Female friend wants to do a cycle. Help?

[likelifting]

She's 45 and in good health. Does cardio at least 5 times a week. Eats right. Her workouts are mostly DB's at her house with several rope contraptions and stuff like that. I've helped her a little bit over the years, but she has asked me and asked that I keep it completely private from out friends. She wants to get more toned.

I have no idea where to start on this and was hoping I could get some help from best board on the internet.

I started thinking...well I have some Test C and E and I have some Anavar , etc, but thought I should take a step back and see if it seems appropriate for her first.

Also, AI's?, obviously no need for HCG . It's a totally different deal, so any help would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

[ChiveOn]

Usually women are in the 5-15mg range for Var. and can also take primo but do not give her test...

[gearbox]

She's 45 and in good health. Does cardio at least 5 times a week. Eats right. Her workouts are mostly DB's at her house with several rope contraptions and stuff like that. I've helped her a little bit over the years, but she has asked me and asked that I keep it completely private from out friends. She wants to get more toned.

I have no idea where to start on this and was hoping I could get some help from best board on the internet.

I started thinking...well I have some Test C and E and I have some Anavar , etc, but thought I should take a step back and see if it seems appropriate for her first.

Also, AI's?, obviously no need for HCG . It's a totally different deal, so any help would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

I do not like this idea at all. you can get more toned with proper diet and working out. It takes hard work. It sounds like someone wants a short cut. Anavar is a mild compound and extremely overrated imo. Newbie's think they can pop some pills and the fat just shreds off. Cardio is the way to do this not aas. If she want in tip top shape and was considering competing my advise would be different.

[< <Samson> >]

Well,

Var only is a optimal 1st cycle for a female. Starting slow typically is best. If I am recommending a cycle to a female, it would go:

Var 5mg a day for about a week
If no sides arise go up to 10mg a day

You can go up a little more, but monitoring sides is still key.

Max cycle length I'd suggest is 8 weeks. Again, possibly shorter depending on arising side effects.


But, yeah. . . Also agreed with the above. Just depends on the individual

[likelifting]

Usually women are in the 5-15mg range for Var. and can also take primo but do not give her test...

Thank you, Chive.

Why don't women do test if you don't mind me asking.

[likelifting]

Well,

Var only is a optimal 1st cycle for a female. Starting slow typically is best. If I am recommending a cycle to a female, it would go:

Var 5mg a day for about a week
If no sides arise go up to 10mg a day

You can go up a little more, but monitoring sides is still key.

Max cycle length I'd suggest is 8 weeks. Again, possibly shorter depending on arising side effects.


But, yeah. . . Also agreed with the above. Just depends on the individual

Thank you. Good point. Start low when she gathers all the info she needs.

[likelifting]

I do not like this idea at all. you can get more toned with proper diet and working out. It takes hard work. It sounds like someone wants a short cut. Anavar is a mild compound and extremely overrated imo. Newbie's think they can pop some pills and the fat just shreds off. Cardio is the way to do this not aas. If she want in tip top shape and was considering competing my advise would be different.

You sure did read a lot into my post by saying "Newbies think they can pop some pills and fat just shreds off" and It sounds like someone wants a short cut"

Maybe you could've asked a couple more question before getting on your high horse.

[< <Samson> >]

No no

No test for females unless they are extremely experienced or need some sort of HRT

[likelifting]

No no

No test for females unless they are extremely experienced or need some sort of HRT

Gotcha. Thanks again Samson.

[likelifting]

Can anyone add anything on cycle supps for a women?

Thanks

[likelifting]

I bet if I was a female I'd be getting some help.

[Back In Black]

Get her to sign up and she can specifically post in the female only section.

[likelifting]

Thanks Back in Black

I showed my friend Gearbox's reply, and frankly, she was offended. I didn't like it either. I said I didn't think his reply represented the board well, from my experience. But she said he was a 'knowledgeable member' by the board so. I didn't have a response to that.

I think I'll pm Admin and simply ask if they feel the reply was appropriate and if they feel it represents the board. If so, she won't join and I'll prolly take my measely lil purchases from ar-r and go home. Kind of joking but not really, I guess.

