Child Molesting Priests

[tryingtogetbig]

Originally posted by 47john
...i dated a girl whose 9 year old boy had already been caught forcing his little brother to give him oral sex and actually attempted to have sex with a 4 year old girl . should he be castrated ?, how about raped ? , if he did it to your child would you kill him too ?

I think that is a little different bro. I don't know what I would do in that situation if it was my kid. I hope none of us ever have to find out.

Originally posted by 47john
...what about mary kay letourneau who had sex with her 13 year old student and had his baby , should she be raped ? what about female circumcision (removal of the clitoris and stiching shut the inner lips of the vagina) is that a good idea ? maybe she should be put in a cell with two big inmates and raped everyday for the rest of her life too , or not .

Yes. She was an adult that should be held responsible for her actions. Read previous post about my thoughts on appropriate punishment.

Originally posted by 47john
...and who decides where to draw the line .

If it's one of my loved ones, I do.

Originally posted by 47john
...it would be a shame if you were ever falsely accused of rape , and then found to be innocent (like 1 in 12 men in prison for rape) but you were already castrated and raped then killed by an angry parent .

Again, I think this out of the scope of the discussion, but yes, that would be a shame.

Originally posted by 47john
...these aren't the only reasons but some of the good ones why i will just worry about the safety of my children and let people decide what kind of punishments offenders should receive .

I totally understand your worrying for your children. That means you're a good parent. Again, I hope none of us ever have to deal personally with such issues. Unfortanutely, odds are that some of us will have to.

peace,

ttgb

[Canes4Ever]

Originally posted by 47john
you make a valid point about how wrong some of these things are however it is you who should re-read your posts .

in your post you speak of some pretty deviant things thats for sure , but you yourself name all of 3 or 4 people of commiting these crimes .

how in the blue $@#! does that constitue "much" of a group of people whose numbers are in the millions if not billions .

i am not trying to be offensive but i know there is some animosity between groups that advocate gay rights and catholic christians and their beliefs .

im sure you could find 3 or 4 homosexual men guilty of molestation , does that mean that homosexuals as a group are responsible for creating a situation where molestation is tolerated ?

47 John thanks for responding, yes I only mentioned several cases but if you wish I can try and find link to more on the internet. I should be able to find plenty.

I know that the Diocese of Palm Beach settled 2 cases just last month, as per the Miami Herald article I spoke about, one for $ 2 million the other for $ 5 million a total of $ 7 million in just one month.

It involves more than just "a few" priests, it involves dozens, maybe even hundreds. But that even ONE was allowed to happen was TOO MUCH. And why do I hold the Church Hierachs more culpable than others in the Church ? Because according to the evidence I have seen so far, they not only KNEW about the molesters, they AIDED & ABETTED the criminal priests. They new better yet either did nothing to prevent these things from happening again. They even put them in charge of children (as in the Florida case) after it was KNOWN they were molesters.

Even if it is only 3 or 4 do you belive we should just sweep it under the carpet ? That is what it sounds like to me that you wish to do...these people should be helped, yes by all means I want them to get councelling, but I want them to be getting councelling INSIDE A PRISON not outside where they can still be around children.

[Canes4Ever]

Originally posted by 47john
it is not the christian way to turn your back on anyone regardless of what they did , people from the catholic church spend many many hours in jails and prisons and everywhere else the rest of us are afraid to venture , they do it to offer compassion to people in need , so if you want to blame the catholic church for failing to understand the severity of these crimes and not dealing with it as well as they could have , fine . just realize , you are speaking of a handful of individuals who made the mistake . and it was the job of the police , and the judicial system , not the church to prosecute these INDIVIDUALS .

I am in no way wanting to turn my back on these men, I want them to get help, but we can't get them help unless it is made known to the public.

47John I assure you it is not just a handful of individuals, when all is said and done it's going to involve hundreds of priests.

By the way, when people fail to come forward to the police to tell them a crime has been committed, but instead go to the Diocese office and then to a lawyer, no police are involved, because what is done is the people settle out of court and get huge amounts of cash from the Church to NOT come forward. That is why its being classified as HUSH MONEY. The Church has bought the silence of those that have been molested.

