Blood Work before TRT

[brazilian86]

5'8 155 lbs. Posting my blood work before I started TRT 200mg Test Cypionate weekly, no Ai yet.

Here we go...

[bass]

the first pic is cut off and can't read the left column! how old are you? i am assuming you're on TRT now, do you have blood work after TRT? and finally what is your TRT protocol?

[brazilian86]

25 yrs old, and 2 wks in 200mg test cypionate every week for 15 weeks, then 2 wks of HCG . Then another 15 wks of test cypionate 200 mg weekly, following 2 weeks of HCG.

Thanks Bass

[zaggahamma]

wow....i've never seen that low of LDL cholesterol....

was there a question to this post/thread?

[brazilian86]

I just wanted to know if they look alright or if I need to change anything in order to achieve better blood results... Such as estrogen E2 might be too high, even before starting TRT. I'm two weeks in, and don't feel my nipples getting sensitive so I think it's going well, but then again it's only two weeks in...

[Mario L]

How long after starting trt will you get your next blood work?

[brazilian86]

I will get more blood work prolly 6 weeks or 8 weeks into the treatment.

[Mario L]

Are you going to wait until your next bloodwork to start an AI?

[zaggahamma]

you got total estrogens tested instead of estradiol so gonna be hard to advice on AI for any future e2 control...

obviously the doc diagnose you with low-T or hypo since you mentioning the test dosage...which btw is a pretty high STARTING dose...

do you have another thread talking about your trt??????

[brazilian86]

I will get the right E2 test in at 8 weeks. I don't know if I have this thread somewhere else, don't think so.

[bass]

25 yrs old, and 2 wks in 200mg test cypionate every week for 15 weeks, then 2 wks of HCG . Then another 15 wks of test cypionate 200 mg weekly, following 2 weeks of HCG.

Thanks Bass

its hard to make anything out of this at this point, but AI is important even at this stage especially at this dose, the two weeks hCG doesn't make sense, it should be part of your treatment as well. what do you expect from this treatment? based on your protocol you will be completely shut down after your second cycle. what are the plans after your second cycle?

[brazilian86]

Hey Bass, isn't an AI only if I get gyno sensitive?
Also I will talk to my doc in a few weeks about using some HCG during my treatment... He is a very good doctor, also used a lot of Stetoids from 18 yrs old and he looks like Arnold in his golden years now. So I'm sure whatever he says is what it is.

Thanks

[bass]

200 mgs test ew will get your E2 up in no time, even if you don't feel sensitivity in your nipples you will feel like crap with high E2, also high E2 will work against testosterone ,so your treatment will be very ineffective!

[brazilian86]

Yeah I was reading on that, thanks for info. I will get on arimidex soon as the doc authorizes.

[brazilian86]

Yeah I was reading on that, thanks for info. I will get on arimidex soon as the doc authorizes.

[aaronexists]

Looking at your blood work, I question whether jumping straight to Test Cyp was the best move in your case, especially considering your age. Your cholesterol was borderline low, and you need cholesterol to make T. And your FSH was low. Usually, concern is more with LH than FSH. But what's up with the low FSH? So your upstream conditions were not entirely conducive to having good T numbers. Did you have SHBG tested? Wonder if your problems would be better addressed by getting your cholesterol up and the low FSH addressed. See where that gets you and then make your next move.

I'd only get on AI like Arimidex if you need it based on how you're feeling/doing and blood work. A little can go a long way.

Personally, I get more consistent, better feeling results from using 75 mg of Test Cyp every 4 to 5 days than 150 to 200 mg all at once every week. That gets my total T between 750 and 900 most of the time. Lower dosage of Test Cyp more frequently also allowed me to significantly reduce estradiol levels without an AI.

[brazilian86]

Low Cholestherol isn't good? People congratulated me madly for having it that low, specially being the bad Cholestherol... I am the most active person I know, I play soccer 3 times a week on three different leagues, I also do Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and MMA. I wonder if I have those low T numbers because of 25 ml of Winstrol done 4 years ago.

[zaggahamma]

Looking at your blood work, I question whether jumping straight to Test Cyp was the best move in your case, especially considering your age. Your cholesterol was borderline low, and you need cholesterol to make T. And your FSH was low. Usually, concern is more with LH than FSH. But what's up with the low FSH? So your upstream conditions were not entirely conducive to having good T numbers. Did you have SHBG tested? Wonder if your problems would be better addressed by getting your cholesterol up and the low FSH addressed. See where that gets you and then make your next move.

