Elevated Estrogen help...

**Scottish-Muscle** · 03-12-2013, 12:02 PM

Basically ever since being shifted from Nebido (which was doing nothing for me) to sustanon I've been having issues with bloating, puffyness and water retention. I don't really get side effects from testosterone aside from water retention. Anyway it has been affecting me badly as the sweating is so damn bad, I always sweat but when working for example im soaked completely thru in 5 minutes and end up feeling very very ill as in dizzy and lethargic brain fog etc, blood pressure reading of 155/42 at this stage, after which it normalizes.

I had my estrogen checked which is currently sitting at 155... The normal reading for men (in UK) is 0 - 160. The doctor won't bother about this reading as "it's in range" and water retention isn't a big issue to worry about for them if your on NHS care....

Anyway I've started taking aromasin today. 12.5mg. Plan to run this mon-wed-fri just to help bring it back down. Also taking proviron but finishing this up soon. Was thinking of adding masteron in? Doctor currently has me on 1 shot of sust 250mg every 3 weeks which is zero use so I add in an extra shot which is test e. So im getting a shot roughly every 12 days on average.

So my question is what is a suitable estrogen level? Just so I can monitor it.

**HRTstudent** · 03-12-2013, 05:08 PM

I would probably first start looking for a new doctor.

Beyond that, I would talk to the dr about letting me inject twice per week (and cut the dose in half). This should help minimize estradiol conversion and give you more steady levels. If you did this, then that dose of about 83mg per week might be very good. But when you do 250mg every 3 weeks... well, that's a joke.

**kelkel** · 03-12-2013, 08:00 PM

What HRT said. And adding in other ancillaries at this time is really not a good idea. You're complicating things unnecessarily and making finding stable TRT levels even harder.

**steroid.com 1** · 03-12-2013, 10:39 PM

I'll make it simple; find another Doctor who understands TRT in men as this one is trying to kill you.

E2 at those levels...God for bid!

**VTX1800** · 03-13-2013, 06:29 AM

Sounds like the doctor has you on twistie ass roller coaster.
^ Do what the pro said! Lol I assume there are A4M docs in UK?

**Scottish-Muscle** · 03-13-2013, 06:36 AM

Guys I've noticed your from USA, well at least two of you. Understand that here in the UK if you are on the NHS it's free health service therefore imagine the "bare-bones" we don't get AI's or anything like that unless it was an extreme case such as bad gyno.

This is my second endo, I can't get anything else done than this. The first one put me on hcg then ignored me for 6 months so I had nothing. Took a lot of complaining to get this new one who I've been with for about a year. Started with nebido now the sustanon . He says that there is a short supply and it's hard to get....

Good point on what you said HRTStudent. I could do that? I mostly just inject myself anyway don't really bother with the doctor as it's near impossible to get nurse appointments to do the injection as it's so over-crowded...

Would keeping the dose at 250mg every 11 days not be ideal? Only issue is im switching esters.... I use test e pharma amps myself but they give me sustanon... I can get sustanon amps though?

I understand that adding in AI may cloud things. But seriously they won't do anything with elevated E2. It's not OVER the range. It could be 159/160 and it's not an issue of concern as it's guide lines. Just like if my testosterone was 10 or 11 serum out of 30 they wouldn't bother.

If the AI can normalize things then I don't mind. The water retention issue isn't a vain or image issue it's actually causing physical discomfort. From getting very bloated to sweating profusely, I have to change clothes 2-3 times a day because I soak everything thru and I can't wear t-shirts as that's the worst so stick to vests and hoodies. When working my other job (on my feet a lot) sweat is so bad it runs down my eyes etc and have to sit down as I start getting light headed/palps.

Honestly if I could easily change doctor I would but it's so difficult. Even if I could I would be waiting months on end for any result!.

**Scottish-Muscle** · 03-13-2013, 06:38 AM

Originally Posted by VTX1800

Sounds like the doctor has you on twistie ass roller coaster.
^ Do what the pro said! Lol I assume there are A4M docs in UK?

A4M? and yeah well he's pretty clueless I asked to be put on an AI or alike because of the water. My weight shoots up by sometimes 6-7lbs one day and drops soon after if I have a bad sweat attack.... He said that "only people with gyno get ai's" that's how retarded we are talking.

Also it's hard for me to have a come back on this as I really don't have time to go round n round in circles so I just self-medicate. Hence why I added in an extra shot to try balance out levels.... And now adding an AI in since I've confirmed the E2 levels are pretty high.