Without fail I will try and find some threads that you can follow and learn more about this disgrace upon The Church.

Also I do take exception to your insinuating that I am taking my stand because the Chuch has had problems with gays and gay rights. It has NOTHING to do with that, but it does have EVERYTHING to do with the fact that this is a personal issue with me as I was raped and molested as a child myself when I was 9 years old. It's a very PERSONAL issue with me.

All it does is make me want to

[Canes4Ever]

Originally posted by 47john
i wouldnt wish that on anyone , and i hope i havnt offended you , i wasn't saying we should go help them , i believe they should be punished just the same as everyone else . i just meant the church isnt well equipped to prosecute these crimes .

sorry to hear about your victimization .

47John I didn't want to make mention of it, because it is something I have tried to forget about, as you can understand.

Thank you for your understanding. I am over this thread.....it's not you 47John but I am sick now, just sick. I think you understand.

[Nate_Dog]

Two further points I would like to bring up -

1. The Church and its celibacy rule(this I want to expand on).
I will go out on a limb here and say that a % of people that attracted to a position that makes them exempt from a normal sexual life, may indeed be in question. For it is not a normal human response. Say a person with say skewed views on sex is attract to the priest hood. For a while it frees the person from their issues around sex, as they do not have the option. BUT over time as all disfunctions do, they prop up... and in nastier more twisted ways. So if they address the "no sex issue" then the odd sick fuckers that are yet to abuse children may not so readily be attracted to the job.

2. The History of most Offenders.
When people say "Cut there nuts off etc etc etc" I think that is a rather narrow minded view. I understand everyone should be punished for there actions. BUT if you have ever researched the topic, 70% of sexual abusers were abused them self as children. I think the solution is therapy, when they are in prisioned. That way they have a chance to work through it and have a shot at a normal life. REOFFENDING is a different issuse... think that the person should not be able to resume life as a citizen. It is just to damn dangerous.

JMO.

Interesting thread !

[tryingtogetbig]

Originally posted by Nate_Dog
...That way they have a chance to work through it and have a shot at a normal life. REOFFENDING is a different issuse... think that the person should not be able to resume life as a citizen. It is just to damn dangerous.

JMO.

Interesting thread !

Hey Nate, I agree with what you are saying (& John). One side of me tries to agree, the other says f*ck that. What if 100,000 people are imprisoned each year for child molestation - and let's only concentrate on that particular 100,000. After 15 years of imprisonment and therapy they are released. Optimistically, let's say 75% have been cured (or at least won't reoffend). That means out of one years original total incidents, 25,000 more (additional) children are going to be molested; and this time by repeat offenders. That's where I start getting conflicted emotions on the whole rehab thing. Especially when it is children's innocence we are considering. I agree people deserve 2nd chances, but I believe more that children deserve their first chance. Just my thoughts bros.

peace,

ttgb

[Dr.Evil]

Originally posted by 47john
it was the job of the police , and the judicial system , not the church to prosecute these INDIVIDUALS .

my whole point of starting this thread is that i'm appalled by the fact that the criminal justice system is not pursuing these matters to their best effort and leaving it up to the churches to resolve the issue. the church in response have historically lied and covered up these types of scandals.

sex crimes are very very difficult to prove and many get away with it. i can't say all priests are sex offenders and all churches cover it up, but if all of them were, we the public wouldn't know about most of it anyway.

[Big Buffalo]

In canada Native americans have FINALLY stepped forward and told the horror stories of Catholic ran Boarding schools. The privalages the nuns and priests took with the children is horrible. The church is paying though in the Millions from court cases they lose. It looks like they will be bankrupt eventually and lose whats left of their followers! I know the same events have been takeing place in the US since the first Catholic ran boarding school for assimulateing Native Americans in 1879
Better late then never that this issue finally sees the light of day??

