Enlarged Prostate: Solutions?

[2Sox]

I have a question. I'm in my sixties and now that my prostate is the size of an orange (slight exaggeration), I awake 3-4 times a night to pee, can't even count the number of times a day I do, and there is never a time urination does not involve pain to some degree (particularly at night). Urinary retention, big time but strangely no pain at all during sex! I am considering finasteride for some degree of relief. For those that don't know me, I'm on 98mg T cyp/week, 700iu hCG /week, 12.5mg anastrozole/week.

I understand that it takes some months for the size of the prostate to be reduced with this medication and for certain men at certain stages of prostate enlargement, this may never even happen - or to a degree to relieve symptoms. It is not guaranteed. What does happen is a reduction in DHT which should decrease prostate growth and decrease hair loss (which is a side benefit I wouldn't mind). DHT has many other benefits, not the least is it's involvement in libido and erections.

I'm not at all optimistic or enthusiastic about the Finasteride route. But I have to do something about my condition. My quality of life is suffering severely. The other option I'm considering is TURP - a procedure which has been done for decades, which is the surgical widening of the section of the urethra that passes through the prostrate and removal of adjoining prostate tissue - thus lessening urinary retention and eliminating pain and frequency. Given results: 1. immediate relief which makes it very popular 2. retrograde ejaculation - not the worst thing. Possible risk: 0.01% chance of impotence - which I believe mostly involves men with other serious medical conditions. The procedure is fairly simple but the necessity for catheterization afterwards - the pain is excruciating with bladder spasms only relieved somewhat with opiate suppositories. (Sorry if this is TMI. I had bladder surgery recently and I can personally attest to this.)

I welcome a discussion on this and any suggestions, experiences, or opinions to help make clear my options.

[jimmyinkedup]

If your looking strictly for symptomology relief give low dose daily cialis a go, it works wonders. If you want to address the actual problem you need to be sure to manage e2 at all time keeping it around the lower end of normal and possibly use a 5ar inhibitor like fina or dutasteride. I recommend duta if you are going to go that route. More powerful at half the dosage with a lower % of sexual related sides. Like 1.3% of all users - which is pretty damn low.

[kelkel]

What does your Uro say? Recommend?
You are on cialis, correct?

[2Sox]

check out PAE its done in a N/C hospital chapel hill i believe..As we speak it in clinical trails.. Its going to cost me 6.500.00 plus airfare and hotels about ten grand after everything said. Check it out.. Its going to replace the TURP. The TURP is a band aid the PAE seems to be a fix.

Been looking into this since you posted about it. Sounds amazing! Thank you for this information. When are you going to get it done?

[2Sox]

I live in NYC.

Kel,
Yes I take Cialis - 10mg/day. Sometimes twice a day. I also take Flomax, 2-3 tablets a day. Nothing seems to give me much relief at this point. And Flomax doesn't have any effect on me regarding sex at all. It's just the other issues I mentioned in my original post.

Going tomorrow for a follow up on the TURB - bladder operation I had on Monday. Don't know if it's cancer yet but it probably is and at a very early stage. Easily treatable with surgery alone. Doctor said to hold off on TURP until this issue is resolved - and I agree. Makes a good deal of sense.

I don't look forward to TURP because of the points I made previously but the end results would far outweigh the short term pain. At least this is what I tell myself but if you ever were catheterized you don't want to go through it again. It can be agonizing.

I'm eager to learn more about this PAE - Prostatic Artery Embolization. Looks promising. But out of pocket is unfortunate.

Here's a link to the procedure:
http://news.unchealthcare.org/heartandvascular/pae

[kelkel]

Wow, PAE looks really interesting.

[2Sox]

Wow, PAE looks really interesting.

Yes, it does. I'm going to look around here in NY. I don't see why there shouldn't be a hospital in this town that does it!

[kelkel]

It may be worth visiting the guys who developed the procedure.

