Asking a Question I'm potentially gonna get flamed for

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 01:09 PM

Ok, so I've been looking on this site and I must say I'm very impressed with the wealth of knowledge and community support. You guys have done a great job here.

That being said. I've gotten my diet under control (great diet section!) and I'm working out religously. From everywhere I've garnered off this site youre supposed to only start a cycle after youve reached your peak and can't go any further my question is this: If you have the right diet and your doing cardio what would be the overall harm in jump starting with a cycle? I'm asking this because I'm obviously thinking about it and would like some genuine insight into this. It seems like it's not a great idea (based off all the posts I've seen) but my question is why?

Thanks Guys!

**nombie** · 10-27-2009, 01:18 PM

Originally Posted by BD67

f you have the right diet and your doing cardio what would be the overall harm in jump starting with a cycle?

Thanks Guys!

Because there is a chance you may not recover your Test levels to where they were (wosrt case, not at all) and you will find it hard to make gains without the "juice". If this happens you may need to undertake hormone replacement therapy (HRT) to keep your Test levels up. This may involve injecting Test every day which is prescribed by your doctor!!! A lot of guys on this board are on HRT.

Ask yourself do you want to risk having to use HRT by the time your 30?? People just dont understand this risk before they use AAS.

Also if your making gains naturally with diet and exercise, why the hell do you want to use AAS??????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 01:24 PM

Originally Posted by nombie

Because there is a chance you may not recover your Test levels to where they were (wosrt case, not at all) and you will find it hard to make gains without the "juice". If this happens you may need to undertake hormone replacement therapy (HRT) to keep your Test levels up. This may involve injecting Test every day which is prescribed by your doctor!!! A lot of guys on this board are on HRT.

Ask yourself do you want to risk having to use HRT by the time your 30?? People just dont understand this risk before they use AAS.

Also if your making gains naturally with diet and exercise, why the hell do you want to use AAS??????????????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????????

Well I'm almost thirty, not that it's an excuse. So the risk associated is having to undergo HRT? The only reason why I'm asking this question is the studies I've read where people have been givin Test and just gained weight, everything I've read so far has indicated there has been no real issues or problems, I'm just trying to get to the bottom of it and I appreciate everyones answer.

**chuckt12345** · 10-27-2009, 01:28 PM

[QUOTE=BD67;4922778]Well I'm almost thirty, not that it's an excuse. So the risk associated is having to undergo HRT? The only reason why I'm asking this question is the studies I've read where people have been givin Test and just gained weight, everything I've read so far has indicated there has been no real issues or problems, I'm just trying to get to the bottom of it and I appreciate everyones answer.[/QUOTE

the risk of TRT/HRT makes no diffrence how long you been training or if your at your natural weight.....

your 30,, if you wanna do a cycle do a cycle. Just do it right

what are your stats?

**nombie** · 10-27-2009, 01:30 PM

So if your diet is so good, why are you even considering AAS?

**nombie** · 10-27-2009, 01:36 PM

Originally Posted by BD67

Gotta help me with that one man. I have no idea...

Gotta help me with that one man. I have no idea by what you mean

Edit: Nevermind

figured it out:

6'0"
196
bf- 28%
30 yrs

You need to sort your diet and training out before you even think about steroids !!!!!!!!!!! ^^^^^

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 01:38 PM

[QUOTE=chuckt12345;4922785]

Originally Posted by BD67

Well I'm almost thirty, not that it's an excuse. So the risk associated is having to undergo HRT? The only reason why I'm asking this question is the studies I've read where people have been givin Test and just gained weight, everything I've read so far has indicated there has been no real issues or problems, I'm just trying to get to the bottom of it and I appreciate everyones answer.[/QUOTE

the risk of TRT/HRT makes no diffrence how long you been training or if your at your natural weight.....

your 30,, if you wanna do a cycle do a cycle. Just do it right

what are your stats?

Ok so now were getting a differing opinion. This is kinda what I'm looking for, whats wrong and whats right.

Let me be clear about this, I'm looking for this information because like most people I'm interested in Instant Gratification, however I'm smart enough to realise that this isn't always a great idea.

My stats are:

188
6'0"
30 yrs
25 % BF

I guess what would be the overall harm in running a short (5 week) cycle of test and dbol ? Obviously with the right diet and not huge levels of either (400 mg Test/wkly and 10 mg od Dbol/daily?

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by nombie

You need to sort your diet and training out before you even think about steroids!!!!!!!!!!! ^^^^^

Thats exactly what Ive been doing. And like I said I'm just looking for all the facts, thats all.

**nombie** · 10-27-2009, 01:41 PM

Originally Posted by bd67

(5 week) cycle of test and dbol?

rofffffffffffffffffflmao!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!

**Nooomoto** · 10-27-2009, 01:41 PM

25% BF is too high to be using AAS. You need to bring that down quite a bit before gearing up.

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 01:43 PM

Originally Posted by nombie

So if your diet is so good, why are you even considering AAS?

I'm considerering it as a jump start. I think I said that earlier?!?! Liike I said, iof it's bad I want to know exactly why, I haven't found any differing info on it yet and I'm just trying to get a good understanding. So all help is very much appreciated.

**nombie** · 10-27-2009, 01:44 PM

[QUOTE=BD67;4922801]

Originally Posted by chuckt12345

Ok so now were getting a differing opinion. This is kinda what I'm looking for, whats wrong and whats right.

Let me be clear about this, I'm looking for this information because like most people I'm interested in Instant Gratification, however I'm smart enough to realise that this isn't always a great idea.

My stats are:

188
6'0"
30 yrs
25 % BF

I guess what would be the overall harm in running a short (5 week) cycle of test and dbol? Obviously with the right diet and not huge levels of either (400 mg Test/wkly and 10 mg od Dbol/daily?

wow you have dropped 8 Lbs and 3% BF in just 9 days????? Wow thats impressive!!!

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 01:45 PM

Originally Posted by nombie

rofffffffffffffffffflmao!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!

Hey man, do me a favor. I'm not asking this to get ridiculed I'm asking to gain some knowledge, so if you can do me a favor and act your age and not your shoe size I'd appreciate it greatly.

Thank You

**chuckt12345** · 10-27-2009, 01:46 PM

6' 188lb,, i serioulsy dont thnk your accurate on BF%,,, you need to post a pic

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 01:47 PM

[QUOTE=nombie;4922812]

Originally Posted by BD67

wow you have dropped 8 Lbs and 3% BF in just 9 days????? Wow thats impressive!!!

I'm running four miles a day, cut out all crap food and im on a steady high protein diet plus im on a shedding supplement. I have a great metabolism, just havent kicked it into gear in years.

**1bigun11** · 10-27-2009, 01:47 PM

If you want to do a cycle, do a cycle bro. Like Chuck said, just do it right. Nobody on here who uses geer ever reached 100% of their natural potential before starting. Drs. give test shots to fat guys for trt all the time.

Hell, many of the "experts" on these boards have never even ran a cycle.

Have a good one bro. Cheers.

**nombie** · 10-27-2009, 01:48 PM

Originally Posted by BD67

Hey man, do me a favor. I'm not asking this to get ridiculed I'm asking to gain some knowledge, so if you can do me a favor and act your age and not your shoe size I'd appreciate it greatly.

Thank You

Look! People aint gunna spoon feed you answers. You need to reseach. Noone it the right mind will sit at there computer and type up everything you need to know and why!! Use the search option and read the stickies. The fact that you want to run 5 weeks of test at 400 mg, and dbol 10mgs shows how much you have to learn.

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 01:49 PM

Originally Posted by chuckt12345

6' 188lb,, i serioulsy dont thnk your accurate on BF%,,, you need to post a pic

Thats what the test at the gym said..... If I had a working camera at the moment I would. Those things at the gym are accurate, yes?

**chuckt12345** · 10-27-2009, 01:50 PM

Originally Posted by BD67

Thats what the test at the gym said..... If I had a working camera at the moment I would. Those things at the gym are accurate, yes?

lol,, that thng may be 10% off. If your 28% BF at those measurments then you would seem to have very very little muscle mass.

**nombie** · 10-27-2009, 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by BD67

Thats what the test at the gym said..... If I had a working camera at the moment I would. Those things at the gym are accurate, yes?

impedance scales are by far the most inaccurate of all bf measurement.

**chuckt12345** · 10-27-2009, 01:53 PM

[QUOTE=1bigun11;4922824]

Drs. give test shots to fat guys for trt all the time.

EXACTLY,,, most normal people on TRT not involved in body building are usually over weight and some of the reasons of there weight problem is caused by low test levels. Im sure most studies show TRT patients have loss in BF% and gain in muscle mass.

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 01:53 PM

Originally Posted by 1bigun11

If you want to do a cycle, do a cycle bro. Like Chuck said, just do it right. Nobody on here who uses geer ever reached 100% of their natural potential before starting. Drs. give test shots to fat guys for trt all the time.
Hell, many of the "experts" on these boards have never even ran a cycle.

Have a good one bro. Cheers.

Thats what makes me curious about it. It can't be horrible at low doses can it?

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 01:56 PM

Originally Posted by chuckt12345

lol,, that thng may be 10% off. If your 28% BF at those measurments then you would seem to have very very little muscle mass.

I'm by no means a big guy, I have a runners physique. It's part of the reason why I am asking this, muscle doesn't come easy to me, leaning out however does.

**chuckt12345** · 10-27-2009, 01:58 PM

Originally Posted by BD67

I'm by no means a big guy, I have a runners physique. It's part of the reason why I am asking this, muscle doesn't come easy to me, leaning out however does.

find a member pic on here that sort of resembles you and copy the link,, im guessin you way under 20%

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 02:05 PM

Originally Posted by chuckt12345

find a member pic on here that sort of resembles you and copy the link,, im guessin you way under 20%

This one is similiar, second picture down. a little more leaner tho.

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=398286

**chuckt12345** · 10-27-2009, 02:12 PM

second one is prb 18 to 20
i personally dont have prbs with people starting cycles at higher bf's than the typical 15% but others do. Just read up on test only cycles, pct's etc.

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 02:17 PM

Originally Posted by chuckt12345

second one is prb 18 to 20
i personally dont have prbs with people starting cycles at higher bf's than the typical 15% but others do. Just read up on test only cycles, pct's etc.

Thats exactly what I have been doing. Its also why I was considering a small run of 5 weeks at a low dosage with some Dbol to start it. The objective isn't to erupt into a 260 pound monster, it's more to get maybe up to 195-200 of good looking lean muscle.

**chuckt12345** · 10-27-2009, 02:20 PM

if you gonna run something do not do the dbol and run a lower dose test cycle (200 to 400mg/wk) for 10 to 12 weeks

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 02:23 PM

Originally Posted by chuckt12345

if you gonna run something do not do the dbol and run a lower dose test cycle (200 to 400mg/wk) for 10 to 12 weeks

Why not the dbol and I read that sticky about shorter cycles being more beneficial (8weeks) and thought that they way to go.

**chuckt12345** · 10-27-2009, 02:28 PM

Originally Posted by BD67

Why not the dbol and I read that sticky about shorter cycles being more beneficial (8weeks) and thought that they way to go.

you want to bloat up or what? your saying one thing and then you want to do something totally diffrent. test takes awhile to kick in so you may not notice shite until the 5th or 6th week,, and your sayin when that happens you wanna stop after 2 or 3 more weeks?

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by chuckt12345

you want to bloat up or what? your saying one thing and then you want to do something totally diffrent. test takes awhile to kick in so you may not notice shite until the 5th or 6th week,, and your sayin when that happens you wanna stop after 2 or 3 more weeks?

Ok Gotcha. I was throwing the dbol in because I read that combined with Test it makes a good beginners cycle because it kicks in quick.

**Chev** · 10-27-2009, 02:42 PM

You need to do more research man, there are many "stickies" you can read for new guys. Theres no point of running test E or C for 6 weeks with dbol . Read up!! Its a waste of gear and time.

**tripmachine** · 10-27-2009, 04:09 PM

hey.... i would run a test only cycle for 12 weeks.... skip the dbol ...(dbol i don't think is good for people higher in bf%) maybe frontload the test e for the first week... that combined with cardio/diet/lifting will get you the results you are looking for as long as you are true to yourself. Good luck!

**fig** · 10-27-2009, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by nombie

rofffffffffffffffffflmao!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!

Don't do that. There was a day when you knew nothing about AS.

**fig** · 10-27-2009, 06:07 PM

Not sure if someone mentioned or not, only scanned thru all these posts. With high BF you run a greater risk of gyno. Also, I'm assuming you do not have years of training under your belt by your posts. If so, gear will put your strength up, so your muscles will outgrow your ligaments, giving your muscles the ability to snap your ligaments.

**Kibble** · 10-27-2009, 06:12 PM

No flaming... only constructive criticism

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 06:15 PM

Originally Posted by fig

Not sure if someone mentioned or not, only scanned thru all these posts. With high BF you run a greater risk of gyno. Also, I'm assuming you do not have years of training under your belt by your posts. If so, gear will put your strength up, so your muscles will outgrow your ligaments, giving your muscles the ability to snap your ligaments.

Well thats definitely a drawback......

**PistolPete33** · 10-27-2009, 06:22 PM

I would stick with a very basic cycle of Test only E or C. Keep it at 500mg/week shot twice a week for 10-12 weeks. If you have higher BF you will risk getting gyno more easily as previously stated. I understand why you want to try AAS to lower the timeframe that you generate results. However, keep in mind that bodybuilding is a LONG process and you should have long and short term goals. You want to be healthy so do yourself a favor and do a ton of research. This is what I've done since being here and I'm on my 10th week of my first cycle. There have been many pros and cons along the way so be prepared that there are many risks involved and many ups and downs during the cycle. I had a headache that lasted almost a week when my body started getting use to the AAS. Not a good experience at all. Also, have all your PCT meds on hand BEFORE starting the cycle. I took this advice and around week 3 started getting gyno symptoms so luckily I had the Nolva on hand to battle it.

Good luck, be smart, do your research, and be responsible.

**tronics** · 10-27-2009, 09:20 PM

at that bodyfat...gyno is right around the corner

nombie chill with the flaming

edit: just missed the post above gyno was mentioned..

**BD67** · 10-27-2009, 09:40 PM

Originally Posted by tronics

at that bodyfat...gyno is right around the corner

nombie chill with the flaming

edit: just missed the post above gyno was mentioned..

Everyone keeps on saying that but, I'm under the impression that test binds to fat molecules and promotes shedding. At least thats what it says in the profile. Coupled with High protein and high cardio plus Nolva wouldn't I be ble to avoid this?!?!?!