[Dr.Evil]

i just saw this stat today:

128 priests in 29 states have resigned due to sex/molestation scandals since january 2002

[Canes4Ever]

Editorial by JIM MORIN in the Miami Herald today.....

[Nate_Dog]

Originally posted by Dr.Evil


my whole point of starting this thread is that i'm appalled by the fact that the criminal justice system is not pursuing these matters to their best effort and leaving it up to the churches to resolve the issue. the church in response have historically lied and covered up these types of scandals.

sex crimes are very very difficult to prove and many get away with it. i can't say all priests are sex offenders and all churches cover it up, but if all of them were, we the public wouldn't know about most of it anyway.

When is this problem going to be giving the attention it deserves. That is insane!!!

[gixxerboy1]

What ever happened to" seperation of Church and state". I dont get why our law makers meet with church officials about making laws that effects morals. I dont know if i got that across right. But like how they talked to the church about the stem cell research thing.

Preist are people like everyone else and should be treated the same. And any other church member who helped cover things up should be charged also.
I just dont understand how some parents let it get covered up. If they know a preist did something to there kids why didnt they further with the police instead of the church just handleing it. If they just believe in the church that much and think all will be dealt with. Thats sad. Sounds like the church is more brainwashing then worshipping.

[Canes4Ever]

Originally posted by gixxerboy
I just dont understand how some parents let it get covered up. If they know a preist did something to there kids why didnt they further with the police instead of the church just handleing it. If they just believe in the church that much and think all will be dealt with. Thats sad. Sounds like the church is more brainwashing then worshipping.

The parents took the "hush money". It was to be paid off in increments not all at once, so this "buys" the silence of the parents. When these kids are becomeing adults, they are now going after the priests. This is what happened in the Father Goeghan cases in Massachusetts.

[cugar]

What do the Catholic Church and Macy's have in common?

They both have little boys' pants half-off!

[gixxerboy1]

Cugar that was a tastless joke considering that all this is true.

A preist near me was just arrested today

[sp9]

I agree these guys should be sent to a court and if convicted go straight to jail(really should be worse than jail). I am glad they got a hold of that priest today that was raping a six year old child repeatedly and sometimes in the confessional. This preist actually help start a man/boy love association and cardinal Law new the preists feelings towards boys and just moved him around.

The real crime here is the damage this does mentally to children for the rest of their lives. It impacts thier ability to have close relationships and to trust other human beings for a very long time if not forever. These guys should be castrated if convicted with no anesthisia (sp?) and let them bleed to death from their stump of a penis!

[Mrs. T]

There has been a lot of speculation about what folks would do IF ... my opinion of child molesters was politely poo poo'd earlier, and that's ok. I give my opinion, but I certainly don't require that anyone at all agree with me ever on anything. We all make our choices and decisions based on our own personal experiences (or lack thereof). Personally, I was raped/molested repeatedly as a child, beginning at the age of 6. When I told my mother (as best I could at the age of 6), her response was, "That's silly! Why would a grown man be interested in YOU?"

Now, personally, I never received professional counseling or even any particular amount of sympathy. I also didn't grow up to be a child molester. I DID, however, grow up to be a VERY watchful parent. I have never allowed either of my children to be alone with another adult, and I am ever watchful of any signs that there might be ANYTHING AT ALL amiss with either one of them. I learned the difference between right and wrong, both by being taught and by being a victim. By being an extremely protective parent, my kids (now 17 and 19) are both happy, healthy, well adjusted virgins (oh, yes they are) and I have no doubt that they will be great parents because they were taught to be and they will never be victims because they were taught not to be.

I am certainly not qualified to choose the "perfect punishment for child molesters", but I am acquainted with several mental health professionals, one of whom is a prison counselor. I have asked them all if there has ever been a reported case of a child molester being rehabilitated. The answer is NO. Castration keeps them from being sexually able, but they are not cured. If the cycle is broken, that is the only cure. Victims should be counseled and taught the difference between right and wrong. Child molesters should be kept off the streets. If the problem continues to be swept under the rug and the behavior is contuned to be excused, the monster will continue to grow.

