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  1. #1
    One Way Step is offline New Member
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    Best ways to dose test, hcg, ai

    Hey guys,

    I'm currently taking the following protocol;
    Monday: 500iu HCG , .25mg AI
    Tuesday: 200mg test cyp

    This routine works well for me. It gives me good energy, good appetite, and general feelings of wellbeing. HOWEVER, I do not get morning wood on this routine and my libido is somewhat off. Erections are pretty good, though.

    I've done routines where I split everything into twice a week and none worked at all. I don't react to anything below 200mg of test in a shot, and taking HCG or AI more than once a week sends my e2 too high or too low.

    Anyway, I am trying to find a better protocol to improve my libido and bring back morning wood.

    I was thinking of moving the AI to the same day as test (Tuesday), and just taking the HCG on Monday.

    I was also thinking of taking test and the AI on Tuesday, and taking the HCG on Thursday or Friday.

    Thoughts guys? Any suggestions on improving libido and restore morning wood?

  2. #2
    xcraider37 is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Way Step View Post
    Hey guys,

    I'm currently taking the following protocol;
    Monday: 500iu HCG , .25mg AI
    Tuesday: 200mg test cyp

    This routine works well for me. It gives me good energy, good appetite, and general feelings of wellbeing. HOWEVER, I do not get morning wood on this routine and my libido is somewhat off. Erections are pretty good, though.

    I've done routines where I split everything into twice a week and none worked at all. I don't react to anything below 200mg of test in a shot, and taking HCG or AI more than once a week sends my e2 too high or too low.

    Anyway, I am trying to find a better protocol to improve my libido and bring back morning wood.

    I was thinking of moving the AI to the same day as test (Tuesday), and just taking the HCG on Monday.

    I was also thinking of taking test and the AI on Tuesday, and taking the HCG on Thursday or Friday.

    Thoughts guys? Any suggestions on improving libido and restore morning wood?
    Need bloodwork posted before we can answer any of those questions. If your dick works when you need it too why do you care if it's rising in the morning?

    Stop masturbating that might help morning wood.

  3. #3
    kelkel's Avatar
    kelkel is offline HRT Specialist ~ AR-Platinum Elite-Hall of Famer ~ No Source Checks
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    Your over-thinking all of this. Morning wood is not the barometer for your libido. As long as things function on demand then you're good to go. Way too many people (and forums) tend to place too much emphasis on morning wood. As we age, things change.

    When it comes to your HCG and a once per week Test protocol, you should inject both one and two days before your T injection. So for you that would be 250 iu's both Sunday and Monday. The purpose is to give your waning exogenous test level a bump via HCG at the end of the week. In reality I'd still suggest a twice per week protocol for test as it quite possibly would eliminate the need for your AI.
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  4. #4
    One Way Step is offline New Member
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    Blood Work from a few weeks ago...

    TEST: 631
    E2: 37

    This was taken at the end of the week right before I took any HCG or AI.

    For the routine of 250iu HCG (SUN), 250iu HCG (MON) and 200mg TEST (TUES), would it make sense to add the AI on the same day as the test shot (Tuesday)?

  5. #5
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    Metalject is offline Knowledgeable Member
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    Agree with kelkel, morning wood doesn't mean anything. I'm not sure if I've had a morning erection in 10yrs, and barring putting myself in some mind F situation, it all works just fine. I'd actually say my libido is stronger than it was in my teens or 20's.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Way Step View Post
    Blood Work from a few weeks ago...

    TEST: 631
    E2: 37

    This was taken at the end of the week right before I took any HCG or AI.

    For the routine of 250iu HCG (SUN), 250iu HCG (MON) and 200mg TEST (TUES), would it make sense to add the AI on the same day as the test shot (Tuesday)?
    If you need the AI then just dose it the day of injection or day after. Either will work just fine and cover the peak of your testosterone . I would again urge you to consider twice weekly injections as stated above.
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  7. #7
    One Way Step is offline New Member
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    Thanks for the replies guys

    In term of splitting doses, I have taken 100mg twice per week and 125mg twice per week. The split doses left me unenergetic, lazy, no appetite, and no sex drive. Idk why.

    Question regarding the HCG ; what is the basis for taking 250iu two and one day before injections, as opposed to just taking 500iu the day before? Would taking 500iu two days before make any sense?

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Way Step View Post
    Thanks for the replies guys

    In term of splitting doses, I have taken 100mg twice per week and 125mg twice per week. The split doses left me unenergetic, lazy, no appetite, and no sex drive. Idk why.

    Question regarding the HCG; what is the basis for taking 250iu two and one day before injections, as opposed to just taking 500iu the day before? Would taking 500iu two days before make any sense?
    You present dose of 200mg/week, is a fairly high dose to begin on TRT, IMO. Most start lower - around 100mg/week. There are some who start lower than this. Consider lowering yours. As Kel suggested, breaking your dose into two or more injections per week would make for a smoother ride and less aromatization into estrogen. The symptoms you describe are very likely caused by your high T dose and resulting greater conversion into estrogen. The symptoms of high E2 are identical to those of low T.

