On TRT Wondering what the "Perfect Dose" is???? EXPERTS or VETS only PLEASE!!!!

**JuicDinNY** · 08-08-2013, 03:06 AM

So I have been to a ton of do ctors by now and they all put me on different do ses and sometimes i feel good sometimes i feel like trash.

From EXPERIENCEEEE, not a guess and not what you have read in a book, but EXPERTISE or EXPERIENCE, from someone who knows this like the back of their hand, what is a good dose for R X Wa tson Cy p for a 27 year old male with prior early age ana bolic abuse who does now not have an L H or FS H level on or off and t le vels can drop down to SINGLE digits???????????????????????

Ive heard what different endos have said and hrt do cs have said but off the record the good docs tell me that all the pro and vet bodybuilders that i personally know have a better understanding for the dru g than people who read a book and get a degree and are able to pres cribe but don't personally know a damn thing. They screwed me up worse than Ive ever been and now its time to get outside help to "fix" me the best i can.

I have Wa tson C yp, about 2 and a half 10m l bottles left and was doing .8c c every 7 days but was thinking about doing about .5c c every about 5 days or so????? Or is this specific es ter better done like .5c c every 10 days???? I just HATE when i physically and mentally feel myself plummet down to single or double digits and it has shown in blo od la bs. Anyone have any info???

I am VERY sensitive to ES TRO and have had the GYN O sur gery TWICE because the first one was done by a moron and I have arimi dex r x bottles full which I cut in half so .5 e d or e od as needed and just want to get the te st dose down to a science as i have been hearing this is what the big hype is now. Its "new" dosing methods and its down to a science and you feel great 24 7 lol. Pipe Dreams.

I really just want to get off the WELLBU TRIN for depr ession because like me and my doc tors and family think, it is all hormonal and once i find that perfect balance and dosing, i wont need these deathly toxic devil dru gs and will be able to remain on only the test and ween off the depre ssion me ds. How do you feel about ar imidex while on E OD? or E D?

ALSO I have been experiencing PRETTY bad almost like RED WELT BLISTER AC NE which is PAINFUL. My face is FLAWLESS but my neck, sometimes has sparatic welts on it just red not white but my back, shoulders and upper arms are all covered in red and white ac ne blisters and Ive used everything under the sun and had it under control for a while now i don't. Is it the Estr ogen or is it the Te st not being inje cted correctly???? I use 1in 25 g in the glut es upper outer quadrant and was doing the DELTS but everyone who has been in the game 10-20 years plus said DONT do delts because the oils leak out and that's why im breaking out bad on the shoulders and upper back????? Where else to shoot? and WTF am i doing wrong?!?! I need to be fixed asap lol at least on the ac ne and mood!

Sometimes i think my sudden HORRENDOUS mood and irritability is LACK of test in my system and now sometimes im thinking its too much!!! No healthy median! Someone who really knows their stuff plz lemme know and PM me if you have to! Thanks alot guys and thanks for your patience. Im no where near a newbie but i am tweaking a lot to try and get better results not in the gym but mood wise and lifestyle wise.

Thanks again!
JuicdinNY

**kelkel** · 08-08-2013, 07:33 AM

Start low and titrate based on BW. It's the only smart way to go. My advice would be 50mg every 3-4 days followed by BW in 6 weeks. IF an AI is needed at this dose it should be as minimal as possible. Such as .25mg 24hrs after each injection. Your goal here should be to not need an AI at all.

What total T level you shoot for should be based on how you feel, not necessarily a number. You are not a number on a chart. Other factors come into play such as shbg levels and free T, etc. Simply put, less is more on TRT.

You mentioned past gyno issues. This is where the twice weekly smaller injections will help you greatly. Less injected = less spike in E. It's a simple concept really. It will take you time and several BW's to dial in, especially if you have E issues. Hence why less is more and small, incremental changes work best.

Give it time. TRT is completely different that cycling. You're looking for overall health and balance.

**SEOINAGE** · 08-08-2013, 08:21 AM

Kelkel gave you good advice, the thing you need to understand though is that there is no basic answer, everyone's body is so different, My dose could be 3 times higher than anothers to obtain the same test levels and feeling of well being.

There are other doctors that actually do know what they are doing out there. I suggest getting in contact with one. You seem extremely stressed out and having professional assistance can help alleviate some of that, however you need someone that can work fast and help you make smart modifications as you go with proper blood work etc, and willing to listen to you when you are freaking out.

I hope you can get dialed in, and find out what else you need to do to be happy. I know I have been a lot happier since trt. But the start was really rocky because of a poor doc.

**Metalject** · 08-08-2013, 10:28 AM

Everything kelkel said is true.

The overall answer to the thread, there is no such thing as a perfect dose in the way you're asking for it. That would imply there's a perfect one size fits all answer.

