Week 2...bunk or impatient?

**newbie2017** · 01-16-2018, 06:29 PM

5-9 150 31yrs cycle 1
500mg test e / week
Hcg 500iu / week
Sunday night / Wednesday night

The first week I took my .25 adex and the day after E2 crashed for sure. Couldn't get it up. Was feeling strange. Haven't taken the adex since.

3 pins deep, no significant changes. Long ester...most say full saturation is around 3-4 weeks.

Any advice, thoughts, comments, or concerns?

I'm keeping my eyes out for that good water retention and small strength gains.

-no shoulder or back acne. Was going to wait it out and feel my body out.

**kelkel** · 01-16-2018, 07:32 PM

Be patient and pull bloods after 6 weeks. If feeling nothing pull them at 4.
Taking .25 adex did not crash your E2 and cause a libido issue that quickly. That's in your head.

**Clove1234** · 01-16-2018, 07:44 PM

I was thinking the same thing when i started mine. Noticed a difference end of week two, big one during week three

**newbie2017** · 01-16-2018, 08:05 PM

Alright. Maybe so idk. My natural test is 965. I don't ever have a problem and I'm really in tune with my body. I'm just afraid to take the adex...I was hoping to get some high E2 symptoms just ever so slightly before I take any more. My appetite is up and I'm feeling pretty good. Little tired at times but I'm pushing hard in the gym. What do you think I should do about AI. My natural E2 was like 38. I'd like to keep it up there.

**magic32** · 01-16-2018, 08:21 PM

Impatient.
3 pIns is insubstantial for long ester effects. Keep training and eating right.

Also, HCG is not necessary in a Test-only cycle, and works quickly enough to wait until PCT for harsher cyles unless you KNOW recovery is slow.

Best to you.

**newbie2017** · 01-16-2018, 08:29 PM

I have done a lot of reading. I don't understand why anyone wouldn't run hcg on cycle ever! Why wouldn't you keep the boys running and reduce the risks? It only makes pct easier. So how do you feel about Austinites hcg thread under the educational article database?

**GearHeaded** · 01-16-2018, 08:35 PM

Originally Posted by newbie2017

Alright. Maybe so idk. My natural test is 965. I don't ever have a problem and I'm really in tune with my body. I'm just afraid to take the adex...I was hoping to get some high E2 symptoms just ever so slightly before I take any more. My appetite is up and I'm feeling pretty good. Little tired at times but I'm pushing hard in the gym. What do you think I should do about AI. My natural E2 was like 38. I'd like to keep it up there.

this is all person dependent . if growth is your overall goal you may not want to take an AI at all.

Estrogen helps with muscle growth and other growth factors.. here are just a few benefits
- E helps promote nitric oxide production and stimulates better blood flow and relaxation of vascular system (it has cardiovascular benefits ,, this is why we see women in their early 20s with high levels of estrogen rarely ever having heart attack or stroke,, but men in their 20s still die from these things as well as do older post-menopause women with low estrogen)

- E works on a host of different receptors , from the brain, kidney, heart etc.. to skeletal muscle . Estrogen acts on a specific muscle receptor that is responsible for satellite cell proliferation (specifically interacts with ER-B receptors to increase myogenic substances). So estrogen encourages muscle growth in a very similar way as does growth hormone .. satellite cells are muscle stem cells that aide in growth and repair.

- Estrogen , in the presence of high levels of Test, will stimulate the elevation of IGF-1 (the most anabolic hormone) and thus aide in muscle growth as well as more satellite cell stimulation
^^. that right there is enough to warrant letting your E levels be elevated while on cycle if growth is your primary goal

thats kinda the science stuff . but even old school bodybuilders who had no idea the science as to why estrogen helps you grow knew it and they go on record saying they grew much better in the off season by not using an AI

if my main goal is growth , then I rarely use an AI (or use it at lower doses .. just depends on my goal for that cycle) but not every cycle we do is just about growth . if we want to stay tight and dry and less watery then we will probably need to use an AI often . my point is not to be afraid of E especially if growth is the goal.

my theory as to why high levels of test, with tren , with high levels of estrogen will really help a guy grow (if he's not gyno prone) is because of the massive spike in IGF-1 . IGF gains are more permanent growth gains , compared to just blowing up with Dbol for a few weeks

**newbie2017** · 01-16-2018, 08:38 PM

I'm gonna let it ride till I feel emotional or get back acne. I don't think I'm gyno prone but I also know it's early. I can't take it every other day. Thanks bro!

