aromasin replace nolvadex?

[jef]

any need for nolvadex and arimidex while using aromasin on a cycle of prop,tren ,eq,var?

recommendations on the number of mgs a day to take of aromasin? I was thinking 30...

[C_Bino]

I dont think you will need 30mg ED on cycle. I havent tried it myself so Im hoping you can get some feedback from Jay or BD on this. I think Jay is running at at 12.5mg ED and I forget what BD ran it at...maybe 20mg ED. The usual amount is 20 or 25mg ED I would say. But obviously Jay is going under that so Im hoping he hops on this thread.
And to answer about nolva, I dont think you will need it, aromasin isnt the strongest AI out there so nolva could be taken with it but if you arent super prone to gyno than I wouldnt worry about it. If you are super prone than I would suggest taking something else instead of aromasin.

[jef]

I have plenty of nolvadex and arimidex on hand...I also have 2 grams of letro to batch up in case of an emergency with gyno...bump for Jay or BD input...

It seems like even with.25 arimidex after about a month or two my nipples itch slightly but no gyno and a lot of water retention

[IBdmfkr]

Map out you cycle for us...

When I ran aromasin I started it at 25mg/day and it held off water-retention great while running Drol,Test,Primo,Deca . About a month in if I remember correctly I had loss of libido so I dropped aromasin back to 25mg EOD which seemed to work much better, BUT towards the end of the cycle I started getting symptoms of gyno on my rights side (itchy/sensativity) so I started Nolva at 20mg/day along with the aromasin at 25mg EOD which proved to be sufficient.

I'd run it at 25mg EOD or 12.5ED like Jay is doing and keep nolva on hand, I am running it at 25mg/Day during PCT w/Proviron + nolva with great results. I think the Proviron is what is saving my libido, without it I'd probably drop the dosage a bit.

[jef]

Map out you cycle for us...

When I ran aromasin I started it at 25mg/day and it held off water-retention great while running Drol,Test,Primo,Deca . About a month in if I remember correctly I had loss of libido so I dropped aromasin back to 25mg EOD which seemed to work much better, BUT towards the end of the cycle I started getting symptoms of gyno on my rights side (itchy/sensativity) so I started Nolva at 20mg/day along with the aromasin at 25mg EOD which proved to be sufficient.

I'd run it at 25mg EOD or 12.5ED like Jay is doing and keep nolva on hand, I am running it at 25mg/Day during PCT w/Proviron + nolva with great results. I think the Proviron is what is saving my libido, without it I'd probably drop the dosage a bit.

for someone sensitive to aromatization and water retention; would you recommend running it like you did and keep arimidex and nolvadex on hand or run them together from the start and drop aromasin?

nolvadex is all I would ever need for signs of gyno with aromasin no?

[jef]

My cycle starts tomorrow:
-2-13 600mg eq wk
1-16 test prop 700mg wk
1-8 tren acetate 350mg wk
1-6 or 8-16 var 50mg day

[IBdmfkr]

My cycle starts tomorrow:
-2-13 600mg eq wk (Run starting week 1)
1-16 test prop 700mg wk (16wks is too long IMO, you'll stop seeing gains around week 10-12).
1-8 tren acetate 350mg wk
1-6 or 8-16 var 50mg day Possibly replace Winstrol wks 8-16 @ 50mg/day as it lowers SHBG which may help w/continuation of gains late in cycle

What's your previous cycle history, age, stats?

for someone sensitive to aromatization and water retention; would you recommend running it like you did and keep arimidex and nolvadex on hand or run them together from the start and drop aromasin ?

nolvadex is all I would ever need for signs of gyno with aromasin no?

That's hard to say, everyone has a little bit different experience with AI/SERMs.. so I'd say pick one and run it at an appropriate dosage and see what happens but have others on hand incase the chosen one fails.

Aromasin/Proviron would be a great stack as well.
25mg/day + 50-100mg/day

If you have access to aromasin I'd go with it to see how it works, I'd start with 25mgEOD and adjust as needed. If you use proviron with it then I'd bump it to 20-25mg/Day.

Eat clean (low sodium/low sugar/low sat fat) and you will be less susceptible to water retention.

[jef]

what's best for zero water retention and zero gyno? I thought aromasin woudl be best and/or better than nolva and arimidex ...sounds like I've misunderstood what I've been reading.

[jef]

Age: 28 - 6'2" - 12.5%bf - 212lbs - training 12 years

Only 1 previous cycle:
1-12 test c 500mg week
13-14 prop 700mg week
1-5 deca 500mg week
1-2 dbol 44mg day (dropped this because it seemed like it caused a shield of itchy scalp)

Originally Posted by jef
My cycle starts tomorrow:
-2-13 600mg eq wk (Run starting week 1) Already kick started it 2 weeks ago and front loaded with 1600mgs

1-16 test prop 700mg wk (16wks is too long IMO, you'll stop seeing gains around week 10-12). was thinking of running it through august since my last cycle showed a breakout with acne after the cycle...maybe this was the clomid?

1-8 tren acetate 350mg wk

1-6 or 8-16 var 50mg day Possibly replace Winstrol wks 8-16 @ 50mg/day as it lowers SHBG which may help w/continuation of gains late in cycle//may try that...have lots of 50mg winny's but was second guessing because of hairloss which I'm not prone to hereditarly wise...basing off of dbol results. I'm not sure how the trent will be there.

I'm sure that most people will say this is a pretty advanced cycle for it only being a second run but I just want to get as shredded as possible bye and for summer.

