does the rocket juice?!?

[LilVito469]

does the rocket juice?!? well according to sportscenter garry sheffield said i know hes just a pitcher but hes not just drinking soda water

[Jack87]

Lets just say i know someone that caught for him for a few seasons
and yeah there's something special about his orange juice in the
morning... Like most pro athletes... BTW what the hell is up with
this thread looking totally different then all the others? I must be
tripping...

[KeyMastur]

they're called greenies

[biglouie250]

who cares hes a jerkoff any way....dont see him "protecting" his teammates by beaning batters anymore ...why?? because all AL pitchers dont have any balls

[Bob Balco]

It sucks that all this steroid talk is out. All of us in this forum know for a fact that LOTS of guys were juicing if there were no tests. Think about it.....you have a contract year with potentially millons $ staring you in the face and they dont test for juice! Not to mention you can get the hook up on the best stuff and have the $ to buy whatever you want. Well over half the rosters in college when i played and coached were on some roids.

Roids dont make you all that much better but thats up for debate for obvious reasons. But steroids dont make Barry Bonds see the ball better and have tremendous plate disapline. So the thing is all of the baseball fans that are not knowledgable about steroids think all the accomplishments these players have made are cheap. This is wrong in my opinion

None of us really know if rocket juiced and he has never pissed + so who are we to say. If you were to ask me I woudl say the comment Sheff made was reffering to the rocket and "greenies" a form of speed.

[Rsox1]

roger is a big guy but by no means muscular, i mean his bf has got to be over 17%, I am usually the first person to scream "juicehad" at pro althetes, but in rogers case I think he just matured, I mean I saw him training one time in a special and he was doing smith machine squats with 135, not exactly "juice" weight, In my opinion Roger is just got olderr and bigger, the body he has could be easlily obtained with a little work and a lotta texas smoke house food, and btw Sheffield should talk, its possible he is on juice but I wouldn't bet on it.

[Jack87]

Not to disagree, but i have first hand info that's all I'm gonna say...

[Jack87]

BTW just because he's not squating 500lbs for 10 reps
doesn't mean he doesn't juice... alot of pro athletes use
anabolics more to speed recovery then just pure power
or mass gains... For example you think in the NFL that
the players could recover for next weeks game if they
weren't on something? They need to be just to speed
recovery so they can perform next week...

[Rsox1]

buff i agree with you 100% juice isn't just to have ripped muscles, the fact is roger is not a hard body by any means, but that doesn't mean he doesn't juice to help him recover after each start, and maybe your source is correct I never said that it wasn't true, but what I am saying is that the phyique he has acquired is far far from a "juiced" physique, more like a bar room brawler's body. Its very possible he has juiced but it wold not surprise me if he hasn't. So in the end its just not as obvious as somone like David Boston in football, just my $.02

[Bob Balco]

Clemens is a strong dude. Clemens can squat a ton I bet. Clemens off season and in season work outs are stuff of legend in basbeball. All parts of his conditioning program have been used by college coaches and fellow major leaguers such as Curt Shilling. I am sure you can find info about that on a search engine. Clemens being stong and in shape has enabled him to be a success as a power pitcher late in his career. Having a "roid looking body" is not what a pitcher taking the juice would be after. I am not at all saying rocket took roids nor do i care if he did.

[Rsox1]

woahh wait one second I could entertain the thought that roger might be juicing, but jerry rice had legendary workouts, clemens is legendary and he works out there is a differnce, no that you are totally wrong but most of our information comes from morons like Tim McCarver who would think that the gazelle could produce a legendary workout, and anyone who watches red sox or diamondbacks baseball knows one thing for sure Curt
Shilling has never ever done a legendary workout, his workout is with his mind, he is one of the smartest players in the game. Shilling is a grat guy (so it seems) but he is more outta shape then Clemens, he has a big gut, and chicken legs, and his arms are stringy, maybe Clemens workout is great for a pitcher, but it is very very likely not legendary, just in the gullible public's mind

[Krunchtime]

who cares hes a jerkoff any way....dont see him "protecting" his teammates by beaning batters anymore ...why?? because all AL pitchers dont have any balls

he pitches in the nL........