[Cycleon]

"Christianity is the best religion. I would have become a Christian myself but I have not found one true Christian."- Mohandas (Mahatma) Ghandi

So many give lip service to being Christians, but how many have fully surrendered their lives so completely to Christ that they have allowed His life to transform them and flow from them. How many can say as the Apostle Paul, "I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ lives in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God who loved me, and gave Himself for me. (Gal.2:20)

During India's struggle for independence from British rule, a man named Mohanda Ghandi, The Mahatma, as he was know (Mahatma, means "great soul") pioneered the use of active, but non-violent resistance as a means of achieving his goal of freeing India. It was well known that in his struggle for independence, Ghandi often quoted Jesus' sayings and parables from the Gospels, and was especially fond of that passage in Matthew's gospel that we call "The Sermon on the Mount." Yet, he was not a Christian and steadfastly rejected any suggestion that he become a Christian.

That fact intrigued a methodist missionary in India named E. Stanley Jones. He met with Ghandi on one occasion and asked him, "Mr. Ghandi, though you quote the words of Christ often, why is that you appear to so adamantly reject becoming his follower?"

Ghandi replied, "Oh, I don't reject your Christ. I love your Christ. It's just that so many of you Christians are so unlike your Christ." Ghandi's rejection of Christianity grew out of an incident that happened when he was a young man. During his years studying law in Britain, he had become attracted to the Christian faith, had studied the Bible and the teachings of Jesus, and was seriously exploring becoming a Christian.

One Sunday, in South Africa where he had gone to practice law after getting his degree, he decided to attend a church service. As he came up the steps of the large church where he intended to go, a white South African elder of the church barred his way at the door. "Where
do you think you're going, kaffir?" the man asked Ghandi in a belligerent tone of voice.

Ghandi replied, "I'd like to attend worship here." The church elder snarled at him, "There's no room for Kaffirs in this church. Get out of here or I'll have my assistants throw you down the steps."

From that moment, Ghandi said, he decided to adopt what good he found in Christianity, but would never again consider becoming a Christian if it meant being part of the church.
I think that says it all

[Cycleon]

How different would India be today perhaps if that preist had showed even the most minute capability of the love that he claimed to represent.

How many Perverted preists have molested boys that have then gone on to molest others or are later "found" to be homosexual or "drawn" to a deviant lifestyle.

Though I have much to answer for myself, I would shudder before GOD to be one of these people - who have led others to damnation for the pursuit of their own pride and pleasure.

Mark 9:41 For whosoever shall give you a cup of water to drink in my name, because ye belong to Christ, verily I say unto you, he shall not lose his reward.
42 And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea.

[sp9]

CYCLEON, Like your post. It is a crazy world we live in! Paul was an amazing guy. Murderer of many Christians but wrote many books in the New Testament. An example for everyone that even murderes can be forgiven. He changed himself through devine intervention. As much as I hate to say it even child molesters can be forgiven.

Mrs. T - I agree with you on your post, especially that victims should seek help. I think there are a majority of victims that would never think about harming a child after what happened to them.

In summary it is just a sad state of affairs in general on this planet. The way some people treat each other. I just hope that one day things will be better.

[Cycleon]

No question that they can be forgiven - but that has to be proceeded by real repentance - and only God can judge that - Since we cant really know that, we have to go with the fact that it is illegal and forgiven or not, the laws of the land still require that justice is done.

God may forgive those who fall down but that dosnt mean that they dont break a leg

[Cycleon]

Originally posted by BigGunz

It doesn't do any good to seek forgiveness if you haven't repented within your heart.

Hard to say it better than that

[Canes4Ever]

Originally posted by BigGunz


Very well spoken, Cycleon. You touch a chord within me.

True, God is a very forgiving God. But the one point about forgiveness that very few people see is that true forgiveness means doing all that is possible to keep yourself from ever committing the same sin again.

As Jesus said so many times: "Your sins are forgiven you. Go and sin no more."

