Does anyone have comparative bloodwork with Sub Q vs. IM injections?

[PistolPete33]

I'm reading more and more about Sub Q Test injections and it seems to be becoming the norm. I asked my TRT Dr. about it and he said that IM has been the way Test has been administered for ages so why change it? Obviously Sub Q is way easier to administer and I would think would cause way less trauma than IM esp. since we're doing this for the rest of our lives.

That said, does anyone have any bloodwork results of when they were on IM and then switched over to IM? I'm thinking of switching to IM even without my Drs. approval.

[FRDave]

If you switch to sub-Q, give it adequate time (8-10 weeks minimum) before getting blood work as most made comparisons way to early, giving false results in my opinion. My blood levels rose for a good 10 weeks on sub-Q, currently sitting at 991 injecting 80mg per week.

[HRTstudent]

I'm reading more and more about Sub Q Test injections and it seems to be becoming the norm. I asked my TRT Dr. about it and he said that IM has been the way Test has been administered for ages so why change it? Obviously Sub Q is way easier to administer and I would think would cause way less trauma than IM esp. since we're doing this for the rest of our lives.

That said, does anyone have any bloodwork results of when they were on IM and then switched over to IM? I'm thinking of switching to IM even without my Drs. approval.

there is a thread someone started and it has quite a bit of info.

but really, this information would not change your doctors opinion, nor should it.

but would it hurt to try? you could ask that. the pluses would be less muscle trauma over decades (big deal IMO) and possibly less T peaks and valleys because you can switch from once a week to twice or even three times.

testosterone has been administered for decades intramuscular, but many of the doctors on the front lines of TRT are using subQ now. they wouldn't do it if it didn't have advantages for some, or even most, men.

worst case, you can always go back to intramuscular.

[PistolPete33]

Thank you for your replies. If I decide to switch to Sub Q will my T levels drop first or would it be a pretty seamless transition? I know this is long term so not a big deal if the levels drop for a week or 2 but just trying to decide if I want to make the switch. Are you doing Sub Q injections?

[powerlifterty16]

there really is no reason to do IM if subq works. why do painful injections that scar your muscle when you can do painless injections that dont damage your muscle?

[bass]

I was on IM then switched to SQ and will never go back to IM unless I am doing high doses. I tried them all and 60 mgs twice a week SQ injecting in two places 30mgs each place is by far the best.

[PistolPete33]

I tried switching over to Sub Q tonight but no such luck. My 30 guage insulin syringes are way too small and I could only draw 20% of the test I needed into the syringe. What size insulin syringes are you all using?

[jay adams]

I use 29. Takes an extra minute or so.

[powerlifterty16]

I tried switching over to Sub Q tonight but no such luck. My 30 guage insulin syringes are way too small and I could only draw 20% of the test I needed into the syringe. What size insulin syringes are you all using?

how long did you try for? what brand is your cyp? for all the members using small needles what brand is your cyp?

[powerlifterty16]

I was on IM then switched to SQ and will never go back to IM unless I am doing high doses. I tried them all and 60 mgs twice a week SQ injecting in two places 30mgs each place is by far the best.

do you have to clean the needle after you change spots or do you just take one needle, swab your right thigh(hypothetically) with alcohol, inject 30mg, and then take the needle out, swab left thigh with alcohol and inject?

[bass]

do you have to clean the needle after you change spots or do you just take one needle, swab your right thigh(hypothetically) with alcohol, inject 30mg, and then take the needle out, swab left thigh with alcohol and inject?

Yes but I swab both spots first then inject. This also helps reduce the chance for lumps especially if you're doing more than 50mgs.

[physicslifter]

I tried switching over to Sub Q tonight but no such luck. My 30 guage insulin syringes are way too small and I could only draw 20% of the test I needed into the syringe. What size insulin syringes are you all using?

Yea, you're not being patient enough. Give it an extra minute or two with a 30 ga slin pin. It's certainly not as fast as drawing with an 18 ga and injecting IM with a 23 ga, but it's easily done with the 30 ga. If you're impatient, just run the bottle under hot water for a minute to help with viscosity.

[imom]

I tried switching over to Sub Q tonight but no such luck. My 30 guage insulin syringes are way too small and I could only draw 20% of the test I needed into the syringe. What size insulin syringes are you all using?

I'm using 30 gauge with Test Prop, and it's not a problem. It's not as fast as pinning a water based solution but it's not too slow either.

