First post- Androgel etc...

[Burkmere]

This is my first post so excuse me if I'm seeming a little ignorant. I'm 58. 5 ft 9, 160...good shape body-wise. I wish I'd found this site earlier. I was prescribed Testosterone cream by Dr Neil Nathan from Gordon Medical Associated in Santa Rosa. I took the cream for maybe a year. My Test levels upon beginning with Dr Nathan were about 290 and thy increased to about 350 as I recall...but I didn't really have any big problems w six drive, but always thought I should have had a little more libido....

About a year and three months ago I saw an Endo who prescribed 3 pumps of the 1.62% androgel ( my bone scan results indicated osteopenia and I've had chronic fatigue syndrome for many many years). He thought I could benefit from TRT. After a few months I noticed morning erections, increased interest in sex....hornier more than I used to be and also a T level of up to 580. I was happy about that. However, about a year into into it, the libido is down again and my last T test was 395. In addition *** taken 100 mcg of levothyroxine now for years md since my last test my T3 was 74..(Quest labs) so have increased my levothyroxine to 112 mcg.

My Endo said I could either do HCG shots or try upping the androgel to 4 pumps. I upped the androgel to 4 pumps 4 days ago and increased my levothyroxine to 112 mcg.

So, given above info I have some questions.

1. Is he correct about the either androgel or HCG? My insurance will cover my ndrogel, but not sure if it will cover HCG.

2. I haven't had noticeable much testicular Shrinking at this point, but I've been reading that hCG taken with AndroGel will prevent that. Is this true? My Endo chronologist never explained that to me. He just said I could take one or the other. Suggestions?

3. Is it true that if I don't take hCG or some other protocol that indeed my testes will eventually shrink and hurt? I don't want that to happen if I can prevent it.

4. This might be kind of a wild shot but I am currently being treated by Dr John Linfoot in Lafayette, CA And the HMO HealthNet covers the Andro gel so far. Does anyone know anything about him or if there are other doctors in the San Francisco Bay area that are part of HealthNet that
Might be better to work with?

I guess that's enough information for now. Please feel free to ask me anything as I feel a little lost and certainly could use some more guidance.

Burk

[warmouth]

The other guys are going to help you immensly on this, but from my expierience with the gels, I hate them. My test actually lowered after 6 months of use, so my dr told me to double it. Nothing changed enough to keep with it. Injections I have found to be the most stable, but I am no expert on this subject. Good Luck!

[Burkmere]

Thanks for the info. Looking forward to more feedback. Wondering how to research my HMO (Foundation Health) and Hills Physician Group to see if I can find a better Endo. However, mine odd say either gel OR HCG . So he's open to HCG. just not sure if I'll have to pay out of pocket as not sure if my HMO will pay for it. or maybe it's too late for HCG?.

[lovbyts]

Agreed, from the feedback I have seen/read over the years a lot of people experience diminished results with the gel after time although some are OK with it. Biggest thing to consider is exposure to others. Make sure if you have grand-kids they do not get 2nd hand exposure and it happens quite easily.

Your doctor is good in suggesting using HCG . Most doctors wont and dont know anything about it. It's not just for fertility but helps testicular health and hormone levels to some extent.

The only think is most insurances done cover it and it's $$$. It's actually a lot cheaper to get it without a prescription I have found in the past.

[Rusty11]

1. If you're hypothyroid (I was for years), that alone can be an issue with t levels.
2. It sounded like you had the option of keeping your current androgel dose and adding hcg . To me, this is a better idea than upping androgel dose alone. Hcg does wonders for t levels, sex drive, feelings of well-being, and a whole lot more. I added hcg and lowered my daily gel dose. T levels improved greatly.
3. Everyone is different. It took about nine months before I had small shrinkage with slight pain. Hcg took care of that.
4. I've read numerous posts here where docs rx for hcg gets denied. So, who knows how that will go. But, as lovbyts stated, it's usually much cheaper without a rx. There are numerous threads regarding the how/where/when use of hcg. Start with the sticky at the top of the page. It's very informative.
Good luck.

[Burkmere]

Thanks for the info. I'm a little foggy about how to use, mis, order HCG ...even after reading the sticky above...will have to take my time to get through it I guess....is anyone willing to walk me through it a bit ? Thx. Oh ,and what about travel and HCG?? I go abroad for many times a month at a time..,Thailand. SE Asia, etc....for vacation...is it possible to travel w HCG or any danger to quitting it for that period of time etc?? Thanks...

