Out of tune

[swllce]

On my 6th week of trt.
Started out conservative wk1 100mg test C
wk2 100mg test C
wk3 100mg test c ,no AI
wk 4,5,6 150 mg test C ,0.5mg Anastrozole 3 times a week.
So i started out feeling like superman,sexdrive and mood strength where up.
Now on my 6th week i feel crappy,
Clinic says i diden't take my ai as prescribed.3 1.1mg anastrozole per week,so my e2 proly shot up.
So im going to try to knock it down.
I have had sore nipples, and trouble sleeping, and now also anxiety.
I will have bloodwork drawn i 2 weeks.
would a regular GP agree to test fore e2,test,free test ,etc?
Anyone here with an aa clinic who has their GP onboard for their blood work?

[bass]

sorry to hear it! i bet your blood has gotten thick! your RBC and Hemoglobin! i feel tired, weak and unmotivated when my blood gets thick. so donate blood ASAP if thats the case!

[swllce]

Hey bass,i am going to have that checked,thanks bro!

[steroid.com 1]

On my 6th week of trt.
Started out conservative wk1 100mg test C
wk2 100mg test C
wk3 100mg test c ,no AI
wk 4,5,6 150 mg test C ,0.5mg Anastrozole 3 times a week.
So i started out feeling like superman,sexdrive and mood strength where up.
Now on my 6th week i feel crappy,
Clinic says i diden't take my ai as prescribed.3 1.1mg anastrozole per week,so my e2 proly shot up.
So im going to try to knock it down.
I have had sore nipples, and trouble sleeping, and now also anxiety.I will have bloodwork drawn i 2 weeks.
would a regular GP agree to test fore e2,test,free test ,etc?
Anyone here with an aa clinic who has their GP onboard for their blood work?

Are you taking any HCG ? A classic symptom in some men who are in HPTA shut down is depression and anxiety due to the lack of precursor hormone Pregnenolone and one huge reason why a man on TRT needs HCG.

You can buy DHEA and Pregnenolone at any good vitamin store (I like Vitamin Shoppe). Try taking 50 mg of the DHEA before bed and 50 mg twice daily of the Preg (like AM and PM) and see if this doesn't help. The uptake on these are low, really low, like 10% after passing the liver so you'll be absorbing small doses. Gels work much better.

Let me know how you feel if you try this.

gd

[forrest_and_trees]

Clinic's right.. get yer E2 down and all will be well again. Good luck.

[lifter65]

agree with gdevine, dr crisler has written about how after a few weeks people dont feel the same without hcg , im one of them

[steroid.com 1]

The OP is on 150 mg per wk of T Cyp with 1.5 mg of AI. That would hold down any rise in E2. It's hard to understand his post "3 1.1mg anastrozole per week,so my e2 proly shot up." Even if he was taking 1 mg per week it would still keep 150 mg in check in my opinion.

BUT, his post said he "had sore nipples".

Hard to make sense of it but it could very well be E2 or if no HCG the anxiety.

[steroid.com 1]

agree with gdevine, dr crisler has written about how after a few weeks people dont feel the same without hcg, im one of them

Yep. We need pregnenolone it's just a fact. Screws up the brain and depression and anxitey are at the top of that list. Crisler and Mogentaler both write on this subject.

[zaggahamma]

The OP is on 150 mg per wk of T Cyp with 1.5 mg of AI. That would hold down any rise in E2. It's hard to understand his post "3 1.1mg anastrozole per week,so my e2 proly shot up." Even if he was taking 1 mg per week it would still keep 150 mg in check in my opinion.

BUT, his post said he "had sore nipples".

Hard to make sense of it but it could very well be E2 or if no HCG the anxiety.

agree....was also super confused at the bible verse numbers before the anastrozole....but agree that another good reason not to guess....

he DID complain of sore nips which when that happens to me i take an extra .25 or .5 of dex to knock that out....

g, about the dhea and the preg cream....you can take these and benefit similarly to being on hcg ? or do you NEED to run all 3?