However, certain practitioners (including the clergy) of the Catholic faith presume that by going to services for an hour (or less) on Sundays forgives all their sins of the previous week so that they can turn around and commit the same sins the next week. These hypocrites clearly understand "Your sins are forgiven you." but can't seem to fathom "Go and sin no more." That is really at the height of my disdain for the Catholic faith.

It doesn't do any good to seek forgiveness if you haven't repented within your heart.

Peace,
BG

Big Gunz, I couldn't agree with you more. This is what has always facinated me, but also disgusted me with MOST Christians. It doesn't happen only within the Roman Church, but in every denomination.

I certainly am not an but I try to be as nice a guy as I can. To help others and generally be a cheerful individual. I remain a Christian, but I disdain all the organized Churches and Denominations.

I was brought up as a Southern Baptist and was taught that; go to church every Sunday and pray for God to forgive you for your sins and.......well sadly there never was that "AND". I was never taught that you should try to change your life, only taught that God would change you if you prayed hard enough. I must have been a lousy pray-er.

I hated myself for years because I wanted very much to be a "Good Christian" but was self-loathing of myself because I "sinned" by being raped and molested and because as I became an adult I was having homosexual thoughts. I remained a virgin, yes a VIRGIN** until I was 33 years old, however I still thought I was a sinner because I was made to feel guilty because of my homosexual thoughts. I prayed and prayed, yet I remained a homosexual in my thoughts. I would see a woman and didn't get excited, if I saw a guy with nice muscles and hairy chest I wanted to talk to him, etc etc....After this I would go home and cry and become very depressed because I thought God hated me, or had condemed me for life because of the sin *I* had been involved with by being raped and molested when I was 9 years old. I thought it was my fault, maybe I had enticed him, or I said something to him, or whatever. But I remained a very hurt and scared man, who thought he was a loser, and God wanted him that way because I was a stupid, asshole, jerk and a F*G. My Self-Esteem on a level of 1-10 was I owed 5 points.

Thankfully when I was 33 I stood up for myself and really forgave myself, no not for being gay, but for not realizing that God had made me this way and I had wasted much of my life in self-loathing and self-pity. I now celebrate my openess and express myself in way that many here on AR still don't approve of. I no longer feel guilty about that, I consider that *THEIR* problem not mine. If they are so close-minded and hateful of one of Gods creatures then they are exactly what this post started out about, being unrepentant, unloving and most of all UNCHRISTIAN.

To be Christian is to forgive and learn to love everyone. Heck I even love BulkOrders aka Cryton. I am not perfect, but I at least try to change and have from what I was 20 years ago. I was self-hating, and I showed it by being jealous towards many of the type of guys on this board; they were my sworn enemy....jock/athlete/handsome STRAIGHT men were what I craved sexually but I also loathed them because I wanted to be one of them wasn't and couldn't. After I came out I learned to love-myself, and then that made me able to love others. I think I am now closer to being a Christian than I have ever been.

In my heart I have forgiven Mr. Cunningham for what he did to me when I was 9 years old. It is not for me to sit in judgement, Jesus will do that for me when the time of Judgement Day is upon us.

As for the Roman Church and the offending Priests, they need to really understand the nature of God's Gift of Forgiveness and yes, believe it or not, if they TRULY repent of what they have done, and sin no more, then God will forgive them. That however has no bearing on what we as a society need to do to these men, and that is make them pay for their crimes. For what they have done can be forgiven by God, but is still punishable by men.

Thank you (said like Sister Mary Elephant....Cheech and Chong fans will at that one....geeesh, boy does this give my age away)

---

** I still believe a person is a Virgin even if they have had sex, if it was under duress. For a person to lose their virginity, it needs to be voluntary. Just my opinion however.

