VERY low test levels but still have muscle mass? confused...

**Xanode** · 02-01-2015, 08:14 AM

I'm 33 in June. Skip to the end for the short version. So i had a blood test done the other day for my hemochromatosis(Iron overload) and my new doctor decided to check my testosterone levels at the same time.

The result was (sorry im not clued up to the exact terms used in the measurement) my doctor said that normal levels for a man my age(32 are between 30 and 70, Mine was 1! which he explained that a 1 on the test in all likely hood means that my level was so low that it probably didn't even register on the test.

He was quite shocked as was i. So we had the test repeated and it confirmed that my testosterone levels are nearly non existent.

Now ill give you a little bit of background, i bodybuilt from the ages of 16 to 27, i hit my natty peak around age 23, i must of had good levels back then cause i grew like a mofo, i spose i could of gotten a little bigger natty if i had the perfect diet and training but at 24(stupidly) i took the gear road. All up i did 2 12 week cycles of test E, each with PCT in between consisting of 10 weeks on nolva and clomid. At my peak i weighed in at 135 - 140kgs with not much fat, not sure of the exact % but it wasn't much, and then i slowly quit bodybuilding over the years, working out on and off to the age of 30.

So i have all the symptoms of low T, severe treatment resistant depression and anxiety, lethargy, low sex drive, yada yada... all but one. i don't have low muscle mass, actually im still quite large with quite a bit of mass and strength, atm i weigh 130kg but with a bit more body fat, if i had to guess 15 - 20%? Also im not losing any hair or facial hair, this was another thing that really surprised my doctor. We also learned from the test that my cortisol steroid levels were extremely low as well.

Is this out of the norm? to have non existent T levels but still have quite a bit of muscle mass and strength?

I'm actually glad to find this out, because the depression and anxiety was literately killing me, not one medication has helped, tried nearly every anti- depressant in the book, nothing helped, and my doc said the low T and cortisol levels were in all likelihood behind it.

I'm going to see a specialist next week but i wanted to get opinions on my story, so any help is much appreciated.

Many Thanks.

**Beethoven** · 02-01-2015, 08:36 AM

I was low and still carried some good mass. Kept working out and was still strong, etc. The thing that getting my low t under control did for me was kept me healthy first off, but made better gains (which would have been normal gains with a normal t level) and libido, sex. So if you have good muscle it's not like it will go away overnight but in time. You probably caught it in the early stages.

**NACH3** · 02-01-2015, 08:53 AM

Originally Posted by Xanode

I'm 33 in June. Skip to the end for the short version. So i had a blood test done the other day for my hemochromatosis(Iron overload) and my new doctor decided to check my testosterone levels at the same time.

The result was (sorry im not clued up to the exact terms used in the measurement) my doctor said that normal levels for a man my age(32 are between 30 and 70, Mine was 1! which he explained that a 1 on the test in all likely hood means that my level was so low that it probably didn't even register on the test.

He was quite shocked as was i. So we had the test repeated and it confirmed that my testosterone levels are nearly non existent.

Now ill give you a little bit of background, i bodybuilt from the ages of 16 to 27, i hit my natty peak around age 23, i must of had good levels back then cause i grew like a mofo, i spose i could of gotten a little bigger natty if i had the perfect diet and training but at 24(stupidly) i took the gear road. All up i did 2 12 week cycles of test E, each with PST in between consisting of 10 weeks on nolva and clomid. At my peak i weighed in at 135 - 140kgs with not much fat, not sure of the exact % but it wasn't much, and then i slowly quit bodybuilding over the years, working out on and off to the age of 30.

So i have all the symptoms of low T, severe treatment resistant depression and anxiety, lethargy, low sex drive, yada yada... all but one. i don't have low muscle mass, actually im still quite large with quite a bit of mass and strength, atm i weigh 130kg but with a bit more body fat, if i had to guess 15 - 20%? Also im not losing any hair or facial hair, this was another thing that really surprised my doctor. We also learned from the test that my cortisol steroid levels were extremely low as well.

Is this out of the norm? to have non existent T levels but still have quite a bit of muscle mass and strength?

I'm actually glad to find this out, because the depression and anxiety was literately killing me, not one medication has helped, tried nearly every anti- depressant in the book, nothing helped, and my doc said the low T and cortisol levels were in all likelihood behind it.

I'm going to see a specialist next week but i wanted to get opinions on my story, so any help is much appreciated.

Many Thanks.

I'm going thru the same situation my TT IS 315 but my LH/FSH/thyroid/lipids/CBC/Prostate/CMP(metabolic panel) all good but my TT/and FT SUCK! But I too 31, and now need TRT/GH therapy... All my BW and levels/including my extensive med history... Check the HRT SECTION under a post right there "So... Been feeling way off... BW confirms LowT + med history" as I mention what I've gond thru...

Many Thanks.[/QUOTE]

**kelkel** · 02-01-2015, 01:26 PM

It takes time to lose what you gained. Muscle doesn't simply waste away immediately in linear fashion with your T level. Over more time you would see greater changes. That said, be sure to get full BW so you can determine exactly where your problem lies, meaning primary (testicals) or secondary (pituitary) related. Take a look at the Finding A Doc Sticky thread at the top of this forum for an example of Blood Work to get. Tell your doc it's what you want and maintain copies of your BW from this point forward.

