Anabolics
Search More Than 6,000,000 Posts
Results 1 to 27 of 27
  1. #1
    tcw's Avatar
    tcw
    tcw is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,323

    Author L. Rea..."1rstCycle"....

    In Mr.Rea's book...he mentions a 1rst yr cycle that starts off with Deca for 4 weeks...by itself. Then...he suggests adding Primo and Anavar .

    MY QUESTION: "Mr. Rea is a proported expert in Chemical Muscle enhancement...but doesn't recommend "Testosterone " during the first year of AAS use. HOWEVER...i've read from several posters that "Test" is needed with any AAS...

    Is Mr. Rea's 1rst cycle approach correct...or is it recommended to USE "test" during your first cycle?


    Any Constructive input is greatly appreciated...Thanks

  2. #2
    eGGz's Avatar
    eGGz is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    The point of no return.
    Posts
    2,210
    Just because someone writes a book or is a so called "expert" does not mean or in any way guarantee that they actually know anything. The word expert is very misleading. There are no licenses, board exams or certifications required to be an "expert" in any field. Our society is rampant with purported experts in every subject known to man.
    Last edited by eGGz; 11-05-2005 at 12:05 AM.

  3. #3
    Knight1811 is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    261
    Quote Originally Posted by tcw
    In Mr.Rea's book...he mentions a 1rst yr cycle that starts off with Deca for 4 weeks...by itself. Then...he suggests adding Primo and Anavar .

    MY QUESTION: "Mr. Rea is a proported expert in Chemical Muscle enhancement...but doesn't recommend "Testosterone " during the first year of AAS use. HOWEVER...i've read from several posters that "Test" is needed with any AAS...

    Is Mr. Rea's 1rst cycle approach correct...or is it recommended to USE "test" during your first cycle?


    Any Constructive input is greatly appreciated...Thanks
    If I recall correctly, I think his "first cycle" is the first part in many of his First year Male cycle. In other words, Author L. Rea has the whole year planned out...and the first part (after the bloodwork) is the 4 weeks of Nandralone. Then four weeks of nothing (except bloodwork)...then the next part and so forth...it's suppose to be a whole year endeavor.....which is why he calls it the "First year Male cycle." Then he plans out the second year and third. You CAN NOT just do the first four weeks and expect to get huge and shiat. lol. It's one part in many for the whole year.
    Regarding Author L. Rea, he is NOT an advocate for high dosages so that is why you don't see high dosages. He believes in using the minimal amount to elicit gains.
    Personally, I think the man is brillant. If you are interested in his writings, you can read the two books he has out and you can find articles in various issues of "Musclar Development."

    Knight1811

  4. #4
    IBdmfkr's Avatar
    IBdmfkr is offline AR VET
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    10,383
    I have two of his books, chemical enhancement and Build a perfect Beast. I am not sure about his studies, but I may try some of his suggestions in the future Just to experiment and see how they work.

  5. #5
    ccriderss is offline New Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    49
    I have read his works too and agree that his year cycle needs to be done in full to get the benefits of it.... but i also agree with the fact that deca causes some bad side effects if used by utself such as "deca dick" i also think that 4 weeks of deca is a waste of money as u will be stopping before the real results kick in.... i would throw some testosterone ethanate or cypionate in there and use them both for about 12 weeks...maybe for a fis time user 500mg of test a week and 400 of deca a week and split that into two injections a week...mon and thursday... u can put them in the same dart.... adding proviron to prevent gyno and water retention is a good idea....and then of course PCT

  6. #6
    tcw's Avatar
    tcw
    tcw is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,323

    thanks...

    I thank you for your kind responses.

    I have enjoyed his book CME and have learned quite a bit (as a beginer). However, after talking with several people and studying...i have come to the conclusion that most of this is very "subjective"...What may be successful for one person...may not work for another. To a large extent..it appears to be trial and error (unfortunately).

    This will be my first cycle...so i am searching and studying as carefully as possible...

    thanks again!

