Has anyone actually done a Deca only cycle??

[justaname]

It seems like everyone is constantly slamming Deca but if you take the Deca d**k issue out of the equation it seems you have a very safe moderatly strong steroid without worrying to much about hair loss or prostate cancer...All gear shuts down your natural test production dbol winny tren take any of them without test and you are gonna get a limp noodle eventually.


(ready with my flame retardant suit for what is sure to come)

[Dmize9]

Yes..... Before I found this sight and had any clue about what i was doing. It's a real bad idea. I only did six weeks, every workout sucked because I was absolutely lethargic and had no energy, and no real gains to speak of. It's true when they say if you don't have test, you don't have a cycle.

[dive_kid]

I did 5 weeks before I got some test in there.
I felt like ****. Tired and real cranky. I was pissed off about every thing all the time. started the test......it all cleared up.
I like deca ...Ilove it with test

[sniper320]

My first cycle was deca and d-bol, i didnt know what i was doing and i learned the hard way, sooooo deppresed no sex drive and hardly any gains. dont even think about it.

[justaname]

I am a week into one now I just moved here and its all I have..I havnt even found a decent gym yet I am working out at the YMCA and None of the 90 year old patrons seem to have any gear....you guys think I wont get anything out of it?

[einstein1905]

I am a week into one now I just moved here and its all I have..I havnt even found a decent gym yet I am working out at the YMCA and None of the 90 year old patrons seem to have any gear....you guys think I wont get anything out of it?

You'll very likely get gains with a deca -only cycle....that's not the point.....nor is "deca dick" the main thing you should worry about. It's the overall effects of a deca only cycle that are unwise to gamble with.
I use stupid analogies all too often, but here's another:

You'll hear many people say, "I did a deca only cycle, and I had no problems". Likely true. Similarly, you could hear many people say, "I ran out into oncoming traffic and didn't get hurt"...this may very well be true too.....my point is, don't go out into oncoming traffic in the first place.
Deca is notorious for increasing prolactin levels...elevated prolactin levels are known to inhibit dopaminergic actions. This can lead to depression-like states (and full-blown depression) as well as libido issues. Also, deca has relatively little androgenic component to it, yet taking it shuts down endogenous test and therefore DHT synthesis....this leaves you in an androgen-deprived state, so gains will tend to be very "soft". The main reason for adding test though, is that testosteron is dopaminergic.......it counters the anti-dopaminergic effects of elevated prolactin from deca. Sure, you should be taking something to combat elevated prolactin in the first place, but that still won't take care of the lack of androgens in your body.


Don't just write off the fact that so many warn against a deca only cycle......sure, thread parroting has become epidemic, but when so many are singin gthe same song, there's likely good reason for it.

[50%Natural]

yes, and simply put it was hell coming off

[MMC78]

Also, deca has relatively little androgenic component to it, yet taking it shuts down endogenous test and therefore DHT synthesis....this leaves you in an androgen-deprived state, so gains will tend to be very "soft".

So then does it follow that taking finasteride would also render gains (whether obtained naturally or not) soft?

[BeefCakeStew]

So then does it follow that taking finasteride would also render gains (whether obtained naturally or not) soft?

Correct me if I am wrong.

No, Finasteride will not completely inhibit DHT conversion, it will slow it down.

Even without DHT, Testosterone alone acts on androgenic receptors, just not as much as DHT.

[50%Natural]

Correct me if I am wrong.

No, Finasteride will not completely inhibit DHT conversion, it will slow it down.

Even without DHT, Testosterone alone acts on androgenic receptors, just not as much as DHT.

of course it acts the androgen receptor...that is the only receptor aas bind to

[BeefCakeStew]

of course it acts the androgen receptor...that is the only receptor aas bind to

I went off on an irrelevant and/or arbitrary tangent. For some reason, at the time, I thought I was writing something substantial yet concise .

