Where Did All My Gains Go?

[TurboNSX]

STATS: M / 30 / 5'9" / 160 (normal weight) / 173 (maximum weight on cycle) / 10-12% body fat.

I've done two cycles and here's an outline...

FIRST CYCLE: Sustanon 250 (British Dragon) @ 500mg/week for 12 weeks.
PCT: HCG only (I've lived, learned and I know that was improper).
RESULTS: I gained 12 lbs but lost about 6-7 of it which was expected since I didn't do proper PCT.

Worst of all, I lost 90% of my sex drive when the last shot wore off.

SECOND CYCLE: Sustanon 250 (Organon Nile) @ 500mg/week for 12 weeks (almost same as before).
PCT: Tamox (Nolvadex ) @ 40mg ED for 3 weeks, then 20mg for 2 weeks. I was also on Liquidex (Arimidex ) @ .25ml ED that whole time. I waited 3 weeks after the last shot to start PCT.
RESULTS: I gained about 8 lbs and soon lost it all. Sex drive diminished again but not as bad as before. Also, this was a slow and gradual decline in weight where last time everything just dropped alot quicker.

So it brings me to my next question, what has worked for you guys to keep gains? Anything I'm missing or not doing correctly? I'd like to do my homework before starting my 3rd cycle which will consist of Dbol for the first 4-5 weeks along with the Sustanon 250. I will fcus more on diet and harder workouts this time around too but my main concern is keeping the mass.

Here's what also boggles me....I've been measuring my arms (biceps) through the whole process and I haven't lost much size at all (barely any if at all). Where did I lose all the weight?? I understand some water weight will be lost off-cycle but does the muscle mass generally stay??

I know this was long but I wanted to be thorough. Any input appreciated.

[Kingweb50]

what is your diet like post cycle? You will have to eat enough to sustain the added mass of your new gains.

[hugoboss]

I suspect its all in the diet!~

[Kratos]

2 words "diet forum"

I know 3 different people with similar stats to your own that can't gain weight even though then train awsome. The problem is almost always the same, they eat big once a day and not much the rest of the day.

[hugovsilva]

PCT 1st cycle sucked. The 2nd one shows it was the diet.

[TurboNSX]

Thanks for the initial input everyone. Diet could very well be a possibility. I read everywhere before starting my first cycle that my appetite will increase tremdenously but mine didn't increase too much more than normal.
If definitely increased but I wasn't eating everything in sight like I should have.

Also, what are your thoughts on this?....My protein intake was around 220-250 grams a day while on cycle. Off cycle, it was about 100 grams. I didn't think my body in it's natural state would process an excess amount of protein like it would when I'm juiced.

[senseicarr]

have never lost weight after a cycle and i keep almost all my superpowers. lol
I eat very clean and put on pure learn mass no water or fat!!

[InsaneInTheMembrane]

Also, what are your thoughts on this?....My protein intake was around 220-250 grams a day while on cycle. Off cycle, it was about 100 grams. I didn't think my body in it's natural state would process an excess amount of protein like it would when I'm juiced.

There you go..... DIET!

[TurboNSX]

^^ So even while completely off cycle, my body will still process mass amounts of protein?

I guess I was always under the impression that you piss out what you don't use and when you're off cycle, you don't use as much so it was a waste.

ALSO: So if I started eating like a horse now, I'm not going put back on the weight am I? Plus, how can I tell if I'm putting on good weight (muscle mass)or bad weight (water weight and fat)?

[Roidal]

You must have missed something, either in training or dieting.

[Titleist]

^^ So even while completely off cycle, my body will still process mass amounts of protein?

I guess I was always under the impression that you piss out what you don't use and when you're off cycle, you don't use as much so it was a waste.

ALSO: So if I started eating like a horse now, I'm not going put back on the weight am I? Plus, how can I tell if I'm putting on good weight (muscle mass)or bad weight (water weight and fat)?

Well, you've already established (or I have) that your diet is the problem.

The weight you put on depends on the food you are taking in. Hence the saying, "You are what you eat".

You really need to read up on a proper diet. The diet forum is a great place to search around, but the internet as a whole has everything you need to know. It's up to you to utilize it, alternatively, you could stay the same size/weight....

[FASTBOATS25]

The protien intake should not drop off like that. I know it's easier to put it down while your on your cycle but spread it out through the day and get it to where it was. Hopefully it will help this time around.

[J-41-sd]

I'd also recommend using aromasin and not a-dex post cycle, keep a-dex on hand for an ai while on but not for pct.

[TurboNSX]

Thanks everyone, now I don't feel as lost as I did before I sarted this thread. I thought I was eating enough but apparently not. This third cycle will be my best one yet because I'm determined to make it that way.

What kind of calories are you guys recommending for my size? In looking through the diet forum, I see it varies with people's natural size. Also learning about "clean calories" etc...

[FASTBOATS25]

To be honest with you, there are so many good diet combinations. What I do is take certain things from different ones. For instance, I read some guys diet and he couldn't stand the taste of tuna where I love tuna. Just take what you like but don’t forget to balance it after the models (carbs, protien, fats) and like you said eat "clean calories" and you'll be surprised at the mass you can hold.

[J-41-sd]

You could go with anywhere from 2200 cals to 4500 cals depending on the purpose of the cycle. Personally I would keep the protein at around 200-250g a day and adjust your carbs to fit how you feel and what you want to do, play with those then set accordingly. I like to carb cycle at 150-200g a day 5 days a week then go 350-400g 2 days a week, that has been great for me, either way good luck to you.

[Second2None]

eat more, 8lbs in 12wks you can do that naty.

[malidfa]

food is ur friend you need more cals
i eat between 3500-3800 cals

[largerthannormal]

still more 5000 cals EAT!!!!! but be careful what. 99% of the time no one gains the first time to much is all in the diet. i failed as well but im well prepared prior to each cycle from then on! most expensive part of AAS i think is always the food

[HoytT]

I just finished my first cycle and gained about 38lbs. (and dropped BF as well), and i was eating over 6000/day. It takes alot of food to make new mass.

[largerthannormal]

holy crap thats a nice gain ! how much did u lose?

[HoytT]

About 6lbs., but i've leaned out a little more too, so i don't think it's all muscle lost

[largerthannormal]

wow impressive bro. what was your cycle consist of if u dont mind me asking. im sure your diet was very incheck! i gianed only 15lbs after pct was over and i thought i was eating good. i lost alot of fat so i may have gianed more!very impressive though. and how many cycles is that for you? sorry all the questions i just never seen those types of gains

[HoytT]

I was on tren and prop, it was my first cycle, i ran 28 weeks (although i gained the full 38lbs. in the first 16 weeks). My diet was pretty good, ALOT of clean foods, rice chicken, lean red meats, but i also throw some junk in too just to up the calories... once or twice a week i would eat a pizza or some china buffet... i just kind of base my diet on my leaness, if i'm leaning out too much, i eat a little more junk to balance. Sounds like your gains were really good too tho! I would say if you were losing fat too that u probably gained even more muscle than you're giving yourself credit for!

[largerthannormal]

yeah it was okay i guess ur right. its just those numbers were impressive. yet i only weighed in at 187 when i started. congradulations bro and thanks for the info.

[MasonMan]

I was on tren and prop, it was my first cycle, i ran 28 weeks

holy smokes mate...28 weeks???

[largerthannormal]

ahahah thats what i was thinkin. but still impressive! man hearing this shit gets me pumped for next round!!!!