    T

  7. #7
    JohnnyB's Avatar
    JohnnyB is offline AR-Hall of Famer / Retired
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Califas
    Posts
    9,265
    I wouldn't recommend any of his cycles to my worst enemy, stay away from any thing he says, just to be on the safe side

    JohnnyB

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    The South Side
    Posts
    779
    4 wks on deca wont do anything, it doesnt start to do anything til about 6 or 7 weeks. Its a waste of time and money IMO

  9. #9
    JohnnyB's Avatar
    JohnnyB is offline AR-Hall of Famer / Retired
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Califas
    Posts
    9,265
    Quote Originally Posted by Son Of Khadafi
    4 wks on deca wont do anything, it doesnt start to do anything til about 6 or 7 weeks. Its a waste of time and money IMO
    I agree

    JohnnyB

  10. #10
    IBdmfkr's Avatar
    IBdmfkr is offline AR VET
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    10,383
    The 4 weeks of deca only is one that I don't think I'll be trying. He has a few other approaches, some of which look like they may work considering your change some things around and run the compounds differently.

  11. #11
    tcw's Avatar
    tcw
    tcw is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,323
    Thanks...

    What about trying Deca with Anavar for 8-12 weeks...?

  12. #12
    diezell's Avatar
    diezell is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    northeast
    Posts
    1,559
    Quote Originally Posted by Son Of Khadafi
    4 wks on deca wont do anything, it doesnt start to do anything til about 6 or 7 weeks. Its a waste of time and money IMO
    itl do something, itl shut you down hard, that guy should be shot for recommending a cycle like that

  13. #13
    shortie's Avatar
    shortie is offline AR Biggerologist
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Back in da box!
    Posts
    3,413
    Quote Originally Posted by tcw
    Thanks...

    What about trying Deca with Anavar for 8-12 weeks...?
    The problem here is the same, it is not a dose problem or a stack problem it is that you are using compounds that both individually will shut down natural test production. The reason I always recommend test as a base for any cycle is obvious to me, it is a totally natural compound, your body has been producing it since the beginning, even women have test in their bodies.
    So it makes sense to me, and evidently to anti-aging experts, that test has beneficial properties beyond sexuality(gettin wood) but in personal well being, attitude, and outlook on life. So even if you think Deca all by itself is a good cycle you should understand it will eliminate natural test production in the body, and even if you play the woman in a gay relationship(LOL)you still need to feel good about yourself, confident and the whole host of other benefits one has from test.

  14. #14
    tcw's Avatar
    tcw
    tcw is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,323
    thanks for the input...Here is Author Rea's response...taken from Bodybuilding.com

    QUESTION TO MR.REA
    In your first year sample cycles section for the male (In Chemical Muscle Enhancement), the cycle outlined for weeks 1-4 is 200 mg deca per week. now that much deca per week is less anabolic than what the natural test (HPTA) can produce (test being stronger than nandrolone mg to mg). And because of the ester attached to nandrolone, 4 weeks long is hardly enough for blood levels to reach a constant level.

    Also, how is deca easy on the HTPA, you go ahead and say post cycle meds are not necessary as deca is easy on the HTPA which we from multiple examples know is so not true, cases of testicular shrinkage, limp dick, etc are so much reported normally on a deca only cycle sir. Can you please explain your logic behind this?

    MR.REA'S ANSWER.
    You also mention cytomel increased cellular androgen receptor clearing (pg 181 and 182 in the book). How true is this sir?I look forward to your answers to these questions sir, thanks.

    Nandrolone is actually more anabolic but less androgenic than testosterone and as such allows an increase in muscle protein synthesis in excess of that seen with testosterone. So the next question should obviously be "why then does testosterone deliver more weight gain then nandrolone?"

