(PIC INSIDE)First Cycle... Need sincere advice

**T_Own** · 07-23-2008, 05:55 PM

Originally Posted by 200byjune

ya everyone is different. and no shit your body doesnt make an ester. test e has 70mgs of test per 100 mgs because 30mgs is the ester. 70+70=140. he produced around the much at that age. you run 250 and waster your money. i dont want this kid to spend $70 and gain 5 pounds over 12 weeks. i did not say 500mgs. it would be more like 433mgs. if you did that 20mls should last you the full 12 weeks. do what you want but im just giving you honest information that will lead to you recieving better results and making you a happier person..

haha well you made it sound like your body was producing test e. i agree on the ester weight part, but still, 175mg of test (250mg test e) is more than double your natural test, which, like stated above, is around 70-80mg a week MAX. some lucky people might get 100, but thats an extreme.

**T_Own** · 07-23-2008, 05:56 PM

Originally Posted by Gdupm6

What do you mean by "shut you down"?

that it will shut down your natural testosterone production. almost all steroids do it, test takes a little longer than some, especially at that dose, but over 12 weeks it happens. thats why you need a pct to bring it back up to normal as fast as possible

**200byjune** · 07-23-2008, 05:58 PM

.........

**200byjune** · 07-23-2008, 05:59 PM

Originally Posted by T_Own

haha well you made it sound like your body was producing test e. i agree on the ester weight part, but still, 175mg of test (250mg test e) is more than double your natural test, which, like stated above, is around 70-80mg a week MAX. some lucky people might get 100, but thats an extreme.

hes young. remember thats the average for an adult.

**scribbs12** · 07-23-2008, 06:03 PM

yes he is young thats why his test lvs would be at the highest...

just rough estimate.....

but usually ur test lvs are higher around your teens to mid twenties.. and late twenties to mid 30s it plateaus ... after 40s test lvs slowly decrease.. so in this case t_town would be right.

**T_Own** · 07-23-2008, 06:03 PM

i'm pretty sure thats average for young people. like 18-24 area, and as you get old it just declines from there

**scribbs12** · 07-23-2008, 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by T_Own

i'm pretty sure thats average for young people. like 18-24 area, and as you get old it just declines from there

well i have to go.. but i'll be back on to check the outcome of this thread...

**T_Own** · 07-23-2008, 06:07 PM

same

**Gdupm6** · 07-23-2008, 06:10 PM

Well if it produces 70mg lets say, even worst case 100 mg of natural test, then 250 mg would make a difference.. But what have first timers have been most happy with doing ? 250 mg or 500mg?

**mkrulic** · 07-23-2008, 06:19 PM

the addition of shots is not linear. google exponential decay.

**T_Own** · 07-23-2008, 06:32 PM

Originally Posted by mkrulic

the addition of shots is not linear. google exponential decay.

yes, but it will still build over 250mg. there will be traces of stuff from the first shot still in you til the end. small amounts, but still something

**Gdupm6** · 07-23-2008, 06:57 PM

So ultimately what would be better? 500mg or 250mg as a starter? I want to be happy towards the end. lol.

**inky-e** · 07-23-2008, 07:04 PM

Why you gotta be pullin your pants down? You're gonna be teasin a few guys here! jk lol I'm not one of them. Its my understanding that injected winnie is less toxic than oral. I've shot it with just a little discomfort, got tight as fukk.

**inky-e** · 07-23-2008, 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by Gdupm6

So ultimately what would be better? 500mg or 250mg as a starter? I want to be happy towards the end. lol.

If you have enough for 500 mg's per week, then thats the way to go IMO.

**Gdupm6** · 07-23-2008, 07:44 PM

Ok so

Test E /500mg /EW for 12 weeks

How about if i took winstrol Orally at 70mg ED from weeks 8 to 14

**scribbs12** · 07-23-2008, 09:36 PM

Originally Posted by Gdupm6

Ok so

Test E /500mg /EW for 12 weeks

How about if i took winstrol Orally at 70mg ED from weeks 8 to 14

yea looks good.

**Gdupm6** · 07-23-2008, 10:06 PM

Will i feel bloated at 500mg?

**scribbs12** · 07-23-2008, 10:14 PM

somewhat.. depends... some people react different.. i had a bloated look somewhat.. but i didnt feel bloated.....just pound the water?... and if you are seriously worried about it.... but i wouldnt you could always use lasix. but not necessary at all.

**Gdupm6** · 07-23-2008, 11:46 PM

Got it, i just want everything to go smooth, i dont wanna run into any problems.. I was reading a thread on ************ and some guy was saying he was going thru his 1st cycle, and he decided to inject his shoulder and then it got swollen, the guy ended up goin to the doctor, and the swelling didnt go away.. I jus want it to go smooth without problems..

