Vitamin D – More may not be better?

[APIs]

Had my yearly Physical with my TRT Doc today. One discussion of interest was my Vitamin D levels. Last September 2012 my Vit D level was 61.1. This was with no supplementation, just a multivitamin and plenty of sun at the beach through the summer. Knowing that I would be away from the sun this winter, in September I started supplementing with 2,000 units Vitamin D per day along with my other regular supplements. After about 5 months, my Blood Work last week showed my Vitamin D level @ 67.8 (LabCorp range 30.0-100.0). So through using only 2,000 units of D per day over the last 5 months (with no sun), I was able to maintain my “Summer” Vitamin D levels and even improve them a bit. Naturally, I thought that I was doing pretty good right?

The shocker was when my Doc said he wants my Vitamin D levels down to around 50.0 & advised me to drop the supplementation down to only 1,000 units per day & re-test again in May/June. He said there is some good & recent literature coming out of University of Connecticut & The Mayo Clinic that Vitamin D Levels in men above 50.0 ng/nL can lead to calcification in some of the major arteries.

After all the discussions regarding Vitamin D in here, I was amazed to say the least. This is what I pay my Doc for, so I’ll listen to him and re-test it again in May/June. Has anyone else heard of this? Very interesting...

[Rusty11]

Hmmmm...yes, that's interesting to hear. My level was around 40 a year ago and I've been taking 2-4000/day. I've not had any vit d testing since. Thanks. I need to do some reading on this. No reason to overload if it's actually detrimental to ones body. I'll be interested to hear what others say.

[steroid.com 1]

Had my yearly Physical with my TRT Doc today. One discussion of interest was my Vitamin D levels. Last September 2012 my Vit D level was 61.1. This was with no supplementation, just a multivitamin and plenty of sun at the beach through the summer. Knowing that I would be away from the sun this winter, in September I started supplementing with 2,000 units Vitamin D per day along with my other regular supplements. After about 5 months, my Blood Work last week showed my Vitamin D level @ 67.8 (LabCorp range 30.0-100.0). So through using only 2,000 units of D per day over the last 5 months (with no sun), I was able to maintain my “Summer” Vitamin D levels and even improve them a bit. Naturally, I thought that I was doing pretty good right?

The shocker was when my Doc said he wants my Vitamin D levels down to around 50.0 & advised me to drop the supplementation down to only 1,000 units per day & re-test again in May/June. He said there is some good & recent literature coming out of University of Connecticut & The Mayo Clinic that Vitamin D Levels in men above 50.0 ng/nL can lead to calcification in some of the major arteries.

After all the discussions regarding Vitamin D in here, I was amazed to say the least. This is what I pay my Doc for, so I’ll listen to him and re-test it again in May/June. Has anyone else heard of this? Very interesting...

What research did you find that supports what your Physician said???

I've read a number of negative conditions that can come from high serum levels of D3 but the positives far out way the negatives...but who knows.

Tell me what you find in your research.

[APIs]

What research did you find that supports what your Physician said???

I've read a number of negative conditions that can come from high serum levels of D3 but the positives far out way the negatives...but who knows.

Tell me what you find in your research.

I get your thinking, but I'm not inclined to research it further. I pay him to personally manage my health. On something like this, I'll take his word for it. Especially since I’m not Vitamin D deficient to begin with anyway…

[HRTstudent]

Id ask the doc for the research.

I've seen how some docs "research"... it often involves no more than reading an abstract or following the advice of "respected" individuals in the field.

Have you ever heard some FDA doc recommendations?

To put it mildly, it can often be extremely defensive medicine, with no focus whatsoever on individual quality of life.

[bullshark99]

Common sense would suggest to much of anything, prob not wise.....personally I would like to give a Dr the benefit of the doubt on something like this rather than coming to my own beliefs... Could be wrong of course, but over kill on Vits and sups might not be best for ones liver and kidneys.

[APIs]

Id ask the doc for the research.

I've seen how some docs "research"... it often involves no more than reading an abstract or following the advice of "respected" individuals in the field.

Have you ever heard some FDA doc recommendations?

To put it mildly, it can often be extremely defensive medicine, with no focus whatsoever on individual quality of life.

Ordinarily, I'd agree with you considering the many "doc" stories we get in here. However, his practice has almost 400 patients on TRT alone. So I'm inclined to let him "drive-the-bus" on this one. While this forum is a great resource, in reality, no one here is an endo, cardiologist or even a general practitioner. IMO sometimes you just have to put trust in the person with experience who's providing you the medical care. Especially on something as simple as this. Hell, if I over analyzed everything like this I'd never be able to run my business...

[powerlifterty16]

seems there is research that naything is harmful. Too much d is harmful, too little is harmful. i have taken 10k units per day for years...

[steroid.com 1]

Ordinarily, I'd agree with you considering the many "doc" stories we get in here. However, his practice has almost 400 patients on TRT alone. So I'm inclined to let him "drive-the-bus" on this one. While this forum is a great resource, in reality, no one here is an endo, cardiologist or even a general practitioner. IMO sometimes you just have to put trust in the person with experience who's providing you the medical care. Especially on something as simple as this. Hell, if I over analyzed everything like this I'd never be able to run my business...

I wish this was the case APIs and in your case it sounds like you trust your Doc so good for you...but if I had a dollar for every guy that comes in here only to tell of the horror they experienced with Doc's who don't know what they are doing and mismanage their guys only to come here for the right counsel I could pay off my bar tab for the next three years.

At the end of the day you will be the only one to assess your Doctor's care of you...but please don't put them on a pedestal; I've seen enough medical mismanagement in here to fill a life time!

