Anti-Estrogen's 2 Weeks Proir to Cycle?

**gr8gear** · 09-06-2005, 08:12 AM

I've been reading around and have found that many find it favorable to start anti-estrogens around 2 weeks prior to a cycle. The cycle I will be doing is from Mud Man's great post: http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...=Cycles+newbie

I plan on running:
1 - 4 Propionate 75mg EOD
1 – 12 Cyp 400mg/wk
1 – 12 EQ 400mg/wk
1 – 15 Nolvadex 10mg ED
1 – 15 L-dex .25mg ED

I under stand that the Cyp is a slower released ester, so I wanted to jump start my test levels with the Prop. Since the prop will increase my blood levels faster should I start taking the Nolvadex 2 weeks prior to this cycle?
I know its typically taken prior to cycles with faster releasing esters as opposed to those like the Cyp and Undec, but should it be done do to the use of the Prop? Thanks bros.

**symatech** · 09-06-2005, 08:44 AM

You can run it before the cycle starts, I personally do not because I don't really have a problems with those effects, but if you are sensitive to gyno or whatnot then you can start your nolva before your cycle. It's not a necessity though.

**TheMudMan** · 09-06-2005, 10:32 AM

Originally Posted by gr8gear

I've been reading around and have found that many find it favorable to start anti-estrogens around 2 weeks prior to a cycle. The cycle I will be doing is from Mud Man's great post: http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...=Cycles+newbie

I plan on running:
1 - 4 Propionate 75mg EOD
1 – 12 Cyp 400mg/wk
1 – 12 EQ 400mg/wk
1 – 15 Nolvadex 10mg ED
1 – 15 L-dex .25mg ED

I under stand that the Cyp is a slower released ester, so I wanted to jump start my test levels with the Prop. Since the prop will increase my blood levels faster should I start taking the Nolvadex 2 weeks prior to this cycle?
I know its typically taken prior to cycles with faster releasing esters as opposed to those like the Cyp and Undec, but should it be done do to the use of the Prop? Thanks bros.

It really doesn't matter if it's a short or long estered compound when it comes to aromatization. Test levels are being built from the first injection and there will some aromatiztion taking place. I'm not gyno prone but I still start all my anti-e's 2 weeks prior to the cycle.

**Property of Steroid.com** · 09-06-2005, 11:31 AM

Originally Posted by TheMudMan

I'm not gyno prone but I still start all my anti-e's 2 weeks prior to the cycle.

Save your money. Start taking them four days before your cycle.

Even though it takes a week for Arimidex to reach steady state plasma levels in the blood, and letrozole takes up to 60 days, the time needed to reach maximal estrogen (E2) suppression levels is only 2–4 days for either of them. (1)(2)

References:

Plourde P. V., Dyroff M., Dowsett M., Demers L., Yates R., Webster A. ARIMIDEX: a new oral, once-a-day aromatase inhibitor. J. Steroid Biochem. Mol. Biol., 53: 175-179, 1995.
Demers L. M., Lipton A., Harvey H. A., Kambic K. B., Grossberg H., Brady C., Santen R. J. The efficacy of CGS 20267 in suppressing estrogen biosynthesis in patients with advanced stage breast cancer. J. Steroid Biochem. Mol. Biol., 44: 687-691, 1993.

**dazbo** · 09-06-2005, 11:35 AM

Id listen to hooker - you can ALWAYS rely on him!!

**jucinator** · 09-06-2005, 11:41 AM

yeah go with hooker, i myself prefer letro it works great for me just 3 squirts eod.

**chest6** · 09-06-2005, 12:23 PM

you could run the cyp for one more week and bump it up to 500mg....but thats up to you

**TheMudMan** · 09-06-2005, 01:02 PM

Originally Posted by dazbo

Id listen to hooker - you can ALWAYS rely on him!!

The information that hooker provided here is very useful especially in cases where a user is experiencing estrogen related sides and wasn't running and AI durring the cycle. This information is useful to indicate when the drug will help suppress estrogen. But the information I gave isn't wrong this is how I have started my cycles and I have never seen any problems from estrogen related sides. So there are a lot of other peple you can rely on as well.

**Property of Steroid.com** · 09-06-2005, 01:16 PM

Advice contrary to mine isn't always wrong, it's just not (in this case) optimal. You can suppress estrogen within 4 days on the compounds being discussed; ergo, taking it a week, or 2 weeks, or 10 or 100 weeks before going on a cycle isn't wrong, per se, it's just not doing much for you....i.e. starting your AI's 2 weeks prior to a cycle provides no additional benefit over starting your AI's 4 days before the cycle. You save 10 days worth of your AI, my way.

You can turn a doorknob three times every time you open a door, also, but it doesn't open the door any better than turning it once. My way is turning it once.

**TheMudMan** · 09-06-2005, 01:30 PM

Originally Posted by hooker

Advice contrary to mine isn't always wrong, it's just not (in this case) optimal. You can suppress estrogen within 4 days on the compounds being discussed; ergo, taking it a week, or 2 weeks, or 10 or 100 weeks before going on a cycle isn't wrong, per se, it's just not doing much for you....i.e. starting your AI's 2 weeks prior to a cycle provides no additional benefit over starting your AI's 4 days before the cycle. You save 10 days worth of your AI, my way.

You can turn a doorknob three times every time you open a door, also, but it doesn't open the door any better than turning it once. My way is turning it once.

I agree and I will take what those two references stated into consideration. Instead of two weeks prior I may start one week out. For me money is no issue so that isn't a concern but the concern I have is how long I'm running some of these drugs to help protect me from the other drugs I'm taking.

The original poster was asking about nolvadex . Do you have any information indicating when it would reach a steady state plasma level and keep the estrogen receptor clear?

**Property of Steroid.com** · 09-06-2005, 02:28 PM

I suppose money is an issue for me, but not regarding AAS or ancilliaries, since I don't really pay for them...

I don't know if I understand your question though...

Do you have any information indicating when it would reach a steady state plasma level and keep the estrogen receptor clear?

Do you mean clear or clogged? Like...since estrogen binds, etc, yadda, yadda, blah...I'm sure you know what I'm talking about...the estrogen receptor (in breast tissue) would be clogged, not clear...

Do you mean that?

**TheMudMan** · 09-06-2005, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by hooker

I suppose money is an issue for me, but not regarding AAS or ancilliaries, since I don't really pay for them...

I don't know if I understand your question though...

Do you mean clear or clogged? Like...since estrogen binds, etc, yadda, yadda, blah...I'm sure you know what I'm talking about...the estrogen receptor (in breast tissue) would be clogged, not clear...

Do you mean that?

Clear from binding estrogen. That would be the only concern for anyone in relation to estrogen and gyno.

**Property of Steroid.com** · 09-06-2005, 09:33 PM

Originally Posted by TheMudMan

Clear from binding estrogen. That would be the only concern for anyone in relation to estrogen and gyno.

The receptors will be full, not clear....

SERMs exert their effects by binding to to the estrogen receptor, and/or to the typical anti-estrogen specific binding site, and/or to low density lipoproteins in the plasma. In certain tissues SERMs can block the effects of estrogen, and in others it acts as an actual estrogen, activating the receptor.

SO...I mean you can argue that the receptor is "full" of a binding estrogen (sorta), not clear, when you use nolvadex .