**lovbyts** · 03-13-2013, 08:39 AM

No no no 250mg every 11 days is way to much. You will still be on a roller coaster ride. Either 150 mg every 7 days or better .75 evwry 3.5 days

**Scottish-Muscle** · 03-13-2013, 09:35 AM

Originally Posted by lovbyts

No no no 250mg every 11 days is way to much. You will still be on a roller coaster ride. Either 150 mg every 7 days or better .75 evwry 3.5 days

But over 14 days that is 300mg. So would it not make sense to be on 250 every 12 days? Thing is I have my test checked and have been doing 250 every 11 for a while and it comes back still in range (serum test between 10-30 sits around 24.) and free test still in range. So it's not going over at all.

Wouldn't really be sure how to measure out 150mg it's only a small 1ml amp?

**Trific** · 03-13-2013, 10:01 AM

Originally Posted by Scottish-Muscle

But over 14 days that is 300mg. So would it not make sense to be on 250 every 12 days? Thing is I have my test checked and have been doing 250 every 11 for a while and it comes back still in range (serum test between 10-30 sits around 24.) and free test still in range. So it's not going over at all.

Wouldn't really be sure how to measure out 150mg it's only a small 1ml amp?

How many mgs in your 1mL amps....250mg? If it is, you could pin 125mg(half the amp) every 6 days and store the rest of the amp (125mg) in a syringe for the next shot.
That might not work too bad and if you decided you needed more you could move to pinning the same amount every 5 days or if you need less pin every 7 days.

**lovbyts** · 03-13-2013, 01:02 PM

You can do less mg sure but not less frequent. Do Not inject only 1x every 2 weeks. At the minimum inject 1x every 7 days but every 3.5 is better. Its a mater of half life and keeping your levels steady

**Scottish-Muscle** · 03-13-2013, 07:11 PM

Thanks for replies. In regards to the halfing the amp into seperate syringe etc I can see that being a pain in the neck quick enough lol!. On the blood levels though, with the ester being say sustanon wouldn't this balance out if injected say every 2 weeks or a little less? No idea why this doctor has me on one every 3 weeks then seems silly.

I suppose 2 a week would be more beneficial but a bit of a nightmare with amps. I can get 10ml bottles UGL stuff but much easier to use in that case.... Or should I switch esters? can get anything, cyp/sust/e/prop etc.

On the half life as well though, test e is usually up to 10-11 days? sustanon they say up to 14? So in that case wouldn't the levels still stay steady with say test e if injected once every 10 days?

**lovbyts** · 03-14-2013, 08:00 AM

No. Do you really want to wait until your test levels am almost crashed and you feel like crap or would you rather do it more frequently where are your test levels stay the same all the time and you are not on the rollercoaster ride of feeling like crap and then slowly feeling better for a few days until you feel really good and then you start feeling worse again until several days after you taken your next shot. What makes more sense?

It's not that big of a deal with the amps just feel to separate syringes and put 1 away for a few days.

Hopefully this will help.
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...w#.UUHff6OIbFo

**2Sox** · 03-14-2013, 09:53 AM

This question may seem too obvious, but are you able to be prescribed topical testosterone gels through NHS? If you are able to get them and respond to them, there is nothing better for a steady state. When I used them my E2 levels had been in range.

**Scottish-Muscle** · 03-14-2013, 10:51 AM

^They won't give me test gel due to already getting the sust :/ can't win lol.

lovbytes, why is trt pescribed generally speaking at every 11-12 days etc from endos? and I was thinking would sustanon not be the most ideal option in that case? Just thinking if injecting every 3-4 days say that amount doesn't for example test e take a certain amount of time to start building up in your system? so it would still technically peak and trough on each injection? as the time is to short between each one? Which would make more sense to use say test prop?

Also on the link you provided I read this but there's no way my endo will bother about that they need to stick to guidelines etc so if I am to change I will need to do it myself only.

**BuzzardMarinePumper** · 03-14-2013, 11:00 AM

Not being mean just a thought from your statments in your thread . Are you obease and do you exercise as BF effects E2 from what I have learned and belly fat even worse ! I have E2 issues and I eat healthy and exercise I have lost 30 lbs since Oct. 29 2012 and actualy gained muscle Still need more good calories to get more muscle size !

