Blood Test result explaination please?????????

[Complete novice]

Stats: 35, 250lb, 6ft, 30% + bf (gained over 3 stone since diagnosed with low test).

Symptoms: no libido, no drive, no erections, no morning wood or any other time. Tired and lethargic constantly, very moody, depressed, anxious, no get up and go. Weight gain, fat gain, just generally feel like crap.

History: I have been suffering with all the usual symptoms for nearly 2 years and have had four different endos:

1st gave me nebido after his under study thought this was the best treatment, I tried this and it gave me pain in my testicles (horrible), spots and no improvement at all, had two shots over 6 months.

2nd endo saw me and after I told him about my symptoms, he told me to stop (tbh I'm surprised I lasted that long with the pain) he then told me to leave it for 6 months which I found unacceptable.

3rd endo, was great spent all afternoon chatting to me and suggested I have a sleep study, see a dietitian and referred me to a so called specialist. He thought it was appalling I have had to live with these issues, but was retiring. So didn't want to start a new case, so to speak.

4th endo (so called specialist) wouldn't see me till I'd had a sleep study done, after I had that done it showed I had sleep apnea due to massive tonsils... Had them removed, got two hemoridges and a blood clot.. 3 operations later and a hell of a lot of pain. I took a 4 hour drive to have a blood test!!!

He then told my gp to start me on test enthate, the dose was 0.8ml every two weeks, after 4 days of first shot I felt worse than ever. Pain, shrinkage, spots, really wanted to commit suicide.. But I stuck it out for 2 months.. Was horrible.. He then told me to stop and have another blood test (4 hour drive). After that I was put on clomid, which after 10 days made my nipples feel like they had been through a cheese grater.. After another 4 hour drive the so called specialist told me he couldn't do anymore.

NONE OF THESE MADE ANY DIFFERENCE WHAT SO EVER

Blood results from Thursday 9am last week:

Testosterone (Serum testosterone): 11.400nmol/L (7.6-31)
Oestradiol (Serum Oestradiol level): 44.000pmol/L (N/A)
Thyroid:
TSH: 1.280miu/L (0.35-5.00)
Free T4 18.100pmol/L (11.0 - 23.00)
Prolactin (Serum prolactin level): 205.000mU/L (<324)
PSA (Prostate specific antigen): 0.610ug/L (<3.0)
Ferritin (Serum ferritin): 133.000ug/L (20-500)
Vitamin D (Total 25-hydroxyvitamin D level): 129.600nmol/L (50-150)
Cortisol (Serum cortisol): 433.000nmol/L (170-540)
B12 (Serum vitamin B12): 610.000ng/L (200-900)

I am due to see a new endo on Monday, any advice would be great, sorry for the long post.

[bass]

sorry you had to go through so much pain and struggle. unfortunately UK is lagging behind when it comes to TRT, but we have few members from UK that have good doctors and they are every happy. hopefully they'll chime in and give you some advice. you BW definitely indicated that something is wrong with your hormones, but if you're getting the type of attitude from your docs, well, I don't know what else you can do except talk to those who are getting proper care and hopefully they can help. hang in there, Patience is the key here.

[Complete novice]

Thanks for the kind words, Which part indicates the problem?

[bass]

obviously your testosterone and Cortisol. do you know the range of your E2? your thyroid seems to be okay but unfortunately not enough BW to make a sound assessment, you will need a complete male hormone panel like the one listed in the sticky "Finding a Physician"

[Complete novice]

The GP said everything was fine as they are "in range" I posted before my blood test and asked what blood tests I should have, and had the ones stated in the replies. I'm going to see the new endo on Monday any suggestions for what I should say? Recommend? Treatment? If I need more bloods what exactly should I ask for?

Thanks again

[FRDave]

you will need a complete male hormone panel like the one listed in the sticky "Finding a Physician"

See Bass's response above for necessary blood work.

[bass]

also read this,

http://forums.steroid.com/hormone-re...-outdated.html

[Complete novice]

I'm in to see the endo in the morning, any suggestions as to what I should say?

[bass]

simply tell him all about all the sides you are experiencing.

[Complete novice]

Went to see the endo this morning.

He has asked me to have further blood tests done and a semen analysis! He said my test is borderline. But since I have the symptoms he would offer me:

Sustainon 1 x 250ml per month or a small dose of nebido! He will not offer hcg or anything else, those are my two options, although he is wary of offering me either due to the sides I have had previously! Server testicle pain and shrinkage!

Any sugestions

[bass]

what's the complete protocol he's suggesting? even though Sustanon half life is longer than C and E (10-15 days depending on which blend) its not sufficient for once a month protocol. Nebido is the way to go but what does he mean by a small dose? he needs to give you the proper dose to get your tests levels to where they need to be based on how you feel and making sure all other hormones are in balance.

[Complete novice]

He said to have the more lengthy period between injections to see if I got less server symptoms! As I complained about them last time I was crippled over with testicle pain after using either the test E or nebido!

He didn't state an actual protocol he just said he would try less of a dose! But he suggested i take time to think about what I want!

Tbh I had 2 shots of nebido previously and felt no different at all over a 6 month period! I want to feel better in less time to know that whatever it is I need to use is going to work!

He said they are my only options, I was at the fertility clinic with my mrs the other week and their advice was we need to have sex more often! When I told them I have NO libido they said to talk to my endo, I told him this today and he said he can't give me anything to fix it!

I have never done any steroids before, but my friends have! They lose body fat in no time and say they feel horny all the time, there strong and energetic! I thought me having trt would make a difference to me but nothing!

I asked the endo if it would be worth me trying 1 mil a week of an anabolic steroid to see if it actually makes a difference, he said its totally different!

