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Thread: 4th Cycle - Choice

  1. #1
    CALLMEOCT's Avatar
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    Thumbs up 4th Cycle - Choice

    After talking with several forum members and exchanging some private messages regarding my upcoming cycle; this is what i ended up deciding to start running during Mid-October right after my 27 Birthday.

    Week 1 to 12: Testosterone Propionate @ 100mg Mon - Wed - Fri (300mg Total/week)

    Week 1 to 12: Masteron Propionate @ 150mg Mon - Wed - Fri (450mg Total/week)

    Week 1 to 4: Dbol @ 50mg ED.

    Week 1 to 12: Arimidex - From day 2 up to PCT; Twice a week; dosed at 0.25 -

    Week 1 to 12: Proviron - 50mg ED - I like the effect of it on my body and i can feel it; i know there might be some controversy around it but im definitely running it.

    Week 8 to 12: Winstrol - 50mg ED.

    Goals: Lean muscle mass gains.

    Cycle Start: October 7th - Monday

    This is going to be my first time trying Test Prop; and Masteron ; and im really looking forward what's coming; i heard T prop is painful but after running Test E a couple times i wanted to give it a try.

    Any advices are welcome.

    Stats Updated Today:
    Weight: 90.800kg
    Heigh: 1.85cm
    Body Fat: Been fluctuating around 13% using Caliper Clip.


    Diet: Starting at 3000 Cals
    Macros: 40C - 35P - 25F
    Last edited by CALLMEOCT; 09-24-2019 at 10:12 AM.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by CALLMEOCT View Post
    After talking with several forum members and exchanging some private messages regarding my upcoming cycle; this is what i ended up deciding to start running during Mid-October right after my 27 Birthday.

    Week 1 to 12: Testosterone Propionate @ 100mg Mon - Wed - Fri (300mg Total/week)

    Week 1 to 12: Masteron Propionate @ 150mg Mon - Wed - Fri (450mg Total/week)

    Week 1 to 12: Arimidex - From day 2 up to PCT; Twice a week; dosed at 0.25 -

    Week 1 to 12: Proviron - 50mg ED - I like the effect of it on my body and i can feel it; i know there might be some controversy around it but im definitely running it.

    Week 8 to 12: Winstrol - 50mg ED.

    Goals: Lean muscle mass gains.

    Cycle Start: October 7th - Monday

    This is going to be my first time trying Test Prop; and Masteron ; and im really looking forward what's coming; i heard T prop is painful but after running Test E a couple times i wanted to give it a try.

    Any advices are welcome.

    Stats Updated Today:
    Weight: 90.800kg
    Heigh: 1.85cm
    Body Fat: Been fluctuating around 13% using Caliper Clip.


    Diet: Starting at 3000 Cals
    Macros: 40C - 35P - 25F
    Why are you running Arimidex when there’s hardly any estrogen in this cycle?

    I’d double the test. 600mg a week. Unless that’s 300 a week on top of a longer Esther test you forgot to list.

    If you want to run the Mast just run 100mg every other day instead of Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. Your body doesn’t know there’s 7 days in a week, but it does notice hormone fluctuation.

    I don’t really know fuck all about proviron , it seems expensive vs. the return, but it’s not going to hurt either.

    Winstrol looks good.

    I’d add like 400-600mgs of deca , NPP, or DHB to this since you’re already using the mast. Maybe add some dbol or Anadrol to the first 4 weeks.
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  3. #3
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    this is a VERY androgenic cycle. every compound your running, Test, Mast, Proviron , Winny, are all going to have a significant effect on DHT levels and add to the androgenic load of this cycle .
    I'm not saying thats good or bad, just pointing it out.

    this cycle is likely going to give you a lot of initial 'cosmetic' effects and you'll transform quite nicely. Androgenic based 'cosmetic' effects are generally temporary though. high androgen cycles like this are generally ran for pre contest prep , because the bodybuilder is going for a certain cosmetic look on stage, and androgens help with this. he's already built his mass in the off season.

    so this cycle isn't going to put a whole lot of quality mass on you per se.. its way too dry as well for true mass gains. you may also find yourself having to eat a lot more then you think to keep up with the androgen load , androgens stimulate your CNS and raise your TDEE and thus demand more calories (thats why high androgen load cycles are great for cutting as well, but harder to bulk on)


    I'm sure you'll look great by week 12 though . its not a bad plan.

