TRT Blood Work - Thinking of running on my own

[Flooopie]

I'm a 43yo male, and I've been on TRT for about 6 months. Started with 125 and now at 250 once per week. When I first started, they were also injecting HCG . I got my 8 week blood work back, and my Total Test was a little over 900 (range 250-1100). I felt fantastic - the best I've felt in years. After that, they stopped injecting HCG with everyone because they determined it 'wasn't necessary', and my next blood work showed Total Test at 600. They gradually increased the dosage to 250, and here are my most current test results:


TSH 1.85 (0.40-4.50 mIU/L KS)
HEMATOCRIT 45.4 (38.5-50.0 % KS)
ESTRADIOL 31 (< OR = 39 pg/mL)
PSA, TOTAL 0.7 (< OR = 4.0 ng/mL)


TESTOSTERONE , TOTAL, LC/MS/MS 672 (250-1100 ng/dL)
TESTOSTERONE, FREE 108.9 (46.0-224.0 pg/mL)
TESTOSTERONE, BIOAVAILABLE 228.8 (110.0-575.0 ng/dL)
SEX HORMONE BINDING GLOBULIN 28 (10-50 nmol/L)
ALBUMIN, SERUM 4.6 (3.6-5.1 g/dL)


My issue is that I don't feel near what I did when they were injecting HCG along with Test - and my numbers dropped significantly when they removed HCG. 250 is the max they'll inject, so I'm considering leaving the doc-prescribed program and running it on my own. At least I know if I run it on my own, I can increase my Test dosage to reach better levels. As a baseline, before TRT, my Total Test was 230 (250-1100) and Free was 29 (46-224). So if I stop TRT, life was suck again. I'm in St Louis, so options are limited when looking for TRT doctors.

Does anyone else run TRT without HCG? Should my numbers have dropped this much when HCG was stopped?

[kelkel]

How you doing Floopie and welcome to the forum. Sorry I missed this post yesterday.

First, that's one really large amount of testosterone . Normally high end TRT is about 200 mgs per week. 250 is really up there.
When was the above blood work pulled relative to your last injection?

HCG can be easily and cheaply purchased via on-line pharmacies. Stick around and contribute and once you attain 50 posts your pm ability will be turned on and you can send and receive messages from other members who will give you direction. For your doctors to determine HCG is not necessary shows a level of ignorance, imho. Simply look at a package insert from one of the major manufacturers and it will say for "Hypogonadic Hypogonadism." But I guess the practice you go to didn't have the time....

Regarding your last question, yes, many go without HCG and do just fine. For some it's by choice, for others I guess ignorance is bliss, who knows. I'm personally a believer in it and have always run it, even though I really don't feel a difference.

[DanMan250]

Firstly, as Kel wrote, 250mg/week of test is a really large dose. I take a total of just 80mg/week along with 250iu HCG twice a week and this puts me toward the top of the ref range.
I also agree that your doctors are totally ignorant, which is not at all uncommon!
My doctor is also ignorant, but he supplies me with what I need, so I do my own protocol. Really he is nothing more than a drug dealer with a medical licence, like so many docs.
I think the reason you felt so good with HCG is because you have secondary hypogonadism. Your balls work fine, but your pituitary isn't releasing enough LH to stimulate the leydig cells in your balls. Do you have your LH levels before you started TRT? If your LH was low, a knowledgeable doc would have started you off on clomid to see how you respond and then maybe HCG mono and if neither of those methods made you feel better, testosterone with HCG. Never testosterone only! All that would do is shut down your balls, which already work fine!
What dose of HCG were you taking?
I think you would feel even better than you did at the beginning if you injected HCG 2 or more times a week rather than all at once.
Keep reading the posts on this forum as well as other forums and educate yourself. It won't be too long before you know more about TRT than most docs.

[sweatymoo]

I to am from STL. I'm gonna follow this one

[Simon1972]

agreed with both responses- go bi weekly- and by that i mean inject 2x a week not fellatio with both sexes.
250 seems too much- cut down to 150 a week (75mg tuesPM and satAM) see if you feel better on less, if not you can always go back up but id be going down and working back up and rework out your sweetspot- i suspect you are overdoing it and might be feeling the ill effects over overdosing.

i feel you need to reset- and work it all out- keep a diary and record you energy levels.

im at 800 on your scale at that dose of 75mgx2/week

[Flooopie]

Thanks for the responses, and I also agree that 250 is too much. Takes me back to when I cycled. I’m confused why I’m at 672 when I’m running 250 per week.

It was definitely a noticeable change when they stopped with HCG and my numbers dropped, but I wasn’t sure if that was my body readjusting or if it was something else. I’ve never taken HCG before, so I wasn’t sure.

kelkel, the above results were pulled 7 days after my last injection. I go to a local testosterone treatment office (sweatymoo probably knows the one). They pin once a week. I’ll get blood work done again next Wed, so I’ll be able to post updated results in a couple of weeks.

DanMan250, I don’t have my initial LH levels with me, but I’ll get that Wed from the doc and post them.

Simon1972, the doc only injects once per week, so I wouldn’t be able to split it up – although I do agree with you that I should pin twice weekly, and that 250 is too high.

