**HELP** My shoulders get WAYYY too involved in my chest workouts!!

[Farmer]

The title sums it up but Im tired of this and its effecting my progress. I try everything pulling my shoulders back, sticking my chest out and what not. I get a pump in my front delts before my chest and Its been awhile since I've gotten a REALLY good pump in my chest. I hurt my shoulder my junior year in highschool and it still bothers me and it gets the most pump of the two. It sometimes goes numb or what not and kinda aches but its just because my shoulders are too involved. SOMEONE please help me out here!

thanks everyone

peace

[xxxl83]

Farmer,

Try tucking your elbows in towards your body and bringing the bar down lower on your chest. Then on the press, press the bar towards your feet instead of up over yor face.

xxxl83

[D3m3nt3d]

I have the same problem bro...are your arms long? Whenever i am benching, when the bar touches my chest my arms have broke wayyy past parallel and all the weight is shifted to my shoulders. And as far as shoulder problems, i have the unfixable one...2 steroid shots and one unsuccessful shoulder surgery...it really knocks out your motivation to go lift when all you feel is pain. I have been one day to the gym in over 2 weeks=\

[RATM]

Originally posted by xxxl83
Farmer,

Try tucking your elbows in towards your body and bringing the bar down lower on your chest. Then on the press, press the bar towards your feet instead of up over yor face.

xxxl83

it sounds like that would have him incorporate his triceps a lot. It is physiologically impossible to eliminate shoulder or tri work when doing any pressing motion. An horizontally lateral motion such as flyes would work and may put more emphasis on the chest muscles, but flyes do not build muscle. Concentration is the key. Regardless, it is a common problem that we all face.

JMO

[BigGreen]

RATM is, for purposes of this discussion, correct in stating that flyes don't build muscle...however, they might come in handy for you given your situation. I once had the same problem, so for a solid three months i began my chest day with three HARD sets of flyes, then moved on to the pressing movements. With your chest pre-exhausted, there's almost no way you can perform the exercise without feeling it in your chest. After three months of that, I couldn't believe how much more aware i was of how to "feel" the pecs during the bench press...going back to the old routine of starting with benches of some variety, it's now not an issue to concentrate on the pecs.

[RATM]

well put big green, i didnt even think of pre exhaustion. that might work for him.

[jake66]

I am no expert by far but I have kinda the same problem. My shoulders hurt when I use dumbells. It almost seems that if I lift heavier the shoulder pain gets ignored or goes away because of the chest pump. Just my $.02

[Farmer]

Definently appreciate the input everyone! just got back from work and was glad to see some info and I think its going to help. I am gonna hit chest again on thursday and going to start with flys... to pre-exhaust it. I myself think i have excellent mind muscle connection because I can feel every muscle except chest because of my shoulders and because I hurt the one shoulder its kind of a weak point for me. I have a feeling that thursday is gonna be a whole new ball game folks!

Thanks again !

peace

[defdaz]

Sorry RATM but to say flyes don't build muscle is a bit silly. That's like saying bent over raises won't work your back and rear delts; stiff arm pulldowns won't work your lats and cable crossovers won't work your pecs.

The fact of the matter is that physiologically your muscles have absolutely no idea what exercise you are doing. None. Your pecs have no idea whether you are benching, doing dips or flyes. All they now is the current load on them and what your mind is asking them to do. If a high enough load is placed up a muscle - i.e. a hard set then the body will atempt to adapt to this and hopefully hypertrophy will occur if sufficient resources are available.

Isolation exercises do provide enough of a stimulus to the focus muscles, in fact it could be said that they offer a greater stimulus because fewer ancillory muscle groups are involved and hence there is less risk of these muscles causing faliure in a set before the focus muscle is expended. For example - if during benching your triceps or delts can no longer contract with the force required then that's it, set over. Your pecs may have still had 10% left in them and so the load on them was acceptible - the body may not treat this as sufficient an overload to trigger any adaptation.

As BigGreen says one key benefit of isolation exercises it to use them to pre-exhaust the main muscle so that when you come to the compound exercise such as bench press your pecs are pretty much guaranteed to be the muscles that cause faliure in the set and so the load upon them is at it's maximum.

Sorry to be so antagonistic but I am very worried that statements like you have made will be believed and acted upon by less experienced trainers.

Cheers,

Daz

[Pete235]

This is a little tricky to master and your ego may take a beating (you will have to use a lower weight for a while) But try performing the 3 basic shaping movements (press, inclines, flies), using dumbells on a swiss ball. Trust me, it really isolates the chest muscles and takes shoulders out. It also offers an amazing stretch at the bottom of the movement as your upper back is slightly rounded because of the ball.

[RATM]

Defdaz, good point and i Hope that new people would not get the wrong idea.

[superbeast]

Originally posted by RATM


An horizontally lateral motion such as flyes would work and may put more emphasis on the chest muscles, but flyes do not build muscle. Concentration is the keyJMO

Horsesh*t! Every exercise is capable of building muscle, not just compound ones. If an exercise is done correctly and heavy enough, it will build muscle.

When benching, pull your shoulders down toward your feet and back around the bench, expand and press your chest up, and never lock the movement out completely if you want to isolate the chest as much as possible. You are always going to feel a little bit of shoulders, but this will concentrate more on the chest.

[Farmer]

Thanks again everyone!

peace

[xxxl83]

Ratm,

Yes a powerlifting style of bench does incorperate more triceps, if the stress is taken off the shoulders it has to be picked up somewhere else.
This style of bench will make it easier on your shoulders and allow you to bench with minimal shoulder strain.

Pete 235 is also correct about the presses on the swiss ball they're great. I use them for recovery work.
Be sure to use an anti-burst ball if you are a heavier guy or using heavier weight. I'm 245lbs and had a ball pop about 2 months ago while I was doing presses with 100lb DB's I didn't get injured but I was pretty shaken up and I realize it could've been alot worse.

xxxl83

[Little Jonah]

I got the same prob bro

[Farmer]

Originally posted by Little Jonah
I got the same prob bro

ya bro I can tell by the cannonball delts

peace

[Alex Cross]

Whatup fellas

Shit, I have been having the same probem- TOO MUCH DAMN SHOULDERS!! So does anyone have any other tips on avoiding the shoulder...

A/C

[Commander_Bash]

i have the same problem even if i pre=exhaust my pecs like say with cable flyes or pec/deck my chest might feel it more but my shoulders die out even quicker....it really sucks

[$uperman]

i use to have the same prob also. i just stuck w/ lighter weight till i found a movement that i really felt in my chest. i noticed that when i tucked my elbows more toward my torso and push the weight over my chest or further down it helped too. i think i was pressing the bar more over my face and thats what was causing the shoulder pump and pain.

[defdaz]

One extra tip I can think of is that when do a bilateral movement like barbell work 'try' to bring your hands together as you press - obviously you won't (don't let your hands move on the bar) but by trying to you should feel your pecs contract a bit harder... takes a bit of effort to get right but is worth it.

Daz