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  1. #1
    kojak_x's Avatar
    kojak_x is offline Associate Member
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    Anadrol 50 only cycle, a few serious questions.

    Hopefully someone here knows what there talking about and can answer a few things.

    Now there was this guy the other day that had a post about how he did about 3 or so cycles of only Anadrol 50. He said that he kept most of his gains, with no PCT. Now from what I know is that this steroid is very strong. Apparently he isn't that bright and didn't do any research. Now my questions is that why does TEST always have to be run with another steroid?

    Assuming this guy isn't lying and everything is true.

  2. #2
    Hunter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kojak_x View Post
    Hopefully someone here knows what there talking about and can answer a few things.

    Now there was this guy the other day that had a post about how he did about 3 or so cycles of only Anadrol 50. He said that he kept most of his gains, with no PCT. Now from what I know is that this steroid is very strong. Apparently he isn't that bright and didn't do any research. Now my questions is that why does TEST always have to be run with another steroid?

    Assuming this guy isn't lying and everything is true.
    When you run compounds your body stops producing test which can lead to sexual dysfunction. This is not always the case but is very possible. If you dont like test you can always run it at an hrt dose with your cycles and use other compounds for your gains. Test is cheap and effective thats another reason people run it.

    Mainly the reason you should always run test is so you dont risk sexual dysfunction.

  3. #3
    ALIN is offline Anabolic Member
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    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by kojak_x View Post
    Hopefully someone here knows what there talking about and can answer a few things.

    Now there was this guy the other day that had a post about how he did about 3 or so cycles of only Anadrol 50. He said that he kept most of his gains, with no PCT. Now from what I know is that this steroid is very strong. Apparently he isn't that bright and didn't do any research. Now my questions is that why does TEST always have to be run with another steroid?

    Assuming this guy isn't lying and everything is true.
    I would say for the most part I would never run ANADROL alone,,always with some additional testosterone . PCT is a MUST after an ANADROL cycle.

  4. #4
    amcon's Avatar
    amcon is offline physical pain is temporary. It may last a minute, or an hour, or a day, or a year, but eventually it will subside... The pain of quiting will lasts forever!!
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    the guy is and has to be lieing or the stuff didnt work with him and he gained from working out harder and eating right ... i love anadrol ... it is very very harsh

    i have dont two cycles of anadrol and sust... gained 30+ lbs from each cycle and lost 18 - 20 lbs after each cycle... kept the strength gains and some size but there are better (much better) combos that will yeild better gains and better long term results...

    do some research and see why every one uses test and then adds on to that...

    on top of all that what are you goals? stats? and cycle history?

    if you have the anadrol and feel you must use it just be smart

  5. #5
    kojak_x's Avatar
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    Im pretty sure I would never even use A50 with or without test to be perfectly honest. Its to powerful of a drug it seems for me. The main reason I was woundering about it was because I did a epistane cycle which is a Methylated version of the steroid Epitiostanol and I ran it without any sort of TEST. I had no sort of sexual dysfunction. In fact I had an erection all the time almost so to speak. Libido was way up. I did a pct of Nolvadex 40 40 20 20. With a solid 10lbs of dry mucsle gained. And didn't lose any muscle.
    Im just a very paranoid person so I just want to make sure I don't screw myself up. I feel great. Going to tell my Dr what I did and going to get bloodwork done Aug 28.

    It seems to me that everyone knows everything about all the gear except epistane. There doesn't seem really any detailed infromation on this steroid.

  6. #6
    Matt's Avatar
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    Im sure this is also called havoc lol, maybe check that out..

  7. #7
    kojak_x's Avatar
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    yeh Havoc is the brand name. I can't seem to find detailed information like from a medical dictionary.

  8. #8
    Matt's Avatar
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    Epistane

    Other brand names:

    Epistane , Havoc, Hemaguno

    What is Epistane?