[thisAngelBites]

This procedure does look interesting, and I hadn't heard of it. (it's nice to hear about these new medical technologies)

A friend who is a neurosurgeon told me that prostatic enlargement is often caused by low progesterone in men as they age. He says it is worse for people who are stressed as increased cortisol destroys progesterone, and then it creates problems w vasculature, increasing stroke risk, etc. It also blocks 5 alpha reductase, so tends to lower DHT.

I don't methodically read the men's TRT posts, just when a title catches my eye, but I have come across very little here about progesterone levels in men. Have I just missed it, or is there a repository of info somewhere?

I have not seen men testing it or taking it. I have it on my list for my husband's next blood work, so I can keep an eye on it.

It's horrible not sleeping, not only is nocturia an annoyance, it's not good for your overall health. I wish I could help. Good luck researching the PAE and finding something that works for you, and let us know how it goes.

[Moonjumper]

I don't methodically read the men's TRT posts, just when a title catches my eye, but I have come across very little here about progesterone levels in men. Have I just missed it, or is there a repository of info somewhere?

Closest I've seen to it is just the discussion of why hcg should be used in conjunction with trt. Keeps the testes functional and they are the producers of that hormone in the male body. But in my short time here I've not seen it discussed as taking it otherwise.

[2Sox]

It's horrible not sleeping, not only is nocturia an annoyance, it's not good for your overall health. I wish I could help. Good luck researching the PAE and finding something that works for you, and let us know how it goes.

Thank you for you good wishes - and for your input - which I personally always find extremely useful.

My last progesterone reading in August was 0.47 with a range of 0.14-2.06. On the low side. DHT on this same report came in at 27 with a range of 16-79. Nothing extraordinary. So I'm still in the dark as to the cause of my severe symptoms - at least in regards to DHT. But that's a moot point. My attention is towards alleviating them.

I'm going to look into Jimmy's suggestion above regarding dutasteride for DHT control - and if it's even necessary with my numbers.

[thisAngelBites]

Thanks for the nice comment. I completely get that you are trying to solve an urgent problem. But when I write I also think of the thousands of people that see these posts, and so I am also tuned into trying to mention things that other people can google and investigate, even if their situation is less urgent.

But now I am intrigued that your progesterone is quite lowish, and that the problem is so severe, and I am thinking about whether my friend is correct. Btw, he thinks all men past their late 40s should be checking and supplementing progesterone (he says everyone is low as they age, men and women).

Can I ask who is ordering your progesterone test? are you requesting it or your doc? If it's your doc, does he intend to do anything with the results (meaning what does it tell him and does he ever treat)? I wonder if supplementing would do any good for you, because even a small improvement might translate into a larger improvement in surgical outcome (that's just conjecture, but do you see what I am getting at?), and would also lower DHT (even though your numbers are low, maybe you are someone who is sensitive, at least as far as the prostate, to DHT).

I just went and looked at my doc's website, and he has a page about symptoms of low progesterone in men that is interesting, although I have no idea how he treats (and I just saw him in August or I would ask and post):

http://www.hertoghe.eu/patients/pdf/...Deficiency.pdf

Maybe this is something men should be watching as they get older, particularly if they are on TRT and may have higher levels of DHT.

[bigdil511]

Best of luck 2sox unfortunately have nothing to contribute no real knowledge on the subject.

[2Sox]

Can I ask who is ordering your progesterone test? are you requesting it or your doc? If it's your doc, does he intend to do anything with the results (meaning what does it tell him and does he ever treat)? I wonder if supplementing would do any good for you, because even a small improvement might translate into a larger improvement in surgical outcome (that's just conjecture, but do you see what I am getting at?), and would also lower DHT (even though your numbers are low, maybe you are someone who is sensitive, at least as far as the prostate, to DHT).

I just went and looked at my doc's website, and he has a page about symptoms of low progesterone in men that is interesting, although I have no idea how he treats (and I just saw him in August or I would ask and post):

http://www.hertoghe.eu/patients/pdf/...Deficiency.pdf

Maybe this is something men should be watching as they get older, particularly if they are on TRT and may have higher levels of DHT.

