Results 1 to 33 of 33
Like Tree4Likes
  • 1 Post By Bio-Active
  • 1 Post By Bio-Active
  • 1 Post By Bio-Active
  • 1 Post By NACH3

Thread: UGL underdosing

  1. #1
    GhostHykur7's Avatar
    GhostHykur7 is offline New Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    33

    UGL underdosing

    So I've researched the hell out of this and it appears that the consensus is that UGL oils and orals are underdosed. Some folks say up to 30% or more from what the label reads.

    My question then is do you adjust your dosage up front when using UGL's and then confirm with your mid-cycle bloods? Seems like you could potentially waste a whole cycle if you trust the label and your mid-blood work comes back with bunk test levels.

    Thanks guys

  2. #2
    Bio-Active's Avatar
    Bio-Active is online now AR-Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    L.A
    Posts
    24,316
    Quote Originally Posted by GhostHykur7
    So I've researched the hell out of this and it appears that the consensus is that UGL oils and orals are underdosed. Some folks say up to 30% or more from what the label reads. My question then is do you adjust your dosage up front when using UGL's and then confirm with your mid-cycle bloods? Seems like you could potentially waste a whole cycle if you trust the label and your mid-blood work comes back with bunk test levels. Thanks guys
    thats not really true. Sometimes they are overdosed. The risk you take with ugl is there is nothing regulating it
    almostgone likes this.

  3. #3
    Oki-Des's Avatar
    Oki-Des is offline Anabolic Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    3,306
    Yeah, you should never assume your ugl gear is under dosed. I have found that it sometimes is, but I would not simply assume so.

  4. #4
    Bio-Active's Avatar
    Bio-Active is online now AR-Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    L.A
    Posts
    24,316
    Quote Originally Posted by Oki-Des
    Yeah, you should never assume your ugl gear is under dosed. I have found that it sometimes is, but I would not simply assume so.
    right just run your labs and you will know. Heck I been doing this long enough I know just based on how I feel within a couple hours of administration

  5. #5
    NACH3's Avatar
    NACH3 is offline VET
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Baking chicken
    Posts
    19,418
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Bio-Active View Post
    thats not really true. Sometimes they are overdosed. The risk you take with ugl is there is nothing regulating it
    Exactly... I have some UGL that's very well dosed.... Have had it normally(5-6x higher it all depends on your source...

  6. #6
    NACH3's Avatar
    NACH3 is offline VET
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Baking chicken
    Posts
    19,418
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Bio-Active View Post
    right just run your labs and you will know. Heck I been doing this long enough I know just based on how I feel within a couple hours of administration
    When I run prop I usually dose at least 150mgs the first pin couple pins(daily) & I can feel my HR spike pretty quickly...

  7. #7
    Bio-Active's Avatar
    Bio-Active is online now AR-Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    L.A
    Posts
    24,316
    Quote Originally Posted by NACH3
    When I run prop I usually dose at least 150mgs the first pin couple pins(daily) & I can feel my HR spike pretty quickly...
    hmmm I don't ever run test prop. Usually cyp. I get that euphoric feeling within a few hours even with a longer ester but it goes away by the end of the day

  8. #8
    NACH3's Avatar
    NACH3 is offline VET
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Baking chicken
    Posts
    19,418
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Bio-Active View Post
    hmmm I don't ever run test prop. Usually cyp. I get that euphoric feeling within a few hours even with a longer ester but it goes away by the end of the day
    Not much experience w/the long esters(test e) but always liked prop but I don't like how fast it leaves your system

    And I'll feel my HR spike(just more than normal ya know) doesn't last till it's fully kicked... A wk/2most to really feel it...

  9. #9
    GhostHykur7's Avatar
    GhostHykur7 is offline New Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    33
    Makes sense. And like you guys said the blood work will prove it either way. Is there some sort of range of what my test levels would look like on a cookie cutter cycle, like 500 mgs of test cyp a week for 12 weeks, assuming the gear was dosed correctly?

  10. #10
    NACH3's Avatar
    NACH3 is offline VET
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Baking chicken
    Posts
    19,418
    Blog Entries
    2
    3-5x or higher than the highest part of range(TT in ng/dl) or your FT
    Last edited by NACH3; 04-18-2015 at 07:23 PM. Reason: Edit 3-5x

  11. #11
    Bio-Active's Avatar
    Bio-Active is online now AR-Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    L.A
    Posts
    24,316
    Quote Originally Posted by GhostHykur7
    Makes sense. And like you guys said the blood work will prove it either way. Is there some sort of range of what my test levels would look like on a cookie cutter cycle, like 500 mgs of test cyp a week for 12 weeks, assuming the gear was dosed correctly?
    500 mg ew should put you at or above 3,000 ng/dl
    NACH3 likes this.