    Since nandrolone is about 80% less affected by aromatase when compared to testosterone, it should seem obvious that the lack of GLUT-4 (increased muscle glycogen synthesis) activity will also result in a decrease in intracellular content but not cellular wall protein synthesis. Since we are speaking of post-cycle retention as well here we would be in error if we included the on-cycle increase in the body's water table from estrogen/aldosterone resulting from the higher aromatizing testosterone in our comparison.

    When we employ brief cycles of 4 weeks, a 200mg dosage of nandrolone decanoate would have an additive effect to the endogenous (naturally produced in the body) testosterone for the first 3 weeks. For a novice this accounts for about twice the normal rate of anabolism possible if diet is correct (anabolism is not potentiated unless the macronutrient environment is as well). Many do not realize that the body actually produces about 150mg of testosterone weekly. It circulates about 50mg of testosterone weekly, but it produces about 150mg. Much testosterone is lost to enzymic conversion to 4-androstenediols and various intermediates of DHT. So in essence we are creating a close hormone environment comparison to that realized at about week 6 of a 200mg each testosterone cypionate and nandrolone decanoate protocol.

    The issue of nandrolone having such profound progesterone effects is a bit overplayed for some reason that I cannot grasp. For periods of only 4 weeks and at dosages of up to 400mg weekly, the actual progestin effect is not really of concern. Though it should be noted that the HPTA will not supply adequate testosterone (and subsequently DHT) to support a healthy libido beyond that point. And the estrogenic value is far less for nor-estrogens as a whole. As example is the effect upon HPTA function. LH and FSH are the determining factors for HPTA function itself.

    For this reason we can determine the degree of HPTA function inhibition that occurs as a result of the administration of different AAS. Novices that had normal LH/FSH levels prior to nandrolone administration showed an average decrease in LH/FSH of only about 33% at day 21 and 39% at day 28. Additionally at day 42 (2 weeks after discontinuance) LH/FSH level were only suppress an average of 21% thus showing a positive rebound effect. In comparison testosterone administration for the same period results in an addition decrease in LH/FSH of about 12% (bodyfat levels can have a profound effect upon this).


    TCW

  15. #15
    tcw's Avatar
    tcw
    tcw is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,323
    Whoops....here's Mr.Rea's answer

    ANSWER
    Nandrolone is actually more anabolic but less androgenic than testosterone and as such allows an increase in muscle protein synthesis in excess of that seen with testosterone. So the next question should obviously be "why then does testosterone deliver more weight gain then nandrolone?"

    Since nandrolone is about 80% less affected by aromatase when compared to testosterone, it should seem obvious that the lack of GLUT-4 (increased muscle glycogen synthesis) activity will also result in a decrease in intracellular content but not cellular wall protein synthesis. Since we are speaking of post-cycle retention as well here we would be in error if we included the on-cycle increase in the body's water table from estrogen/aldosterone resulting from the higher aromatizing testosterone in our comparison.

    When we employ brief cycles of 4 weeks, a 200mg dosage of nandrolone decanoate would have an additive effect to the endogenous (naturally produced in the body) testosterone for the first 3 weeks. For a novice this accounts for about twice the normal rate of anabolism possible if diet is correct (anabolism is not potentiated unless the macronutrient environment is as well). Many do not realize that the body actually produces about 150mg of testosterone weekly. It circulates about 50mg of testosterone weekly, but it produces about 150mg. Much testosterone is lost to enzymic conversion to 4-androstenediols and various intermediates of DHT. So in essence we are creating a close hormone environment comparison to that realized at about week 6 of a 200mg each testosterone cypionate and nandrolone decanoate protocol.

    The issue of nandrolone having such profound progesterone effects is a bit overplayed for some reason that I cannot grasp. For periods of only 4 weeks and at dosages of up to 400mg weekly, the actual progestin effect is not really of concern. Though it should be noted that the HPTA will not supply adequate testosterone (and subsequently DHT) to support a healthy libido beyond that point. And the estrogenic value is far less for nor-estrogens as a whole. As example is the effect upon HPTA function. LH and FSH are the determining factors for HPTA function itself.