[Krunchtime]

roger is a big guy but by no means muscular, i mean his bf has got to be over 17%, I am usually the first person to scream "juicehad" at pro althetes, but in rogers case I think he just matured, I mean I saw him training one time in a special and he was doing smith machine squats with 135, not exactly "juice" weight, In my opinion Roger is just got olderr and bigger, the body he has could be easlily obtained with a little work and a lotta texas smoke house food, and btw Sheffield should talk, its possible he is on juice but I wouldn't bet on it.

Not to flame... but roger is not fat by any means.. I know you didnt say he was but I promise under that uniform there is a well built athlete

[Bob Balco]

Dude I am going to get some links for this. Do a search on clemens work out. I dont want to argue but I know I am right. Shill credits clemens with helping him with his work out routine which prolonged his career. They used to work out together in the off season in Houston. Shill can "work out with his mind" all he wants but its not going to help him be a power pitcher STILL at this age. He is a smart pitcher but face it he relies on his heat. I cant believe you are a red sox fan and dont have a clue about Clemens off season regimen?? I am sure clemens diet is not the cleanest lol. You dont have to be lean and look good with your shirt off to be a good pitcher.

[Rsox1]

Yes I am a red sox fan and way before he had this rebirth Roger was fat outta shape and screwed the red sox, with 4 ****ty seasons, the best shaoe he was ever ever in was in 97 with toronto, I have no proof because I did not know roger personally when he was here, but the only legendary workout he did while he was with the red sox was at dunkin donuts, and I agree you do not have to be able to take off your hsirt to be a good pic but the point of this article was that roger was on juice and I ran to his defense, I said his phyique could be obtained without juice unlike some others in baseball, thats all I said

[Bob Balco]

Roger has numerous endorsements for baseball training products dude. This doesnt make Rocket a beast but you dont get them endorsements by being a fat lazy guy who dont work out bro. You dont contend for the cy young and start the all star game in your 40's as a power pitcher being a fat lazy guy. Lots and LOTS of training goes into the 4 days between starts for rocket.
No kidding you didnt know Roger personally when he was with boston. If you did we wouldnt even be having this convo. Because he may have had a high bodyfat % doesnt mean he wasnt working out dude......ok man!!!!!!!!!!! time to go get links to add for this post. Jeez man...EVERYTHING the rocket is right now is because of his training! WHY on earth do you claim the guy is a out of shape, donut eating, guy that dont work out?? You just like to argue or you really dont know baseball? I am going to take the friggin time to get you some links. If I get links and you dont have anything with a link for your proof that rocket dont work out the convo is over dude. Argueing something you obviously have no clue about is not cool bro.
http://www.mensjournal.com/healthFit...t_clemens.html
http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/nyy/ne..._nyy&fext=.jsp
http://www.onlineathleticclub.net/resources/rocket.asp
look at this one and tell me he is fat http://www.cardillousa.com/brianmac.htm
LOL read this one peter gammons this one actually quotes sheff and what he said http://www.nydailynews.com/front/sto...p-183667c.html
ok bro I highly doubt you will even read these few links i found. I will copy and paste what was said by sheff the other day and man it really differs from what you have to say....
"But the Yankee right fielder wonders why other stars with obsessive workout routines and high productivity, such as Roger Clemens, escape steroid suspicion and have their superior fitness level attributed to their dedication"

"Sheffield pointed to Clemens as an example of a player whose success is attributed to a superior fitness program"
Your turn for links????????

[Bob Balco]

Here is a link to a interview with Schilling about some of his work out in the off season. He talks about being addicted to the martial arts while even though in beginner stages. Far from not doing ANY work outs and working on "working on his mind". He also talks about doing pilates which he still does to this day. http://msn.foxsports.com/content/view?contentId=1000316

[LilVito469]

i didn't know this topic would have made people argue over whether he juices or not...i personally dont think so but then again i could be wrong, i thought he was just on some kind of routine that i should be on to be 40 and in good shape like that...

[Rsox1]

this is the last i am going to say on this issue and then I am done , I read the links, the workout seems like a very good workout, no doubt about it. First point that I am going to make, thats what Roger says he does, ask anybody what they bench and then watch them bench and you will see that most of the time people exxagerate. Second and my most important point, I have read that workout and surrently I am about 5"10 and 205 and a bf of around 11 to 12 ish and I am being 100 percent honest, right now If I were to try that workout I could not do it, but given two weeks I could complete that workout, and within a month I know could do that workout and do it well, A "legendary workout" as it was put should not be something the a shmoe off the street could do with a month of training, granted I try to be humble but I do not think that I am a shmoe, but I know that I am not even close to legendary. A legendary workout should be something that most people couldn't do even if they put all their effort into it, legendary ie jerry rice, walter payton, running up hill for a mile with a tire on, Kurt Angle workouts running 3 ,miles a day in under 18 mins with a 50 backpack on those are legendary because to be honest I don't think thatr even most trained people could do those workouts with 6 months of training. Roger gained 30 freaking lbs in 2 years with the sox and it was not from workong out, and when I see him in his uni now he don't look much different, believe all the media tells you and what you want to belive but no person with a least a 38 inch waist and over 17% bf does legendary workouts, Even though I do not like the man at all he is and was one of the most legendary players to play the game but please do not let the media mix that up with legendary workouts, this is all I have to say about this issue, and for the original post does he juice, I could see it either way so only Roger really knows

[Krunchtime]

bottom line.... Roger may not look as good with his shirt off as some people on this board but there isnt one person on here that can throw a fastball as fast as him. Guarnteed

[O.T]

bottom line.... Roger may not look as good with his shirt off as some people on this board but there isnt one person on here that can throw a fastball as fast as him. Guarnteed

I'm going to have to agree with this point.

I also believe that even though roger's body may not be anything to brag about. Under that uniform lies a beast. Personally, I think he uses steroids for recovery purposes. Why not? everyone else in sports does now a days..

[saboudian]

I honestly cannot believe how ppl are talking up clemens' workout, this so called "legendary routine" is a complete joke, its just ridiculously retarded.

[NorCaLifter]

see in my opinion pitchers really dont need to juice... mechanics are way more important than your bench when it comes to pitching. Hell look at nolan ryan...skinny as hell but completely dominating.... i think its dangerous for pitchers to juice..here is why.... building up all that muscle especially in the upperbody, i think it would cause too much strain for the tendons... hell being natural is hard enough on a pitchers arm... Im of the philosaphy... "if your a pitcher...you either have it or you dont" All the great pitchers back in the day were natural and didnt need any gear. So if clemens is juicing I dont think it has made him any better, I think he was a stud of a pitcher without it.

[Hugh-Hefner's-Son]

IMO my vote goes for him being on the juicy juice. Recall the time when he threw the broken bat at Piazza. WTf was that about, he was raging.

Just because he's a pitcher doesn't rule him out, just look at John Rocker. He was a nut and appeared to be juiced. Of course pitchers don't "need" to juice, but could it hurt them being a little stronger and recovering faster.

[NorCaLifter]

I think it can hurt a pitcher. Pitching is mechanics, plain and simple. Sure having a strong arm help but strength doesnt mean size or biceps or the amount you can curl. There are plenty of pitchers out there that i can out curl or out bench or out squat but... but... i cannot throw a 95mph fastball. This is a case were size and strength dont matter. I dont think that juicing will take a guy who can throw 80mph to 90mph... the only place a pitcher can really grow and not worry about screwing up his tendons and ligaments is his legs but when your juicing... its not just confined to the lower body. So on the question, does roger clemens juice...who knows, he was a big boy way back in the day and is a big boy now... and i know a lot of guys who get pissed really easy who do not juice... its called being a fierce competitor. So him throwing the bat i cannot attribute to steroids . Now its not that noticable if he juices if he does...not like the case of barry bonds... I mean look at how he grew so **** fast when he came to sf... he was a twig with the pirates and just ballooned like crazy way way too fast. So its hard to say if roger juices... If he is, it hasnt improved his game, hell look at him in the beginning with boston...well.. thats my opinion anyways.

[Krunchtime]

see in my opinion pitchers really dont need to juice... mechanics are way more important than your bench when it comes to pitching. Hell look at nolan ryan...skinny as hell but completely dominating.... i think its dangerous for pitchers to juice..here is why.... building up all that muscle especially in the upperbody, i think it would cause too much strain for the tendons... hell being natural is hard enough on a pitchers arm... Im of the philosaphy... "if your a pitcher...you either have it or you dont" All the great pitchers back in the day were natural and didnt need any gear. So if clemens is juicing I dont think it has made him any better, I think he was a stud of a pitcher without it.

btw.. nolan ryan lived in the weight room. His legs were massive which is where he got his power from... since I am a pitcher he is my idol. 101mph fastball is extremely rare.. As far as the rocket juicing...who knows? Rocker is a yes on the juice and I believe kyle farnsworth may have done it as well. HItters...well that list goes on for miles

[Krunchtime]

I think it can hurt a pitcher. Pitching is mechanics, plain and simple. Sure having a strong arm help but strength doesnt mean size or biceps or the amount you can curl. There are plenty of pitchers out there that i can out curl or out bench or out squat but... but... i cannot throw a 95mph fastball. This is a case were size and strength dont matter. I dont think that juicing will take a guy who can throw 80mph to 90mph... the only place a pitcher can really grow and not worry about screwing up his tendons and ligaments is his legs but when your juicing... its not just confined to the lower body. So on the question, does roger clemens juice...who knows, he was a big boy way back in the day and is a big boy now... and i know a lot of guys who get pissed really easy who do not juice... its called being a fierce competitor. So him throwing the bat i cannot attribute to steroids. Now its not that noticable if he juices if he does...not like the case of barry bonds... I mean look at how he grew so **** fast when he came to sf... he was a twig with the pirates and just ballooned like crazy way way too fast. So its hard to say if roger juices... If he is, it hasnt improved his game, hell look at him in the beginning with boston...well.. thats my opinion anyways.

those are all great points. agree 100%

[NorCaLifter]

Oh of course, by no way did i mean that mr. ryan didnt train. The man stood at 6'2 about 200lbs in 93 at his peak weight. The man was a rock for sure. And as far as being your idol, hell you couldnt pick a better one. I can remember growing up playing ball and wanting to dominate like he did.

[Krunchtime]

Yeah. Ryan probably didnt have the best bench press numbers but as you said pitchers don't rely on their strength in bench. However his leg press is something to talk about

[Rod Farva]

Roger might juice. Might not. That much I'm not sure of. Some of the reasoning on this thread can use some work though.

Nolan Ryan was NOT skinny as hell. Ask Robin Ventura what a pushover Nolan Ryan was. He came from an era when lifting in baseball (ESPECIALLY for pitchers) was strictly taboo.

Being in NY, I saw some of the specials they did on Rocket's routine. They showed him in the hot tub warming up for the days' run one time. He didn't have a ripped physique at all but that has more to do with his priorities than anything else. The people on this board lift for show...he lifted for go. As for his wide waist, a lot of that is natural. Some people are just built that way. Not to mention he's going to work his obliques hard without worrying if it fuks up his tapered V look. Obliques are big in baseball hitting/pitching to build torque for the swing/delivery. You combine strong trunk work (abs) with very little upper body work (can't take a chance of fukking up the wing) and you get Roger or any other pitcher. Instead of a V build he looks like a cylinder. Obliques make his already thick waist look even wider.

How many pitchers have athletic bodies? That's the nature of the position. I know guys that are considered to be in fairly good shape (not as competitive BBers but rather as John Q Public) and I know for a fact that some of these guys are just natrually lean and all they do is lift chest and arms. Their natural skinny build plus a modicum of upper body development makes them look to be in far better shape than Clemens or 90% of other pitchers. That's because our society looks at tits and arms first and not legs/obliques. How many times you see a guy with a normal build up top and big legs and hear somebody marvel at his physique? How many times have you seen the opposite (big upper/average legs) and people who don't know better are impressed by it? Very few "average" people lift legs much if at all. Tits and arms are the only things that a pitcher really CAN'T do. They can't mess around with that upper shoulder region. How many guys don't do much bench because of bad shoulders. Now imagine how much precaution you take if your multimillion dollar livelihood depended on those shoulders. Uh...bye bye benchie!