    If I was going to tweak it slightly for a little more 'mass' orientated gains , I'd add a wet non androgenic compound into the mix somewhere. maybe pull the winstrol and run Anadrol instead, or simply start the cycle off with an Anadrol or Dbol
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    Quote Originally Posted by i_SLAM_cougars View Post

    I’d add like 400-600mgs of deca, NPP, or DHB to this since you’re already using the mast. Maybe add some dbol or Anadrol to the first 4 weeks.
    we are thinking on the same page here
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    this is a VERY androgenic cycle. every compound your running, Test, Mast, Proviron , Winny, are all going to have a significant effect on DHT levels and add to the androgenic load of this cycle .
    I'm not saying thats good or bad, just pointing it out.

    this cycle is likely going to give you a lot of initial 'cosmetic' effects and you'll transform quite nicely. Androgenic based 'cosmetic' effects are generally temporary though. high androgen cycles like this are generally ran for pre contest prep , because the bodybuilder is going for a certain cosmetic look on stage, and androgens help with this. he's already built his mass in the off season.

    so this cycle isn't going to put a whole lot of quality mass on you per se.. its way too dry as well for true mass gains. you may also find yourself having to eat a lot more then you think to keep up with the androgen load , androgens stimulate your CNS and raise your TDEE and thus demand more calories (thats why high androgen load cycles are great for cutting as well, but harder to bulk on)


    I'm sure you'll look great by week 12 though . its not a bad plan.

    If I was going to tweak it slightly for a little more 'mass' orientated gains , I'd add a wet non androgenic compound into the mix somewhere. maybe pull the winstrol and run Anadrol instead, or simply start the cycle off with an Anadrol or Dbol
    Following your advice; the right tweak would be adding Dbol for the first 4 weeks; and ''divide'' the cycle in phases. By adding Dbol i might end up pulling winstrol out; any thoughs GearHeaded?

    Edit: Or keep both since i wont be using a huge amount of both compounds.

    Thanks!

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    if it were me . I would run a Dbol taper with most this cycle.

    Week 1-4
    50mg Dbol
    Week 5-6
    30mg Dbol
    Week 7-8
    20mg Dbol

    then off

    Then use Wiinstrol as mainly a cortisol suppressant at the end of the cycle going right into PCT
    Week 11-13
    Winny 50mg

    you can run Winny up until the very day you start PCT . you don't need to wait a week to let it clear like test p


    the reason for tapering the Dbol down over time is so that you can run it longer term and that will help you acclimate to the "dbol gains" . a lot of guys run Dbol for only 4 weeks and then come off and then piss away all the weight they gained (literally) . nothing wrong with running Dbol for only 4 weeks as a kickstart to a cycle ,, but you'll get more acclimated to the I intercellular retention if you keep it in longer term.
    by lowering the dosage over time your keeping liver stress down (not that I'd be too concerned with those lower doses of Dbol and liver stress anyhow)

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    Wannabhuge14 is online now Junior Member
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    Dang only 3,000 calories! You’re metabolism must be slug mode or you don’t roll off the couch ever. Combination of both?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wannabhuge14 View Post
    Dang only 3,000 calories! You’re metabolism must be slug mode or you don’t roll off the couch ever. Combination of both?
    believe it or not something in between 3/3.1K is pretty much what I need to maintain my current weigh; that’s why I clarified that’s the starting point - my current macros - daily calorie Intake.

  9. #9
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    4th Cycle - Choice

    Quote Originally Posted by Wannabhuge14 View Post
    Dang only 3,000 calories! Youíre metabolism must be slug mode or you donít roll off the couch ever. Combination of both?
    OP is 6í1Ē
    About 200lbs

    3k calories is ball park maintenance for most people this size. Iím 6í 210 lbs and maintenance for me is around 3.2k calories give or take, and thatís lifting 5-7 days weekly.


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    Quote Originally Posted by i_SLAM_cougars View Post
    Why are you running Arimidex when there’s hardly any estrogen in this cycle?