    Epistane is one of the newest designer steroids on the market today, and it is gaining attention very quickly. Epistane is actually a methylated version of the controlled substance Epitiostanol (2±,3±-Epithio-5±-androstan-17²-ol), which was created in the 1960's and used as a treatment for breast cancer. Since the only place Epitiostanol is only availabe at this time is in japan, chemists added a methyl group to the compund and the final product was a substance now known as Epistane. Epistane is a sulfur containing steroid which is known to have strong and long lasting anti-estrogenic activity as well as weak androgenic and mytropic activities.

    What you can expect?

    Since it is designed to be anti-estrogenic you can expect very dry gains from this compound. Epistane has low androgenic to anabolic activity. This meaning that it is much more anabolic then androgenic. Thus making sides very minimal to non existant from this substance. Also one of the great properties of this substance is that it does a great job in keeping the natural suppression of the gonads away. Since it has anti-estrogenic properties it keeps your LH levels elevated and it is also said both through science and human trial that epistane may have the ability to reduce gyno. This is still a widely debated outcome of epistane but is actually showing more and more positive results as it becomes more popular. Even though users will see dry gains on epistane it does not mean that it would be any insufficient for a bulking cycle. In fact it would be beneficial because it would generate lean gains. Through research it is reported that most users who have taken this substance have gained anywhere from 5-12 lbs in a 3-5 week cycle. Now in my opinion epistane would be better in a cutting cycle to keep the body dry while preserving and potentially add more lean muscle tissue.

    Dosing:

    Most users run epistane for 1-6 weeks using a dose between 10 and 60 mgs.

    You should not run this substance for longer than 6 weeks.

    A recommended beginner cycle would be starting at 10 mgs for the first 2 days of the cycle and then running it like this for the rest of the cycle.

    Week 1: 10 mgs for the first 2 days then increasing the dose to 20 mgs.

    Week 2: 20 mgs

    Week 3: 30 mgs

    Week 4: 40 mgs- This week should be optional depending on how your body reacts.


    While taking epistane you should be aware that it is a methylated compund therefore you should not exceed the proper dosing.

    What needs to be taken with Epistane?

    Even though epistane has very minimal side effects, you should still use the proper support supplements to make sure your body stays in good health throughout the cycle. Since Epistane is methylated, milk thistle is highly recomended to protect the liver values. It would also be wise to get blood work done after completing a cycle.

    Red Yeast Rice- This product is a Fermented Rice product that basicly protects your cardiovascular system from any damage Sostonol that may come from Sostonol.

    Celery Seed- Acts as an anti-oxidant which helps reduce blood pressure and also can aid the liver on cycle.

    Hawthorne Berry: Also very useful to lower BP and keep it on check. A great on cycle supplement.
    Dosage 1000mg ed on cycle.

    Milk Thistle (80% standardized Silymarin)- This should be taken all the way through. It should be started as a pre load and be taken all the way through PCT(Post Cycle Therapy ).

    Also you may want to look further into these products to help with blood pressure and cholesterol regulation / liver and support:

    Liver: K-R-ALA, NAC ( N-Acetyl-Cysteine), Lecithin

    Cholesterol: Sesathin, Guggul, CoEnzyme Q10*, Flax Seed Oil, Safflower Oil*, Policosanol*, Niacin, Garlic, Pantethine

    Blood Pressure: Coenzyme Q10, Garlic ,C-12 Peptide, high-dose vitamin B6 and vitamin C.

    Post Cycle Therapy (PCT)

    Even though epistane does have anti-estrogenic properties, it does not mean that PCT should be avoided. A proper SERM will make sure that your natural hormone levels are back where they were before the cycle.

  9. #9
    kojak_x's Avatar
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    thx, I have some detailed info. Epitiostanol is a relatively obscure steroid used for breast cancer that is only

    available in Japan. Again you might say, “How does a drug used for breast cancer work

    for us extreme fitness types?” Well, Epitiostanol was actually developed back in the

    1960’s and has an
    extremely good anabolic /androgenic ratio. This means that it causes a whole host of

    positive effects in the body with minimal negative androgenic effects. The reason it was

    used for breast cancer is that it was shown to exert a potent anti-estrogenic effect

    which halted the progression of estrogen-stimulated cancers. What wonderful

    characteristics to have in a steroid! Great muscle growth with small androgenic

    phenomenon with no estrogenic problems like gyno…sounds like the perfect steroid!