  12. #12
    NACH3's Avatar
    NACH3 is offline VET
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Baking chicken
    Posts
    19,418
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Bio-Active View Post
    500 mg ew should put you at or above 3,000 ng/dl
    I thought it'd be a lil higher... but I have read that 3-5 is more accurate...

    Thx...

  13. #13
    Bio-Active's Avatar
    Bio-Active is online now AR-Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    L.A
    Posts
    24,316
    Quote Originally Posted by NACH3
    I thought it'd be a lil higher... but I have read that 3-5 is more accurate... Thx...
    that's only if it's dosed accurately lmao.... Well it depends on when you run the labs as well. I would always run them at my lowest point right before my next pin
    almostgone likes this.

  14. #14
    NACH3's Avatar
    NACH3 is offline VET
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Baking chicken
    Posts
    19,418
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Bio-Active View Post
    that's only if it's dosed accurately lmao.... Well it depends on when you run the labs as well. I would always run them at my lowest point right before my next pin
    Yeah accurately

    Ok that makes sense to do it at its lowest point so you know it's higher as that would be the biggest trough right? And Ed pinning wouldn't have that problem(prop - short esters)
    almostgone likes this.

  15. #15
    Bio-Active's Avatar
    Bio-Active is online now AR-Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    L.A
    Posts
    24,316
    Quote Originally Posted by NACH3
    Yeah accurately Ok that makes sense to do it at its lowest point so you know it's higher as that would be the biggest trough right? And Ed pinning wouldn't have that problem(prop - short esters)
    correct brother

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    3,449
    Quote Originally Posted by NACH3
    I thought it'd be a lil higher... but I have read that 3-5 is more accurate... Thx...
    A ballpark figure is about 6-7 times your dosage.
    Thus 500mg should be around 3000-3500.

  17. #17
    Dog-Slime's Avatar
    Dog-Slime is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Dirty South
    Posts
    1,139
    Sorry edited for drunkeness

  18. #18
    2iron's Avatar
    2iron is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    out there
    Posts
    476
    This topic is on my mind a lot lately. Can anyone explain test numbers like 7500ng/dl on 450mg test prop or 11,0000ng/dl on 650mg teste. These numbers seem crazy. Are they legitimate, possible?
    These are not numbers I read off of forum somewhere either
    Last edited by 2iron; 04-18-2015 at 10:21 PM.

  19. #19
    Bio-Active's Avatar
    Bio-Active is online now AR-Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    L.A
    Posts
    24,316
    Quote Originally Posted by 2iron
    This topic is on my mind a lot lately. Can anyone explain test numbers like 7500ng/dl on 450mg test prop or 11,0000ng/dl on 650mg teste. These numbers seem crazy. Are they legitimate, possible?
    I could see 7500 if you ran the labs on the day you pin

  20. #20
    2iron's Avatar
    2iron is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    out there
    Posts
    476
    Quote Originally Posted by Bio-Active View Post
    I could see 7500 if you ran the labs on the day you pin
    ok it was approx 5hrs after pin

  21. #21
    Bio-Active's Avatar
    Bio-Active is online now AR-Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    L.A
    Posts
    24,316
    Quote Originally Posted by 2iron

    ok it was approx 5hrs after pin
    It would be pretty high then

  22. #22
    Mp859's Avatar
    Mp859 is offline Knowledgeable Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    2,445
    Quote Originally Posted by Bio-Active
    500 mg ew should put you at or above 3,000 ng/dl
    also depends on the individuals rate of conversion to estrogen.

  23. #23
    2iron's Avatar
    2iron is offline Associate Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    out there
    Posts
    476
    Quote Originally Posted by Mp859 View Post
    also depends on the individuals rate of conversion to estrogen.
    I was under the impression that estrogen conversion didn't affect test levels. That would help explain though. All the other test levels I got were way lower but e2 was high from bunk ai's. Like above 500

  24. #24
    Mp859's Avatar
    Mp859 is offline Knowledgeable Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    2,445
    Quote Originally Posted by 2iron
    I was under the impression that estrogen conversion didn't affect test levels. That would help explain though. All the other test levels I got were way lower but e2 was high from bunk ai's. Like above 500
    I may be wrong. But logically, if you are converting a lot of your test to estrogen then I would think your total test levels would be lower.