My original doctor always ordered progesterone to be tested. Wasn't sure why - but I'm beginning to understand now. I still see that doctor from time to time but I have a urologist I see regularly who has no problems ordering whatever tests I want. I always request that Progesterone be included. Looking back at these labs, I see that it has always been on the high side as has been DHT. But until now, I was asymptomatic. I told my wife the other day that I had probably reached that "tipping point" and everything just went to shit. Luckily, with sex there is no problem at all.

So according to what you are saying, there is a connection here between low progesterone and high DHT? Hmmm. But my progesterone has always been in the high ranges. Curious.

I have been prescribed finasteride. I asked the doctor if dutasteride was superior to Finasteride. He been explained to me that finasteride is superior because it acts on both the enzymes that produce DHT - and dutasteride only acts on one. I haven't begun taking it because I don't know much about it or the long term negative side effects. I'd welcome feedback on this. I want to get some relief and if this helps without risk, I'm on it!

Apologies for late responses to posts. For some reason, I am not getting email notifications of the threads I'm participating in. I hope the site administrator gets on the ball about this.

[Ashop]

I would try some CIALIS and there has been some research showing cruciferous veggies like broccoli can help.

[2Sox]

I would try some CIALIS and there has been some research showing cruciferous veggies like broccoli can help.

Love both! Cialis twice daily.

And BigDil, Thanks for your good wishes.

[2Sox]

Finasteride and sexual side effects

Here is a very comprehensive write up on Finasteride. Fairly recent and seems to cover all the bases.

[Mr.BB]

Bumping this as is a subject of interest for me

[2Sox]

Bumping this as is a subject of interest for me

I've been learning that prostatitis is a condition that medical professionals are having great difficulty understanding and treating - admittedly so.

This seems to be my issue, along with BPH.

BTW, STILL not getting email alerts to the threads I'm participating in.

[2Sox]

Permit me some philosophic thinking here. It may be very obvious but I think it needs to be said. IMO, a great deal of what we do - meaning those or us who put stuff into our bodies to look better and be stronger than others, boils down to this: TREMENDOUS self love and the drive to be superior to others - pure and simple. I don't want to sum people up and I'm not saying this is the whole story - but I am saying this is a VERY large part of it.

Whatever happened to, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."? I think a great deal of the pain we find ourselves having is of our own doing. How many people put as much effort into living an ethical life as they do working to look good physically? Vanity can be poisonous. I accuse myself of this. And I hope to God I learn from it.

A common theme on all the men's forums is "More is not necessarily better". How many of us REALLY listen? I paid attention but I didn't really think it applied to me and I believe I got paid back for it - big time. I'm not a competitor or body builder - but I've been in shape all my life. I could have used GHRPs just once a day for anti aging, as is suggested. And it worked great for me for injury recovery - and prevention. But I thought maybe two or three times a day would be better. After all, I work out with a bunch of youngsters. But I really did NOT need it - especially at my age; I'm in my sixties. GHRPs increase GH. Along with T, GH enlarges the prostate. Some connection to my condition? Too much to be coincidence.

This is completely unscientific but here's the upshot: I've got early stage bladder cancer (which is being addressed) and prostatitis - big time. I don't smoke. I don't drink. WTF! You better f#$&*@g believe I'm rethinking a whole lot of things....

[Mr.BB]

Is it non bacterial prostatitis?

[2Sox]

Is it non bacterial prostatitis?

Non-bacterial

[2Sox]

Again reading through your post i swear i could be writing theme . 2 SOX i have been dealing with exactly the same shit as you. I even goes as far as ejaculate blood at times. When my sex life gets out of control. I have a younger wife. Lucky me. Honestly 2sox i have tried everything out there for help.. By the way i have had this for about 5 years now..The only thing i can say it got worse when i when on TRT I know no one want to hear that. prostatitis is a bitch .I have done all the drugs no help.. The only drugs i have not done are finasteride.. Was not willing to take a chance on that stuff

I definitely feel ya on this. I stopped Finasteride for now. On my las BW, my DHT came back on the low side of the range. Don't want to do away with my libido altogether!