[JD250]

g, about the dhea and the preg cream....you can take these and benefit similarly to being on hcg ? Or do you need to run all 3?

x2 ^

[bass]

Are you taking any HCG ? A classic symptom in some men who are in HPTA shut down is depression and anxiety due to the lack of precursor hormone Pregnenolone and one huge reason why a man on TRT needs HCG.

You can buy DHEA and Pregnenolone at any good vitamin store (I like Vitamin Shoppe). Try taking 50 mg of the DHEA before bed and 50 mg twice daily of the Preg (like AM and PM) and see if this doesn't help. The uptake on these are low, really low, like 10% after passing the liver so you'll be absorbing small doses. Gels work much better.

Let me know how you feel if you try this.

gd

yea forgot about hCG, good point!

[lovbyts]

I need to talk to my doc about donating. They wont let me because I had Hep B so it has to be per RX because they just destroy it. Maybe I should just do it myself? NOT.... LOL Fill up a 1/2 gallon bag of blood. Maybe there are some vampires around who might want it.. LOL

[swllce]

The first 3 weeks i did not use any Anastrozole,no AI at all.Then for the next 3weeks i cut 2 1.1mg anastrozole caps in half = 0.55mg 4 times a week.
I wanted to add in the ai in gradually to see how much i would really need.
Maybe i convert t to e2 easily?
The HCG does sound like a potential culprit.
Could i be entering HPTA shutdown after only 6 weeks though?
Sorry about typing errors! wifey is always peekin at the puter screen.She is in the dark about all this

The OP is on 150 mg per wk of T Cyp with 1.5 mg of AI. That would hold down any rise in E2. It's hard to understand his post "3 1.1mg anastrozole per week,so my e2 proly shot up." Even if he was taking 1 mg per week it would still keep 150 mg in check in my opinion.

BUT, his post said he "had sore nipples".

Hard to make sense of it but it could very well be E2 or if no HCG the anxiety.

[GotNoBlueMilk]

First, tell your wife and explain why it is a good thing.
Second, if that avatar is not your wife, lose the avatar so you don't have to hide this forum from your wife.
Doing First and Second items will greatly reduce your anxiety issue!

If you are taking 0.55 mg of anastrozole 4 times a week, then you are probably taking too much. The sore nipples is confusing, though. Low E2 will make you feel like crap. Maybe you had sore nipples before starting the AI and now you are taking way too much AI?

FYI, controlling E2 is probably the hardes thing about HRT. It takes some work and has a learning curve.

[zaggahamma]

First, tell your wife and explain why it is a good thing.
Second, if that avatar is not your wife, lose the avatar so you don't have to hide this forum from your wife.
Doing First and Second items will greatly reduce your anxiety issue!

If you are taking 0.55 mg of anastrozole 4 times a week, then you are probably taking too much. The sore nipples is confusing, though. Low E2 will make you feel like crap. Maybe you had sore nipples before starting the AI and now you ar taking way too much AI?

FYI, controlling E2 is probably the hardes thing about HRT. It takes some work and has a learning curve.

lol...his wife will still see 38 jumpers and cyoungers(couple of my favs) but yeh get these wifeys in check lol..
about your ai/e2 theory....only thing..whem i take even a small dose the sore nips go away so r u sayin not to take always with that symptom present? Hard2 do bloodwork more than a few times a year

[steroid.com 1]

agree....was also super confused at the bible verse numbers before the anastrozole....but agree that another good reason not to guess....

he DID complain of sore nips which when that happens to me i take an extra .25 or .5 of dex to knock that out....

g, about the dhea and the preg cream....you can take these and benefit similarly to being on hcg ? or do you NEED to run all 3?

I run all 3 three J. HCG injected 250 iu EOD and daily low dose cream of DHEA/Pregnenolone and a added bonus of Selegiline (this stuff is the shits!). Crilser likes the added DHEA and Preg on TRT and so does my MD.

[steroid.com 1]

150 mg T Cyp and .55 mg AI 4x would hold down E2. Sore nips before the AI most likely. Anxiety most likely due to no Pregnenolone production.