[crazy mike]

This is my first post so excuse me if I'm seeming a little ignorant. I'm 58. 5 ft 9, 160...good shape body-wise. I wish I'd found this site earlier. I was prescribed Testosterone cream by Dr Neil Nathan from Gordon Medical Associated in Santa Rosa. I took the cream for maybe a year. My Test levels upon beginning with Dr Nathan were about 290 and thy increased to about 350 as I recall...but I didn't really have any big problems w six drive, but always thought I should have had a little more libido....

About a year and three months ago I saw an Endo who prescribed 3 pumps of the 1.62% androgel ( my bone scan results indicated osteopenia and I've had chronic fatigue syndrome for many many years). He thought I could benefit from TRT. After a few months I noticed morning erections, increased interest in sex....hornier more than I used to be and also a T level of up to 580. I was happy about that. However, about a year into into it, the libido is down again and my last T test was 395. In addition *** taken 100 mcg of levothyroxine now for years md since my last test my T3 was 74..(Quest labs) so have increased my levothyroxine to 112 mcg.

My Endo said I could either do HCG shots or try upping the androgel to 4 pumps. I upped the androgel to 4 pumps 4 days ago and increased my levothyroxine to 112 mcg.

So, given above info I have some questions.

1. Is he correct about the either androgel or HCG? My insurance will cover my ndrogel, but not sure if it will cover HCG.

2. I haven't had noticeable much testicular Shrinking at this point, but I've been reading that hCG taken with AndroGel will prevent that. Is this true? My Endo chronologist never explained that to me. He just said I could take one or the other. Suggestions?

3. Is it true that if I don't take hCG or some other protocol that indeed my testes will eventually shrink and hurt? I don't want that to happen if I can prevent it.

4. This might be kind of a wild shot but I am currently being treated by Dr John Linfoot in Lafayette, CA And the HMO HealthNet covers the Andro gel so far. Does anyone know anything about him or if there are other doctors in the San Francisco Bay area that are part of HealthNet that
Might be better to work with?

I guess that's enough information for now. Please feel free to ask me anything as I feel a little lost and certainly could use some more guidance.

Burk

Hi Welcome. these guys are good so your in a good place. I'm not of sure of what your ultimate goal is. What are your stats now regarding your bw. Do you know what your est level is at as well as what was mentioned about the thyroid....stable mike

[Burkmere]

Mike, what do you mean by bw? My estrogen levels have not been taken but I do see that the Dr is going to have me take a test for "estradiol" (E2) next labs in two months.

Anyone here from SF Bay area? I need to talk to someone Local about doctors to see here. I am limited to Foundation Health as my HMO. My current Endo, whom I've been seeing for about a year, seems okay but says I should try either Andro gel or hCG and I don't think my insurance will cover hCG but it does cover AndroGel . My current Endo is Dr. John Linfoot from Lafayette. I think he is decent, but he is also 82 years old and doesn't work full-time anymore. Would love to find someone within my HMO but I don't know how realistic that is. Hills Physicians Group. I can change to Blue Cross next January which would probably give me a wider range to choose from.

Thanks.

[kelkel]

Burk spend some time reading all the sticky threads at the top of this forum. They will answer many of your questions. There are specific threads on HCG and one for Finding a Doc that includes proper BW (blood work) to obtain. Be sure to get the correct BW pulled. It means everything and is your guide to proper dose titration. There are also search engines in that sticky to help find a doc. Try the A4M one first.

When it comes to HCG definitely get on it. If your insurance won't immediately cover it have your doc write a letter of medical necessity to your insurance provider as that may help. On many HCG med inserts it is listed as a use for Hypogonadic Hypogonadism. Make sure when you test your estrogen it is a "Sensitive Assay" otherwise you're wasting your time. If you happen to use Labcorp I can provide you the proper codes.

When it comes to type of treatment. It's up the the individual, the effectiveness of the current protocol as well as lifestyle and family come into play.

Start reading here and you'll get up to speed quickly!

Welcome Burk.

[crazy mike]

"Burkmere" I can't help with people places or things and I think if I am correct no one else will..?? Anyway I'm 61 and I know that my test level was 619 normal and that was great but they were not interested in my Est. "hey old man your looking great"...ha I insisted on the E2 and found that my E was a little high. Within range but for me what it was dooing was holding down the effects of my good test...this to a small degree but fore my purpose anything holding me down or (not boosting me ) was not what I wanted. So I don't know for sure but that's worth investigating. I started with some cream on my own (ha) and my test didn't go anywhere but my E just started climbing. So now for me with the cycle my E2 is out of contol, but the AI of course helped. My E want to climb.....crazy mike

[Burkmere]

Thanks, Kelkel. My HMO uses Quest but he's pretty open to tests, etc.