**RaWRZ0R!** · 07-24-2008, 12:00 AM

Originally Posted by T_Own

taking the injectable orally lowers its potency i believe. so you would have to take more like 70mg to get 50mg out of it. best to inject it or get the tabs

the test is low, but it will work. you won't gain as much as you would off 500mg, but you probably won't bloat as much either. most people sue the first cycle to bulk, not cut, which is why they go for a higher dose

there was a post from a senior senior member saying it only looses about 5-10% potency with oral so i dont believe that..not trying to rip on ya just lol thats what he said

**Gdupm6** · 07-24-2008, 12:16 AM

so you believe its more than 10 %?

**mv540** · 07-24-2008, 12:49 AM

is there any way to check how much test u actually produce like a test from a doctor or something?

**Gdupm6** · 07-24-2008, 02:22 AM

I was just curious, theres alot of talk about the TEST RECOVERY STACK from Primordial Performance. Does anyone have experience with this? Would it be smart to apply this stack to my cycle or should i just leave my cycle as is with Nolva & Clomid.

**RaWRZ0R!** · 07-24-2008, 02:15 PM

Originally Posted by Gdupm6

so you believe its more than 10 %?

no i dont believe what t-own said i believe the senior member

**Gdupm6** · 07-24-2008, 06:17 PM

Originally Posted by RaWRZ0R!

no i dont believe what t-own said i believe the senior member

so according to that senior member, its only losing about max 10 % potency if taken oral?

**T_Own** · 07-24-2008, 06:23 PM

i guess. it would be good to get that figured out more definitely though.

mv, yeah a blood test can tell you that

**MercyDog** · 07-24-2008, 07:12 PM

really who in the world produces 200mg. a week, share your info, I've never heard anything like that before. And yes you will grow at 250, thats about 5 times natural production.

**MercyDog** · 07-24-2008, 07:16 PM

winny hurts like a bit** to shoot, feels like sand in your muscle. But I can't see how drinking and shooting has the same sides on your liv. Also I'd say the 70% remark is that or even lower, but I could be wrong.

**MercyDog** · 07-24-2008, 07:19 PM

Remember also that test E is 2-3 weeks, so you're actually keeping around 500mgs. constant.

**200byjune** · 07-24-2008, 07:23 PM

Originally Posted by MercyDog

really who in the world produces 200mg. a week, share your info, I've never heard anything like that before. And yes you will grow at 250, thats about 5 times natural production.

200mgs is only 140mgs of test smart guy. dont try acting like your right because neither of us r in this case. we will not no unless blodwork is done

**T_Own** · 07-24-2008, 07:29 PM

he's going off 250 injected, but even 140 is double natural production. but i would still go much higher than that if i were to shut down my natural production (might as well get more out of it right)

**200byjune** · 07-24-2008, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by T_Own

he's going off 250 injected, but even 140 is double natural production. but i would still go much higher than that if i were to shut down my natural production (might as well get more out of it right)

exacly what im saying

**MercyDog** · 07-24-2008, 07:47 PM

Originally Posted by 200byjune

200mgs is only 140mgs of test smart guy. dont try acting like your right because neither of us r in this case. we will not no unless blodwork is done

Not a smart guy just a guy who reads alot and most everything I've found from group studies is 4-7mgs. a day naturally. Thats 7x7 or 49mgs. a week on the high end, comparing 140mg.x2=280mgs. of test-e stacking long distance with the esters each week after week 3. hence more than 5 times your natural production. Why is this so hard to believe? I'm just trying to help by setting it straight.

**Pac Man** · 07-24-2008, 07:49 PM

Originally Posted by T_Own

he's going off 250 injected, but even 140 is double natural production. but i would still go much higher than that if i were to shut down my natural production (might as well get more out of it right)

werd

Originally Posted by MercyDog

But I can't see how drinking and shooting has the same sides on your liv.

I thought injecting it doesn't effect your liver at all...
;

**MercyDog** · 07-24-2008, 08:29 PM

I always took it that pills ran the liver twice while injects were once. Either way though winny is a water based 17a and not hard on the liv to begin with.

**Gdupm6** · 07-25-2008, 01:04 AM

So what do you guys say should i up the dose to 500mg of Test E ?

Im really down to do the winny, its just that i wanna do it right. If i take winny orally and its only 10% less effective than doing an injectable then i would much rather take it orally and save myself the pokes. So winny is not harsh on the liver to begin with is what you were saying?

**scribbs12** · 07-25-2008, 04:00 AM

Originally Posted by Gdupm6

So what do you guys say should i up the dose to 500mg of Test E ?

Im really down to do the winny, its just that i wanna do it right. If i take winny orally and its only 10% less effective than doing an injectable then i would much rather take it orally and save myself the pokes. So winny is not harsh on the liver to begin with is what you were saying?

dude bow up .... just do the injections of winny.. take milk thistle..and do 500mg of test a week.. since you cant make up your mind between 250 and 500.. 250 will show you noticeable gains... even more so 500.... you said you wanted to gain some clean mass... but not too much.. and i said IMO 250 was good.....
--- dont forget pct..

plan your cycle before you start it.. that always helps...