IMO Diet is as much a part of TRT as the Meds all things work together to acheive the desired goal

**lovbyts** · 03-14-2013, 12:45 PM

Originally Posted by Scottish-Muscle

^They won't give me test gel due to already getting the sust :/ can't win lol.

lovbytes, why is trt pescribed generally speaking at every 11-12 days etc from endos? and I was thinking would sustanon not be the most ideal option in that case? Just thinking if injecting every 3-4 days say that amount doesn't for example test e take a certain amount of time to start building up in your system? so it would still technically peak and trough on each injection? as the time is to short between each one? Which would make more sense to use say test prop?

Also on the link you provided I read this but there's no way my endo will bother about that they need to stick to guidelines etc so if I am to change I will need to do it myself only.

Its not generally prescibed wvery 11-12 days except by doctors who don't know better. Most doctors who are up to date do either every 7 days or 3.5 if the patient is ok with punnint that often.

You need to stop thinking your doctor understands hrt. Clearly he doesn't.

No you don't want to use test prop for trt. You are over thinking this. Yes it takes time to build up and Peak but the whole idea is to keep it steady as possible if you wanted to you could inject every day but a much smaller amount with Test E or C and be perfectly fine. Just because it takes a few days to peak does not mean injecting more often is not beneficial.

**Trific** · 03-14-2013, 12:59 PM

You named this thread "Elevated Estrogen..... more frequent test dosing helps keep the E2 down.

**Scottish-Muscle** · 03-14-2013, 06:16 PM

Originally Posted by BuzzardMarinePumper

Not being mean just a thought from your statments in your thread . Are you obease and do you exercise as BF effects E2 from what I have learned and belly fat even worse ! I have E2 issues and I eat healthy and exercise I have lost 30 lbs since Oct. 29 2012 and actualy gained muscle Still need more good calories to get more muscle size !

IMO Diet is as much a part of TRT as the Meds all things work together to acheive the desired goal

Nah im around 220lbs and pretty ripped. Full abs as a rule, but atm bloating like hell but when the water runs off me back to full pack again ha ha! it's irritating though but the aromasin seems to be doing it's job nicely now. Im always very very lean though.

Originally Posted by lovbyts

Its not generally prescibed wvery 11-12 days except by doctors who don't know better. Most doctors who are up to date do either every 7 days or 3.5 if the patient is ok with punnint that often.

You need to stop thinking your doctor understands hrt. Clearly he doesn't.

No you don't want to use test prop for trt. You are over thinking this. Yes it takes time to build up and Peak but the whole idea is to keep it steady as possible if you wanted to you could inject every day but a much smaller amount with Test E or C and be perfectly fine. Just because it takes a few days to peak does not mean injecting more often is not beneficial.

Hmm I could ask but think I'll get nowhere so I'll just do this one myself tbh. How longs loading a syringe up good for? can it be stored like that no bother for days on end? I'll do the jabs more frequently. So even 125mg every 6 days?

Also Test E or sustanon ? Thanks. Also keep running aromasin? seems to be doing a good job atm, sweated a lot of the water out feel a lot better already and that's only 3 days.... Face has pulled back in and abs back out and skin isn't like a saggy bag on my stomach anymore and I've even upped the carbs

.

**lovbyts** · 03-14-2013, 09:57 PM

Test E 125 every 6 days would be fine. Ai is dependant on if you really need it or not but its not a bad idea

**Trific** · 03-15-2013, 01:42 AM

How longs loading a syringe up good for? can it be stored like that no bother for days on end?

Don't know how long. I did read a story of where a guy flew to another country and took two sets of loaded syringes...a set in two different bags so that he had a better chance of both pieces of luggage not being lost. He also only wanted syringes and no vials or amps of test so he wouldn't have trouble with customs.. He did his trip and when he got back home he still used those loaded syringes that were left over. It's mainly an oil and you only need half of what you take in a syringe for 3.5 days.

**Trific** · 03-15-2013, 01:52 AM

You could also purchase a sterile sealed vial and transfer half of the amps over to it:

http://www.ar-r.com/accessories/glas...rile-vial.html

**Scottish-Muscle** · 03-15-2013, 05:57 AM

^Worth noting thx could try that.

Alternative is to just get UGL lab stuff 10ml bottles. Or I could transfer it over but really hate playing about with stuff like that as pretty paranoid about bacteria etc.

Well doctor has me on sustanon so atm im getting 1 test e and 1 sust.... I could just cancel that I guess and stick with the test e....