[Kid Shred]

Originally posted by CYCLEON
"Christianity is the best religion. I would have become a Christian myself but I have not found one true Christian."- Mohandas (Mahatma) Ghandi

So many give lip service to being Christians, but how many have fully surrendered their lives so completely to Christ that they have allowed His life to transform them and flow from them. How many can say as the Apostle Paul, "I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ lives in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God who loved me, and gave Himself for me. (Gal.2:20)

During India's struggle for independence from British rule, a man named Mohanda Ghandi, The Mahatma, as he was know (Mahatma, means "great soul") pioneered the use of active, but non-violent resistance as a means of achieving his goal of freeing India. It was well known that in his struggle for independence, Ghandi often quoted Jesus' sayings and parables from the Gospels, and was especially fond of that passage in Matthew's gospel that we call "The Sermon on the Mount." Yet, he was not a Christian and steadfastly rejected any suggestion that he become a Christian.

That fact intrigued a methodist missionary in India named E. Stanley Jones. He met with Ghandi on one occasion and asked him, "Mr. Ghandi, though you quote the words of Christ often, why is that you appear to so adamantly reject becoming his follower?"

Ghandi replied, "Oh, I don't reject your Christ. I love your Christ. It's just that so many of you Christians are so unlike your Christ." Ghandi's rejection of Christianity grew out of an incident that happened when he was a young man. During his years studying law in Britain, he had become attracted to the Christian faith, had studied the Bible and the teachings of Jesus, and was seriously exploring becoming a Christian.

One Sunday, in South Africa where he had gone to practice law after getting his degree, he decided to attend a church service. As he came up the steps of the large church where he intended to go, a white South African elder of the church barred his way at the door. "Where
do you think you're going, kaffir?" the man asked Ghandi in a belligerent tone of voice.

Ghandi replied, "I'd like to attend worship here." The church elder snarled at him, "There's no room for Kaffirs in this church. Get out of here or I'll have my assistants throw you down the steps."

From that moment, Ghandi said, he decided to adopt what good he found in Christianity, but would never again consider becoming a Christian if it meant being part of the church.
I think that says it all

Great post , I'm a fellow Indian as well , born in Delhi and hold the G-man with great respect due to his successfull acts of Passive-Resistance against the British.I've been to his memorial several times and always get that shiver when seeing his Blood Stain on the Concrete enclosed in glass.Then I look and see the two gunmen on each side of the glass and think how ironic. I think it's important to note that Gandhi's Passive -Resistance ideals were based on the principles of Henry David Thoreau and his works on "Civil Disobedience',as the G-man was a great admirer of Thoreau.The G-man turned Thoreau words into action.May he rest in Peace.

[Gear101]

two words.. Capital Punishment

[tryingtogetbig]

We sure do have some very insightful people on this board. I hadn't read this thread in a few days so I just went through the posts since I last posted, and I realized I am very fortunate.

Mrs T: You are a very strong woman. I'm not talking about in the gym either. It is amazing that you have come so far and maintained such a positive attitude. Your children are very lucky. I agree with what you said about child molesters "get them off of the streets". I don't guess when it is all boiled down anything else matters (punishment, rehab, etc.), just as long as they are off the streets and can't commit the same act twice.

Cycleon: You should be a college educator (if you are not already-I can't remember). Very, Very educated, in-depth insight into a very complicated situation. Thanks for sharing your insight and wisdom.

Big-Gunz: You are right about repenting. How could the catholic church truly ever know if a priest has repented? They can't. That is why they need to let the government prosecute these guys and get them off of the streets. It's like the priests are getting a 3 strike law from the church, but in this case each strike (that they actually get caught) is the loss of innocence for a child. Very Sad.

Canes: I am sorry it took you so long to get the "brain washing" out of your system. I am very happy that you have learned to like yourself. You are one hell of guy. I too am not fond of organized religion. I feel guilty sometimes for not going to church on Sundays-sometimes I think I feel like I am being lazy and should do more to show God I truly do respect him. But everytime I go to church and see the two-faced people in there speaking out of both sides of their mouths, I feel it puts distance between me and my beliefs. I almost become anti-religion, and that's not what I am. I am just anti-bullshit. If you know what I mean.

Scott: I have convinced myself that someday things will get better. I think if any of ever give up on that, it's a sad day. I know what you are saying bro.