Thanks for your help BD.

[IBdmfkr]

I'd try other compounds during PCT to see how you react, narrow down if clomid was the cause etc... Possibly Nolva + proviron ?

Tren /Deca are both hard on the hairline as well.. I wouldn't worry about winny affecting it much more than either of those compounds. You could try running finasteride/propecia throughout cycle. Also I'd recommend 200mg B6/day, forgot to list that in last post.

This cycle is intermediate, and maybe a bit too much for a second cycle, but that's up to your judgement. Make sure your diet/training/rest are in order before starting. Maybe start a thread with your current diet in the Diet Forum.

[jef]

what does the b6 do?

Hopefully the tren won't be too bad on the hairline and other sides... If it is then I may go down to 6wk vs. 8. I'll be using nizoral 2% on monday and Friday and 1% on Wednesday.

Probably throw in the winny for the last 6-8 weeks too and see how I react. Would 22mg a day be too little or split 24 and 24mg 2xday?

thanks a mil for you input.

[IBdmfkr]

B6 helps reduce progesterone which in turn help reduce certain sides.

Straight from the profile. The info is all here, use the search function.

"Trenbolone is also a highly androgenic hormone, when compared with testosterone , which has an androgenic ratio of 100; trenbolone’s androgenic ratio is an astonishing 500. Highly androgenic steroids are appreciated for the effects they have on strength as well as changing the estrogen/androgen ratio, thus reducing water and under the skin. As if the report on trenbolone was not good enough, it gets better; Trenbolone is extraordinarily good as a fat loss agent. One reason for this is its powerful effect on nutrient partitioning (9). It is a little known fact is that androgen receptors are found in fat cells as well as muscle cells(10), androgens act directly on the A.R in fat cells to affect fat burning.(11) the stronger the androgen binds to the A.R, the higher the lipolytic (fat burning) effect on adipose tissue (fat)(11). Since some steroids even increase the numbers of A.R in muscle and fat (11, 12) this fat loss effect would be amplified with the concurrent use of other compounds, such as testosterone.

Trenbolone promotes red blood cell production and increases the rate of glycogen replenishment, significantly improving recovery (13). Like almost all steroids, trenbolones effects are dose dependant with higher dosages having the greatest effects on body composition and strength. Mental changes are a notorious side effect of trenbolone use(15), androgens increase chemicals in the brain that promote aggressive behavior(16), which can be beneficial for some athletes wanting to improve speed and power.

Trenbolones chemical structure makes it resistant to the aromatize enzyme (conversion to estrogen) thus absolutely no percentage of trenbolone will convert to estrogen. Trenbolone administration would not promote estrogenic side effects such as breast tissue growth in men (gynecomastia , bitch tits) accelerated fat gain, decline in fat break down and water retention trenbolone. Trenbolone is also resistant to the 5- alpha-reductase enzyme, this enzyme reduces some steroid hormones into a more androgenic form, in trenbolones case however this does not matter, trenbolone boasts an androgenic ratio of 500, it can easily cause adverse androgenic side effects in any steroid.com members who are prone cases of hair loss, prostate enlargement, oily skin and acne have been reported. Unfortunately trenbolones potential negative side effects do not end there. Trenbolone is also a noted progestin: it binds to the receptor of the female sex hormone progesterone (with about 60% of the actual strength progesterone) (17). In sentitive steroid.com members this can lead to bloat and breast growth worse still, trenbolones active metabolite17beta-trenbolone has a binding affinity to the progesterone receptor (PgR) that is actually greater than progesterone itself (18). No need to panic though, the anti-estrogens letrzole or fulvestrant can lower progesterone levels, and combat any progestenic sides. The use of a 19-nor compound like trenbolone also increases prolactin…. bromocriptine or cabergoline are often recommended to lower prolatin levels (20). Testicular atrophy (shrunken balls) may also occur; HCG used intermittently throughout a cycle can prevent this. (21) It is also wise for Tren users to closely monitor their cholesterol levels, as well as kidney function and liver enzymes, as Tren has the potential to negatively affect all of those functions. Trenbolone, being a powerful progestin, will also shut down natural testosterone production which even a relatively small dose and keep the testosterone level suppressed for an extended period of time, this can lower libido and cause erectile dysfunction (fina dick). It is essential that you always stack trenbolone with testosterone."

Another progesterone thread, progesterone help???

And another, Prolactin Levels, B-6 and T3....
This one explains T3 usage a bit, another alternative I didn't mention but always include when I take Tren.

[SPIKE]

I'll start with the initial proposed question even though BD seemed to take care of it all.

any need for nolvadex and arimidex while using aromasin on a cycle of prop,tren,eq,var?

Sooooooooo many things to talk about here. I have to say Aromasin is some good stuff, expensive but good. I started at 25mgs ED and also lost some libido. I dropped back to 12.5mg ED and its working out just fine. I dont know why I see so many taking Aromasin EOD when it has a half life of just alittle over a full day (27 hours to be exact).

BD mentioned something crucial, B6!!! Keep in mind that AI's wont block progesterone aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaannnnnnndddddddd Nolvadex actually increases the amount of progesterone receptors. Thats why whenever taking Deca or Tren you should always have some B6 on hand if you dont have access to Bromo or even Cabergoline.

As far as water retention is concerned I"m sure the Aromasin will be enough, If not then you can add the Nolva. An AI and a SERM is a great combo. No need to combine 2 AI's (Aromasin/Proviron ).