**Brazensol** · 08-08-2013, 10:38 AM

Originally Posted by kelkel

Start low and titrate based on BW. It's the only smart way to go. My advice would be 50mg every 3-4 days followed by BW in 6 weeks. IF an AI is needed at this dose it should be as minimal as possible. Such as .25mg 24hrs after each injection. Your goal here should be to not need an AI at all.

What total T level you shoot for should be based on how you feel, not necessarily a number. You are not a number on a chart. Other factors come into play such as shbg levels and free T, etc. Simply put, less is more on TRT.

You mentioned past gyno issues. This is where the twice weekly smaller injections will help you greatly. Less injected = less spike in E. It's a simple concept really. It will take you time and several BW's to dial in, especially if you have E issues. Hence why less is more and small, incremental changes work best.

Give it time. TRT is completely different that cycling. You're looking for overall health and balance.

Perfectly said. There is no "magic" number as we are all individuals.

**bass** · 08-08-2013, 10:40 AM

^^^ I agree, nothing else I can add, the guys cover it all.

**FRDave** · 08-08-2013, 11:34 AM

In regards to the acne, I noticed I started getting some on my upper chest, back and shoulders. Once I got my estrogen under control and in range, I no longer have the acne. I don't think it has anything to do with your injection spots, but I do inject via sub-Q in the glutes only if that makes a difference.

Like mentioned, the amount of test used is different for everyone and based on blood work. My last set of labs had my test levels at 991 ng/dL using only 80mg per week split in two doses of 40mg every tues night and sat morning. I also convert more to estrogen than the majority in which I have to take a total of 1.5mg Arimidex per week.

Hope this helps

**Brazensol** · 08-08-2013, 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by FRDave

In regards to the acne, I noticed I started getting some on my upper chest, back and shoulders. Once I got my estrogen under control and in range, I no longer have the acne. I don't think it has anything to do with your injection spots, but I do inject via sub-Q in the glutes only if that makes a difference.

Like mentioned, the amount of test used is different for everyone and based on blood work. My last set of labs had my test levels at 991 ng/dL using only 80mg per week split in two doses of 40mg every tues night and sat morning. I also convert more to estrogen than the majority in which I have to take a total of 1.5mg Arimidex per week.

Hope this helps

Another great example of how we are different. My last labs had me at about the same test level as you but it takes 130mg/week to get me there. I also inject every 3.5 days. And my e2 levels are mid range with no ai. We're all different.

**JuicDinNY** · 08-17-2013, 01:28 AM

Hey guys sorry i havent been on here I got in an accident with an idiot who was reading his gps and just turned and smashed me LOL like it couldnt get any worse, it did haha but im ok so its fine.....
I want to thank you guys for all your time and your comments and ill give you a little update. My TRT doc switched me to weekly injections so instead of doing 1cc per week i am doing .6cc of watson rx cyp monday and another on thursday night. I feel like i can instantly taper down off the wellbutrin depression stuff because my mood is already more stable.
As for my e2, it all came back fine so my arim dose is fine at .25 per day. Its amazing what finding the right dose can do your body and mood. I am 230pounds and 6 foot tall with like upper teens body fat which of course id love to lower but very limited with alot of injuries so i do my best. I am startiung to feel like me again and every time i see a girl, I feel like im 14 again and get rock!!!! LOL LOVE this!
You know its a good sign when you wake up daily in the am and u are solid as a rock hahahaha.
As for the ACNE, I cant get rid of it. I have been trying the best of the best washes that Victor Martinez aqctually told me about as well as a few other bodybuilders which is the neutrogena orange and white bottle and a good glycolic toner after. Its actually getting worse and idk what is going on. Maybe the swat and the summer? I am even taking 3k mgs of extended release pantothenic acid aka vit b5.
Any other input would be appreciated on the acne thing its ALL over my back in painful red mounds but tanning and the beach seem to "hide it" but i dont want to hide it i want to get ridda it!

Thanks again guys anjd if anyone knows a GOOD hgh or trt doc in the NEW YORK area that would be sick! MY insurance ocvers them both! Thanks again!!!

Greg

**Brett N** · 08-17-2013, 04:13 AM

I am doing the same with 50mg zinc and 5 grams B5 (x2 on both) . Only for 2 weeks now and I have been informed by austintine that it does take time to work. Personally, I have set the number 6 weeks in my head to give it time, never missing a morning or night. I would like to keep it as simple as this and hoping it works. If for some reason it doesn't work for me, I may go see a dermatologist and look into accutane. I know I will want to see a derm. for the scarring I have on my forehead and back of neck once I quit breaking out. I have always had acne though. 41 now and started when I was 14. Acne is really a confidence killer with me but we almost all have to deal with it at one time or another.

I