I enjoyed reading everyone's feelings on this very complicated and sad matter. I do see something good coming out of all this. By discussing all of this with you guys I feel closer to my new friends.

Peace,

ttgb

[Mrs. T]

47john - I wasn't the least bit offended that you disagree with me. Do it any time you want to. Your opinions are based on what you know, my opinions are based on what I know. It's absolutely possible for two people to have completely different viewpoints and both be right.

Canes - I understand a lot about what you have gone through. Not the gay part, but the guilty victim part. Probably not by coincidence I was also raised Southern Baptist. Isn't it amazing that if you can get away from THAT, you can find yourself? I spent a HUGE part of my life trying to figure out what I did to deserve to be victimized. God did, indeed, make you and everything about you. He loves you for who you are. It really IS ok to just get on with being THAT guy ... with no apologies needed. Love you.

[Canes4Ever]

Originally posted by Mrs. T

Canes - I understand a lot about what you have gone through. Not the gay part, but the guilty victim part. Probably not by coincidence I was also raised Southern Baptist. Isn't it amazing that if you can get away from THAT, you can find yourself? I spent a HUGE part of my life trying to figure out what I did to deserve to be victimized. God did, indeed, make you and everything about you. He loves you for who you are. It really IS ok to just get on with being THAT guy ... with no apologies needed. Love you.

Love you too Mrs. T. you are one cool sister !

I guess this has been a very cathartic thread for me in many ways. I have gotten to express things that I have kept hidden and wash them away in a sense. That is why I appreciate this open forum. We ALL are more than just lifters and bodybuilders, we are all first and foremost human beings, with all the range of emotions that encompasses.

peace and good wishes to you too TTGB, I have gotten to know you through our PM's and think extremely highly of you, young man. You have your head screwed on straight and I know you will go far in your life.

See something good has come from such a disgusting topic. I just wish we could do that with all the victims of those that have commited these crimes against the innocent.

[Dr.Evil]

Originally posted by Canes4Ever

In my heart I have forgiven Mr. Cunningham for what he did to me when I was 9 years old. It is not for me to sit in judgement, Jesus will do that for me when the time of Judgement Day is upon us.

i see that you still have faith... but what if god doesn't exist and what if there is no afterlife or judgement day? you don't want to pursue the prosecution of mr. cunningham? chances are you're not the only kid he ever abused or will abuse later...

[Canes4Ever]

Originally posted by Dr.Evil


i see that you still have faith... but what if god doesn't exist and what if there is no afterlife or judgement day? you don't want to pursue the prosecution of mr. cunningham? chances are you're not the only kid he ever abused or will abuse later...

Dr. Evil,

Mr Cunningham has been dead over 10 years, so anything other than forgiveness on my part & in my heart, is wasted energy. I'd rather love than hate, just the way I am.

[angry_clown]

Please keep in mind guys, that there are priests out there who joined the priesthood for the right reasons & are true to the word of god.

[Canes4Ever]

Originally posted by angry_clown
Please keep in mind guys, that there are priests out there who joined the priesthood for the right reasons & are true to the word of god.

No one has ever disputed that, we aren't talking about those priests, but we are talking about those that have abused & molested children. As we are finding out, there are more than have ever been suspected and this is a porblem worthy of discussion, and not to be swept under the carpet.

[angry_clown]

Yes I agree, but alot of people are makeing the assumption that all priest are child molesters

[Canes4Ever]

Originally posted by angry_clown
Yes I agree, but alot of people are makeing the assumption that all priest are child molesters

I don't think so, but I am not everyone, but I have tried to make it clear in my posts its only the criminal priests I am talking about.

[tryingtogetbig]

Originally posted by angry_clown
Yes I agree, but alot of people are makeing the assumption that all priest are child molesters

How can you tell the difference. If it's your children your sending to church to be alone with someone, will you automatically assume that your priest won't commit the same actions? That's the bad thing about a child's innocence - once it's taken, it's gone!

Just a thought bro. I know not all priests are bad. But the facts are coming out that many are, and that's pretty damn scary.

peace,

ttgb