    SHBG levels also affect free test levels. So lower SHBG, and free test will raise.

  25. #25
    Bio-Active's Avatar
    Bio-Active is online now AR-Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    L.A
    Posts
    24,316
    Quote Originally Posted by Mp859
    I may be wrong. But logically, if you are converting a lot of your test to estrogen then I would think your total test levels would be lower. SHBG levels also affect free test levels. So lower SHBG, and free test will raise.
    you should be managing that with your ai so that should not be an issue brothers

  26. #26
    NACH3's Avatar
    NACH3 is offline VET
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Baking chicken
    Posts
    19,418
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Bio-Active View Post
    you should be managing that with your ai so that should not be an issue brothers
    Right but what about if ones more sensitive(and they don't realize how to properly manage E2 levels?? Just playing devils advocate here

  27. #27
    NACH3's Avatar
    NACH3 is offline VET
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Baking chicken
    Posts
    19,418
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Mp859 View Post
    I may be wrong. But logically, if you are converting a lot of your test to estrogen then I would think your total test levels would be lower.

    SHBG levels also affect free test levels. So lower SHBG, and free test will raise.
    This does make sense in theory to me but like Bio said AI should/would take care of this(unless one doesn't use one)

  28. #28
    Bio-Active's Avatar
    Bio-Active is online now AR-Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    L.A
    Posts
    24,316
    Quote Originally Posted by NACH3
    Right but what about if ones more sensitive(and they don't realize how to properly manage E2 levels?? Just playing devils advocate here
    with all the info we have here managing your estrogen is how you run a proper cycle so again it shouldn't be an issue. To answer your question yeah whatever your body sees in excess it's going to try to aromatize it to maintain the natural balance of test and estrogen

  29. #29
    NACH3's Avatar
    NACH3 is offline VET
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Baking chicken
    Posts
    19,418
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Bio-Active View Post
    with all the info we have here managing your estrogen is how you run a proper cycle so again it shouldn't be an issue. To answer your question yeah whatever your body sees in excess it's going to try to aromatize it to maintain the natural balance of test and estrogen
    Samething I was thinkin! In regards w/the AI... No reason not to be able to manage your E2!!!
    Last edited by NACH3; 04-19-2015 at 04:47 PM. Reason: Worded it wrongly

  30. #30
    jstone is online now Knowledgeable Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    1,342
    On pharm grade test cyp my levels come back over 10 the dose. 200mg a week puts me at around 2000ng/dl at 7 days out right before next dose. So it is well over 2000 earlier in the week. I also get the same fealing as bio when I pin my test cyp. It doesn't last long, but I remember when I got my first trt shot. I felt like there was nothing I couldn't do for about 2 hours.

    From what I have read if your testosterone is properly dosed your levels should come back in the 7-10 times range of the dose. I know from my past bloodwork that my levels should be in the 10 times range for the dose.

  31. #31
    Bio-Active's Avatar
    Bio-Active is online now AR-Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    L.A
    Posts
    24,316
    Quote Originally Posted by jstone
    On pharm grade test cyp my levels come back over 10 the dose. 200mg a week puts me at around 2000ng/dl at 7 days out right before next dose. So it is well over 2000 earlier in the week. I also get the same fealing as bio when I pin my test cyp. It doesn't last long, but I remember when I got my first trt shot. I felt like there was nothing I couldn't do for about 2 hours. From what I have read if your testosterone is properly dosed your levels should come back in the 7-10 times range of the dose. I know from my past bloodwork that my levels should be in the 10 times range for the dose.
    well that's true but not. Everyone metabolizes it different. For instances 14 days out from my last pin even when running a heavy test cycle my levels will come back in the tank even though 7 days from my last pin my levels are still pretty high. There is no one size fits all only averages

  32. #32
    jstone is online now Knowledgeable Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    1,342
    Yeah I completely understand that. Thats why I said I know my levels should come back in the 10 range. 14 days out mine would be in the tank as well. I have only tested out as far as 12 days. At 12 days after my lever are in the mid 600's. This is not a heavy cycle, but it is well over my trt dose.

  33. #33
    Bio-Active's Avatar
    Bio-Active is online now AR-Hall of Famer
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    L.A
    Posts
    24,316
    Quote Originally Posted by jstone
    Yeah I completely understand that. Thats why I said I know my levels should come back in the 10 range. 14 days out mine are would be in the tank as well. I have only tested out as far as 12 days. At 12 days after my lever are in the mid 600's.
    it also depends on which ester you are running as well but I think everyone gets the idea

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •