Very Low T at 19 years old

[iain]

Hey guys,

I've been feeling like crap lately. I started noticing it 6-7 months ago; very low energy levels, inconsistent libido, intense anxiety, sleep issues, mild/moderate gynecomastia etc. My weight has hit a plateau(even gone down a bit) despite proper diet and switching up my workouts every 2 weeks. I feel depressed and out of it for no real tangible reason, my life is otherwise good. I play AAA hockey and my performance has gone down the shitter. I have little to no aggression on the ice and it's really hurting my development.

The gynecomastia is what prompted me to see my doc. She sent me off to an endocrinologist who ordered some bloodwork. It was pretty clear what was going on judging by the results (serum test: 237 [200-800]). He shrugged it off saying it was in the normal range.

I called up an anti-aging clinic that offered HRT for a second opinion, but they won't even see me because I'm too young.

Here are my "stats":

19 years old
5'9"
170lbs
11-12% bf
Never taken steroids or prohormones

I really just don't know what to do here, I can't live like this for much longer. I can barely get out of bed in the morning these days. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

[funkymonk]

Normal LabCorp range is 280-800, not 200-800. Regardless, you're still muddling in the 200s when you should be in the 500s+. See a different doctor.

[CHEVYMAN646]

I would definetley get a second opinion from another doctor. At your age you should be much higher. If it has come on suddenly then be sure to get it checked again so you are sure there are no immediate health issues that are causing the low levels. Are you on any other prescriptions? Some meds, like prozac or something similar can cause a serious decrease in test if I'm not mistaken.

[Times Roman]

did you have your free test analyzed?
thyroid?

[iain]

I've been on Adderall XR(20mg, 2x daily) for coming up on 4 years now, no meds other than that.

They checked a whole bunch of things with the blood work though, I've got the results sheet lying around here somewhere. I'll find it and post the whole thing.

What I'm slowly discovering though is that most doctors wouldn't be caught dead prescribing anabolics to a 19 year old athlete, regardless of the numbers.

[CHEVYMAN646]

all of the symptoms you stated are side effects of adderall. If you have been on it for that long then maybe ask about switching it up to a similar medicine. Doesn't explain the test level but it may help with some of the other side effect ie ...
"very low energy levels, inconsistent libido, intense anxiety, sleep issues, mild/moderate gynecomastia etc. My weight has hit a plateau(even gone down a bit) despite proper diet and switching up my workouts every 2 weeks. I feel depressed and out of it for no real tangible reason, my life is otherwise good. I play AAA hockey and my performance has gone down the shitter. I have little to no aggression on the ice and it's really hurting my development."

" Common Side Effects of Adderall XR
Adderall XR has been studied thoroughly in clinical trials, with many people having been evaluated. In these studies, the side effects that occurred in a group of people taking the drug were documented and then compared to the side effects that occurred in another group of people taking a placebo (a "sugar pill" that does not contain any active ingredients). As a result, it was possible to see what side effects occurred, how often they appeared, and how they compared to the group not taking the medicine.

Based on these studies, the most common Adderall XR side effects include:

•Loss of appetite -- in up to 36 percent of people
•Dry mouth -- up to 35 percent
•Difficulty sleeping (insomnia) -- up to 27 percent
•Headaches -- up to 26 percent •Abdominal pain (stomach pain) -- up to 14 percent
•Temporary increase in blood pressure -- up to 11 percent
•Weight loss -- up to 11 percent (see Adderall and Weight Loss)
•Emotional changes -- up to 9 percent
•Nausea, upset stomach, or vomiting -- up to 8 percent
•Dizziness -- up to 7 percent
•Diarrhea -- up to 6 percent
•Feeling of weakness (asthenia) -- up to 6 percent •Increased heart rate (tachycardia) -- up to 6 percent
•Infection, including urinary tract infection (UTI) -- up to 5 percent
•Fever -- up to 5 percent
•Heartburn -- up to 2 percent.

Adderall XR can also cause a temporary slowing of growth in children. This is usually small (less than an inch and less than two pounds), and children usually catch up to within normal limits in time.

Report
Some side effects with Adderall XR, while occurring infrequently, are potentially serious and should be reported immediately to your healthcare provider. These include but are not limited to:

•Suicidal thoughts
•Confusion
•Chest tightness
•Chest pain or heart palpitations
•Shortness of breath
•Depression (see Adderall for Depression)
•More outgoing or aggressive behavior than normal
•Strange behavior
•Hallucinations (seeing, hearing, or feeling things that are not really there)
•Agitation or restlessness
•Fainting
•Seizures
•Unexplained rash
•Hives
•Uncontrolled movements of the head, neck, mouth, arms, or legs (known as tics).

Rare Side Effects Seen With Adderall XR
Rare Adderall XR side effects were reported in very few people taking the drug. Given how uncommon these side effects are, it is difficult to tell whether they are caused by the medication or something else.

Some of these rare side effects include but are not limited to:

•Fatigue or tiredness •Constipation
•Shakiness
•Sweating
•Impotence (also known as erectile dysfunction, or ED)
•Decreased sex drive (see Adderall Sexual Side Effects).
If you have seizures, heart problems, or mental problems, Adderall XR can aggravate the symptoms of these conditions.

Final Thoughts
You may experience some or none of the side effects listed in this article. Unfortunately, there is no way for your healthcare provider to know beforehand if you will have side effects from a medicine that you have never tried. Therefore, be sure to let your healthcare provider know if you develop any side effects while taking the drug. Also, let your healthcare provider know if you develop something that "just does not seem right." While it may not be a side effect of Adderall XR, your healthcare provider will be able to diagnose and treat the problem."


http://adhd.emedtv.com/adderall-xr/a...e-effects.html


I would ask the Doc if the adderall could be causing the lower test levels. Seems from what I have read it is a possibility.

[iain]

I've considered that possibility, tried going off it for awhile but that did nothing but exacerbate my symptoms. It was actually the first thing I thought of before I looked into hormones and what not.

I've always responded quite well to adderall. Mind you I've experienced most of those side effects, but they're fleeting and only happen when you first start on it. In my experience they tapered off or completely dissapeared within a few months.

Good thought though, I always appreciate the help!

[zaggahamma]

nice post by the chevy...thats what came to my head when i read your post (well not the whole page) but the adderal taking...man i hope u get better...

hate to break it down this way...but if you knew u would have suffered the sides youre describing would u say it was worth the relief that the adderal provided you?

best of luck

[iain]

Well that depends on what sides you're referring to. If you mean the sides I was experiencing when I first started on the stuff a few years ago, then absolutely; adderall has done wonders for me. If hypothetically it were the cause of the way I'm feeling now, then I'd have to say no. Like I said though, I can pretty much say for sure that adderall not the reason for all this.

That said, I'm not doctor, but I'll talk to my endo and see what he thinks and get back to ya. Thanks again guys

[iain]

oops, double post

[zaggahamma]

really surprised to hear you say that.....it really freaks me out to hear all the youth on these rx's these days (including my own child/children) 2 of 3 on new medications my youngest being on a form of ritalin,etc. (concerta/intuniv)....teachers wanting to have my mom put me on as well...i always did feel awkward however...maybe the newness/discovery of all these syndromes/disorders confuses....but then again hrt is new as well....so...... food for thought....

[iain]

Alrighty guys, sorry it took so long but I've got the test results here in their entirety:

TSH - 4.08 mU/L (0.30 - 5.50)

Free T4 - 22 pmol/L (11 - 22)

FSH - 4.2 U/L (2.0 - 18.0)

LH - 8.0 U/L (2.0 - 18.0)

Prolactin - 9.4 ug/L (4.0 - 15.0)

Estradiol - 70 pmol/L (< 156)

Testosterone - 14.9 nmol/L (8.4 - 28.7)

Free Testosterone - 249 pmol/L (200-800)

SHBG - 41 nmol/L (13-71)

[zaggahamma]

what did the endo say about em..

interesting estradiol range...anything under 156 is ok? imma check my old bloodwork and see what measurements were used..

how u feelin, same?

wut r your thoughts/ideas?

[iain]

I got the typical within normal range crap from him, no surprise there. I'm still not feeling good; depressed, pretty anxious, weak.. On top of that I'm sleeping 12-14 hours a day and taking constant naps throughout the day. I keep falling asleep after dinner which isn't like me, I'm usually a bit of an insomniac.

The 249 free test just seems wrong for someone my age with my activity level. Estradiol seems high too, I always thought optimal was 10-30pmol/L. Doc doesn't seem to think anything is wrong though..