What I should have said is, DHT conversion optimizes the effects of Testosterone on libido and the other androgenic functions of Testosterone ; however, with supraphysiological Testosterone levels , the Test alone should act well enough on the centers in the brain controlling libido and on the receptors controlling muscle quality. Also, since Test levels are very high, I doubt finasteride will completely inhibit Test to DHT conversion enough to create an androgen deficient state significant enough to adversely effect (above a reasonable degree) muscle quality and/or libido, CNS..., via AR's or any other mechanisms.

Again, correct me if I am wrong.

[MMC78]

of course it acts the androgen receptor...that is the only receptor aas bind to

I was under the impression that there were two seperate receptors: andogenic and anabolic each with a high affinity for either DHT or Test respectively.

Otherwise, how could a substance like deca produce marked anabolic effects without much in the way of androgenic side effects?


Or maybe there is one receptor (AR) which behaves differently whether DHT or Test binds to it...

****it, I wish there was a good available text that covered these things without requiring 2 semesters of biochem and endocrinology.

[einstein1905]

I was under the impression that there were two seperate receptors: andogenic and anabolic each with a high affinity for either DHT or Test respectively.

Otherwise, how could a substance like deca produce marked anabolic effects without much in the way of androgenic side effects?


Or maybe there is one receptor (AR) which behaves differently whether DHT or Test binds to it...

****it, I wish there was a good available text that covered these things without requiring 2 semesters of biochem and endocrinology.

The androgen receptor is all that's directly relevant with AAS, with blocking of glucocorticoid receptors being an indirect effect (there are also non AR-mediated AAS effects too). However, since there are also AR coactivators, this helps to explain why some AAS that may have weak AR binding affinity may still be very androgenic, as the ligand-receptor conformation is important in recruiting AR coactivators, and it's the combination of these actions that mediate a particular AAS's effects

[BeefCakeStew]

I was under the impression that there were two seperate receptors: andogenic and anabolic each with a high affinity for either DHT or Test respectively.

Otherwise, how could a substance like deca produce marked anabolic effects without much in the way of androgenic side effects?


Or maybe there is one receptor (AR) which behaves differently whether DHT or Test binds to it...

****it, I wish there was a good available text that covered these things without requiring 2 semesters of biochem and endocrinology.

I am still learning, but DHT and Test effect physiology by other means than AR receptors also. For instance, DHT and Test have and affinities for location in the brains that stimulate CNS and cause strength. Nandrolone doesnt have the same affinities. As for AAS and AR receptors, check out this quote from mesmo:

"Once a molecule of AAS is bound to the AR, the receptor now travels to the nucleus of the cell, and forms a dimer (pair) with another activated AR. The dimer then binds to certain parts of the DNA, and certain genes then start producing more mRNA. This is a way for the body to selectively activate only certain genes. In this case, only those genes associated with androgens are activated, or have their activity increased.

mRNA is different for each gene, and carries the information the cell needs to make specific proteins. Myosin and actin, which are major components of muscle, are examples of proteins, and these are made, ultimately, as a result of mRNA production from the genes for those proteins.

At last: muscle protein, our goal. The molecule of AAS ultimately causes the muscle cell to make more of certain proteins, helping the user to get bigger. (There were steps needed to get from the mRNA to the protein, but we will skip them.)"
http://www.mesomorphosis.com/article...c-steroids.htm

[BeefCakeStew]

The androgen receptor is all that's directly relevant with AAS, with blocking of glucocorticoid receptors being an indirect effect (there are also non AR-mediated AAS effects too). However, since there are also AR coactivators, this helps to explain why some AAS that may have weak AR binding affinity may still be very androgenic, as the ligand-receptor conformation is important in recruiting AR coactivators, and it's the combination of these actions that mediate a particular AAS's effects

Einstein, something I am still not certain on. What is it about the primarily anabolic AAS, like Deca , that render the gains soft when not taken with concurrently with androgens like Test, DHT, or even Trenbolone .