Even hitters don't always bench that much. I remember thinking that Jay Buhner was a big dude who hit bombs (he did). I saw some SI article on him and they showed him with his shirt off and he had zero chest. That just gets in the way of a good smooth baseball swing. Most of the juiceheads you see now just lift in the place of developing a good swing. Many of these guys use lifting to mask bad swing mechanics. Outside of the hated Bonds and Sosa, how many of these big strong guys are hitting tape measure shots any more? Darryl Strawberry hit the ball farther than any of these guys. Micky Mantle was 5'11" and 200 lbs and never lifted weights and he hit the ball farther than anybody. He hit the ball out of stadiums. He almost hit one out of Yankee stadium. Try googling Mantle to see how far he hit the ball. Nowadays you get guys raving about a ball going 450 but Mantle hit a ball 565. Look it up. I'm sure he was strong as a bull but he didn't look like a competitive BBer by any stretch. Big shoulders don't help in baseball. I know a local juicehead who was a big deal in high school baseball but never went anywhere with it. He was all juiced up but like a lot of guys (Paul Konerko) figured that if a little juice/lifting is good then a lot must be better. Got too big (shoulders like volleyballs) and said he can't hit baseball any more and even has trouble adopting to slowpitch softball and harnessing all his strength. He looks like a total bodybuilder but that's not helping him at all.

Wow...somebody shut me up...my keyboard is smoking and I forgot my original point.

[Rod Farva]

Just reading one of Bob Balco's links and this shows everything...


http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/nyy/ne..._nyy&fext=.jsp

When Clemens hangs up his pitching spikes for the final time, he will return to his home in Houston to spend time with his wife and four sons. He said that while he plans on continuing his workouts, they won't be to the level that they are now.

"I'll probably lift a little more than I do now, as long as it won't hurt my golf swing," he said. "I'll still work, but I'll be active enough. I'll be chasing four boys around."



That shows how little lifting Roger does.

Another point is that the only guy who ever hung in with Roger's workouts was Andy Pettite who is a great big fatass. The man is a perfect pear. Complete opposite of what the average BBer would desire in a physique yet he's the only guy who hangs with Clemens.

[biofx]

I'm sure a little juice wouldn't hurt the velocity on that fastball. It's weird how sheffield called him out like that. Not cool to point fingers

[goodtobeapimp]

If you think steroids will make you pitch like clemens...Be my guest. I get so tired of people using steroids for their excuse why they aren't something great. I read an article about ryan throwing in the 90's when he was in high school. **** he must have been on gh... Matter of fact Mantle did hit a ball estimated 565 feet. That doesnt mean he was a steroid junkie. What about Ruth? Hell he is one, if not the most dominate player of a sport of a certain era.

Thats why I laugh when I see so many people in college talking about steroid this and that. Yea steroid use is there without a doubt in my mind. You have to be a total moron to think that steroids are going to make you something you arent. That isn't steroids, thats TALENT.

People tend to point fingers at steroids like they are magic. Hell Ronnie should be throwing 200mph fastballs and dunking from half court.

[AustrianOAK14]

i dont think he juices

[Jack87]

I know someone that has caught for him in the past and yes
he does along with alot more major league players then you
think...

i dont think he juices

[AustrianOAK14]

well he probably did in the past but right now hes fat

[Jack87]

That doesn't mean he doesn't juice... alot of the MLB pitchers
use anabolics to speed recovery between starts... Trust me
i have some inside information, but i really don't blame him
ior any other pro athlete that does... **** i do it and i'm not
even playing for millions of dollars each year... these guys
careers depend on having respectable numbers year in and
year out, do you really think they don't try to make their
numbers the best they can so when they are up for a new
contract or maybe in Roger's case the hall of fame that they
have done everything they can do assure themselves of
getting what they work so hard for?

well he probably did in the past but right now hes fat

[O.T]

Yeah, every one juices for one reason or another, lay off of bonds and sheffield.. every athlete in every sport..

[AustrianOAK14]

i think the referees are jucing too

[O.T]

lol