***48 on TRT & Have ?'s***

[DeeJay7211]

Been on TRT now for over 4 mo using various protocols to see which felt better, T-cyp 50mg - 200mg (2 X/wk), Anastrozole 0.25mg - 0.5 day of injections, no hCG . Dr. finally gave me a script for hCG last week, however asked that i stop taking the AI due to potential side effects. He now has me taking DIMension 3 from XYMOGEN 2 X/day.

-48
-6.0'
-252lb
-35% BF
-Rx = Benicar HCT 40-25mg (take am 6yrs), Amlodipine Besylate 10mg (take pm 6yrs), Omeprazole 20mg

Current protocol: 50mg T-cyp 2X/wk, DIM 2 X/day, hCG 300iu 2X/wk.

For incase it helps im posting a LabCorp lab I had 8/17/11 (1yr+ before any TRT):

*eGFR = 93 REFERENCE >59
*BUN/Creatinine ratio = 11 REF 9-20
*Sodium serum = 141 REF 135-145
*Potassium, serum = 4.4 REF 3.5-5.2
*Chloride, serum = 101 REF 97-108
*Carbon Dioxide = 27 REF 20-32
*Calcium = 9.6 REF 8.7-10.2
*Protein total = 6.8 REF 6.0-8.5
*Albumin = 4.3 REF 3.5-5.5
*Globulin = 2.5 REF 1.5-4.5
*A/g ratio = 1.7 REF 1.1-2.5
*Bilirubin = 0.4 REF 0.0-1.2
*Alkaline phosphatase = 59 REF 25-150
*AST = 22 REF 0-40
*ALT = 40 REF 0-55
*TTL Cholesterol = 101 REF 100-199
*Triglycerides = 51 REF 0-149
*HDL Cholesterol = 52 REF >39
*VLDL = 10 REF 5-40
*LDL = 39 REF 0-99
*A1c = 5.7 HIGH REF 4.8-5.6
*Testosterone , serum = 348 REF 249-836
*WBC = 8.0 REF 4.0-10.5
*RBC = 5.20 REF 4.10-5.60
*Hemoglobin = 15.9 REF 12.5-17.0
*Hematocrit = 47.8 REF 36.0-50.0
*Monocytes = 1.0 REF 4-13
*Glucose, serum = 97 REF 65-99
*BUN = 12 REF 6-24
*Creatinine = 1.10 REF 0.76-1.27
*TSH = 1.300 REF 0.450-4.500

Can someone tell me more about this DIM? Not sure that i trust it managing my E2. Pretty sure that i've been E2 dominant for yrs.... I will post other labs in separate post so not so long.

I have always had very low CHOL. My TTL has always hovered around 100 or so. I've always been told this is fantastic until new Dr. sit me down and let me know that this might be worse than having High CHOL. Recently, have read more in the forums and discovered that all of the hormones are directly synthesized from CHOL. I did not know this. So now wondering if this is my prob???

I really would appreciate some insight into these matters. Many thanks....

[DeeJay7211]

1st Lab 11/06/12 Low T ctr (before any TRT):
*FastPack TT = 149
*FastPack PSA = .09
**Dr gave me 200mg inj T-cyp on the spot after explaining HPA Axis, etc., etc.
**Also gave blood for complete work up.

