Tips on my stack please

**godzillaaaaa** · 12-19-2013, 04:42 PM

Hey team, trying to plan out my next cycle so would like some tips on the one i have put together so far, please let me know your reccomendations/changes etc. thanks

Im 6'2 at around 210lb 21years and sitting at about 12% bf or under.

So far i've successfully completed two cycles of Test E at 500mg a week for 12weeks. But this time i'm wanting to complete a Dbol , Deca , Test E cycle so id prefer to have it critiqued to make sure its right before i go my first time on both deca and dbol.

Here it is:
Wk 1-4: Dbol @ 40mg/ed
Wk 1-10: Deca @ 400mg/wk
Wk 1-12: Test E @ 500mg/wk
Wk 1-12: Letro @ 0.5mcg/eod

PCT: (14 days after last pin)
Nolva 40/40/20/20
Clomid 100/50/50/50

Also: this is first time using AI's so please let me know if you have a better dosing, already purchased letro though so i will probably go with that as the AI

Thanks

**DexterMorgan** · 12-19-2013, 04:47 PM

I would wait a couple more years. Cycling at 21 can be cause many serious problems. I know that you've done 2 cycles already, but you never know what's going to happen after the 3rd one.

**Euroholic** · 12-19-2013, 04:51 PM

No dont use letro as a ai. Arimidex 0.25mg eod and adjust as you go from feel/bloods. Also look into hcg .

**godzillaaaaa** · 12-19-2013, 05:08 PM

Okay no worries, just wondering but whats wrong with letro? and could it be used for anything during the cycle since ive already purchased it?

Yes obviously the age is the hard one, by the time i would've wanted to start this cycle i would be 22. Im open to comments about the age to, would like to know what you all think about doing a deca cycle at the age of 22.

**Euroholic** · 12-19-2013, 05:13 PM

You should reconsider you may be doing irreparable damage to your body. Letro is a strong compound you will most likely crash your e2.

**godzillaaaaa** · 12-19-2013, 05:25 PM

I should reconsider the letro?
No problem, i can go with Arimidex , just thought id check to see if it can have some use.

**DexterMorgan** · 12-19-2013, 05:26 PM

Originally Posted by godzillaaaaa

Okay no worries, just wondering but whats wrong with letro? and could it be used for anything during the cycle since ive already purchased it?

Yes obviously the age is the hard one, by the time i would've wanted to start this cycle i would be 22. Im open to comments about the age to, would like to know what you all think about doing a deca cycle at the age of 22.

You know cycling at that age put you at risk for permanent erectile dysfunction, hair loss and many other problems. Do you want to risk that in your early 20's?

**Euroholic** · 12-19-2013, 05:27 PM

If your going to do it look into hcg aswell

**godzillaaaaa** · 12-19-2013, 05:52 PM

Ok cool so next question: (sorry to be a pain in the ass but id rather get it all right)

How much hcg and how often per week is the best option?

**Euroholic** · 12-19-2013, 10:22 PM

500 iu a week spread over two pins stop before you start pct.

**Back In Black** · 12-20-2013, 01:47 AM

Originally Posted by DexterMorgan

You know cycling at that age put you at risk for permanent erectile dysfunction, hair loss and many other problems. Do you want to risk that in your early 20's?

i think he may be ignoring you. You're not telling him what he wants to hear.

Euro, tell him about your permanent side effects from cycling young

**Euroholic** · 12-20-2013, 01:53 AM

Originally Posted by Back In Black

i think he may be ignoring you. You're not telling him what he wants to hear.

Euro, tell him about your permanent side effects from cycling young

Were is the line in helping someone who is going to use anyway?

**Back In Black** · 12-20-2013, 03:15 AM

You've actually wished side effects on young users before, why change your life philosophy
?

**NaijaBoy** · 12-20-2013, 03:42 AM

2 cycles at only 21 years old is too much my dude. Besides you're fine based on your stats. Just eat, train and sleep. Steroid is not a miracle drug you know.

But if you've decided you will still go along with your 3rd cycle, your proposed plan works fine.

Just curious, what were your first two cycles?

**Euroholic** · 12-20-2013, 04:29 AM

Originally Posted by Back In Black

You've actually wished side effects on young users before, why change your life philosophy
?

You got angry at me for my tough love aproach so i changed like you told me too.

**Back In Black** · 12-20-2013, 05:38 AM

Originally Posted by Euroholic

You got angry at me for my tough love aproach so i changed like you told me too.

You can still explain what you are/have suffered from. Just don't follow it up with 'I hope it happens to you to'.

**Euroholic** · 12-20-2013, 05:45 AM

Originally Posted by Back In Black

You can still explain what you are/have suffered from. Just don't follow it up with 'I hope it happens to you to'.

Rodgy.

Im learning everyday

**godzillaaaaa** · 12-20-2013, 04:34 PM

Originally Posted by NaijaBoy

2 cycles at only 21 years old is too much my dude. Besides you're fine based on your stats. Just eat, train and sleep. Steroid is not a miracle drug you know.

But if you've decided you will still go along with your 3rd cycle, your proposed plan works fine.

Just curious, what were your first two cycles?

Just two cycles of Test E.

It's okay, this is one of the reasons i posted this thread is to see what people think, yes i understand the risks in young pinning and am listening to your advice, i havent really decided wether im going through with it just yet but IF i did, i want to make sure everything is as safe as i can make it.

I'm not the kind of guy that doesn't give a dam about his body and what goes into it (even though ive already done cycles lol) so if i do something like this, i really want to make sure im doing everything i can to make things the safest possible and keep the dosages at an okay level.