Just my $0.02.

[zaggahamma]

I run all 3 three J. HCG injected 250 iu EOD and daily low dose cream of DHEA/Pregnenolone and a added bonus of Selegiline (this stuff is the shits!). Crilser likes the added DHEA and Preg on TRT and so does my MD.

Yeh i know u do...was wondering wut u thought of just the preg and the dhea

[bass]

I need to talk to my doc about donating. They wont let me because I had Hep B so it has to be per RX because they just destroy it. Maybe I should just do it myself? NOT.... LOL Fill up a 1/2 gallon bag of blood. Maybe there are some vampires around who might want it.. LOL

you just gave me an idea! leeches!

[steroid.com 1]

Yeh i know u do...was wondering wut u thought of just the preg and the dhea

Jman - DHEA and Pregnenolone in digestable supplement form is just insurance and cheap to boot. Lots of recent research on both suggest a lot of added benefits and with high normal range Test it's advisable by some of the best TRT Docs in the business. I take 50 mgs of both before bed time in addition to the cream. Just remember, if you take 50 mg of DHEA the amount that will make it into your blood stream is about 10% (maybe less) so you're getting like 5 mgs daily. Not a lot, BUT, if done consistently, it's a nice add on to your protocol without a big expense.

[lovbyts]

you just gave me an idea! leeches!

They still use leeches in the medical field you know...

[zaggahamma]

Jman - DHEA and Pregnenolone in digestable supplement form is just insurance and cheap to boot. Lots of recent research on both suggest a lot of added benefits and with high normal range Test it's advisable by some of the best TRT Docs in the business. I take 50 mgs of both before bed time in addition to the cream. Just remember, if you take 50 mg of DHEA the amount that will make it into your blood stream is about 10% (maybe less) so you're getting like 5 mgs daily. Not a lot, BUT, if done consistently, it's a nice add on to your protocol without a big expense.

thanks imma pop into a few vitamin stores in the next couple

[steroid.com 1]

thanks imma pop into a few vitamin stores in the next couple

Life Extension Magazine has a lot of articles on both DHEA and Preg. Check these out:
http://www.lef.org/search/?q=DHEA&c=Magazine
http://www.lef.org/search/?q=Pregnenolone&c=Magazine

[GotNoBlueMilk]

They still use leeches in the medical field you know...

And after you fatten them up you can use them for fishing!

[bass]

Life Extension Magazine has a lot of articles on both DHEA and Preg. Check these out:
http://www.lef.org/search/?q=DHEA&c=Magazine
http://www.lef.org/search/?q=Pregnenolone&c=Magazine

this sounds good but need to try it to know for sure! i hate to buy it form anywhere because i don't know if its any good, can you guys recommend a brand that is trust worthy?!

[steroid.com 1]

this sounds good but need to try it to know for sure! i hate to buy it form anywhere because i don't know if its any good, can you guys recommend a brand that is trust worthy?!

I like Vitamin Shoppe Bass. They source from reliable and trusted mfgs.

[bass]

OK thanks! there is one near me...

[swllce]

Just got back some wacky blood work!
total t 2359 ,range 170-***
free t 106, range 4.0-29.0
bioavailable t 2019,range 77-357
estriadol 50
All this after 11 weeks of 200 mg test cyp/week.
I am very soar ,shoulders hurt.
The blood was drawn 48 hrs after my weekly 200 mg test cyp shot.
First thing in the am on a fast.

[GotNoBlueMilk]

Looks like 200 mg/wk is just a tad high. Are you feeling like superman or crap?

[zaggahamma]

doesnt look that whacky actually and i'm sure your mentioning the shoulders separately from the bloodwork?

[GotNoBlueMilk]

doesnt look that whacky actually and i'm sure your mentioning the shoulders separately from the bloodwork?