1st comprehensive LabCorp Lab drawn approx 2pm on 11/06/12 (before any TRT):
*Glucose = 87 REF 65-99
*BUN = 13 REF 6-24
*Creatinine = 1.12 REF 0.76-1.27
*eGFR = 77 REF >59
*BUN/creatinine ratio = 12 REF 9-20
*Sodium = 141 REF 134-144
*Potassium = 4.3 REF 3.5-5.2
*Chloride = 100 REF 97-108
*CO2 = 25 REF 20-32
*Calcium = 9.6 REF 8.7-10.2
*Protein = 7.1 REF 5.0-8.5
*Albumin = 4.5 REF 3.5-5.5
*Globulin = 2.6 REF 1.5-4.5
*Bilirubin = .05 REF 0.0-1.2
*AST = 42 HIGH REF 0-40
*ALT = 73 HIGH REF 0-44
*TSH = 1.510 REF 0.450-4.500
*LH = 8.1 REF 1.7-8.6
*FSH = 3.2 REF 1.5-12.4
*Prolactin = 7.2 REF 4.0-15.2
*WBC = 10.7 HIGH (was feeling fine, not sure why that was high) REF 4.0-10.5
*RBC = 5.26 REF 4.14-5.80
*Hemoglobin = 16.1 REF 12.6-17.7
*Hematocrit = 46.9 REF 37.5-51.0
*MCV = 89 REF 79-97
*MCH = 30.6 REF 26.6-33.0
*MCHC = 34.3 REF 31.5-35.7
*RDW = 13.6 REF 12.3-15.4
*Platelets = 258 REF 140-415
*Monocytes absolute = 1.3 HIGH REF 0.1-1.0
*Estradiol = 35.2 REF 7.6-42.6
*Free T (direct) = 8.0 (dr says we need to get it up to around 20.0) REF 6.8-21.5

11/27/12 LabCorp Lab (getting 160mg inj 1 x/wk):
*E2 = 46.4 HIGH
*FT = 15.5
*TT = 485

Note--Found new dr that would work with me and provided me scripts.

12/16/12 Quest Lab:
*Cholesterol total = 97 LOW LIMITs 125-200
*HDL = 38 LOW LIMITs >OR=40
*Triglycerides = 112 LIMITs <150
*LDL = 37 LIMITs <130
*DHEA sulfate = 50mcg/dl LIMITs 45-345
*Insulin = 9 ulU/mL LIMITs <17
*B12 = 342pg/mL LIMITs 200-1100
*E2 = 42 HIGH LIMITs <OR=39
*PSA = .03 (actually went down since on T) LIMITs <OR=4.0
*Vit D, 25-OH, total = 37 LIMITs 30-100
*A1c = 5.5 (actually went down since on T) LIMITs <5.7
*TT = 762 LIMITs 250-1100
*FT = 164.7 HIGH LIMITs 35.0-155.0

[DeeJay7211]

Feb 08 Labs:

Quest:

-DHT 16ng/dl 16-79 limits
-Pregnenolone 158 ng/dl 13-208
-CRP 0.42 mg/dl >0.80
-Thyroid Peroxidase <10 IU/ml <35
-Homocysteine 9.8 umol/L <11.4
-Cortisol Total 15.6 mcg/dl (taken approx 8am) no limits provided
-Ferritin 11 ng/mL LOW 20-380
-Progesterone <0.5 ng/ml <1.4
-Prolactin 8.7 ng/mL 2.0-18.0
-T4 Free 1.1 ng/dL 0.8-1.8
-TSH 0.92 0.42-4.50
-T3 Free 3.6 pg/mL 2.3-4.2

**note: for some reason they did not include E2, FT or TTL T. Should have those next week.

Can someone please provide some insight into these labs? Does CHOL have anything to do with low Ferritin? As low as this is, i should be anemic, however, I read the symptoms for anemic and I really do not feel like that is me.

Thank you all for any comments, suggestions or any insight...

[Vettester]

DeeJay, there's probably 10 different things here that can be discussed. I'm going to stick to a few for the time being so that things don't get all over the place. Once covered, I will probably have other questions or comments, as I'm sure other members will probably chime in with their thoughts as well.

Let's start at the top. Your stats as you know need some attention. I don't know if you have a plan in place, but finding the ultimate balance will require getting your program under control. I don't want you to feel this is a lecture, as I'm sure you hear it from the doctor and family all the time. I am just letting you know this forum has all the tools, and members with knowledge to help you make this a success. It won't be easy, but if you want to make the most of your HRT program, let's make this the year that you get the ball in motion to have a healthier life. Even getting your BF down into the low 20's would probably mean you would be in a position to dump most of those meds.