She felt he was condescending. She works out hard. She has a really good diet. I don't why he felt like he needed to say it, but whatevs.

Thanks again for your advice B in B.

[austinite]

Thanks Back in Black

I showed my friend Gearbox's reply, and frankly, she was offended. I didn't like it either. I said I didn't think his reply represented the board well, from my experience. But she said he was a 'knowledgeable member' by the board so. I didn't have a response to that.

I think I'll pm Admin and simply ask if they feel the reply was appropriate and if they feel it represents the board. If so, she won't join and I'll prolly take my measely lil purchases from ar-r and go home. Kind of joking but not really, I guess.

She felt he was condescending. She works out hard. She has a really good diet. I don't why he felt like he needed to say it, but whatevs.

Thanks again for your advice B in B.

Sorry to hear she was offended. I think his response had more to do with your post, not her. You have to admit, it was a little out there with all the testosterone talk. I can understand someone being offended if any foul language was used. But I think GearBox had good intentions and nothing on an internet forum should ever be taken personally. Please take a moment to view GearBox's post history, you'll find that he is one of the most helpful and kind members.

This level of sensitivity can be very damaging to one's confidence levels. I hope she is ok and wish her the best of luck. If she joins, many of us are happy to help her in private as well.

Best of luck.

[likelifting]

Ok, I checked out his profile and it says he's 28. My friend has been working out since Gearbox was in friggin diapers. LOL Now don't get offended by that Gearbox. As I've been told, "don't have a level of sensitivity that is damaging to one's self confidence"

So Newbie (Gearbox)thaks for supposed advice on "not taking a shortcut" but like I said, she was working out when you were in diapers.

[likelifting]

Austinite, you've been totally straight up with me and so have others, so I appreciate your reply whether we disagree or not.

I checked out Gearbox's profile and he has received 97 likes and give out 2. Sounds like someone who can occasionally ride on that high horse if you ask me.

I didn't see anything that was particularly kind. I only mention that cuz you suggested I do so.

[austinite]

lol. Ok man. I guess that makes me a jerk because I received 1000 likes and only gave out 300.

Oh well. I tried. Sorry you feel this way man but we will agree to disagree. I personally like you and have no issues with you at all

[Lunk1]

For what it's worth. My experience is that Gearbox is one of the most considerate and caring members of this forum. You have to understand he takes diet seriously and I really saw NOTHING in his post to you (OP) that could have been taken offensively. He simply stated fact. Fact that MANY do llok at AAS as a shortcut and that diet and cardio IS key.

I think Austin meant check Gear's profile and read his post history. Always very respectful.

[likelifting]

lol. Ok man. I guess that makes me a jerk because I received 1000 likes and only gave out 300.

Oh well. I tried. Sorry you feel this way man but we will agree to disagree. I personally like you and have no issues with you at all

You have given some great info and expect you'll continue that. I'm not reading anything into your ratio of likes given/rec'd. Just happened to notice he has only 'liked' 2 posts. Whatevs.

If it was just me that felt like Newbie's(Gearbox) post was rude, I would have stopped at that. But she felt the same without me saying a word before she read it. And she is fine. She is a succesful business person (more than me and I'm not doing bad), so I don't want you to worry about her. We will find some good advice somewhere and move on.

Thank again Austinite. And I hope I haven't crossed the line cuz I like ar-r products. Especially glad that I found their Liquid Cia if you know what I mean.

[likelifting]

For what it's worth. (NOTHING..j/k) My experience is that Gearbox is one of the most considerate and caring members of this forum. I read his post as Austinite suggested and I didn't see anything so "Considerate and Caring" as you have stated. You have to understand he takes diet seriously And she doesn't? and I really saw NOTHING in his post to you (OP) that could have been taken offensively But you are a Packer fan so theres that. He simply stated fact. NOT in this case he didn't. If he is a knowledgeable member, he should take the time to ask some questions before rattling off without applying it to this poster imo. Fact that MANY do llok(are you saying LOOK? at AAS as a shortcut and that diet and cardio IS key. Fine. Maybe many do. But ask some friggin questions before applying some stereoptype of a first time user.

