with wood stock cut down

Most gun crimes are committed by handguns. There are exceptions here and there, but compared to the whole, it is a small problem.

**juicehoe** · 04-15-2005, 11:07 PM

What facts? You said the kid was 13 and at the end of your post he was 12? Second of all it wasnt HIS gun. It might have been his parents and then it would have been an irresponsible gun ower. I grew up with many guns in the house and look i never shot a person

Originally Posted by Lozgod

Last year, about 500 yards from my house, there was a hardware store. It has been there for 3 generations. A 13 yo kid went in there and trued to steal a screwdriver. The 54 yo owner caught him, took the screwdriver and threw him out of the store and went about his business. The kid rode his bike home, got HIS gun. Came back and killed the father of 3 that worked hard and was the neighborhood hardware store guy.

That kid could of had a knife, a lock in a sock, and all these other weapons you guys say criminals could use in place of guns, but he could of defended his self with those. He was in a hardware store, he could of grabbed a sledge hammer if it was necassary. However a 13yo took his life. Without the gun that man would probaly still be alive.

These types of things happen everyday in America. Way way more often than people actually defending themselves with a gun. You can say whatever you want, but the facts don't lie.

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 11:12 PM

Originally Posted by juicehoe

What facts? You said the kid was 13 and at the end of your post he was 12? Second of all it wasnt HIS gun. It might have been his parents and then it would have been an irresponsible gun ower. I grew up with many guns in the house and look i never shot a person

That was a typo. I fixed it even before you quoted me. It was a gun he bought on the street. The serial numbers were scratched off. This is common place. This isn't a rare occurence. Stuff like this happens all the time, do you live in a cave or in the mountains of West Virginia or something? You are acting like I am making this stuff up.

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 11:14 PM

Originally Posted by juicehoe

What facts? You said the kid was 13 and at the end of your post he was 12? Second of all it wasnt HIS gun. It might have been his parents and then it would have been an irresponsible gun ower. I grew up with many guns in the house and look i never shot a person

I live in the city, many teens have illegally owned guns. Once legally owned that is.

**BARLOW** · 04-15-2005, 11:21 PM

i live in a town and near a city......... most teens here are registered gun owners... we have no problem.... maybe they should just make punishment more severe for illegally using a gun and the problem be fixed..........

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 11:28 PM

Originally Posted by BARLOW

i live in a town and near a city......... most teens here are registered gun owners... we have no problem.... maybe they should just make punishment more severe for illegally using a gun and the problem be fixed..........

I agree with that to a small extent. The problem there is if you aren't afraid to face the death penalty and kill someone, you probaly could care less about the punishment for having a gun no matter how severe it is.

**BARLOW** · 04-15-2005, 11:29 PM

too rule a country, you must make an example of others...........

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 11:31 PM

Originally Posted by BARLOW

too rule a country, you must make an example of others...........

Not really. Look at Holland. They have many freedoms americans frown at like legal drugs, but you can walk any street in the country anytime of the night and not have to lok over your shoulder.

**BARLOW** · 04-15-2005, 11:35 PM

i bet they got some harsh penalitys for murder though......

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 11:37 PM

Originally Posted by BARLOW

i bet they got some harsh penalitys for murder though......

Not as harsh as the death penalty.

**juicehoe** · 04-15-2005, 11:41 PM

Their was something in the news last week how a director was shot on the side walk in the middle of the day by an arab in Holland. All because the arab didnt like his film about the abuse of women in the arab world
Guess he though he didnt have to look over his shoulder

Originally Posted by Lozgod

Not really. Look at Holland. They have many freedoms americans frown at like legal drugs, but you can walk any street in the country anytime of the night and not have to lok over your shoulder.

**BARLOW** · 04-15-2005, 11:42 PM

wut i thought

**newbrew** · 04-15-2005, 11:42 PM

Originally Posted by Lozgod

Then why isn't there an epidemic of gun murder in Britain, Japan, etc. They dont allow private gun ownership, and they have maybe 2 gun related homocides a year. I have very hands on experience with illegal guns. They start off as registered legally purchased guns 99.99% of the time.

In countries where they have outlawed guns, the crime has steadily risin. Google crime stats for those countries, specifically gun related crime.

**Lozgod** · 04-15-2005, 11:44 PM

Originally Posted by juicehoe

Their was something in the news last week how a director was shot on the side walk in the middle of the day by an arab in Holland. All because the arab didnt like his film about the abuse of women in the arab world
Guess he though he didnt have to look over his shoulder

WOW, one murder! Holy crap, crime is out of control over there.