I'd only get on AI like Arimidex if you need it based on how you're feeling/doing and blood work. A little can go a long way.

Personally, I get more consistent, better feeling results from using 75 mg of Test Cyp every 4 to 5 days than 150 to 200 mg all at once every week. That gets my total T between 750 and 900 most of the time. Lower dosage of Test Cyp more frequently also allowed me to significantly reduce estradiol levels without an AI.

how do you get your cholesterol up?

[steroid.com 1]

how do you get your cholesterol up?

He could just be genetically predisposed to low Cholesterol J. Eating a ton of shitty foods high in Cholesterol might do it...who knows.

OP's Protocol:
25 yrs old, and 2 wks in 200mg test cypionate every week for 15 weeks, then 2 wks of HCG . Then another 15 wks of test cypionate 200 mg weekly, following 2 weeks of HCG .

* 200 mg a week to start is a lot...way to much in my opinion. Smaller doses to start and inch up over time with BW.
* After 15 weeks THAN 2 weeks of hCG ? What the hell??? That hCG protocol isn't going to do anything to back-fill his pathways and he's going to get all the negative sides of not taking hCG...and we all know what they are by now...correct?
* No AI...ok, but at this Test dosage he's going to most likely sky rocket on E2 in a few weeks...and we all know the neg sides of that...right?

This protocol could be better IMO.

More importantly, I would want to know why a 25 year old has this condition; it's not age related. Something is amiss...

[aaronexists]

Here's a steroid flow map: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Steroidogenesis.svg . Cholesterol in the upper left is an essential precondition for testosterone and other steroids /hormones. Yes, cholesterol can be too low... cholesterol is not bad, it's about balance.

This is a small study but gets at the idea as it relates to testosterone: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9253519 .

How to get cholesterol up? Would depend on the cause of why it's low in the first place. Never had that problem, so don't know much about it, but I'd probably start with increasing saturated/polyunsaturated/monounsatured/essential fatty acid intake... and of course talking to doc about what possible causes could be. I'm not suggesting the answer is to go scarf down ten Big Macs in a day or anything. Just bump up the fat intake with some animal fat and some fats like olive oil or hemp oil.

There are also possible genetic causes of low cholesterol and malabsorption issues too, which probably wouldn't be fixed by just changing diet. Understanding all of this would require more research.

I don't know enough about Winstrol to say, but a quick look on the net shows some guys saying it does or can shut down your natural system. So, if you didn't do post-cycle therapy, then yeah, could've messed you up. That FSH is low.

Just don't want to see you treat the symptom of low T with exogenous T, when the answer is to actually to get your natural system up and running to its full potential. If that doesn't work, then I totally understand why the TRT is important.

[zaggahamma]

He could just be genetically predisposed to low Cholesterol J. Eating a ton of shitty foods high in Cholesterol might do it...who knows.

OP's Protocol:
25 yrs old, and 2 wks in 200mg test cypionate every week for 15 weeks, then 2 wks of HCG . Then another 15 wks of test cypionate 200 mg weekly, following 2 weeks of HCG .

* 200 mg a week to start is a lot...way to much in my opinion. Smaller doses to start and inch up over time with BW.
* After 15 weeks THAN 2 weeks of hCG ? What the hell??? That hCG protocol isn't going to do anything to back-fill his pathways and he's going to get all the negative sides of not taking hCG...and we all know what they are by now...correct?
* No AI...ok, but at this Test dosage he's going to most likely sky rocket on E2 in a few weeks...and we all know the neg sides of that...right?

This protocol could be better IMO.

More importantly, I would want to know why a 25 year old has this condition; it's not age related. Something is amiss...

thats what i was sayin

[brazilian86]

Here is the protocol

Each 'Testosterone and HCG Hormone Replacement Therapy' twelve (12) week treatment cycle described in this medical treatment protocol consists of 10 weeks of testosterone cypionate for injections 200 mg/ml patient self-injected at a dose rate of 100 mg. to 200 every 3 ½ days as indicated by the patient's blood tests and determined by the treating doctor followed by two (2) weeks of HCG for injection administered in seven (7) patient self-injections at a dose rate 1500 Units injected every other day for 14 days. Compounded generic Anastrozole 0.25 mg. tablets may be administered by the patient once every 3 days if the need for an aromatase inhibitor.