I think Austin meant check Gear's profile and read his post history. I did. I can read. Always very respectful. Show me. I read quite a few of his posts and I didn't see anything that he was some "KIND" RESPECTFUL person. Seemed to be an ordinary poster to me.

So there's that.

[FONZY007]

I'm scratching my head on this one...

[likelifting]

Maybe it would be helpful if Gearbox would reply. Instead of Austinite and Sunk1.

[likelifting]

Sorry Lunk1.

[marcus300]

If you get so offended by someone's opinion so easy I really don't think steroids or forums are for you and your experienced lady friend. Sometimes open forums are full of opinions

[MuscleInk]

If you get so offended by someone's opinion so easy I really don't think steroids or forums are for you and your experienced lady friend. Sometimes open forums are full of opinions

^^^Spot on.

[likelifting]

Opinions should be based on some knowledge of the person. He didn't ask. He just assumed and started spouting stereoptypical first time user crap. Ask some questions first. Thats all.

I've used steroids for quite a while. Not as long as you. I've posted in your thread and the Chinese HGH thread and you have given good advice. I just don't agree with Gearbox's post and neither does she.

Again, maybe GEARBOX(newbie) could post instead of taking up the boards time.

And I really don't care if you think I'm a jackass or not marcus, I have to give you props for your photo thread. Really cool stuff.

[likelifting]

So GEARBOX...NEWBIE...WHAT's UP?

[likelifting]

If you get so offended by someone's opinion so easy I really don't think steroids or forums are for you and your experienced lady friend. Sometimes open forums are full of opinions

I'm actually laughing through most of it. 'So don't worry too much. But still think it was an inappropriate reply from a board Know Mem. Thats all. I'm begining to get the sense that the board is the one offended cuz a poster pointed out post from a Knowledgeable Memberr that probably should have asked a question or 2 first.

[likelifting]

And if I get banned, I just want one more purchase from ar-r . And I promise, i'll go quietly.

[ali.jones]

Guys take it easy on him

<Sad Jones>

[gearbox]

I apologize I have not been back since my original post.
To start for many of us age has not changed. I am 31 but its cool either way.

I said what I said because you stated she wanted to tone up. And I do not think aas or var should be considered if just want to tone up. And for someone who has been lifting since I was in diapers should know how to diet properly to achieve this. If they do not then we are here to help.
You have to worry about blood work, all her hormone levels, maybe acne, and so much more. However, if you originally posted something like she is in amazing shape snd diet is spot on (spot on means she is low bf) and wants to start competing or take things to the next level then my op would have been different.
But the op sounds like someone who has a fairly decent diet and likes to lift. If she could achieve the toned and lower bf look without aas then why not try. But 9/10 ppl I hear about on here cant hack a diet for more then 8 weeks. This is a life style (eating clean for years) and using var or test (using test general terms) is even more of a life style change.
I apologize if she was offended but as said above if she has such a strong desire to tone up then have her come on here and read learn ask.
Thanks boys for the kind words and appreciate it. Op we hold a level of respect on here not cause a title, but because we want to gain from other people's experience and to cycle safely.

Gearbox

[likelifting]

I apologize I have not been back since my original post.
To start for many of us age has not changed. I am 31 but its cool either way.

I said what I said because you stated she wanted to tone up. And I do not think aas or var should be considered if just want to tone up. And for someone who has been lifting since I was in diapers should know how to diet properly to achieve this. If they do not then we are here to help.
You have to worry about blood work, all her hormone levels, maybe acne, and so much more. However, if you originally posted something like she is in amazing shape snd diet is spot on (spot on means she is low bf) and wants to start competing or take things to the next level then my op would have been different.
But the op sounds like someone who has a fairly decent diet and likes to lift. If she could achieve the toned and lower bf look without aas then why not try. But 9/10 ppl I hear about on here cant hack a diet for more then 8 weeks. This is a life style (eating clean for years) and using var or test (using test general terms) is even more of a life style change.
I apologize if she was offended but as said above if she has such a strong desire to tone up then have her come on here and read learn ask.
Thanks boys for the kind words and appreciate it. Op we hold a level of respect on here not cause a title, but because we want to gain from other people's experience and to cycle safely.

