Truth about 9mm and LE

**Obs** · 08-10-2017, 12:53 PM

The REAL Truth About Why Law Enforcement is Migrating to the 9mm - Bryce Towsley Read the whole thing.

BG · 08-10-2017, 02:18 PM

I want my 4 minutes of life I just wasted on reading that back

**Obs** · 08-10-2017, 02:38 PM

Oh damn are you packin your nine?

That was one of the funniest articles I have ever read.

**Capebuffalo** · 08-10-2017, 04:23 PM

Two words. Shot Placement.

**Obs** · 08-10-2017, 04:30 PM

Originally Posted by Capebuffalo

Two words. Shot Placement.

Agreed. Still hilarious though. Whole article is a spoof.

**songdog** · 08-10-2017, 07:38 PM

45 gets it done the 9mm is for women.

**Obs** · 08-10-2017, 11:57 PM

Originally Posted by songdog

45 gets it done the 9mm is for women.

Well said sir

**EDCG19** · 08-11-2017, 12:47 AM

All I carry is a 9...

Sent from my HTC6535LVW using Tapatalk

**Obs** · 08-11-2017, 01:00 AM

Originally Posted by goalinmind

All I carry is a 9...

Sent from my HTC6535LVW using Tapatalk

Well yeah but sometimes thats all the extra weight you need in your purse.

Its all good brother.

**Capebuffalo** · 08-11-2017, 04:15 AM

Originally Posted by goalinmind

All I carry is a 9...

Sent from my HTC6535LVW using Tapatalk

Me too. And my BUG is a .380.

Most guys who can't shoot think you need bigger and more power.
Shot placement trumps caliber everyday all day.

Other guy, I hit him in the shoulder with my .44 and it knocked him down.
Me. I put 2 9mm in the chest and 1 in the head. It killed him.

**-Ender-** · 08-11-2017, 05:59 AM

.380 will still break the pelvis.

I prefer .40 s&w, but since this spring my primary has been .380. So much easier to carry in warmer weather.

**kelkel** · 08-11-2017, 06:46 AM

Originally Posted by Obspowerstroke

Well yeah but sometimes thats all the extra weight you need in your purse.

Its all good brother.

**Mooseman33** · 08-11-2017, 07:58 AM

glock 42 and 43.

as Cape said, shot placement. plus you can carry either in a pocket, well the 42 in a pocket.

45 is much heavier, in south florida its real hot every day.

**Obs** · 08-11-2017, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by Capebuffalo

Me too. And my BUG is a .380.

Most guys who can't shoot think you need bigger and more power.
Shot placement trumps caliber everyday all day.

Other guy, I hit him in the shoulder with my .44 and it knocked him down.
Me. I put 2 9mm in the chest and 1 in the head. It killed him.

I will never agree and 99.99% of people will be lucky to hit a torso in a real firefight. Fbi agents dont miss especially under pressure. Look up the fbi miami incident. They were chest shots.
Too many times people get hit with 9mm and .40 and it does not phase them.

**RaginCajun** · 08-11-2017, 10:36 AM

like some have mentioned, shot placement and also bullet weight/type (jacked hollow point, etc.........).

i just purchased a small 9mm, and plan on carrying it. it will be loaded with defense rounds, prob 147gr

also have a .40 s&w, it is subcompact but not as small as the M&P Shield 9mm

i am looking for a concealed class to take

**Obs** · 08-11-2017, 10:39 AM

The shot placement for most in a high stress situation willbe squeezing the trigger as fast as they can till their 16 shots is spent in their glock.
1911 .45. Minimum.

**Couchlock** · 08-11-2017, 11:11 AM

Originally Posted by Obspowerstroke

The shot placement for most in a high stress situation willbe squeezing the trigger as fast as they can till their 16 shots is spent in their glock.
1911 .45. Minimum.

Empty a double stack 45 (12-14 rnds)
In an attacker, that's guaranteed 6 to 7 inches worth of entry wounds. And god only knows the exits wounds.

Again, you wants expansion and energy deposit to create the biggest temporary wound Channel possible to damage soft tissue

That being said there's not much difference from a 380 to a 45 in ballistic gel when it comes to Temporary wound cavity when loaded with proper quality hollow point ammunition

Once you get up into the 41 magnum and bigger territory the wound Channel looks like a bowling ball created it

**Capebuffalo** · 08-11-2017, 11:18 AM

Originally Posted by Obspowerstroke

The shot placement for most in a high stress situation willbe squeezing the trigger as fast as they can till their 16 shots is spent in their glock.
1911 .45. Minimum.

I take tactical training. I'm not going to blow my wad. One target shoot until the threat is neutralized. Multiple targets two shots in each starting with the closest and work back. Then come back and acquire and engage closest threat. Always moving to cover if possible. Never stand still. Always be working to better the situation.

**Obs** · 08-11-2017, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by Capebuffalo

I take tactical training. I'm not going to blow my wad. One target shoot until the threat is neutralized. Multiple targets two shots in each starting with the closest and work back. Then come back and acquire and engage closest threat. Always moving to cover if possible. Never stand still. Always be working to better the situation.

All cops do this then you hear on the news where four of them fire 15 shots each and hit nothing.

"You never know who is worth a fuck until that first bullet passes overhead" -master gunnery sargeant Hales

**Obs** · 08-11-2017, 11:27 AM

Originally Posted by Couchlockd

Empty a double stack 45 (12-14 rnds)
In an attacker, that's guaranteed 6 to 7 inches worth of entry wounds. And god only knows the exits wounds.