[stevey_6t9]

your total and free test is fine, completely normal... maybe looking into your thyroid, you could have hyperthyroidism... your on the high level of free t4, maybe you should look into that?

hyperthyroidism can cause weakness, lack of energy, depression etc

[layeazy]

have u thought about try some tribulus to maybe try and boost your natural test levels there debate that they dont work however i have found that the do get me more energy more aggresive and focussed on the activity otherwise maybe look into energy tablets like gurana to keep you stimuated when you exercise you might get more out of it and train harder.

[iain]

Fine as in within normal range or fine as in optimal? From what I've read my free test should be at least twice if not three times as high as it is? I'm 19 years old after all.

[stevey_6t9]

Fine as in within normal range or fine as in optimal? From what I've read my free test should be at least twice if not three times as high as it is? I'm 19 years old after all.

im 19 years old also and my levels are lower then yours, not everyone is given high test levels, your delt certain cards in life and you have to take them.

your shbg is normal, you dont have albumin results so i cant comment there, though everything according to these results is normal. no doctor or hrt clinic would even consider remotely trt at your age and numbers.

i would consider full bloodwork done ie FBC etc, you might have something underlying causing your symptoms; ie anaemia etc

[trix8]

nahh thats low 249 bro **** that i got hrt at 21 with lvls just over 300, this one of the most important times of your life

[zaggahamma]

im 19 years old also and my levels are lower then yours, not everyone is given high test levels, your delt certain cards in life and you have to take them.

your shbg is normal, you dont have albumin results so i cant comment there, though everything according to these results is normal. no doctor or hrt clinic would even consider remotely trt at your age and numbers.

i would consider full bloodwork done ie FBC etc, you might have something underlying causing your symptoms; ie anaemia etc

agree with everything but in bold

[stevey_6t9]

agree with everything but in bold

as his age and levels, thats just my opinion... prescribing androgens to a 19 yr old with those levels, and a single blood test warrants a review of a medical license.

well OP's 3 options are

get FULL bloowork done to find and underlying problems

try and nag HRT clinics and docs to get trt

go on self medicated trt

anyway thats my 2 cents good luck with everything OP, hope things work out.

[zaggahamma]

as his age and levels, thats just my opinion... prescribing androgens to a 19 yr old with those levels, and a single blood test warrants a review of a medical license.

well OP's 3 options are

get FULL bloowork done to find and underlying problems

try and nag HRT clinics and docs to get trt

go on self medicated trt

anyway thats my 2 cents good luck with everything OP, hope things work out.

dont get me wrong, i think youre giving excellent advice...i should have elaborated that...i however looking back, wonder how long i may have been low T and may have benefited with TRT at a young age...definately like your saying with doctors supervision....but the young man has symptoms...i mean if a person isnt processing sugar they treat with insulin ....not much different with trt..
the op def has a lot to look at coming from the other meds..
i also hope the op gets treated correctly

[Sicko]

Best of luck bro..I hope they are able to narrow down the problem and resolve it.

[iain]

I appreciate your input stevey, you're clearly very knowledgeable when it comes to this kind of thing. That said, I'm 19 years old and I can't get my dick up for my smoking hot girlfriend(or anyone for that matter). That is NOT normal and it is NOT fine. I'm virtually at my physical peak, these are supposed to be the most virile years of my life yet I feel like a sad decrepit old man. Something's gotta be done here, I've just gotta decide what.

Thanks again for the replies you guys, I'll post again when I figure all this out.

[iain]

Heya guys,

So it turned out I have hypopituitarism, most likely due to the all the concussions I've had. My doc finally saw the light and put me on 100mg test C/week! That was a few weeks ago and I've gotta say the difference is night and day. I feel ****ing fantastic; I'm not anxious or depressed, I feel strong and confident again, I'm finally back on the ice again and getting better each day, and I'm horny 24/7. I couldn't ask for more. I've truly never felt better in my entire life.

I really appreciate all the advice, you guys all played a part in turning my life around for the better. Thanks so much.

[JohnnyVegas]

Glad to hear you are feeling better.

[LeanGreenMachine]

Great to hear you are feeling better!