Gearbox

Hey...finally. Thanks for your reply.

Like I said, she would have come on here, but didn't appreciate your reply at all. Ok, but thats been covered. She didn't know boards like this existed.

So I used the word 'toned'. Maybe that was wrong on my part. She had worked out most of her life. I'd say her bf is 10-12 but I should go look at those pics someone posted as a guidline again. If I'm reading your post correctly, you only give advice to cycle if someone is in 'amazing shape? I don't know she is in 'amazing shape', but she's in pretty amazing health, in my opinion.

She sees me lifting dieting as she does and then when I cycle, she sees my gains and how much more (I'm going to use the word toned again) toned I get when on cycle. After decades of working out, she has decided she wants to try it. Her diet in in check and workout routine seems fine. She wants to see what a cycle would do for her. She told me she has never taken a short cut in her life and she didn't expect for weight to just fall off as you said.

She had a child 24 years ago??? I think thats right. I hope she doesn't mind me saying she has a little belly that doesn't seem like fat to me and she has a little pocket of fat on the backs of her arms. She can't seem to get rid of it.

So she decided to try aas.

So, I was just looking for some suggestions for her for an Anavar and which supps she should be taking. I read through the beginers cycles but didn't see any for women. I may have missed it so I'll go back and check.

I'm going to continue to look for info for her here and elsewhere. We will do it together too.

[likelifting]

I apologize I have not been back since my original post.
To start for many of us age has not changed. I am 31 but its cool either way.

I said what I said because you stated she wanted to tone up. And I do not think aas or var should be considered if just want to tone up. And for someone who has been lifting since I was in diapers should know how to diet properly to achieve this. If they do not then we are here to help.
You have to worry about blood work, all her hormone levels, maybe acne, and so much more. However, if you originally posted something like she is in amazing shape snd diet is spot on (spot on means she is low bf) and wants to start competing or take things to the next level then my op would have been different.
But the op sounds like someone who has a fairly decent diet and likes to lift. If she could achieve the toned and lower bf look without aas then why not try. But 9/10 ppl I hear about on here cant hack a diet for more then 8 weeks. This is a life style (eating clean for years) and using var or test (using test general terms) is even more of a life style change.
I apologize if she was offended but as said above if she has such a strong desire to tone up then have her come on here and read learn ask.
Thanks boys for the kind words and appreciate it. Op we hold a level of respect on here not cause a title, but because we want to gain from other people's experience and to cycle safely.

Gearbox

Again, just to be clear, thats what we were doing. Reading learning and asking when we came across your reply.

[likelifting]

Hey...finally. Thanks for your reply.

Like I said, she would have come on here, but didn't appreciate your reply at all. Ok, but thats been covered. She didn't know boards like this existed.

So I used the word 'toned'. Maybe that was wrong on my part. She had worked out most of her life. I'd say her bf is 10-12 but I should go look at those pics someone posted as a guidline again. If I'm reading your post correctly, you only give advice to cycle if someone is in 'amazing shape? I don't know she is in 'amazing shape', but she's in pretty amazing health, in my opinion.

She sees me lifting dieting as she does and then when I cycle, she sees my gains and how much more (I'm going to use the word toned again) toned I get when on cycle. After decades of working out, she has decided she wants to try it. Her diet in in check and workout routine seems fine. She wants to see what a cycle would do for her. She told me she has never taken a short cut in her life and she didn't expect for weight to just fall off as you said.

She had a child 24 years ago??? I think thats right. I hope she doesn't mind me saying she has a little belly that doesn't seem like fat to me and she has a little pocket of fat on the backs of her arms. She can't seem to get rid of it. She doesn't expect AAS to fix her belly (I think she looks fine but it bugs her) or the back of her arms. I didn't mean to suggest that.

So she decided to try aas.

So, I was just looking for some suggestions for her for an Anavar and which supps she should be taking. I read through the beginers cycles but didn't see any for women. I may have missed it so I'll go back and check.

I'm going to continue to look for info for her here and elsewhere. We will do it together too.