Again, you wants expansion and energy deposit to create the biggest temporary wound Channel possible to damage soft tissue

That being said there's not much difference from a 380 to a 45 in ballistic gel when it comes to Temporary wound cavity when loaded with proper quality hollow point ammunition

Once you get up into the 41 magnum and bigger territory the wound Channel looks like a bowling ball created it

Its shock man. A 30-30 winchester will kill a capebuffalo but cape took a 470 nitro express for a reason. They are dangerous as hell. Need all the help you can get

**Capebuffalo** · 08-11-2017, 11:33 AM

Originally Posted by Obspowerstroke

All cops do this then you hear on the news where four of them fire 15 shots each and hit nothing.

"You never know who is worth a fuck until that first bullet passes overhead" -master gunnery sargeant Hales

12 weeks at the academy and a few hours on a range in an individual lane doesn't speak much to preparedness. I'm running live fire with 2 or 4 men teams being screamed at and having to find the instructor and see how many fingers he's holding up on each hand while putting shots down range and covering team members. I'm putting over 1000 rnds down range each time I train there.

**Couchlock** · 08-11-2017, 11:34 AM

Its about energy

A 223 is a .224 diameter slug, yet it wrecks ballistic he'll like a mad man.

A 50gi is 50 caliber, but looks like a 9mm in gell

**Obs** · 08-11-2017, 11:39 AM

Originally Posted by Couchlockd

Its about energy

A 223 is a .224 diameter slug, yet it wrecks ballistic he'll like a mad man.

A 50gi is 50 caliber, but looks like a 9mm in gell

Perfect example. Now shoot a deer and you will see the difference. Deposited energy. Gel is not an indicator of anything but penetration and bone totally changes that comparison.
.50 will roll a deer at any distance. .223 better be a damn vital shot or you will be trailing blood for a quarter mile.

**Obs** · 08-11-2017, 11:41 AM

Originally Posted by Capebuffalo

12 weeks at the academy and a few hours on a range in an individual lane doesn't speak much to preparedness. I'm running live fire with 2 or 4 men teams being screamed at and having to find the instructor and see how many fingers he's holding up on each hand while putting shots down range and covering team members. I'm putting over 1000 rnds down range each time I train there.

I am sure you would do fine just because you can handle adrenaline. The vast majority of people carrying cant.
Shit goes down and they clam up go stiff and move and think slower rather than faster.

**Capebuffalo** · 08-11-2017, 11:44 AM

Originally Posted by Obspowerstroke

I am sure you would do fine just because you can handle adrenaline. The vast majority of people carrying cant.
Shit goes down and they clam up go stiff and move and think slower rather than faster.

And I'm a firm believer there should be a mandatory 40 hr course to be eligible to obtain a concealed carry permit. Just because you pass a background check doesn't mean you're ready to carry a firearm.

Tell someone to watch their back ground and they will just stand there wondering what in the hell that means.

**Obs** · 08-11-2017, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by Capebuffalo

And I'm a firm believer there should be a mandatory 40 hr course to be eligible to obtain a concealed carry permit. Just because you pass a background check doesn't mean you're ready to carry a firearm.

Tell someone to watch their back ground and they will just stand there wondering what in the hell that means.

Did you see that off duty cop getting robbed at the atm?
His response was picture perfect. He used every rule in the book in about 10 seconds.

**Couchlock** · 08-11-2017, 12:07 PM

155g jhp 10mm in gel
https://youtu.be/QtFvSC9WCQM

230g gold dot jhp 45 acp in gell
https://youtu.be/d2taJFU1vG8

124g +p gold dot jhp 9mm in gell
https://youtu.be/zHqJw8BzUhM

90g +p jhp .380 in gel
https://youtu.be/uKLX4VqZjMI

230g jhp 50 gi in gel
https://youtu.be/uO6GSRB-nQI

240g jhp gold dot 44mag
https://youtu.be/VXhCHhFFIFc

185g jhp .460 Rowland
https://youtu.be/nK6BXjf-53w

460g (1 oz) slug 12gauge
https://youtu.be/nK6BXjf-53w

160g 30-30 leverevolution job
https://youtu.be/Jnze4dZU27k

750g 50bmg in gel. Lol nice
https://youtu.be/C7pAXj89hok

556x45 m855 (62g?) In gel
https://youtu.be/HRbAfdoU9vY

**Couchlock** · 08-11-2017, 12:11 PM

Originally Posted by Obspowerstroke

Perfect example. Now shoot a deer and you will see the difference. Deposited energy. Gel is not an indicator of anything but penetration and bone totally changes that comparison.
.50 will roll a deer at any distance. .223 better be a damn vital shot or you will be trailing blood for a quarter mile.

A 50gi is a stretched 45acp topped with a light for caliber .500 diameter slug. Its just a 45 auto.

A 500 mag, or a 50 action express (desert negro) is a very formidable punch

Guns will kill, that's about the crux of the matter.

**Obs** · 08-11-2017, 12:12 PM

Originally Posted by Couchlockd

A 50gi is a stretched 45acp topped with a light for caliber .500 diameter slug. Its just a 45 auto.

A 500 mag, or a 50 action express (desert negro) is a very formidable punch

Guns will kill, that's about the crux of the matter.

I knowbut i love debating them.

BG · 08-11-2017, 02:57 PM

Originally Posted by Obspowerstroke

I will never agree and 99.99% of people will be lucky to hit a torso in a real firefight. Fbi agents dont miss especially under pressure. Look up the fbi miami incident. They were chest shots.
Too many times people get hit with 9mm and .40 and it does not phase them.

plus the 9mm wont go through a windshield of a car.