In other words, Deca increases protein synthesis, but what about androgens makes the resultant muscle become hard as opposed to soft.

[einstein1905]

Einstein, something I am still not certain on. What is it about the primarily anabolic AAS, like Deca , that render the gains soft when not taken with concurrently with androgens like Test, DHT, or even Trenbolone .

In other words, Deca increases protein synthesis, but what about androgens makes the resultant muscle become hard as opposed to soft.

Now you're asking questions that are tough. I don't have a definite answer, but I'd guess that the more androgenic compounds increase the expression of primarily contractile proteins like myosin and actin to a much greater degree than they do other muscular proteins not as specific to the generation of force. So, the result is a more dense musculature....a more functional musculature, whereas the more predominately anabolic compounds increase expression of other muscular proteins not as directly related to the generation of force (but they also increase myosin and actin expression), so that cell volume is increased, but not proportional to strength. This may not be entirely true either though, as a lot of the strength increases from the traditional androgenic compounds comes from them acting at the neuromuscular/myoneural junction to increase muscle fiber recruitment. I may dig around and come back to this

[BeefCakeStew]

Now you're asking questions that are tough. I don't have a definite answer, but I'd guess that the more androgenic compounds increase the expression of primarily contractile proteins like myosin and actin to a much greater degree than they do other muscular proteins not as specific to the generation of force. So, the result is a more dense musculature....a more functional musculature, whereas the more predominately anabolic compounds increase expression of other muscular proteins not as directly related to the generation of force (but they also increase myosin and actin expression), so that cell volume is increased, but not proportional to strength. This may not be entirely true either though, as a lot of the strength increases from the traditional androgenic compounds comes from them acting at the neuromuscular/myoneural junction to increase muscle fiber recruitment. I may dig around and come back to this

Very interesting. I will be all ears (figuratively speaking of course) when you reply with new confirming, or disconfirming, info.

[weightshead]

Now you're asking questions that are tough. I don't have a definite answer, but I'd guess that the more androgenic compounds increase the expression of primarily contractile proteins like myosin and actin to a much greater degree than they do other muscular proteins not as specific to the generation of force. So, the result is a more dense musculature....a more functional musculature, whereas the more predominately anabolic compounds increase expression of other muscular proteins not as directly related to the generation of force (but they also increase myosin and actin expression), so that cell volume is increased, but not proportional to strength. This may not be entirely true either though, as a lot of the strength increases from the traditional androgenic compounds comes from them acting at the neuromuscular/myoneural junction to increase muscle fiber recruitment. I may dig around and come back to this

i hope you do come back to this.

very interesting so far.

[Anhydro78]

My first cycle was a Deca only cycle. I was in worst shape after than when I started, and what I mean by that is my workouts suffered. I was less athletic than when I started.Personally I dont think the sex drive issue is the main issue here. Whats the point of taking the wrong mixture of steroids that creates a very anabolic enviroment but you have no androgens to actually give you the strength and energy to needed to push out a workout that will create growth.

[justaname]

ok so should I stop right now then?
I really need a cycle but not if I am worse off after the fact. I have been training natural for the last two years in an attempt to concentrate and my health and losing size the whole **** time. It has taken two years but I have lost almost all of what I gained from the few cycles I did. Which amounted to about 30 pounds. all I have read untill I came here made it seem like Deca was about the easiest on the body easy on the hair, prostate etc...

[einstein1905]

ok so should I stop right now then?
I really need a cycle but not if I am worse off after the fact. I have been training natural for the last two years in an attempt to concentrate and my health and losing size the whole **** time. It has taken two years but I have lost almost all of what I gained from the few cycles I did. Which amounted to about 30 pounds. all I have read untill I came here made it seem like Deca was about the easiest on the body easy on the hair, prostate etc...

Get ahold of some test and a research site for anti e's and you'll be fine