On the E2 lab, what we need to see is an E2 sensitive lab. The sensitive assay is the male standard, and I can't really make any determination from your previous lab. So, even though that lab is at the high end with that other ref. range, you could definitely be way over the top with a sensitive assay. See if you can't get that one for us instead.

On ferritin, mine is on the other side of the spectrum. I am a carrier for hemochromatosis, and have had it in the 1,500's. In my case, I donate blood to keep it in check. In your case, you DO NOT want to donate blood. Your low ferritin is probably a marker for low iron levels; possibly anemia. Would be beneficial if you also take a TIBC lab. This could be many things, ranging from your diet and iron intake, to gastric conditions, liver pathology, or a little bit of everything.

Start with getting your B12 up in the 1,000 or even 1,500 range. Talk to your doctor about a script for B12 methylcobalamin. And yes, in my case, the liver plays a role with both ferritin and cholesterol. Again, it's a genetic issue causing the hemo with the liver, so there's no way around it in that respect. The best I can do is to stay in shape, keep my diet clean, and avoid the things that will aggravate my liver, such as alcohol. That's my situation at 14% BF (and going down), but your body just might need some diet and lifestyle changes to function normally.

Also, look into some micronized DHEA to supplement and get your level >200. That, B12, and D3 are some quick and easy supplements that are a must, and will make an impact!

Again, this is just a few things that are being covered. I still want to address your baseline LH score, which when looking at your total serum score might indicate a primary hypo diagnosis. Maybe you can elaborate on that if you know more, and tell us how your doctor diagnosed you. Curious if any exams or MRI were taken as well. Much to cover here.

[kelkel]

Vette you pretty much covered it. My question is only about your LH level as Vette questioned. It's high and TT at the time was at the baseline which is an indicator of possible primary hypogonadism (testicular failure) in men. Did your doc mention this to you or consider an HCG stimulation test? Any testicular trauma or varicocele?

Definitely do what Vette said and jump on DHEA-preg and vit D3.

[DeeJay7211]

For some reason i keep getting blocked by the spam filter....

I was trying to post comments in ur actual response. I guess i do not have enuff posts to do that yet. kept getting SPAM filter for some reason.

First and foremost, I really appreciate ur response vett! I kinda thought that there might be many different roads to travel down.

Let me back up, over a month or so ago, yes, i was getting it from all directions that i need to get healthier. Through my 30's I was a picture of health, typical gym rat spending way too many hours training. Not so much last 10yrs obviously. So i have embarked on a new journey to get back to where i was and even better it. I'm committed, dedicated and willing to put the work in. In fact, i have already lost 14lbs this first month. Mountain biking (up to 13miles), fasted cardio on elliptical 3-5 days/wk, and lifting. Not going to gym, i have 1lb -100lb dumbells, good incline/decline bench. Started out lifting light - med so tendons won't get damaged. However, this week will be my first heavy week.

I have already started a nutrition forum entry w/ pics and waiting on GBrice and others to comment. Your right, i'm astounded that i can have access to wealth of knowledge at my fingertips. Had no idea this site existed until last week.

One of my goals is to dump all my Rx's.

Will have dr provide lab orders for E2 sensitive, TIBC and B12. I often wondered whether or not i have a hiatal hernia. Not to get off on this, but does DIM work as opposed to anastrozole?

I joined a dna website couple yrs ago. One thing it came back with is that I too am a HEMO carrier. So very surprised about LOW Ferritin??? I have researched anemia, i just do not feel like that is me. Maybe i'm missing something... My AST/ALT are usually always elevated on tests. Not sure what to think about my Low CHOL. Did some research, and it does not paint a pretty picture, ie., suicide, violent behavior, strorkes, heartattacks, bi polarism, and other mental conditions as i get older. So if one wanted to raise his CHOL, how would one do it? I have had 10yrs of burgers and fries, that certainly did not raise it!

In later yrs have not really beenmuch of a drinker. I do love a few glasses of red wine every once in a while, but have dropped that for now. Earlier yrs different story...

Just started taking zinc, copper, coq10, iodoral, multi, iron, DIM, dhea (not micronized), D3, C, fish oil, and others... Have been for couple wks, feel much better....