Wanted to add a sentence in there.

[Lunk1]

Check out the member cycle section. There are several threads from women who have dine Var cycles. A good jump off point is 5-10mg ED. There are some known side effects for women when using higher doses. I would suggest no more than 8 weeks.

[likelifting]

Thanks Lunk1

We will check it out this evening.

[HitIt]

gear told me once that 2+2 was 4. made me cry. he's so mean.

[likelifting]

^ Wow...that is hilarious.

[Vettester]

OP, I'd like to take this at another angle with your friend ... She's 45yo, sounds to be in decent shape, but looking to take it a step further, right?

Being that she's 45yo, I would be wondering if she is approaching any perimenopausal symptoms? Before considering any cycling to speak of, it would be a huge benefit for her to run top to bottom labs, ranging across the board from thyroid (TSH, FT4, FT3, RT3, antibodies), Iron/ferritin, B12, adrenals (cortisol/ACTH), D3, DHEA, Test, free test (or SHBG can calculate it), Estrogen (E1,2,3), progesterone, LH/FSH ... And of course all the standard CBC's, lipids, metabolic assays ...

Seems most women in their mid 40's are going to be facing hormonal challenges one form or another, and BHRT is in most cases the viable solution. My wife was in the tank with her test serum, free test & DHEA at age 39. Her serum was something like 8ng/dl with only a 1% free test level, and DHEA in the 60's. She had absolutely no building blocks to work with. It's critical that these hormones (and many others) are at an optimal level before introducing any compounds like Anavar or anything else. Her BEST bet will be to establish an account, post an introduction thread possibly in the Female Hormone Therapy forum, which will include stats, relevant background information, and her complete BW. If her basic hormones are optimal (or close thereof) then she can obviously look at taking the next steps to go forward.

If she puts something together, I'll gladly provide some input (as will others). Just send me a message when it's up, as I'm not here as much as I've been in the past. And yeah, my wife actually did a Anavar cycle after several years of getting everything else straightened out with her endocrine system. She's been able to sustain a 60-70ng/dl test serum level with her HRT, and she is closer to 2% on her free test; attributed to proper D3 supplementation and other variables. If your friend isn't sure about any of this stuff I am talking about, that's OK, let's get a conversation going and start building her knowledge base.

[austinite]

OP, I'd like to take this at another angle with your friend ... She's 45yo, sounds to be in decent shape, but looking to take it a step further, right?

Being that she's 45yo, I would be wondering if she is approaching any perimenopausal symptoms? Before considering any cycling to speak of, it would be a huge benefit for her to run top to bottom labs, ranging across the board from thyroid (TSH, FT4, FT3, RT3, antibodies), Iron/ferritin, B12, adrenals (cortisol/ACTH), D3, DHEA, Test, free test (or SHBG can calculate it), Estrogen (E1,2,3), progesterone, LH/FSH ... And of course all the standard CBC's, lipids, metabolic assays ...

Seems most women in their mid 40's are going to be facing hormonal challenges one form or another, and BHRT is in most cases the viable solution. My wife was in the tank with her test serum, free test & DHEA at age 39. Her serum was something like 8ng/dl with only a 1% free test level, and DHEA in the 60's. She had absolutely no building blocks to work with. It's critical that these hormones (and many others) are at an optimal level before introducing any compounds like Anavar or anything else. Her BEST bet will be to establish an account, post an introduction thread possibly in the Female Hormone Therapy forum, which will include stats, relevant background information, and her complete BW. If her basic hormones are optimal (or close thereof) then she can obviously look at taking the next steps to go forward.

If she puts something together, I'll gladly provide some input (as will others). Just send me a message when it's up, as I'm not here as much as I've been in the past. And yeah, my wife actually did a Anavar cycle after several years of getting everything else straightened out with her endocrine system. She's been able to sustain a 60-70ng/dl test serum level with her HRT, and she is closer to 2% on her free test; attributed to proper D3 supplementation and other variables. If your friend isn't sure about any of this stuff I am talking about, that's OK, let's get a conversation going and start building her knowledge base.

Excellent proposal and well said, Vette.