[HRTstudent]

Ordinarily, I'd agree with you considering the many "doc" stories we get in here. However, his practice has almost 400 patients on TRT alone. So I'm inclined to let him "drive-the-bus" on this one. While this forum is a great resource, in reality, no one here is an endo, cardiologist or even a general practitioner. IMO sometimes you just have to put trust in the person with experience who's providing you the medical care. Especially on something as simple as this. Hell, if I over analyzed everything like this I'd never be able to run my business...

I'm not really saying doing go with him or anything. If he's got you feeling better that's what counts.

But what I said I still stand by it. As far as asking to see the research, that's just my genuine curiosity. We are still learning about vitamin D. It's a hot topic in science right now; and with that, I no doubt expect our views to evolve over time.

[APIs]

I wish this was the case APIs and in your case it sounds like you trust your Doc so good for you...but if I had a dollar for every guy that comes in here only to tell of the horror they experienced with Doc's who don't know what they are doing and mismanage their guys only to come here for the right counsel I could pay off my bar tab for the next three years.

At the end of the day you will be the only one to assess your Doctor's care of you...but please don't put them on a pedestal; I've seen enough medical mismanagement in here to fill a life time!

Yes good points & it's probably beneficial for us to be informed & question everything to a degree. LOL, at least he's not injecting me once a month and/or refusing to prescribe HCG or an AI etc. I guess it comes down to our own comfort level & further scrutinizing what's important to us as individuals.

[OdinsOtherSon]

APIs, as to your original question; yes I've heard this as well in a lecture by Dr. Thomas Levy. But, the vit D alone was not the cause of the arterial calcification. It was merely the catalyst when in the presence abnormal calcium levels within the patient, specifically coronary artery calcium. Not agreeing/disagreeing with the good Dr., merely sharing the info.

Edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddgLzQavQzw

This is an excellent video...kinda long but for purposes of this discussion, start at time stamp 52:30 through 58:55

[JD250]

API... I think its great that you have a doc that understands TRT and takes good care of you in that respect, as far as the Vit. D levels are concerned, I guess I can't see what would be detrimental to dropping your levels a few points as he wants to, he still has you in good health all around and he MAY be right about this, I would say go with the doc on this one and be thankful cause you are one of a few who have good docs that can be somewhat trusted.

Odin..... If it is JUST a catalyst then it would still make sense to eliminate that part of the equation, interesting stuff.

[kelkel]

Here's everything you need to know on Vit D. Note over 290 references to scientific papers...

http://examine.com/supplements/Vitamin+D/

[austinite]

Here's everything you need to know on Vit D. Note over 290 references to scientific papers...

http://examine.com/supplements/Vitamin+D/

You got me addicted to that site

[kelkel]

It is without question an excellent site. Was talking to him a couple days ago and he'll be doing MSM powder soon as well. Interested in seeing that one..

[APIs]

APIs, as to your original question; yes I've heard this as well in a lecture by Dr. Thomas Levy. But, the vit D alone was not the cause of the arterial calcification. It was merely the catalyst when in the presence abnormal calcium levels within the patient, specifically coronary artery calcium. Not agreeing/disagreeing with the good Dr., merely sharing the info.

Edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddgLzQavQzw

This is an excellent video...kinda long but for purposes of this discussion, start at time stamp 52:30 through 58:55

Thanks interesting stuff. If this is the study he was referring to, perhaps he misunderstood it?

[powerlifterty16]

im getting my d levels checked hopefully since im going in for a checkup. If my vit d is above 80 ill drop from 10k to 5k per day i guess.

[OdinsOtherSon]

Thanks interesting stuff. If this is the study he was referring to, perhaps he misunderstood it?

Maybe?? The gist of the lecture as a whole was centered on vitamin c, not d; however, what I took from what he had to say was that Vit D wasn't the problem...it was too much calcium. He even suggested being tested for calcium levels (specifically coronary artery) prior to administration of D. Great topic IMO, APIs.

[ramble]

I had been taking 3,000 units of D2 along with 2100 units of K2 for almost a year. My bW showed a 380 reading for D. I was actually surprised that it wasnt higher. It gave me a lot more energy and a little less pain in injured joints. I dropped it down to 20,000 units a few months ago to see if I can get by with that, so far, so good. I got my information from the book on the results of extremly high doses of Vit. D by Jeff T Bowles. The guy is no doctor but has experimented on himself and kept good records. He also claims many more things that are hard to believe but no one seems to be able to refute him and his book has many good reviews. I have had no side effects from this and have only good things to say about it.
I have read many warnings about high levels of vit D being toxic but now, I think its in the same category as the villianizing of steroids . It does seem to have an effect on K though.

[MyteeJ]

I am really glad I stumbled upon this today.

I had high calcium (10.6 on a range of 8.7 - 10.2) on last 2 BW's and also bumped up my D because of all the benefits we hear of.

I am going to have a chat with my Dr about protocol moving forward.

Great topic and a pleasure to see all the input.

[APIs]

I am really glad I stumbled upon this today.

I had high calcium (10.6 on a range of 8.7 - 10.2) on last 2 BW's and also bumped up my D because of all the benefits we hear of.

I am going to have a chat with my Dr about protocol moving forward.

Great topic and a pleasure to see all the input.

Interesting you said this. I just went back & looked at mine & it's @ 9.8 on the same scale you mention. Being it's on the high side, maybe this is why my Doc mentioned this? I'll have to ask him...

[MyteeJ]

Interesting you said this. I just went back & looked at mine & it's @ 9.8 on the same scale you mention. Being it's on the high side, maybe this is why my Doc mentioned this? I'll have to ask him...

I am going to forward that study to my doc as well.

I think it's a strong possibility that your doc mentioned it.

I am trying to figure out if I have a parathyroid issue causing my high calcium. One of the guys on here pointed that out when I joined.

I'll be checking the thread to see what everyone comes up with.