I will get some Preg as well. How about progesterone and DHT?

With regard to my LH, doc never mentioned anything about it. At time, was going to Low T Ctr, took quick test, came back at 149, doc gave me 200mg shot on the spot and said cya next week... Knowing what little i know now, i wish that i would have pursued this further.

Vett, thanks again for helping me out...

[DeeJay7211]

Vette you pretty much covered it. My question is only about your LH level as Vette questioned. It's high and TT at the time was at the baseline which is an indicator of possible primary hypogonadism (testicular failure) in men. Did your doc mention this to you or consider an HCG stimulation test? Any testicular trauma or varicocele?

Definitely do what Vette said and jump on DHEA-preg and vit D3.

Doc never mentioned anything about primary or secondary, or hCG stimulation test. No teste trauma, did not check for varicocele's. I wish i could go back in time so i could have gotten to the bottom of this knowing what little i know now, i certainly could have asked alot of questions... Certainly will pick up some Preg and dhea. Thanks, kelkel!

[Vettester]

For some reason i keep getting blocked by the spam filter....

I was trying to post comments in ur actual response. I guess i do not have enuff posts to do that yet. kept getting SPAM filter for some reason. Yeah, I believe you need 50 posts before that can happen. Either way, hang around awhile, and you will have more access, including PM's.

First and foremost, I really appreciate ur response vett! I kinda thought that there might be many different roads to travel down. You're quite welcome. As I always try to tell new HRT patients, "Yes, there are two paths you can go by, but in the long run. There's still time to change the road you're on." ---Feel like it could be in a song!

Let me back up, over a month or so ago, yes, i was getting it from all directions that i need to get healthier. Through my 30's I was a picture of health, typical gym rat spending way too many hours training. Not so much last 10yrs obviously. So i have embarked on a new journey to get back to where i was and even better it. I'm committed, dedicated and willing to put the work in. In fact, i have already lost 14lbs this first month. Mountain biking (up to 13miles), fasted cardio on elliptical 3-5 days/wk, and lifting. Not going to gym, i have 1lb -100lb dumbells, good incline/decline bench. Started out lifting light - med so tendons won't get damaged. However, this week will be my first heavy week. Excellent!! This will be a great journey for you! I can somewhat relate, as I got out of condition in my 30's. The long and short of it, I'm stronger for the most part than at any stage of my life. I appreciate it more, as I have had to put a tremendous amount of time into getting myself to this point; factoring hormonal, physical, and even enhancing the mental aspect. When you achieve your goal(s) at this stage of life, you will cherish the victory like no other, and I can assure you that you will not look back, or ever go back!

I have already started a nutrition forum entry w/ pics and waiting on GBrice and others to comment. Your right, i'm astounded that i can have access to wealth of knowledge at my fingertips. Had no idea this site existed until last week. GBrice is as good as they come!! Another key member is this area would be 405. Now there's a guy who was also up there in BF, now he's hanging in the single digits. Geezus, I'm sitting at 13%-14%, and he surpassed me big time. Just more motivation for me to step up my game. In your case, get it down the 20's, then make some new goals to takeit to the next level. You've been there before in your younger days, so your body will adapt nicely. You could eventually be one of the best transformations this site has seen!! Wouldn't that be cool!

One of my goals is to dump all my Rx's. Amen brother!! And most of the ones you're on are probably cardiovascular related, so the need for them will be remedied as your successful journey continues. With what you've lost already (and what you've gained), this could really be a breakout year for you!!

Will have dr provide lab orders for E2 sensitive, TIBC and B12. I often wondered whether or not i have a hiatal hernia. Not to get off on this, but does DIM work as opposed to anastrozole? I'm not going to dis the dim, but IMO, if you need to control estrogen, then go with a proven compound that's a Aromatization Inhibitor; Anastrozole/Arimidex being very effective (I believe around the 80 to 82% range of effectiveness on estrogen), and very easy to incorporate and manage with your protocol. Let's see your labs before really talking any protocols. Even if it's "high", we don't need to crash it down right away. If it takes a month or two to dial down, so be it. It will be best to slowly introduce your body to this anyway, then titrate accordingly to the appropriate and effective dosage.

I joined a dna website couple yrs ago. One thing it came back with is that I too am a HEMO carrier. So very surprised about LOW Ferritin??? I have researched anemia, i just do not feel like that is me. Maybe i'm missing something... My AST/ALT are usually always elevated on tests. Not sure what to think about my Low CHOL. Did some research, and it does not paint a pretty picture, ie., suicide, violent behavior, strorkes, heartattacks, bi polarism, and other mental conditions as i get older. So if one wanted to raise his CHOL, how would one do it? I have had 10yrs of burgers and fries, that certainly did not raise it! On the hemo carrier subject ... presumed they did a liver biopsy to discover this? Unless there's a confirmed family member, it's the only way to know for sure. Yeah, it's kind of odd with everything being so low, definitely liver attributed. Cholesterol is needed at some level, and plays a big role with the production of pregnenolone, which is where it all starts. That probably explains your low DHEA, as Preg is a precursor for it, and Chol is the precursor for Preg.

In later yrs have not really beenmuch of a drinker. I do love a few glasses of red wine every once in a while, but have dropped that for now. Earlier yrs different story... You and me both! I think that's a big part where the hormonal train got derailed in my late 30's. Besides the one proverbial glass of wine at the holidays, alcohol and me parted ways along time ago!

Just started taking zinc, copper, coq10, iodoral, multi, iron, DIM, dhea (not micronized), D3, C, fish oil, and others... Have been for couple wks, feel much better.... Yeah, on the DHEA, get the micronized, or better in your case, get Keto 7. I've been on Keto 7 for six months or better, and my levels have sustained at the 275 level, which was equal to the compounding creams. I didn't do well with the creams (just how I felt), and I don't see that with Keto 7. The big benefit, you won't have to worry about Keto 7 screwing with your E2 levels, as it won't convert to either testosterone or E2. This might be beneficial as you try to get a handle on your program early on. Many other benefits associated with it, just read up on it ...

I will get some Preg as well. How about progesterone and DHT? No need for either of these at this time. We don't want your prolactin going any higher than it already is. Let's see how your body metabolizes for awhile, which will probably include some increased DHT in the conversion process.

With regard to my LH, doc never mentioned anything about it. At time, was going to Low T Ctr, took quick test, came back at 149, doc gave me 200mg shot on the spot and said cya next week... Knowing what little i know now, i wish that i would have pursued this further. Yeah, this was a "miss" on your doctor's part, but most of the GP's don't really have a handle on what to really look for with the diagnosis. I'm stabbing on it, but due to the serum level of where it was at (very, very low), and your LH was in the 8's, it's aiming towards primary hypogonadism, which means your testosterone failure is at the testicular level, not the pituitary. The pituitary obviously didn't have a problem producing LH, which is evident from your labs. Serum levels on primary patients are also (from an observation) noticeably lower than secondary diagnosed patients. With that said, I think it warrants further investigation from your physician, OR, a qualified physician that can offer an additional examination. You just want to rule out that you don't have any tumors, cysts, or pathologies that could cause further complications.

Vett, thanks again for helping me out...

In bolds, above ^^^. You're welcome, and let's keep some dialogue on this.

[DeeJay7211]

"Yes, there are two paths you can go by, but in the long run. There's still time to change the road you're on." ---Feel like it could be in a song! You know i'm from Tx so i can damn sure recognize the beginning of a great country song!

Throw me a link to ur story Vette. Sounds like u have been through this and more. Tried searching to no avail...

I appreciate it more, as I have had to put a tremendous amount of time into getting myself to this point; factoring hormonal, physical, and even enhancing the mental aspect. When you achieve your goal(s) at this stage of life, you will cherish the victory like no other, and I can assure you that you will not look back, or ever go back! Yeah, i know the payoff will be there, also know that it is a tough road to hoe... I expect I will have my ups and downs.