[steroid.com 1]

Here is the protocol

Each 'Testosterone and HCG Hormone Replacement Therapy' twelve (12) week treatment cycle described in this medical treatment protocol consists of 10 weeks of testosterone cypionate for injections 200 mg/ml patient self-injected at a dose rate of 100 mg. to 200 every 3 ½ days as indicated by the patient's blood tests and determined by the treating doctor followed by two (2) weeks of HCG for injection administered in seven (7) patient self-injections at a dose rate 1500 Units injected every other day for 14 days. Compounded generic Anastrozole 0.25 mg. tablets may be administered by the patient once every 3 days if the need for an aromatase inhibitor.

Who the hell makes up this shit? Really?

* dose rate of 100 mg. to 200 every 3 ½ days
* followed by two (2) weeks of HCG for injection administered in seven (7) patient self-injections at a dose rate 1500 Units injected every other day for 14 days

Dear God!

1500 units of hCG every other day! He going to end up seriously desensitizing his leydig cells and increase intratesticular E2 in an amazing way.

This is insane.

OP, please print this out and provide it to your Doctor...or whatever he/she is...so you don't get hurt...which you will if you stick to this protocol.

http://www.allthingsmale.com/word_docs/TRT.doc

[brazilian86]

Thanks a lot!!

[brazilian86]

1500 every week I think, not everyday. Lol

[brazilian86]

Also 100mg of test cypionate every 3 1/2 days.

[steroid.com 1]

1500 every week I think, not everyday. Lol

What am I getting wrong:

"at a dose rate 1500 Units injected every other day for 14 days"

[steroid.com 1]

Also 100mg of test cypionate every 3 1/2 days.

Correct and way too much!

Most start up protocols have a man inject 100 mg once a week!

[JD250]

Where are you located? Is this script from an anti aging clinic?

[brazilian86]

Clinic, yes.
I think 200 mg is what I need. I have chrons disease and the meds take my test down. It's Monday, time for my 3rd shot, hope to finally feel the cypionate , third week starts to kick in correct?

[brazilian86]

Located in Los Angeles, clinic in Miami! Lol

[steroid.com 1]

Located in Los Angeles, clinic in Miami! Lol

PLEASE get a second opinion; what they want to do to you is not good.

Did you get a Physicial done by them onsite in Miami???

I wish I could PM you to help you...

[JD250]

I use a clinic also, let us help you NOT make a big mistake, clinics are like a shopping mall, you can buy anything you want but that doesn't mean that you NEED what they are selling..........see a doc or endo that can help you discover what is causing the problem,Dr. Crisler will consult with your doctor for a small fee, if you DO need TRT then educate yourself enough to know what common protocols look like and if you must use a clinic then you tell them what you want but don't let an anti-aging clinic diagnose you......first and foremost they are salesmen, period......take control of your health by educating yourself before you make a decision this big!!!

[zaggahamma]

how is crisler pricewise in comparison to clinics

[steroid.com 1]

how is crisler pricewise in comparison to clinics

Same price...same business model.

[brazilian86]

I have an endo that is very good in LA. He is looming over me. And is the best, same one that worked with Arnold later days and a few professional Olympic athletes. I'm I. Good hands. So far he allows me to do 200mg weekly of test cypionate and is going to put HCG with the 3 ten week cycles. Plus Arimidex every three days. I'm good thanks guys!!

[bass]

why cycle? this is not true TRT! many of us are switching to injecting twice a week just to avoid hills and valleys, and your doc is doing the opposite! three 10 week cycles will shut you down for good, so what comes after that?

[JD250]

He says he's good......good luck and keep learning more about what your involved with here, let us know how it works out for you. Hope we've helped a little.

[bass]

He says he's good......good luck and keep learning more about what your involved with here, let us know how it works out for you. Hope we've helped a little.

yea i guess some times we have to learn from our mistakes! when i started TRT the clinic loaded me up with meds, test, deca , anavar , B12, AI and everyone here advised to take it one step at a time, i didn't listen and paid the price for it, and almost quit TRT because its was making me sick more than healthy. bad TRT protocols are a nightmare! i wish you luck Brazilian!

[brazilian86]

I will talk it over with the doc. I will see that I take 100mg every 5 days... Adding HCG during the cycles. And Arimidex every 3 days .25mg. Does that sound better? And how long can I keep doing this?
Taking a bigger amount of HCG during my off cycles? How long off cycles? 2 months?
All the info here is taken in...not out, trust me I am all ears. Good to have people that already went through this!!!
Keep hitting me up, I really appreciate all the posts!
I have Chrons disease and this is helping me getting hungry and gaining weight, I'm on my third weeknand I've put on 7 pounds already, eating well thank God! I hate this disease...

Best