    I’d double the test. 600mg a week. Unless that’s 300 a week on top of a longer Esther test you forgot to list.

    If you want to run the Mast just run 100mg every other day instead of Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. Your body doesn’t know there’s 7 days in a week, but it does notice hormone fluctuation.

    I don’t really know fuck all about proviron , it seems expensive vs. the return, but it’s not going to hurt either.

    Winstrol looks good.

    I’d add like 400-600mgs of deca, NPP, or DHB to this since you’re already using the mast. Maybe add some dbol or Anadrol to the first 4 weeks.
    Hormone fluctuations are not necessarily a bad thing, your body naturally doesn't have a steady flow of hormones. Dan Duchaine was also working on a theory he called anabolic threshold before he passed, so there is not a lot of info out there, but the theory revolved around singular large doses of long ester compounds. The large dose gives you a high peak, while maintaining about the same trough levels.

    I understand if maintaining stable levels helps keep sides lower for some individuals, but I believe to much emphasis is placed on stable levels.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by jstone View Post
    Hormone fluctuations are not necessarily a bad thing, your body naturally doesn't have a steady flow of hormones. Dan Duchaine was also working on a theory he called anabolic threshold before he passed, so there is not a lot of info out there, but the theory revolved around singular large doses of long ester compounds. The large dose gives you a high peak, while maintaining about the same trough levels.

    I understand if maintaining stable levels helps keep sides lower for some individuals, but I believe to much emphasis is placed on stable levels.
    That’s all good and fine for natural production, and some small amount of HRT testosterone . But when I’m pumping my body full of super physiological levels of artificial hormones to build muscle I feel it’s more efficient to maintain constant levels. That’s why everyday are injections are preferable. I also notice I have less side effects than when things are bouncing all over the place.

    That’s just me though. It seems silly to say there’s a “correct way” to pump your body full of artificial hormones that don’t even belong in it to begin with
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by balance View Post
    OP is 6’1”
    About 200lbs

    3k calories is ball park maintenance for most people this size. I’m 6’ 210 lbs and maintenance for me is around 3.2k calories give or take, and that’s lifting 5-7 days weekly.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    We are pretty much on the same boat in terms in maintaining. Thanks for replying!

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by jstone View Post
    Hormone fluctuations are not necessarily a bad thing, your body naturally doesn't have a steady flow of hormones. Dan Duchaine was also working on a theory he called anabolic threshold before he passed, so there is not a lot of info out there, but the theory revolved around singular large doses of long ester compounds. The large dose gives you a high peak, while maintaining about the same trough levels.

    I understand if maintaining stable levels helps keep sides lower for some individuals, but I believe to much emphasis is placed on stable levels.
    agree with a lot of this . What Dan Duchaine was theorizing is actually utilized with AAS in veterinary medicine as well .

    I've jokingly told guys on here, asking about bringing a bottle of EQ across the boarder from Mexico, to just go ahead and inject the whole bottle before you leave Mexico and you'll be fine and not worry about having to be caught with it . one mega dose of a long ester like EQ will play itself out over weeks and weeks .

    and not in joking fashion , I've advised running EQ at like 1500mg for about 3 weeks is all and letting the long ester play itself out over the rest of your cycle . the idea that you have to run it at a much lower dose for like 12+ weeks cause its a long ester is simply not true.. same with Deca . long esters can work great at larger doses for short duration (its actually the short esters that need to be ran for longer duration .. bros have it ass backwards for years)

    https://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-...es-%3D-bs.html
    Last edited by GearHeaded; 09-24-2019 at 05:43 PM.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    agree with a lot of this . What Dan Duchaine was theorizing is actually utilized with AAS in veterinary medicine as well .

    I've jokingly told guys on here, asking about bringing a bottle of EQ across the boarder from Mexico, to just go ahead and inject the whole bottle before you leave Mexico and you'll be fine and not worry about having to be caught with it . one mega dose of a long ester like EQ will play itself out over weeks and weeks .

    and not in joking fashion , I've advised running EQ at like 1500mg for about 3 weeks is all and letting the long ester play itself out over the rest of your cycle . the idea that you have to run it at a much lower dose for like 12+ weeks cause its a long ester is simply not true.. same with Deca . long esters can work great at larger doses for short duration (its actually the short esters that need to be ran for longer duration .. bros have it ass backwards for years)

    https://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-...es-%3D-bs.html
    Gregg Valentino is proof that this works. He use to inject 50ml bottles of EQ into his arms (that wasn’t synthol), and he said he couldn’t pass a drug test for like 3 years
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    Quote Originally Posted by CALLMEOCT View Post
    After talking with several forum members and exchanging some private messages regarding my upcoming cycle; this is what i ended up deciding to start running during Mid-October right after my 27 Birthday.