Still waiting on GB & 405 to make some comments. I'm sure they will find me eventually.

On the hemo carrier subject ... presumed they did a liver biopsy to discover this? No, it was a DNA saliva test i did for 23andmedotcom. Comes back with all kinds of Health & Ancestry info. In my case, they say based on my dna that I will most likely die of Venous Thromboembolism. They also tell u if you are carriers for anything, hence HEMO. Along with many other disease risks, etc., etc. Kinda cool, but sure u have to take with grain of salt.

With that said, I think it warrants further investigation from your physician, OR, a qualified physician that can offer an additional examination. You just want to rule out that you don't have any tumors, cysts, or pathologies that could cause further complications. I will investigate further with doc.

Again many thanks.

[DeeJay7211]

Oh yea, quick ?. I was under the impression that once you had exogenous T that u would lose both LH & Preg. However, last BW my preg was 158. Am i missing something?

[Vettester]

Oh yea, quick ?. I was under the impression that once you had exogenous T that u would lose both LH & Preg. However, last BW my preg was 158. Am i missing something?

The two hormones are completely different. LH strictly reacts on a negative feedback loop with the testicles. In most cases, if testosterone serum levels are increased, the HPTA will shutdown production of LH.

Preg is at the top of the chart and is the precursor to all other hormones. LH, or adding HCG to a protocol will have some added benefits on Pregnenolne, but that's a different story. Your level (surprisingly) is pretty good, considering DHEA is not.

In your situation, your LH was originally too high, and serum was low, indicating primary hypo. However, it would be good to run another LH lab and see if the pituitary has reacted normally with the increased serum level, resulted from your exogenous medication. If it's still high, then an MRI and further exams are probably warranted. I still think you need a conclusive testicular exam.

[DeeJay7211]

The two hormones are completely different. LH strictly reacts on a negative feedback loop with the testicles. In most cases, if testosterone serum levels are increased, the HPTA will shutdown production of LH.

Preg is at the top of the chart and is the precursor to all other hormones. LH, or adding HCG to a protocol will have some added benefits on Pregnenolne, but that's a different story. Your level (surprisingly) is pretty good, considering DHEA is not.

In your situation, your LH was originally too high, and serum was low, indicating primary hypo. However, it would be good to run another LH lab and see if the pituitary has reacted normally with the increased serum level, resulted from your exogenous medication. If it's still high, then an MRI and further exams are probably warranted. I still think you need a conclusive testicular exam.

Okay, so my wife and I conducted an informal medical investigation of by sack after hot shower. Guess what, i have a few dark purple veins on both testicles. So not sure if these are varicoceles or not. But going to Urologist...

[DeeJay7211]

Still waiting on Urologist appointment for testicular exam.

Finally received my labs.

New labs from 2/11:

-DHEA Sulfate 157 45-345
-E2 30 < OR = 39
-TT 1118 High 250-1100
-FT 290.0 High 35-155
-PSA 0.3 < OR=4.0 It was 0.03. No cause for alarm, right?

I've been taking Omeprazole now for at least 6yrs for gut issues. In past have tried to drop to no avail. After 2 days, the acid is so bad that i can't sleep. Is it possible that this could be causing some malabsorption, i.e., not absorbing iron, or actually causing me to not absorb CHOL properly? Do u know of any better alternatives?

[DeeJay7211]

Just noticed this strange stomach protrusion when doing abs. When relaxed, there is no protrusion. Is this a hernia? There is no pain or discomfort. Feels like air. Doesn't really feel like there is anything there, just air....

[bertgamble]

Just noticed this strange stomach protrusion when doing abs. When relaxed, there is no protrusion. Is this a hernia? There is no pain or discomfort. Feels like air. Doesn't really feel like there is anything there, just air....

OO!! OO!! OO!! I know this one.

It is an abdominal hernia, and the way it pops up is called "Tenting".

At least this is what my doctor told me when I showed mine to him.

[DeeJay7211]

Hey Bert, so what did they do for you? Surgery? If so, what kind of recovery time did you experience.