    For this reason we can determine the degree of HPTA function inhibition that occurs as a result of the administration of different AAS. Novices that had normal LH/FSH levels prior to nandrolone administration showed an average decrease in LH/FSH of only about 33% at day 21 and 39% at day 28. Additionally at day 42 (2 weeks after discontinuance) LH/FSH level were only suppress an average of 21% thus showing a positive rebound effect. In comparison testosterone administration for the same period results in an addition decrease in LH/FSH of about 12% (bodyfat levels can have a profound effect upon this).

  16. #16
    tcw's Avatar
    tcw
    tcw is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,323
    APPARENTLY...Mr.Rea is saying that the low dosage of deca would have very little negative affect on natural test levels...

    I suppose all of these doses and AAS types...would be predicated on each individual and the results therein...

    tcw

  17. #17
    tallyjuice's Avatar
    tallyjuice is offline Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Posts
    677
    I love REA's shit. He has spent the past few years studying aas, and he definately has the means (funding) to conduct proper research. I believe that short cycles, although not a method of attaining 20-30lbs per cycle, do hold a place in steroid usage. This is a great article concurring with such statements:

    Short Cycles??? Good Read!!!!!!

  18. #18
    tcw's Avatar
    tcw
    tcw is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,323
    Tallyjuice........Yeah...me too! I've got his book and its well worth the $50 i paid for it. The dude seems to know his shit.

    And yes you are correct...he has been promoting shorter cycles....

    Thanks for the tip....!

    tcw

  19. #19
    Knight1811 is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    261
    Quote Originally Posted by tcw
    Tallyjuice........Yeah...me too! I've got his book and its well worth the $50 i paid for it. The dude seems to know his shit.

    And yes you are correct...he has been promoting shorter cycles....

    Thanks for the tip....!

    tcw

    I said it in early October and I'll say it again. I personally thing Author L. Rea is absolutely brillant. The man is a walking, talking, breathing resource for AAS and how it impacts the human body. I've read this books, his MD articles, his follow-up responses to his books, and anything else that man has to say.

    It's a shame that folks don't fully read his works yet they opine negatively about his credibility or rational. It really is a dis-service to anyone who wants to expand his/her knowledge of the AAS they are taking or consider taking.

    By the way, great follow-up response. Rea does make some very compelling statement, doesn't he?

  20. #20
    tallyjuice's Avatar
    tallyjuice is offline Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Posts
    677
    He does. I wonder why people have such a hard time dealing with different protocols. Either way, I believe his work is well researched, and I cannot wait to start some of his cycles.

  21. #21
    tcw's Avatar
    tcw
    tcw is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,323
    THANKS for the remarks...

    Yeah...check out this beast who Mr.Rea is training now... http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/author9.htm....the dude has serious potential...

  22. #22
    fLgAtOr is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2002
    Posts
    2,752
    His handling of ALRI and the Ergomax LMG product was a little shady.

  23. #23
    judge_dread's Avatar
    judge_dread is offline Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    muscleland
    Posts
    928
    I have read his two books and I found them really interesting , his approach on doing cycles is well planned,documented and based as he claims in real world use.Anyway I am not sure though if I would follow his protocols at least before I will be assured they are safe too.

  24. #24
    tcw's Avatar
    tcw
    tcw is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,323
    By comparison from what i've read of users on this board....his cycles are low dosage cycles (from book 1). He deviates on the subject of Deca Only...for 4 weeks....beginers cycle.

  25. #25
    Tedbear981's Avatar
    Tedbear981 is offline Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    742
    I can't wait until hooker see's this....

  26. #26
    Knight1811 is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Posts
    261
    Quote Originally Posted by Tedbear981
    I can't wait until hooker see's this....
    Why?

  27. #27
    tcw's Avatar
    tcw
    tcw is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,323
    http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/author9.htm

    WHOOPS....that's the correct link.

    Toney Freeman...

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •