questions for my 2nd cycle

[xmadmanx]

age:22
height:6,2
weight:195
bf%: 14 percent


i just finished up my first cycle of test e

week 1-14 test e 800mg
week 10-14 clen

clomid+nolva 2 weeks after last injection for 3 weeks


so now im getting things ready for my future 2nd cycle while i have spare cash on me.(i dont plan on doing my 2nd cycle for atleast 17 weeks im just getting things ready like filling up my deep freezer ect.)


id like to put alot more mass on me this time around so i have some questions.

would test cyp deca dbol be better for keepable gains or test cyp deca and winstrol .

at what dosage should i run the deca/ test cyp this time around. i was wanting to run the deca kinda high at 600mg but iv read that you should always have the ratio of test/deca 2:1 or close to it to avoid limp deca dick and that would mean using 1200mg of test which seems way to high lol.


what kind of pct should i use for that kinda cycle

how long can i run these orals without risk of liver injury.

[dooie]

Really?

[xelnaga]

6'2 195 at 14% bf....This condition after a 14 weeks high dose test cycle. Are you aware that food is a major component of increasing muscle mass?

[xmadmanx]

yes, i was bulking in week 1-10 and cutting from 10-14, id rather look good on my cycle and gain a little less then look like a big blob and gain a little more.

but on my 2nd cycle im sure i can get myself below 10 percent before i start and id feel comfortable to bulk all the way through

[marcus300]

IMHO your to young to cycle, it isn't worth the risk of shutting down your natural testosterone especially when its not fully developed and matured.

You also using way to much, you need to slow and and stop

Concentrate on your diet and use what you have naturally, with the way your going and the amounts your using your going to damage yourself and it isn't a nice feeling having low test in your 20's.

[stpete]

Agree w/marcus. Your too young for all these compounds. But look down the road and your hpta. This is something you don't want to mess with. Learn how to eat and train hard and you will get gains without aas.

[Chris_ATV]

The reason you would look like a big blob is your diet. Keep it clean and you won't bloat as bad. I went from 160-190 first cycle and I ONLY used 250mg/wk TestEn. I bloated due to not keeping my diet as clean as I should have.


Also at your age you can do damage to you hpta system as stated above. A good rule of thumb is Ex: 10 wks on = 20wks off

[Chris_ATV]

And why am I still a junior member after 8 years on here? haha jk could care less


At 25 and under, your natural test should be plenty with a good diet to add 10-15lbs in 10-15 wks.

[alexISthrowed]

800mg test for first cycle and 195 at 14%?? You need to concentrate on dieting and training before you think about running another cycle imo.

[barakelium]

Yeah... Everyone above is correct. However you were looking for advice on the cycle you intend to do (regardless of other people's opinion as to whether or not you should). If I could do it over I wouldn't have started when I was 22. However for a bulk all you need is test deca dbol . The winni would slightly counter the deca vs the dbol supplementing it while it builds up in your system. And as to the amount of test reqd to prevent deca dick... 250 mg test e/ a week is more than enough. Don't feel pressured into using more than a gram a week of any substance. If you need more stack more. There is this thing called the law of diminishing returns. Just because you take twice the amount doesn't mean your gains will double. You might gain 100% at 1000 a week and 150% at 2000 a week. Cost wise it does not compute

[barakelium]

Also as to the durations. I would never run an oral for more than 6 weeks. If you want to run it longer run it in the beginning of the cycle, take a break for a few weeks, and then run it at the tail of the cycle. Ex. Would be 750 test ew 750 deca ew and 50 dbol ed. Weeks 1-14 test 1-12 deca 1-6 dbol and 10-14 dbol. That's almost 2 grams of gear ew for the majority of the cycle with a boost to the beginning that tapers when the deca kicks and a boost at the end for when gains are plateauing. That is not a beginner cycle though so you may want to modify the dosing to 500 or 600 as your receptors should be in top condition

[barakelium]

Good luck and feel free to pm me any questions

[BBrian]

Where do people keep coming up with this 2:1 test to deca equation? It would only be applicable for someone running a very low dose of each and is therefore a terrible rule of thumb to preach for the reason outlined by the OP. I hope nobody is actually following this guideline.

[xmadmanx]

thank you for all the info,


i was under the assumption that you needed more test then deca in order not to get deca dick during your cycle,


and also arnt dbol gains very hard to keep, and if so wouldnt i be better off with a oral that has more keepable gains like winny or tbol


what kind of pct should i use for this test /deca/oral cycle

[barakelium]

if u dont want deca dick... just take like 250 test a week. deca suppresses your natural production... not your "artificial supplementation" lol

[barakelium]

and dbol gains are just as easy as any other gains to keep. water weight isnt a gain. if you gain 15 lbs on dbol just know youre gonna drop all that water within the first week to two... that doesnt mean you lost anything. you still have 5-8 lbs of gains

[Thor249]

and dbol gains are just as easy as any other gains to keep. water weight isnt a gain. if you gain 15 lbs on dbol just know youre gonna drop all that water within the first week to two... that doesnt mean you lost anything. you still have 5-8 lbs of gains

I completely agree with this. There are so many people out there always saying dbol gains are all water and will be lost.

My test dbol cycle I put on 25lbs and kept every single one after pct.

[barakelium]

anyone i know or talk to who has used dbol alone has agreed with me... they gain 10-20 lbs on their first cycle, and kept 5-12 lbs of it after coming off... same with long ester tests... you gain 20 lbs on enanthate and come off and keep 10... you gain 12 lbs on propianate and come off and keep 10... youre building the same amount of muscle, however you cant keep the excess water weight without the excess estrogen produced while on cycle. water weight isnt a gain

[DanB]

anyone i know or talk to who has used dbol alone has agreed with me... they gain 10-20 lbs on their first cycle, and kept 5-12 lbs of it after coming off... same with long ester tests... you gain 20 lbs on enanthate and come off and keep 10... you gain 12 lbs on propianate and come off and keep 10... youre building the same amount of muscle, however you cant keep the excess water weight without the excess estrogen produced while on cycle. water weight isnt a gain

That's bro science there is no set formula or rule for what you will gain and to say that you will have the same gains from dbol as from test is laughable

Like you said, anybody you know or talked to, so I assume you havnt actually ran these cycles and who is to say who you have spoke to isn't just parrotting b.s. which seems to me like they are

[barakelium]

Those were theoretical numbers lol nothing is exact and i have run them sorry if there was a communication error
if you were to do a cycle of test you will gain x amount of lean tissue (where x stands for theoretical gains) based on your genetics training diet sleep age stress levels etc... Also you will gain y amount of water and z amount of fat based upon the previously stated factors As well as Ttestosterone ester. Where shorter esters typically cause less y and z gain than the longer ester
So if...
Ah screw it if u don't know where im coming from with the elementary terms used in the first post then college level analogies are a waste of time and if you did know where i was coming from and just felt like flexing those big strong internet muscles... Shame on you some people actually come.here.for.knowledge if you just want to down someone go to the gym and find someone smaller than you without a clue and have your fun