This doesn't seem high to you?

total t 2359 ,range 170-***
free t 106, range 4.0-29.0
bioavailable t 2019,range 77-357

[zaggahamma]

This doesn't seem high to you?

total t 2359 ,range 170-***
free t 106, range 4.0-29.0
bioavailable t 2019,range 77-357

where did i say that? and did the shoulder thing make sense to you either?

[steroid.com 1]

This doesn't seem high to you?

total t 2359 ,range 170-***
free t 106, range 4.0-29.0
bioavailable t 2019,range 77-357

Yes it is way too high. The OP is off the charts! The free and bio available almost seems impossible. E2 of only 50 with Total T 2359 is a crazy and probably not doing him any good.

My Total T is high; like 1500. But, my % Free is 2.53 which is ideal and my Free is 64.6% which is ideal. You can have high Total T as long as % Free and Bio Available are optimal and not high. Also, there is concern about the ratio between Total T and E2. If they are off it can cause problems.

I didn't see but is the OP using HCG ?

What's the shoulder have to do with anything?

[zaggahamma]

whacky and crazy...

i'm going to the fn gym

[flatscat]

looking through this thread for the first time, i have a cpl of thoughts and questions.

When I first started my trt - with t, hcg and an a.i., I still got really sore nips - I think it may have just been his body trying to adjust to the added t. I am assuming they went away?

Question to Vick - you said in your last post that you had been on 200mg's for 11 weeks - was that a typo or did your earlier post have a typo?

regardless - looking at the info, it seems pretty clear to me that you felt great on 100mg's a week, and then started feeling like crap after you bumped it up to 150. And now you are on 200? Have not looked at all your threads so I might have missed something, but did anyone ever offer advise to lower your dose of t?

i cant speak for JP, but i dont think it looks whacky either. those numbers are easily reached at that dose and with an a.i. for some guys.

all you mention is your shoulder hurting which means what? did you hurt it while you were training? how are you feeling other wise? did you ever get on hcg and what is your dose if so and what is your current a.i. dose?

you have more than a little tweaking to do it looks like brother.

[swllce]

Flats,the off the charts t levels may be from the fact that the blood was drawn less than 40 hrs after my weekly shot.
First 4 weeks i took 100mg test cyp wk 5-6 150mg wk 7-11 200mg
Maybe there was a higher concentration at the time of blood test.
However my clinic suggested i lower from 1cc to 3/4 cc test cyp with .5 anastrozol eod.
In regard to the shoulderpain,i am having some joint issues and muscle sorness.
I am going to do lighter weights higher reps for a while ,and maybe lay off the iron for a week and see what happens.
I have not felt all that great since starting trt .I have gained lean muscle and shed som bf on a positive note though.
Blood work shows that i lowered my cholesterol by 60 points!
So i am not ready to throw in the towel yet!
No i have not ran any hcg yet,i have it on order.
After reading my bloodwork my clinic suggested cutting my test cyp dosage and add in a small dose of deca to deal with the joint pain.
For now i think i need to get my t levels down a good amount.
Thanks Flats, for taking the time to read the thread.

[flatscat]

Lean muscle gain and lowering chol are great things! But how are you feeling today? I also think.5 eod is high. I have heard that low e2 levels can effect joints, along with many other things so be careful with that dose. I am all for the deca , once you settle into a protocol that works for you and hopefully including hcg and an ai dosage that will keep you around 30. When are your next labs?

No need to thank, we are all here to help broski.

[swllce]

I will re test blood after 9 weeks.
I have a new order of test cyp, hcg and ,b12,coming.
My plan is to lower t dose to 100mg/week Hcg 250 iu x2/week, 0.5 Anazstrozole 3 times a week ,and some b12.
I have a feeling the ai gave me joint problems.
Any thougts?
The clinic had me on 3.3mg a week,i went along with it because i felt like crap and my nips were sore.
I feel tired and achy ,can't work upper body right now,only able to do legs wich might be a good thing since they dont get as much attention in the gym.

[flatscat]

Sounds like a solid plan. I would think.5 three times a week might still be a little too much for that dose but how you feel along w bw will tell. Let us know and good luck bro.