    Well, the Japanese company Shionogi thought so too but they wanted a characteristic that

    epitiostanol lacked—significant oral bioavailability. The smart people at this company

    went back into the literature and found that 17B steroidal ethers caused a significant

    increase in oral bioavailability. They used the ether technology and voila, they created

    Mepitiostane. Fortunately, they didn’t stop there! They decided to
    elucidate just how these ethers work. Read below for the story!

    The Shionogi research team began their quest by asking the question as to what possible

    ways could the ether group be increasing bioavailability. They realized that orally

    administered drugs and nutrients are transferred to the systemic circulation via the

    portal and/or lymphatic route following passage through the mucosal cell of the

    intestinal lumen. They also understood that the portal route is considered to be the

    main route for compounds absorbed from the intestines because blood flow is about 500

    times greater than lymph flow in capillaries of the villus.

    Thus they first looked at the portal route and asked whether the ether group on the

    steroid could be preventing the steroid from being metabolized by the liver. They looked

    at the characteristics of the molecule and decided that this was probably not the right

    answer.

    Although not the primary place of absorption of most compounds, the intestinal lymphatic

    system is known to play an important role in the absorption of some compounds such as

    long chain fatty acids, triglycerides and lipid soluble vitamins. A compound absorbed

    via intestinal lymphatics directly enters the systemic circulation at the level of the

    subclavian vein which avoids first pass metabolism of the compound through the liver.

    With this in mind, our good friends at Shionogi decided to look here for their answers.

    Hey, all I can say is that these guys were right on the money! Using radioactive

    labeling of both Epitiostanol and Mepitiostane, they found that Epitiostanol is almost

    entirely absorbed via the portal route while mepitiostane is almost entirely absorbed

    via the lymphatic route. Bingo!

    One of the most fascinating things that I noticed in their research was that there are

    literally a multitude of factors that determine the bioavailability of orally consumed

    steroids . Intestinal absorption usually refers to the process of uptake of a compound

    from the site of absorption into the systemic circulation. This process includes the

    penetration through the epithelial cells, metabolism in the epithelial cells and

    transfer from the epithelial cells into the portal vein or lymphatics. Any or all of

    these processes can significantly cause inhibition of absorption of the parent compound.

    I have heard for quite some time from various sources that methandrostenolone (Dianabol )

    works much better when taken orally than injected. I used to scoff at this but now I

    might be in a position to believe what I heard. You see, there is quite a bit of

    research which shows that anabolic steroids undergo significant metabolism in the

    epithelial cells. Consequently, ingested methandrostenolone, as well as other orally

    administered steroids, could possibly be significantly converted into other active

    species with highly different characteristics before it even reaches the liver!

    In the magazines and advertisements, we hear all the time that taking so and so amount

    of prohormone will give you thus and thus blood levels of that particular steroid. They

    base this simply by saying that a certain predefined percentage makes it through

    unmetabolized by the liver. They do not consider the facts that a great amount might not

    get absorbed by the epithelial cells nor do they take into consideration the fact that

    much might get metabolized into either more or less active species. Basically, the whole

    situation is quite complex and cannot be simplified with such a sophomoric formula.

    I also want to bring up the point again of how important it is to have a proper delivery

    system to cause increased penetration/absorption in the epithelial cells. I dug up a

    bunch of research which shows that without any type of delivery system as much as 50% of

    the ingested steroid can be unabsorbed. You can guess what happens to this unabsorbed

    steroid! Into the toilet my friend; into the toilet!!!