What should I do? I'm confused and getting nowhere

[tox2501]

Hey man sorry to hear your struggling. It sounds like your doc isn't willing to get on the same page as you. What side effects are you having?

If your testicles hurt you need to get on HGC. On HRT your body sees your testosterone level is increasing and things it has enough so it shuts down your internal production in your testis. Because you don't need them they start to shrink and this is where you pain is coming from. HGC turns your internal production back on and will eliminate the pain.

As far as lowering the dose Bass is right. Your dose needs to be determined by how much you need in order to restore a physiologically normals level which should be determined by lab work. It sounds like your doc is a little behind the times. If he's not willing to give you HGC for the testicle pain. He's not willing to consider a weekly injection scheduled I would find a new one.

[Complete novice]

what's the complete protocol he's suggesting? even though Sustanon half life is longer than C and E (10-15 days depending on which blend) its not sufficient for once a month protocol. Nebido is the way to go but what does he mean by a small dose? he needs to give you the proper dose to get your tests levels to where they need to be based on how you feel and making sure all other hormones are in balance.

what would a proper dose be? And how would I go about the testicle pain and staying fertile? As I would like more children? Thanks again

[bass]

what would a proper dose be? And how would I go about the testicle pain and staying fertile? As I would like more children? Thanks again

don't know much about Nebido, but I believe weather its Nebido, Cyp, E, you still need hCG to keep your testis functioning and prevent atrophy. for us in the US standard protocol in general look like this,

1. test cyp, 80-120 mgs ew, most here split that into two shots a week.
2. hCG is to keep our testis functioning, prevent atrophy and has other benefits. read the sticky regarding hCG for more details.
3. AI, as needed, if you don't convert easily you can get away with taking Zinc.
4. donating blood as needed. TRT tends to raise RBC, Hemoglobin and Hematocrit, donating will keep them in range.
5. supplements, like fish oil, vitamin D3, DHEA...
6. Healthy life style, clean diet and regular exercise.

^^^ this is somewhat a complete TRT protocol.

[Complete novice]

Thanks a lot for the info, I really appreciate it. Do you feel much better when on trt? The main issues I have is my weight gain and my lack of libido.

Will trt help me with these issues? I am a big guy, 18 stone, with no definition what so ever. I never have had any definition really and have suffered with these problems pretty much as long as I can remember. I had my testosterone tested in my mid 20's and it was still around the same level as it is now!

Maybe it's just the way my body is, as I have never taken steroids and not had any kind of bump to the testicles, I also have a 6 year old.

It's strange but I feel like I am lacking in something as I have no drive at all and have to drag myself out of bed in a morning, just feel lazy and useless..

What are the negatives with going on trt? The endo said its just like women taking the pill, once they stop everything goes back to normal. Is this the case?

Thanks again

[bass]

first thing first. you need complete male hormone panel done to see what could be causing your issues, if things can be assessed and diagnosed for the initial BW, your doc should make some suggestions and then treat you accordingly. will TRT work for you and solve your issues, most likely it will but its not a magic pill, its a lengthy process but at the end it will be worth it.

[thisAngelBites]

Do you think the cortisol is too high? Bloods were drawn at 9am, so the cortisol should be pretty high then.

obviously your testosterone and Cortisol. do you know the range of your E2? your thyroid seems to be okay but unfortunately not enough BW to make a sound assessment, you will need a complete male hormone panel like the one listed in the sticky "Finding a Physician"

[bass]

Do you think the cortisol is too high? Bloods were drawn at 9am, so the cortisol should be pretty high then.

good question, its hard to tell weather its something to be worried about or not without doing the 4 panel test.

[Complete novice]

The endo looked at the bloods I had done and said they all looked fine, he said my test is a little low and would expect someone my age to be mid 20s but apart from that he can't see anything else.

I am going to have another blood test next week, not sure what I'm having done, they write everything on a blood bag and I don't know what it means and can't change it once written. But I could possibly ask the nurse to add some tests.

Which tests are missing from the previous bloods I had done? Is it just LH and FSH? Or are there others I need to have done?

Thanks

[thisAngelBites]

It would be nice to have a Free T3 test. I had a low TSH like yours, and a decent T4 (like yours, in the middle of the range), but my T3 was low, as I was not converting all that well from T4 to T3.

For some reason, there is a lot of low testosterone in young men these days, and it seems to coincide with sub-optimal thyroid function, and sometimes cortisol function as well. I'm not sure your one time cortisol draw points to any problems, and I am pretty sure that because of this your endo won't order further tests on your adrenals glands. Nor will they likely endorse a salivary cortisol profile (which is something you would have to do privately, taking four saliva samples from four specific times during the day and sending them off for analysis) - but that would give you more information. These symptoms can be related to any or all of thyroid, adrenals, sex hormones,so they are non specific, unfortunately.

I'll leave someone else to recommend tests for male hormones, as I am still learning in that area. One of the sticky posts at the front of the forum has a list of tests in it (as mentioned, it's called: Finding a Physician). If you are going private I expect the endo would more or less do whatever tests you want. If you're doing it on the NHS you might have to be prepared (so read up on the tests, what they show, and why they would be helpful) to give a good reason why you think you need each test, otherwise I doubt they will go for it.

[Complete novice]

I had another blood test last week, yet can't get my results for some reason, I had LH, FSH and testosterone ! Only ones they would do!

The endo has also sent me a letter saying I can have pretty much anything they can prescribe! They won't give me hcg no matter what! That said I can only have what they give me and only have the amount they prescribe!

Would just having a standard anabolic course make things worse? I've never taken steroids before but I've read and heard that having it has kick started peoples production again after a 12 week course, or is that a load of rubbish?

Thanks for any help