    Kel already gave a beginning answer to your question on hCG . For a fuller explanation, look up the Crisler hCG protocol.

  9. #9
    One Way Step is offline New Member
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    I have been on testosterone since I was 13 years old. I am 23 now.

    I was hypogonadal so took large shots of test to get through puberty. It was great. Grew like crazy, ate whatever I wanted, horny literally all the time. I swear I'm pretty sure I had a hard on from age 13-17. Good times.

    Since age 17 I've in a therapeutic routine of HCG and test. Originally, I was taking 400mg test every two weeks with 2500iu HCG 2x per week (this was my doctor dose). That worked well for a while but the sides sucked, like water retention and the second HCG shot usually killing my sex drive and making me lazy (now known to be because of high E2).

    Last year I did my own research on all this stuff to escape the terrible sides and stumbled upon 500iu HCG and 200mg Test. I've tried all the other routines (100mg test 2x per week, 250iu HCG doses, etc) and I don't react to anything below 500iu HCG and 200mg test. Idk why, maybe I'm desensitized due to all of this stuff being in my system for 10 years at crazy doses.

  10. #10
    2Sox's Avatar
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    Thanks for filling us in. It's useful info. Probably should have said so from the get go.

  11. #11
    kelkel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Way Step View Post
    I don't react to anything below 500iu HCG and 200mg test. Idk why, maybe I'm desensitized due to all of this stuff being in my system for 10 years at crazy doses.
    How do you expect to react?
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  12. #12
    One Way Step is offline New Member
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    If I take 250iu of HCG , I feel absolutely nothing. No difference in anything.

    If I take below 200mg test, I feel lazy, un-energetic, weak sex drive/libido, no appetite, and a general feeling of crappiness. All of these feelings are intensified depending on how low the dose of test is.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Way Step View Post
    If I take 250iu of HCG , I feel absolutely nothing. No difference in anything.

    If I take below 200mg test, I feel lazy, un-energetic, weak sex drive/libido, no appetite, and a general feeling of crappiness. All of these feelings are intensified depending on how low the dose of test is.
    From my experience, hCG has an overall effect on well being and maintains testicular size and a certain degree of testicular function. In addition it increases ejaculate volume and the intensity of orgasms (compared to no hCG). There is no "high" involved. A guy just feels normal. As Kel asked, what do you expect?

    A LOT of factors could make for the other feeling you describe. I'm not sure how scientific your findings are. Do you have blood work to bear out your subjective feelings?

  14. #14
    One Way Step is offline New Member
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    When I take 500iu HCG , I experience everything that you mentioned above. I don't get any of it with 250iu.

    When I take 200mg test, I get good energy, good appetite, etc.

    The only blood work I have available is some T and E2 levels from a few weeks back. I got blood work this past week so I'm waiting for that to come in.

    Other BW I've gotten in the past has shown normal levels of prolactin and SHBG (sorry I don't have it available to post here).

  15. #15
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    Could you simply be hooked on a number? Thinking that with anything less you can't feel as good?
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  16. #16
    2Sox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Way Step View Post
    When I take 500iu HCG , I experience everything that you mentioned above. I don't get any of it with 250iu.

    When I take 200mg test, I get good energy, good appetite, etc.

    The only blood work I have available is some T and E2 levels from a few weeks back. I got blood work this past week so I'm waiting for that to come in.

    Other BW I've gotten in the past has shown normal levels of prolactin and SHBG (sorry I don't have it available to post here).
    It's common knowledge that everyone reacts differently to different doses. In addition, I'm sure you know that you present state of general health affects your numbers and how you feel, as well. See what others do and experiment with doses. But as Kel suggests, don't get stuck on a number.

    If you've been doing practically all your life, you should have a pretty good sense of what works for you. But monitoring BW is a must for everyone on TRT.

    From what I've see here, average hCG dosages seem to range from 500iu to 1000iu weekly. I take 100iu/day and it works fine for me. I'm running about 100mg Test cyp weekly, broken up daily into SQ injections.

  17. #17
    One Way Step is offline New Member
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    The last things that worked were really well for me were...

    450mg test and 2500iu HCG every two weeks
    240mg test and 1500iu HCG every two weeks

    Would taking 240mg test and 1500iu hcg be a stupid/dangerous dose to take once per week (both on the same day) if it is effective? The reason I stopped these doses is because of their sides, mainly water retention.

  18. #18
    kelkel's Avatar
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    I think you simply need to do a reasonable protocol and suck it up for a while. What sides you experience may actual be more psychological then physical. I'd bet over a short period of time you'll adjust and be just fine.
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  19. #19
    waylaid69 is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metalject View Post
    Agree with kelkel, morning wood doesn't mean anything. I'm not sure if I've had a morning erection in 10yrs, and barring putting myself in some mind F situation, it all works just fine. I'd actually say my libido is stronger than it was in my teens or 20's.
    That's good for you man. Do you mind if I ask what your protocol is? I'd love my libido to be like it was when i was in my teens & early 20's!

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