**Clove1234** · 01-17-2018, 01:07 PM

From my understanding, you are running an exogenous testosterone . Your body is going to shut down no matter what Because it doesn’t need to make as much, if any test. So, your testes atrophy. HCG is supposed to prevent that or mitigate it from my understanding.

**newbie2017** · 01-17-2018, 04:22 PM

Check out the hcg thread under Austinite's educational article database.

**Jangles1** · 01-17-2018, 05:48 PM

My Test was under dosed (only doubled my natural test level in 6 weeks) but I still put on more weight than you would normally. Over 13lbs in 3 weeks I think it was. How is your weight ?

**Iron Frenchie** · 01-19-2018, 04:20 PM

There is still fake test around? Stick to UGL's. Gear is the cheapest and purest it's ever been.

**newbie2017** · 01-20-2018, 09:22 PM

Well it's the end of week 2 and I'm starting to get some pretty good results. I've gained a few pounds (more visibly than on a scale) and all my weights are going up. My appetite is through the roof. I'm thirsty as hell pretty much 24/7 and I'm watching my sodium. I'm drinking water only and can easily put down a gallon a day. I could probably use a gatorade here and there. Sometimes I have a lot of energy (as I always have) and sometimes I'm pretty exhausted. Probably from growth and development. Initially pip was pretty rough at the 24hr later mark but it's getting better. Warming oil first and hot bath after seems to help too. Looking forward to week 3.

**GearHeaded** · 01-21-2018, 11:37 AM

Originally Posted by newbie2017

Well it's the end of week 2 and I'm starting to get some pretty good results. I've gained a few pounds (more visibly than on a scale) and all my weights are going up. My appetite is through the roof. I'm thirsty as hell pretty much 24/7 and I'm watching my sodium. I'm drinking water only and can easily put down a gallon a day. I could probably use a gatorade here and there. Sometimes I have a lot of energy (as I always have) and sometimes I'm pretty exhausted. Probably from growth and development. Initially pip was pretty rough at the 24hr later mark but it's getting better. Warming oil first and hot bath after seems to help too. Looking forward to week 3.

good to hear brother..

- nothing wrong with adding in some extra sodium here and there rather then trying to avoid it, especially on cycle trying to bulk. Sodium will aide in the absorption of Carbs and thus help drive nutrients and water into muscle cells. and if your training hard in the gym it will help you in contracting the muscle while lifting (don't want to just move the weight from point a to point b, we want a good contraction)

- Warm bath after every injection , man I'd be jumping in the tub up to 3-4 times a day then

I pin a lot of compounds and a lot of short esters and suspensions, so yeah sometimes I inject 4 times per day.
don't worry, the PIP will get better over time. I can pin Test E in my bicep or chest or lat or wherever and have zero PIP

**Berzerk** · 01-21-2018, 12:06 PM

God damn 965 Natty test at 31yo.

I'd have stayed natural and ate perfect and let that natural test work it's magic.

I'm crippled with Natty test around 250-300

I run try to get to the 900's.

Lucky you

**GearHeaded** · 01-21-2018, 12:26 PM

Originally Posted by Berzerk

God damn 965 Natty test at 31yo.

I'd have stayed natural and ate perfect and let that natural test work it's magic.

I'm crippled with Natty test around 250-300

I run try to get to the 900's.

Lucky you

I think he has been training and dieting for awhile. maybe not optimally, but his natty test levels have him where he is. 900+ is great , BUT its not supra-physiological and thus won't stimulate a supra-physiological response in muscle growth . running Exogenous Test and getting 10,000+ng/dl will initiate a much more anabolic response then his natural levels ever could.

least he as a good baseline to go back to once he comes off though, if he recovers well after pct. so the 900 natty levels will be better to help him maintain his gains, then it was to initiate those gains in the first place