Upcoming Winter Cycle... Thoughts, Concerns ???

**lightweight11** · 10-12-2012, 02:42 AM

Looking to dial in my winter cycle.

Stats:

29yoa 6'1 220 current bf%: 10-12%

I've been lifting seriously since about 2005. I have experience with aas, phs, gh, peptides, pct

Goal: Lean mass gains

Cycle:
Test e, w prop kick, var and proviron

weeks 1-10 test e 500mg / 250mg 2x a week (sun,wed)
weeks 6-12 var 60mg 20mg / 3x a day
weeks 1-12 proviron 50mg / ED

prop kick:
week 1 test p 100mg eod
week 2 test p 75mg eod
week 3 test p 50mg eod
week 4 test p 25mg eod
week 11 test p 50mg eod
week 12 test p 100mg eod

HCG 500iu a week / 250iu 2x week (mon thurs)

AI:

Stane 12.5 mg eod

PCT:

clomid 100/50/50/50
nolva 40/20/20/20
HCGenerate or pytoserms 347
DAA
creatine
vitamin c

Support supps:

AI cycle support
udca
niacin
multi vitamin
fish oil

Emergency supps On hand:

Letro
nolva
caber
cialis

Im also running some blue top hgh at 2iu (yes ive read the thread about bunk chinese hgh so it is most likely no good but ill give it a go anyways)

I am a slow responder to test e it usually takes until around week 5 or so to kick in so I want to use the prop to hopefully speed things up.

Var seems to work well for me other then some killer back pumps at times. Any ideas to combat them? Ive tried taurine didnt seem to help that much. Bananas seemed to be the only thing that helped slightly.

I got some bloods done recently havent got them in the mail yet but the Dr said everything was fine so once I take a peak at those and verify everything looks good ill get things started.

**Sworder** · 10-12-2012, 02:59 AM

Stane dosage needs to be corrected.

Run Nolvadex with the Clomid for PCT:

Nolva 40/20/20/20
Clomid 100/50/50/50

You can extend these doses to 6 weeks if you want. Raising the dose in clomid shouldn't be needed. 50mg/day is enough. The double dose frontload protocol works well.

You should be able to cut the cycle down to 10 weeks and extend with the prop to 12 at a heavier prop dose those two weeks. 50mg EOD week 11 and then 100mg EOD week 12. But your original plan wasn't far off either. Many roads lead to Rome.

I wouldn't run the Anavar in the beginning though, I would save it for the last 6 weeks. Dropping androgens early usually leads to gains slowing down for some reason. I think you are better off finishing off strong rather than strarting strong and then gradually decreasing your doses.

I would drop the Proviron . Personal preference..

**lightweight11** · 10-12-2012, 03:56 AM

Originally Posted by Sworder

Stane dosage needs to be corrected.

Run Nolvadex with the Clomid for PCT:

Nolva 40/20/20/20
Clomid 100/50/50/50

You can extend these doses to 6 weeks if you want. Raising the dose in clomid shouldn't be needed. 50mg/day is enough. The double dose frontload protocol works well.

You should be able to cut the cycle down to 10 weeks and extend with the prop to 12 at a heavier prop dose those two weeks. 50mg EOD week 11 and then 100mg EOD week 12. But your original plan wasn't far off either. Many roads lead to Rome.

I wouldn't run the Anavar in the beginning though, I would save it for the last 6 weeks. Dropping androgens early usually leads to gains slowing down for some reason. I think you are better off finishing off strong rather than strarting strong and then gradually decreasing your doses.

I would drop the Proviron. Personal preference..

Thanks man.

Stane dosage fixed. I made some other adjustments. I would definitely like to finish stronger then start. I ran the var in the beginning before more as a kick starter. Hopefully the prop will kick in quick.

Why dont you like proviron ?

**Chuckdiesel** · 10-12-2012, 04:26 AM

Originally Posted by lightweight11

Thanks man.

Stane dosage fixed. I made some other adjustments. I would definitely like to finish stronger then start. I ran the var in the beginning before more as a kick starter. Hopefully the prop will kick in quick.

Why dont you like proviron?

I would personally keep the proviron in...both having experience with proviron and I'm currently running drostanolone prop @ 50mg ed with 60mg tren ace ed, I love both masteron compounds. It really boost aggression, both in the gym and bedroom

. So what your not gonna compete or in contest shape with a very low bodyfat. The other benefits make utilizing this compound worthwhile

**Chuckdiesel** · 10-12-2012, 04:27 AM

Originally Posted by Chuckdiesel

I would personally keep the proviron in...both having experience with proviron and I'm currently running drostanolone prop @ 50mg ed with 60mg tren ace ed, I love both masteron compounds. It really boost aggression, both in the gym and bedroom

. So what your not gonna compete or in contest shape with a very low bodyfat. The other benefits make utilizing this compound worthwhile

Plus it binds strongly to the SHBG, making more active test to float around in your body

**lightweight11** · 01-02-2013, 09:48 PM

Hey guys I'm about 8 weeks in and having a few issues. I don't feel like this test e is working or is under dosed.

My muscles don't feel like theyre recovering as fast as they were a week or so ago, my libido is low and my unit isn't performing very well. (I even took a little caber and that didn't help)

My lifts still seem solid. Ive been running everything as posted above. The only thing that changed was I added the var in at week 6. I also made fresh hcg today since the potency declines after several weeks. I pinned 300iu today.

Any ideas on what it might be?

I was thinking of just pinning 250mg of test e tomorrow dropping it and bringing the prop back in at 50mg eod for a week and then 100mg eod after until I want to come off either week 12 or before. I felt better on prop and libido was high

Pct will start 3 days after last pin which will be:

Clomid: 100 50 50 50
Torem: 120 90 60 30
Hcgenerate
Daa
Erase
Vitamin c
Lean extreme cortisol blocker

**MickeyKnox** · 01-02-2013, 10:31 PM

Are you getting morning wood similar to previous wks?

Titrating Prop is unnecessary, and wk 4 of Prop was a joke. I would however recommend you save and run your Prop in the last two wks of your planned cycle and drop the Test E at the same time to pick up the long ester. This will enable you to begin PCT in 3 days as opposed to 14.

**lightweight11** · 01-02-2013, 11:08 PM

Ive been getting some weak chub in the morning lately. Previously its been rock solid.

**MickeyKnox** · 01-02-2013, 11:12 PM

Only bloodwork will tell the tale of the tape, but i suspect perhaps your E2 may be creeping up on you. Do you have any previous experience that would support this idea?

**lightweight11** · 01-02-2013, 11:32 PM

That was my guess to. I took 12.5mg of stane today. Do u recommend taking it ED for a few days to see if things get better?

**MickeyKnox** · 01-02-2013, 11:36 PM

Originally Posted by lightweight11

That was my guess to. I took 12.5mg of stane today. Do u recommend taking it ED for a few days to see if things get better?

Thats kind of a slippery slope. I really don't like recommending anyone increasing their AI unless their are other supporting signs that indicate rising estrogen levels. But you could try increasing it for a few days like you suggested and monitor closely. Crashing ones E2 is not a pleasant experience, to say the least.

**lightweight11** · 01-02-2013, 11:58 PM

Ill try taking it today and tomorrow if things don't improve ill get bloods done mon. I did drink on NYE that could of increased estrogen as well.

**MickeyKnox** · 01-03-2013, 12:02 AM

Keep this thread updated with your results. All these experiences are learning opportunities for everyone.

**lightweight11** · 01-03-2013, 12:13 AM

I definitely will. Thanks for your help. Hopefully its a simple fix.

**lightweight11** · 01-07-2013, 11:03 AM

Ive been using erase pro on the days opposite of the 12.5mgs of Stane for the past 4 days and things seem to be getting better. I look leaner and erections are coming back. I ran out of erase pro so im using regular erase now. Im going to continue on for a few more days, I think you were right my e2 slowly got away from me. Ill keep u updated.

One other question. When I switch to prop my last 2 weeks you said before you wouldn't taper the dosage from 50mg to 100mg right? So just keep it at 100mg the whole time?

**MickeyKnox** · 01-07-2013, 11:16 AM

Youre currently running 500/wk. So i would run Prop (and drop Test E) the last two wks at 150 EOD wich = 525/wk.

**lightweight11** · 01-07-2013, 11:45 AM

Originally Posted by MickeyKnox

Youre currently running 500/wk. So i would run Prop (and drop Test E) the last two wks at 150 EOD wich = 525/wk.

Sounds good. Thanks again. I ran hgh for like 6 months last year and had the same feeling I did last week w libido etc. Do u think it could be a similar situation where my e2 slowly rose over time as well?

**MickeyKnox** · 01-07-2013, 12:54 PM

Ive never used HGH, sorry bro.

**valkyrie** · 01-07-2013, 02:24 PM

Originally Posted by MickeyKnox

Only bloodwork will tell the tale of the tape, but i suspect perhaps your E2 may be creeping up on you. Do you have any previous experience that would support this idea?

This. The only way to know.
Get down to a lab.

**lightweight11** · 01-08-2013, 02:26 AM

Originally Posted by valkyrie

This. The only way to know.
Get down to a lab.

At this point the issue seems to be e2 related. I know bloodwork Is the only way to be certain. If I run the gh again and have issues I definitely will get them done.
Regardless post cycle bloods will be done.

**lightweight11** · 01-17-2013, 01:41 AM

Ran that erase for a few more days and got super dry and lean. I could feel some low e2 sides so I backed off. I've been back on the normal AI protocol and things are back to normal. Morning wood etc.