    Week 1 to 12: Testosterone Propionate @ 100mg Mon - Wed - Fri (300mg Total/week)

    Week 1 to 12: Masteron Propionate @ 150mg Mon - Wed - Fri (450mg Total/week)

    Week 1 to 4: Dbol @ 50mg ED.

    Week 1 to 12: Arimidex - From day 2 up to PCT; Twice a week; dosed at 0.25 -

    Week 1 to 12: Proviron - 50mg ED - I like the effect of it on my body and i can feel it; i know there might be some controversy around it but im definitely running it.

    Week 8 to 12: Winstrol - 50mg ED.

    Goals: Lean muscle mass gains.

    Cycle Start: October 7th - Monday

    This is going to be my first time trying Test Prop; and Masteron ; and im really looking forward what's coming; i heard T prop is painful but after running Test E a couple times i wanted to give it a try.

    Any advices are welcome.

    Stats Updated Today:
    Weight: 90.800kg
    Heigh: 1.85cm
    Body Fat: Been fluctuating around 13% using Caliper Clip.


    Diet: Starting at 3000 Cals
    Macros: 40C - 35P - 25F
    Why are you running an AI (anastrozole) when you relatively should have a low amount of estrogen during your cycle? I understand you plan to dose it at only twice a week and a low dose, but I thought the horse was beaten dead already on this forum as far as an AI during cycle goes? Maybe there is something I'm missing?

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by djnuffsaid View Post
    Why are you running an AI (anastrozole) when you relatively should have a low amount of estrogen during your cycle? I understand you plan to dose it at only twice a week and a low dose, but I thought the horse was beaten dead already on this forum as far as an AI during cycle goes? Maybe there is something I'm missing?
    Probably just a new guy. That AI shit is so beaten into guys now in days.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by i_SLAM_cougars View Post
    Probably just a new guy. That AI shit is so beaten into guys now in days.
    Not really; been here since 2017 and I understand what’s the forum position at this time regarding Ai; yet I already did my last cycle without using one the first couple weeks and I had some issues; mostly insomnia after week 4 and a decent amount of water retention that leaded into cramps in certain parts of my body that hurt me big time.

    I will be running it only twice a week at a pretty low dose and; for sure; could tune it once cycling and seeing how is my body actually responding to the low dosage mixed with Masteron and Proviron .

    I’m doing what I think is the best choice for me at this time; and compound wise; pretty much tuned the cycle around the advices I got during last couple weeks in the forum.

    I may not be really active on the forum but I’m always around reading; learning; and trying to improve.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by CALLMEOCT View Post
    Not really; been here since 2017 and I understand what’s the forum position at this time regarding Ai; yet I already did my last cycle without using one the first couple weeks and I had some issues; mostly insomnia after week 4 and a decent amount of water retention that leaded into cramps in certain parts of my body that hurt me big time.

    I will be running it only twice a week at a pretty low dose and; for sure; could tune it once cycling and seeing how is my body actually responding to the low dosage mixed with Masteron and Proviron .

    I’m doing what I think is the best choice for me at this time; and compound wise; pretty much tuned the cycle around the advices I got during last couple weeks in the forum.

    I may not be really active on the forum but I’m always around reading; learning; and trying to improve.
    If you are having problems then lower the Test to HRT, add more Masteron, and do 200-400mg of DIM per day. I am not exaggerating when I say AI's are worse than chemotherapy.

    Propionate Ester needs to be injected Every Day. At EOD injections, you lose almost 80% of your dosing . This can be validated easily by using steroidcalc and graphing the ester. At MWF injections, you are starting from scratch every monday. It's like every week is Week 1 of your cycle.

    More frequent injections also reduce side effects.
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