[funkymonk]

Heya guys,

So it turned out I have hypopituitarism, most likely due to the all the concussions I've had. My doc finally saw the light and put me on 100mg test C/week! That was a few weeks ago and I've gotta say the difference is night and day. I feel ****ing fantastic; I'm not anxious or depressed, I feel strong and confident again, I'm finally back on the ice again and getting better each day, and I'm horny 24/7. I couldn't ask for more. I've truly never felt better in my entire life.

I really appreciate all the advice, you guys all played a part in turning my life around for the better. Thanks so much.

How did you both determine the hypopituitarism?

[Honkey_Kong]

How did you both determine the hypopituitarism?

Yeah, I want to know how this unfolded.

[iain]

Doc told me that it was a pretty easy call, he just had to connect the dots really.

It first crossed his mind when I came in for my appointment with a 4L jug of water(which I had to carry around with me all the time at that point). I was drinking 6-8 litres of water a day out of necessity and having to piss about every 15 minutes. He ordered BW and confirmed that my electrolytes were significantly out of whack, on top of the low test. He prescribed a desmopressin nasal spray(synthetic vasopressin, which is an anti-diuretic hormone secreted by the pituitary) and the problem vanished. With that he took into account the fact that all my symptoms had appeared after my last concussion(in may 2010). He told me that when diabetes insipidus and symptoms of secondary hypogonadism appear virtually simultaneously after traumatic brain injury it's pretty much a slam dunk.

Forgot to mention, he ordered an MRI to screen for a pituitary adenoma just incase, but it came back clear.

[zaggahamma]

did your doc discuss treatment?

[Shol'va]

Your pituitary gland controls the signal to the testis to either produce more testosterone or not, part of the endocrine system in our male bodies along with the thyroid gland. And having head injuries at a young age can cause the pituitary gland to turn off later down the road, sometimes sooner. Unfortunately science has no answer for turning it back on once it shuts off. Your only alternative will be supplementing your body from now on with either the gel form, which sucks, or the shots which you now are receiving. I'm just curious to know if you have to go in for the weekly shots or if the doc has prescribed self shots for you to do on your own. To me the latter would be the ideal way to go especially if you plan in the future to supplement any bodybuilding as you could blast and cruise. And its good that the mri came back negative otherwise they would have to operate and remove it.

[iain]

Yup I'm with ya there, really glad I don't have anything nasty going on up there. My doc showed me how to do it the first time and told me he's fine with self administered shots. He told me to start with 50mg/week but said I could bump it up to 100mg depending on how I was feeling. Maybe I'm just impatient, but I moved up to 100mg after my second week when I found I was dropping off around day 4-5 after I pinned. I'm feeling really good now at a little under a month in; I wish I would've done this sooner!

The only thing I'm not liking is the anti-diuretic nasal spray, it bloats me up pretty bad. At least I don't have to spend half my day pissing though I suppose.

[Honkey_Kong]

Yup I'm with ya there, really glad I don't have anything nasty going on up there. My doc showed me how to do it the first time and told me he's fine with self administered shots. He told me to start with 50mg/week but said I could bump it up to 100mg depending on how I was feeling. Maybe I'm just impatient, but I moved up to 100mg after my second week when I found I was dropping off around day 4-5 after I pinned. I'm feeling really good now at a little under a month in; I wish I would've done this sooner!

The only thing I'm not liking is the anti-diuretic nasal spray, it bloats me up pretty bad. At least I don't have to spend half my day pissing though I suppose.

Has he done bloodwork to follow up on your treatment?

[iain]

He did BW to check my lytes and they were back in normal range, that was before I went on the TRT though. I'm seeing him next week though, he told me he was going to order some bloodwork then. It'll be cool to see what my numbers are at now that I'm feeling better.

[Honkey_Kong]

He did BW to check my lytes and they were back in normal range, that was before I went on the TRT though. I'm seeing him next week though, he told me he was going to order some bloodwork then. It'll be cool to see what my numbers are at now that I'm feeling better.

Let us know what the TRT raised them to.

[Honkey_Kong]

He did BW to check my lytes and they were back in normal range, that was before I went on the TRT though. I'm seeing him next week though, he told me he was going to order some bloodwork then. It'll be cool to see what my numbers are at now that I'm feeling better.

By the way, you said when you stopped taking Adderall that your symptoms became worse? You understand it is an addictive drug and has withdraw symptoms too. You need to be slowly taken off the drug. You shouldn't just stop cold turkey.