    After Shionogi showed that steroidal ethers are absorbed in the lymphatic system, they

    did a series of studies which determined exactly what was responsible for lymphatic

    versus portal partitioning. Please understand that when the steroid is absorbed into the

    epithelial cell it is PARTITIONED or directed into either the portal vein or the

    lymphatic system. I already know what you are asking, “What determines the

    partitioning?”

    It is a phenomenon called SUPERLIPOPHILICITY! If you remember correctly fatty acids and

    triglycerides are almost completely absorbed into the lymph. Superlipophilicity makes

    the compound associate so strongly with triglycerides and fatty acids that it absorbs in

    a similar fashion. During absorption, superlipophilic compounds become incorporated into

    the core lipids of chylomicrons in the intestinal mucosal cells of the intestinal

    mucosa. These fatty chylomicrons are then transferred almost exclusively into the

    lymphatic system (including the steroidal ethers).

    Epistane/Havoc/Methepitiostane/Hemaguno
    (2a-3a-epithio-17a-methyl-5a-androstan-17b-ol)
    Methepitiostane is an oral anabolic steroid derived from dihydrotestosterone. This drug

    exhibits an anabolic effect that is roughly 12 times more pronounced than its androgenic

    effect, and also imparts an anti estrogenic effect. RPN’s product Havoc and IBE’s

    Epistane were introduced at practically the same time and considered interchangeable by

    many. However, it should be noted that even when two products are identical, users can

    experience different effects depending on the quality of the isomer, manufacturing

    process and so on. With Havoc and Epistane they are chemically very slightly different

    2a,3a-epithio-17a-methyl-5a-androstan-17b-ol 2 (Havoc), and 2,

    3a-epithio-17a-methyletioallo cholan-17b-ol (Epistane). Dosages are usually in the

    10-30mg range. Competitive Edge Labs E-Stane is probably the cheapest listed version of

    Methepitiostane.
    Effects: useful for promoting solid, lean muscle gains with a concomitant reduction in

    estrogen leading to a drier physique, and significant strength gains. This will

    contribute to the vascularity users typically report. Havoc and Epistane are also

    sometimes used purely to combat gynecomastia as they act in the body as an anti

    estrogen, which also may produce some lethargy though.
    Side effects: less hepatoxic and damaging to lipid levels than other orals but

    Methepitiostane is a c17-alpha alkylated compound. Methepitiostane is not aromatized by

    the body.

    Affiliation(s) du ou des auteurs / Author(s) Affiliation(s)
    (1) Shionogi & Co., Ltd, Shionogi Research Laboratories, Fukushima-ku, Osaka 553, JAPON

    Résumé / Abstract
    Substitution of the steroid epitiostanol (EP) at position 17 with methoxycyclopentane

    yields the extremely lipophilic mepitiostane (MP) with preferential partitioning into

    the lymph. Most of the MP in the lymph was associated with the core lipids of

    chylomicrons and very low-density lipoproteins (VLDL), as was also the case for EP.

    However, the dialysis velocity of EP and MP from lymph to plasma differed greatly; EP,

    but not MP, was transferred from the lymph to the plasma. This difference was attributed

    to differences in their unbound fraction in the lymph. Lymphatic transfer and the logP

    value of several tested steroids correlated

  10. #10
    BigHick is offline New Member
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    Im on 150mg ed on drol and have had no problems am uber super strong i throw hay bails around the farm like its nothing i have minor anger issues but thats all

  11. #11
    aldemoro is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by mn_fighter View Post
    When you run compounds your body stops producing test which can lead to sexual dysfunction. This is not always the case but is very possible. If you dont like test you can always run it at an hrt dose with your cycles and use other compounds for your gains. Test is cheap and effective thats another reason people run it.

    Mainly the reason you should always run test is so you dont risk sexual dysfunction.
    how can i do hrt on test??

  12. #12
    marcus300's Avatar
    marcus300 is offline AR-Elite Hall of Famer
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    Quote Originally Posted by aldemoro View Post
    how can i do hrt on test??
    You need to start your own thread, pls

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