[dreadnok89]

My friend swears sub is awful and there are more complications with the test going thru fat than muscle

[PistolPete33]

The problem is I couldn't get any more test to go into the syringe at all. I spent about 5 minutes trying to get it to work and it was barely trickling in and then it wouldn't allow any more in. I will try again on thurs.

[bass]

My friend swears sub is awful and there are more complications with the test going thru fat than muscle

there are no evidence of this. there was one member here who compared IM with SQ and he preferred IM, but this is only one guy and in my option its was not a good comparison anyway.

[keep fightin]

my recent blood work confirms SQ is very effective, no drop whatsoever compared to IM. 29 gauge works well for me.

[roxer]

The problem is I couldn't get any more test to go into the syringe at all. I spent about 5 minutes trying to get it to work and it was barely trickling in and then it wouldn't allow any more in. I will try again on thurs.

Try pumping air into the vial with the syringe before you draw. I moved from a 30g 5/16 to a 29g 1/2 and it improved my draw. Was just a time thing though. 30g always worked - just took a while.

Also try pushing the plunger in a bit and then pulling to draw again - sometimes that restarts the flow. And make sure the needle is in the test if you have a low level of test remaining in the vial. Just pointing that out.

[FRDave]

Try pumping air into the vial with the syringe before you draw.

I was about to say the same. Sounds like he had a negative vacuum in the vial which will make it near impossible to get the oil out.

Place a slip tip in vial with no syringe attached to allow the vial to neutralize it's air volume. Once neutralized, always inject the same amount of air in vial as you plan to pull out in oil. For example, if you plan to pull out .25ml, load that amount of air in syringe, pierce vial, inject air, then draw out the same amount in oil. You can even add extra air to the vial to make it easier as the extra air will force the oil out since it try's to neutralize the air pressure.

[PistolPete33]

I was about to say the same. Sounds like he had a negative vacuum in the vial which will make it near impossible to get the oil out.

Place a slip tip in vial with no syringe attached to allow the vial to neutralize it's air volume. Once neutralized, always inject the same amount of air in vial as you plan to pull out in oil. For example, if you plan to pull out .25ml, load that amount of air in syringe, pierce vial, inject air, then draw out the same amount in oil. You can even add extra air to the vial to make it easier as the extra air will force the oil out since it try's to neutralize the air pressure.

I will try doing the slip tip. Hopefully that will help. When the oil was coming into the syringe it was all bubbled up. I just wouldn't pump any more into the syringe no matter how long I waited. I tried filling the vial with air and then filling but didn't have any success. I will try again on Thursday.

[powerlifterty16]

what brand is your cyp?

[PistolPete33]

The brand of Cyp is APS. I guess I can also have it mixed with Grapeseed oil instead of Sesame Oil but I'm not sure if that would thin it out at all.

[OLDANDWEAK]

I have bloodwork to compare. After several months doing IM my total test was 680 and that was 100mg once per week IM. After seven months doing 50mg twice weekly subQ my total test was 816. I will never switch back to IM as I feel much better with twice weekly subQ injections. The test may be hard to determine if my levels were actually higher because the first test was seven days after injection of 100mgs where the last one was 3 days after injection of 50mgs, but either way I feel much better and more stable with the subQ.

[adam1973]

I have bloodwork to compare. After several months doing IM my total test was 680 and that was 100mg once per week IM. After seven months doing 50mg twice weekly subQ my total test was 816. I will never switch back to IM as I feel much better with twice weekly subQ injections. The test may be hard to determine if my levels were actually higher because the first test was seven days after injection of 100mgs where the last one was 3 days after injection of 50mgs, but either way I feel much better and more stable with the subQ.

680 total test on day seven on 100mg IM testosterone ! I hope I score that high! I just had my labs done!

[PistolPete33]

I did my first sub Q this morning. It took almost 5 minutes to fill the insulin syringe the the .5ml which I wasn't crazy about. The injection was similar to the HCG injections except you really need to press the plunger hard to get the oil out. Since I've already been taking IM injections and the Test has metabolized in my body will my body metabolize the Sub Q injections differently or will my levels for the most part remain stable? I ask because I had to come off TRT for about 3 weeks because of a problem with filling my last prescription and I felt like total crap. I'm just hoping I don't have to feel like crap for a few weeks.