Many of us have been where you are. You'll get through it, just be patient and be sure to find a doctor that knows hormones.

Welcome to the forum.

**Xanode** · 02-01-2015, 06:43 PM

Thanks for all the helpful replys guys, much appreciated.

My doctor is actually pretty cool, for example, when i told him about my steroid use his first question out of his mouth was, "did you do PCT?" ME: "yes", doc: "good, what did it consist of?"

So he seems like he's clued up, also he's quite young, not like some of the older, out of date quacks.

Any more help or opinions are appreciated.

**Beethoven** · 02-01-2015, 07:14 PM

Originally Posted by Xanode

Thanks for all the helpful replys guys, much appreciated.

My doctor is actually pretty cool, for example, when i told him about my steroid use his first question out of his mouth was, "did you do PCT?" ME: "yes", doc: "good, what did it consist of?"

So he seems like he's clued up, also he's quite young, not like some of the older, out of date quacks.

Any more help or opinions are appreciated.

He definitely sounds that way. Good luck brother. This is best place for us, you'll find a lot great info and people here. Welcome.

**kelkel** · 02-01-2015, 09:27 PM

What's the point of the specialist if your current doc is up to speed?
And what type of specialist?

**SEOINAGE** · 02-04-2015, 09:31 AM

I'm also pretty young for TRT, probably different reasons that brought me to that point, but nonetheless I had been lifting regularly prior to trt and focusing on strength, managed close to 500 lb squat and 350 lb bench with low T. Granted bf levels were fairly high, I carried a decent amount of muscle mass. But the effects TRT has had on my mood and happiness have been worth it, it didn't revitalize my libido to like when I was 20, but it improved enough to feel like a man.

If your doctor seems to be up to par, see what he has to say about trying a restart, much like a PCT or a clomid therapy. It can work in some individuals. Be grateful you stumbled upon this information with your doctor, whichever route you go you can bet you'll have improvements in the aspects you mentioned once you are on a proper dose and levels in proper ranges. Just don't forget if you still have some underlying issues to ask your Dr for help. There can be more to it than just T levels, and it is good he is looking at cortisol already.

**Nubster** · 03-10-2015, 12:25 PM

- GAL -->

**Xanode** · 05-14-2015, 09:05 AM

OK sorry for not updating this, ive just been so busy. also i forgot to mention in my other posts im from Australia.

So my diagnosis from my Endocrinologist after an MRI is a "tiny but large enough" benign tumour on my Pituitary gland that has totally shut down my test production, down to below detectable levels anyway.

The specialist prescribed Reandron 1000 which is Testosterone undecanoate and supposed to last 10 weeks in-between injections.

After doing a bit of research and watching allot of youtube vids about TRT allot of others on it prefer more regular and faster working injections of Testosterone Cypionate or sustonon.

what i want to know is it ok for me to ask my doctor for one of these instead?

Mainly because with having near zero test in my system for who knows how long(i have suffered from treatment resistant severe depression and anxiety for the past 10 years, and this is the reason my new doctor thinks why my symptoms have been totally resistant to anti-depressants) and feeling like utter shit i want a faster acting ester so i can get back to feeling normal asap, even if it does mean more sides..

Thank god this doctor thought to have my hormones checked or who knows how long this would have gone undetected. If your depressed and cant fix it have your levels checked!

So is it ok to ask for a different prescription?

thanks for any help.

**bobtail** · 05-21-2015, 10:31 AM

I know this is an oldie but thought I would throw my .02 in. I was off for 3 months because my primary is an idiot. Dropped 20# pretty quick but still looked pretty good and was actually getting stronger! Hung in there at 210#.
When I had it checked, it was 138 total and 14 free. Sucky for sure!
My conclusions? 1) I was just dropping back to my natty weight (probably 195 lean) 2) Strength has less to do with anabolics than I thought. 3) If I wasn't such a jackass, I could still look pretty good on nothing 4) Proved to me that some of your gains are actually permanent

**SEOINAGE** · 05-21-2015, 10:45 AM

Originally Posted by Xanode

OK sorry for not updating this, ive just been so busy. also i forgot to mention in my other posts im from Australia.

So my diagnosis from my Endocrinologist after an MRI is a "tiny but large enough" benign tumour on my Pituitary gland that has totally shut down my test production, down to below detectable levels anyway.

The specialist prescribed Reandron 1000 which is Testosterone undecanoate and supposed to last 10 weeks in-between injections.

After doing a bit of research and watching allot of youtube vids about TRT allot of others on it prefer more regular and faster working injections of Testosterone Cypionate or sustonon.

what i want to know is it ok for me to ask my doctor for one of these instead?

Mainly because with having near zero test in my system for who knows how long(i have suffered from treatment resistant severe depression and anxiety for the past 10 years, and this is the reason my new doctor thinks why my symptoms have been totally resistant to anti-depressants) and feeling like utter shit i want a faster acting ester so i can get back to feeling normal asap, even if it does mean more sides..

Thank god this doctor thought to have my hormones checked or who knows how long this would have gone undetected. If your depressed and cant fix it have your levels checked!

So is it ok to ask for a different prescription?

thanks for any help.

Yes, a good doctor will listen to your concerns, and at least address them, or even work with you on making sure you are satisfied properly within reason. I'd have a hard time trusting something to last properly for 10 weeks, not to mention getting your dose right, we are all so different.