I do really appreciate the info, and you all telling me to wait until im like 25, i guess the hardest part is when all your gym partners are already doing it lol

**godzillaaaaa** · 12-20-2013, 04:35 PM

Oh also one question, test prop or test e with deca ? Whats better?

**Back In Black** · 12-20-2013, 04:40 PM

What was your weight before your first cycle?

How much did you gain and keep after each cycle?

**godzillaaaaa** · 12-20-2013, 04:43 PM

First cycle (sorry doing this in kgs because i live in new zealand)

1st:
Start: 90kg
End: 102kg
Post PCT: 98kg

2nd: Was done while cutting to maintain muscle and i gained 2kg and kept 1kg but dropped bf from 15% to around 11%

**Back In Black** · 12-20-2013, 04:45 PM

Bodyfat after first cycle?

**Back In Black** · 12-20-2013, 04:47 PM

Originally Posted by godzillaaaaa

First cycle (sorry doing this in kgs because i live in new zealand)

1st:
Start: 90kg 198lbs
End: 102kg 225lbs
Post PCT: 98kg 216lbs

2nd: Was done while cutting to maintain muscle and i gained 2kg and kept 1kg but dropped bf from 15% to around 11%

Ended 2nd cycle (post PCT) at 99kg (218lbs?

Current weight 95-96kgs?

**godzillaaaaa** · 12-20-2013, 04:53 PM

Ah no between cycles (about 6 months) i did abit of cutting already so i think from memory i may have been 95kg so ended at like 96kg. Cant remember completely as i didnt really note all my weights down.

And bodyfat at end of 1st cycle was probably about the same (obviously slightly higher, but didnt get my skinfolds done which wouldv been a good idea), ive always been a fan of clean bulking as it saves me time in a cut (even though i was at 15%bf).

So 1st cycle mayve have gained 1% or 2% bf (im a Personal Trainer so try to stay lean as much as i can to market myself as 'looking good' lol)
2nd cycle ended at about 96kg (after already cutting before hand)

**Back In Black** · 12-20-2013, 04:56 PM

Ok, so, when did your last cycle end and why are you the same body weight and bodyfat as that.

Why did you feel the need to start your first cycle weighing 90kg?

**godzillaaaaa** · 12-20-2013, 05:01 PM

Ended about 3 months ago and dont quite understand what your asking for the rest of that question?

And the reason why i chose to start? i guess it was impatience and the eagerness to go along with the other friends who were. Impatience to reach goals and compete in bodybuilding (starting off with physique) earlier at a winning level

**Back In Black** · 12-20-2013, 05:09 PM

Rest of the question is to see whether you have been intentionally trying to maintain those stats or not.

Correct me if I'm wrong in this but it's taken what, 15 months or more, plus 2 cycles, to gain 5 or 6 kilo's in weight. You haven't stated your bodyfat for the first cycle but owing to your comments it would have been about 15% I am guessing?

I'm trying to work out what your net gains have been. It's probably close to 9kg (up to 20lbs). Sound about right? For someone that is your age, over the course of over a year, that shouldn't have been that difficult to get close to that without cycling.

Next question, what are your goals for the proposed cycle? Why do you think you need d'bol and deca to reach those goals? What is your dietary plan to try and achieve those goals?

You have a few hours to answer those I'm off to bed

**godzillaaaaa** · 12-20-2013, 05:19 PM

Yeah well so of the gains went out the window due to average research first cycle owing to but dieting throughout PCT (losing gains, i learnt not to be in a calorie deficit during PCT haha)

As for diet wise, diet aint the problem, im personal train and work with a Nutritionist onsite so we help each other out, if im stuck on my diet i have him to consult and he does quite well in the bodybuilding industry here so i have him to rely on if i really need it.

So yeah i understand i lost out on a lot of gains due to dieting wrong during PCT and the gains i achieved were pretty norm for a years worth of work.
Now i guess the reason i wanted deca is to move up a step, again that is my impatience talking. I chose to be all in on this, i guess a little early. but i was in the mindset that this is what im doing

**Back In Black** · 12-21-2013, 02:20 AM

A little early yes. The more you cycle and the more compounds you use the more likelihood of short and long term problems.

I remember being your age. Just. You think you are bulletproof at that age and nothing can go wrong. That isn't the case. I can't condone you cycling at all, let alone adding 2 more compounds whilst you are still 21.

Have you ever had any bloodwork done?

Have a read of this too

***Cycles going wrong for the young***

And post up your current maintenance diet.

**godzillaaaaa** · 12-23-2013, 12:23 AM

Yeah bad idea, the more i think about it the more i realise im being stupid, you've done your job well i must say, steering me in the right direction.

Now bloodwork, no i wish i did to see the differences, thats one thing i wish i had done i will definately get it done to see where im at right now. As for how i feel and function (even though that doesnt mean my test is fine) im just as horny as i was before both cycles and no erection problems or anything and i always feel great. But yeah again i would still like to get them done to see where i am.

As for cycles in the near future, it will be hard to stop now but its definately opened my eyes a little more.
I do my best to keep everything as safe as i can, e.g. making sure PCT's and cycle dosages are correct etc.

If i get my blood tests done and my levels are good, would a normal Test e only cycle be okay (obviously your not gonna give permission to do cycles), but with proper safety during cycle e.g.:
HCG 500iu's/wk (during cycle)
AI (Arimidex ) 0.5mg/eod (during cycle)
Nolva 40/40/20/20 for PCT
Clomid 100/50/50/50 for PCT

seems like the most i could possibly do to keep things as 'safe' as possible?

But thanks for helping me think twice about adding another two compounds at the age of 21, guess i was getting too eager