Thanks again for the responses!

[kelkel]

Floopie some people simply metabolize much quicker than others. Extreme cases would be called hyper-metabolizers.
Why won't they let you self-inject? Tell me they're not making you pay them once per week for the injection?

[Flooopie]

No - it's a monthly fee that covers injections, blood tests, etc. But it's not cheap, especially if all I'm getting is Test and blood work every 3 month. I believe they do offer home treatment options, at which point, I could control that more. But I haven't approached that with them yet because I'm still trying to dial everything in.

[sweatymoo]

No - it's a monthly fee that covers injections, blood tests, etc. But it's not cheap, especially if all I'm getting is Test and blood work every 3 month. I believe they do offer home treatment options, at which point, I could control that more. But I haven't approached that with them yet because I'm still trying to dial everything in.

I use a local doc am I able to give referenced on this thread? He's been very knowledgeable and I pin at home

[Flooopie]

I had my appointment today and asked about HCG . Apparently, they do provide HCG shots if the patient wants them. Not sure why they didn't make that known months ago! Anyway, I got my weekly test dose (still 250) and my HCG shot. Here's what I'm taking every week.

Test - 250
Anastrozole - 1mg
HCG - 500mg


DanMan250 - my initial LH result was .2 (1.8 - 8.6)

My bloodwork is actually next week, so I can provide an update on my levels in two weeks. Not sure if HCG will make much of a difference, but I'm hoping it will, and that I can lower my weekly Test dose.

[kelkel]

HCG can / will make an impact on both T & E but not so sure you'll see much of a difference in two weeks.
LH at .2. Did your doctor send you for an MRI to check for pathologies?

[Flooopie]

No, they didn't. After reviewing my labs, they said everything looked normal except for low testosterone . That's when I started TRT.

I had them show me the LH number because I thought I misheard.

[DanMan250]

I had my appointment today and asked about HCG . Apparently, they do provide HCG shots if the patient wants them. Not sure why they didn't make that known months ago! Anyway, I got my weekly test dose (still 250) and my HCG shot. Here's what I'm taking every week.

Test - 250
Anastrozole - 1mg
HCG - 500mg


DanMan250 - my initial LH result was .2 (1.8 - 8.6)

My bloodwork is actually next week, so I can provide an update on my levels in two weeks. Not sure if HCG will make much of a difference, but I'm hoping it will, and that I can lower my weekly Test dose.

Didn't I say that I thought your LH would be low! That's why you felt so good on HCG! If 0.2 was indeed your pre TRT level, it is EXTREMELY low and your doc is an absolute dickhead for not sending you for an MRI!
The protocol you are doing now is what I'd describe as total horse manure!
Can't you find another doc who will allow you to inject testosterone and HCG yourself?

[Xphanial]

Didn't I say that I thought your LH would be low! That's why you felt so good on HCG! If 0.2 was indeed your pre TRT level, it is EXTREMELY low and your doc is an absolute dickhead for not sending you for an MRI! The protocol you are doing now is what I'd describe as total horse manure! Can't you find another doc who will allow you to inject testosterone and HCG yourself?

Jesus !
0.2 is nothing, no wonder you felt shit.

[Flooopie]

I honestly haven't looked beyond the treatment facility I'm using now. It's a low testosterone treatment facility, not my doc. I've talked to my doc in the past about low Test, but he has no idea.

At this point, I think it's wise to find a doc who knows what they are doing. Not sure where to start, but I'll give it a go.

[kelkel]

your doc is an absolute dickhead for not sending you for an MRI!

That about sums it up.

[Flooopie]

Quick question. Even though I've been running TRT for several months, that isn't going to affect MRI results, will it? I'm assuming the MRI is to test pituitary functions?

[kelkel]

It won't effect it. The MRI is basically to look for abnormalities and help determine the cause of your low LH.

[criscofats]

I use a local doc am I able to give referenced on this thread? He's been very knowledgeable and I pin at home

I'm interested in this as I'm in St Louis as well, don't want to break any rules, though.

[kelkel]

I use a local doc am I able to give referenced on this thread? He's been very knowledgeable and I pin at home

Yes, you can mention a doctors name and city. It's not a "source" for black market AAS. We speak of Crisler, Shippen and many other quite often here.

[sweatymoo]

Yes, you can mention a doctors name and city. It's not a "source" for black market AAS. We speak of Crisler, Shippen and many other quite often here.

Awesome... I use Doctor Richard Stills from accent urology in DesPeres... he seems very knowledgeable on hrt. Hope this helps, my STL brothers

[sweatymoo]

Awesome... I use Doctor Richard Stills from accent urology in DesPeres... he seems very knowledgeable on hrt. Hope this helps, my STL brothers

We're you able to check it out

[Flooopie]

We're you able to check it out

I did, going to try and get in before the end of the year if possible. Thanks for the recommendation! And it's actually closer than Chesterfield to me.

[sweatymoo]

I did, going to try and get in before the end of the year if possible. Thanks for the recommendation! And it's actually closer than Chesterfield to me.

That's fantastic news man... I hope everything works out. Happy holidays