Going in for a second surgery on the 23rd. They are scraping away the rest of the tumor in the bladder and doing TURP at the same time. Then I come back for a course of immunotherapy for a few weeks. Not looking forward to it. Meanwhile I feel like I'm walking around with a tennis sized ball with spikes between my legs. The freaking pain sometimes is unbearable. Living on 2 ibuprofen+2 tylenol every four hours. Don't want to get into opiods. And take Xanax to get a little sleep between the bladder spasms. If you haven't been there, it's hard to relate.

Meanwhile, I have a responsibility to myself to realize that this is transient and is only a very small PART of my life. Even though there is pain, there is a whole world full of beauty and pleasure to experience. After all, we couldn't truly appreciate one, if the other didn't exist.

[kelkel]

Meanwhile, I have a responsibility to myself to realize that this is transient and is only a very small PART of my life. Even though there is pain, there is a whole world full of beauty and pleasure to experience. After all, we couldn't truly appreciate one, if the other didn't exist.

Nicely said. Hang in there 2Sox.

[bullshark99]

Copy that^^^^

[johnhenry]

Sox, have a look at Recent Posts - I think it will inspire you. JH.

[2Sox]

Thanks, guys. I'm doing my best.

Just couldn't bear the pain anymore so I started on Vicodin-ES every four hours. What a difference! It's hard not to concentrate on oneself when there is intense pain like this that doesn't let up. But I think this experience has given me some insight into what our wounded warriors have gone through. Bless them all.

To avoid the constipation side effect (which wreaks havoc pressing against my prostate down there and makes it even harder to pee) , I'm on a juice and protein drink fast, until my surgery on Monday. Seems to be working. Losing some body fat too.

JohnHenry,
Thanks for the read. I'll give it a look in the morning.

[kelkel]

What's the time line for recovery from this surgery?

[2Sox]

What's the time line for recovery from this surgery?

Well, after the first surgery, that next day I walked my dog 1.5 miles and that night I was eating sushi with my wife. I couldn't believe it myself! I was definitely weak from the whole ordeal but I was very happy that I was doing normal things. I was back in the gym on the fifth day.

But this time, things are very different. The prostatitis is at pain level 10+ and the bladder spasms are very bad too - if I don't take pain meds. But I was told that when the catheter comes out the next morning, the relief is so great, I could likely leave the hospital as soon as I can "pee by myself". From everything I've researched, the results are very dramatic and I don't see why I couldn't be back working out within a week. I'm very aware that I need to listen very closely to my body before I can what I did before. To sum it up, I think it would be at least a month until I'm back to my regular self. But there are really no serious restrictions on what I can do - except dead lifts. Which at my age, I never do anyway!!

[kelkel]

Well, the condition that you keep yourself in will play a large part in a rapid return to normal. Not sure "you" and normal" belong in the same sentence but I went with it anyway.....

[2Sox]

well, the condition that you keep yourself in will play a large part in a rapid return to normal. Not sure "you" and normal" belong in the same sentence but i went with it anyway.....

love it! Lol!

[BG]

Good luck !

[Richard Head]

Good luck and a speedy recovery

[2Sox]

Good luck and a speedy recovery

Thanks guys.

[reporich]

Does Saw Palmetto help this type of thing?

[thisAngelBites]

Sending good thoughts & wishes for the 23rd, 2Sox.

[2Sox]

Sending good thoughts & wishes for the 23rd, 2Sox.

Thank you for your good wishes. This is part of the pleasure and beauty the world contains, along with the pain that meets us from time to time.

[Flynman]

My Father had the TURP procedure done last year for the same issues you are having and he said it was the best thing he ever did. He said he should have done it sooner. He did not have any problems post surgery.

[2Sox]

My Father had the TURP procedure done last year for the same issues you are having and he said it was the best thing he ever did. He said he should have done it sooner. He did not have any problems post surgery.

This is very encouraging. And I could use all the encouragement I can get. Thanks.

[Richard Head]

2Sox,
How's it going? Hope your doing better.