[DeeJay7211]

Ok, i'm a little concerned that i'm getting Gyno. I would like to get someones opinion. I've been taking .25mg anastrozle twice per week for past few months. Last weeks blood test indicated E2 was 17.

I've lost 32lbs, so is this just leftover fat or is this Gyno. If gyno, what should my next course of action be? Get nolva or letrozole ? Any advice is appreciated...

[VTX1800]

Ok, i'm a little concerned that i'm getting Gyno. I would like to get someones opinion. I've been taking .25mg anastrozle twice per week for past few months. Last weeks blood test indicated E2 was 17.

I've lost 32lbs, so is this just leftover fat or is this Gyno. If gyno, what should my next course of action be? Get nolva or letrozole? Any advice is appreciated...

Only surgery will cure gyno 100%, and that does appear to be a nice case. Could the tissue have formed while your estrogen was high?

[DeeJay7211]

Even prior to any TRT 8months ago, my first E2 lab was 66. So am sure I was estrogen dominant for awhile prior to TRT. Just started trying to get in shape last several months, lifting and lots of cardio. Was kinda hoping it was left over fat tissue. So will letro or nolva help at all?

EDIT:Below are all the labs.

-E2 19 (> pr =39)
-Ferratin 50 (20-380)
-DHEA Sulfate 480 H (45-345)
-T 574 (250 - 1100)
-FT 102 (35-155)

Is it possible that DHEA is causing the Gyno? I was taking 50mg per day but have quit taking due to the high serum level. Thanks again for any advice....

*Edit--i really need some opinions on a course of action! Have Dr appt coming up. **EDIT--My doc appt is tomorrow!!! What do I need to ask him for Letro or Nolva???? How much and how long?

Thanks.

[DeeJay7211]

Guys, really need some advice. I have my dr appt tomorrow!!! What do I need to ask for?

[DeeJay7211]

Just came back from Dr. He says Gyno for sure. Put me on Raloxifene 60mg. Told me to stop taking the anastrozole. Any comments from the experts?

[DeeJay7211]

Vett i dropped the straight DHEA S 50mg daily dose. However, still taking the 100mg DHEA Keto. I guess i was under the impression that Keto wouldn't mess with my hormonal balance. Should i drop this for a while as well? Could the H DHEA cause the gyno? I've been on 60mg of Ralox for 4 days, I must say, I believe i already see a difference. Doc said to drop my AI, based on some research, do i need to still take the AI for any circulating E2? If so, what dosage?

Peace.

[ma_fighter]

Hey mate!
Glad to hear that the weightloss is coming along nicely.

That looks like some nasty gyno right there. To me it looks big enough to have taken quite a while to build up, you'll need surgery to get rid of it Im afraid.
As far as the AI goes, only bloodtests can tell. If your Estrogens are elevated you'll need that AI.
Ask the doc exactly what research had him/her drop the AI.

Cant comment on the DHEA / Keto though.

/Maf

[LowT Mike]

^^^^Thats right. DHEA dosent cause gyno. does not covert to E2.

[LowT Mike]

If estradiol levels are left elevated for too long and tissue solidifies. Then the mass is permanent. If your estradiol is back down to 17 pg/ml (within normal range) and you still have the noticeable gyno issues as in the pics for more than a couple months even with controlled E2, surgery might be your only option. Gyno surgery is relatively easy and scares are usually not notiecable. Simple incision under the areola about 1/2 inch long. A little incision under the armpit for lipo-contouring (usually if you want) A good surgeon knows how to cut out the right amount of tissue so you dont have craters in your chest. It does happen!!! Some guys can get whole gland removed and dont have to worry about "crater look" and no gyno issues ever in the future because gland is gone. But I would suggest to find a surgeon that can sculpt the tissue to give you a uniformity on both sides.

[kelkel]

Op, remember if you're not completely satisfied with the results for Ralox look into adding Andractim Gel to your removal protocal. It's a topical DHT Gel that you apply multiple times per day. It has worked for many people so far including several that I know personally. Google it. It's from Australia.