Diagnosed with borderline T levels, Doc prescribed T gel. Can i use it to gain mass?

[paul01090]

Hi, My T levels were 313.4 ng/dl and I had a bit ED for which the doc prescribed me T gel which contains 10mg Test. It is supposed to be applied externally on arms. I used it for the prescribed time period and had my problem solved. Now my query is, will it be harmful if i intermittently use it on the work out days. Earlier i had plateaued twice and i used just two packets for two days post workout and thereafter continued to get gains. I checked my T levels again and its always around the same 310 mark, what do you think would be the side effects if i use the gel once or twice in a week just on the workout days, i am aware that low quantity wouldn't give me huge gains but my aim is not to become extremely huge but just to gain few pounds of lean mass?

Can you also help me with the safest dosage of Test i could use and the mode of using it? I wish to get into very low levels of Test because i am a very hard gainer, i dont gain much despite of good exercise and nutrition along with the best supplements and ive been training for about 1.6 years

Edit: Im 32 yrs, 64 kg with 21% body fat.

Thanks in Advance.

[redz]

This sounds like a bad idea, I wouldn't advise that. Can you give us age and stats?

[paul01090]

Thanks for the first reply redz, Im 32 yrs, 64 kg with 21% body fat. Is there anything else i need to add?

[redz]

The problem is running the test cream is suppressive to your natural testosterone so a temporary boost followed by suppression. You really need to figure out why your test is so low. Some people have luck with clomid but really you should be dealing with a speacialist im pretty sure you could get trt with the right doctor. I would be seeking to fix the test level before going to that extreme.

[kelkel]

The problem is running the test cream is suppressive to your natural testosterone so a temporary boost followed by suppression. You really need to figure out why your test is so low. Some people have luck with clomid but really you should be dealing with a speacialist im pretty sure you could get trt with the right doctor. I would be seeking to fix the test level before going to that extreme.

What Redz said. Question is why were you in the low 300's? Doesn't appear your doc even looked for a reason unless you left that out. Something is suppressing you and you should investigate what it is. Only full BW will help. If you have a copy of your original BW please post it up.

Terrible idea to intermittently use any form of testosterone . It doesn't add to your endogenous T levels, it shuts them down and replaces them. You'd be on a hormonal roller coaster. Figure out why you're low and fix it if possible. Many things can cause low T. Seldom is it idiopathic at your age.

[paul01090]

Hey Redz and Kelkel... I am not just thankful but grateful for your help i wouldn't have received this suggestion from anywhere else and i would have probably continued with my wrong logic that little external T application wouldn't be serious. The problem with doctors is that 300 levels according to them is medically normal (300 to 1050 being the normal) and it isn't fatal despite of being on the lower limit. Doctors try to help you only when you are in trouble and not when you are already normal according to their books, when i asked the doc about the problem he said that his job is to make me a normal man and not a superman, that might been true because altering the endocrinology could be fatal. One probable reason for my low test is that I am a bit depressed, for which i am working on. My problem is that everything else is normal but in the lower limit like my calcium and b complex levels are normal but on the lower level. BASICALLY i didnt bother about the lower levels because i am a small guy. I am 5feet5 and weighed 57 kg a year back, my small stature is one reason for my depression. I was 45kgs when I was completing my undergraduation 10 years back and was bullied a lot because of my small stature after which i started to hate myself. I became 52 kgs a year after i graduated. My journey from 52 kgs to 60 and then a long plateau and then 60 to 64 had been a herculean task and took around 8 years to accomplish, as I said i am hard gainer. Its extremely easy for me to shed weight, like i can shed a pound each day easily.

I just want to gain few pounds of muscle mass so that i could be more confident so people dont take me for granted and I could have few friends.

I would request you to tell me if I could successfully boost them naturally, ive recently started natural test booster like Ashwagandha shilajeet gokhura and fenugreek all of which are abundant in my side of the world, im planing to add zma too.
Secondly, how long does the suppression last and how much would my levels be suppressed. Isnt there a safest way to boost my testosterone levels medically, i dont mind taking a minor risk?
Thirdly what is the normal levels of T that a normal guy who gains naturally should possess, i know 300 to 1050 is normal, but i want to know the T levels of a normal healthy guy and upto what levels i could boost my T before it gets unhealthy.

Thank you guys again. Keep up the good work.

[redz]

You may want to research Clomid aka clomiphene citrate which can be used to increase test levels but reallly I think you need a new doctor to help you with this.

[kelkel]

Interesting story Paul. When it comes to being "in range" albeit lower on the scale. Remember, the range is made up of men off all ages, not just guys your age. Your doc should be searching for the cause of your low levels via better blood work. Try the first list of BW in the Finding A Doc sticky at the top of this forum. You can't fix things if you don't know what's broken! You need to know if the issue is primary related, secondary or possibly caused by other underlying issues such as thyroid or prolactin and so on.

When it comes to the interelationship of depression to testosterone it sort of like "what came first, the chicken or the egg" analogy. Testosterone therapy has been shown to remediate syptoms of depression and vice versa to an extent as well. Read this:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24047633

When it comes to test boosting supplements be very wary as some can actually inhibit endogenous production, which is the last thing you need right now. Research your supps at www.examine.com. Best unbiased supplement site out there. About the only supplement that will help improve test levels would be Vit D3 by virtue of increasing your free testosterone level. You need to know your current D3 (25 OHD) level first via blood work before you start supplementing it. It's fat soluble so it should be taken with a large meal. Shoot for the upper third of the range but don't go over as being to high to long can actually be toxic.

Regarding gaining weight, simply put it's harder than most people think. Visit the Nutrition Forum and post up your goals there. Those guys can help put you on the correct path to achieve your goals. It takes a lot of discipline to continually eat enough to gain quality weight.

If T levels can't be improved by analyzing BW and taking corrective action to remediate what's suppressing you then be proactive with your doctor and push for testosterone supplementation. If he's non-compliant find another doctor who will treat you based on your symptoms, not as a number on a chart. In the meantime keep reading here and self-educating on the various forms of T therapy available and what would fit your lifestyle best.

Be well!

[paul01090]

Thanks a ton redz, Ive seen women taking clomid is it the same that they u se for ovulation or the formula and trade name is different for men. Could you suggest me the dosage and period i could take that for. Clomid seems to be a good try, thanks again.

[paul01090]

Thanks for the investing time in giving me a detailed answer. I would certainly check for a new doc, my current D3 is 8.26 ng/ml and my b12 is 394 pg/ml. Now i dont know which test was done for D3. So now ill be searching for a doc, starting my D3 supplement, and good nutrition. ill post once i see the doctor and get further tests done.

[kelkel]

Full BW is step one paul. Don't take anything (meaning testosterone or clomid) until then. Doing things correctly is worth the investment of your time. I'd hate to implement testosterone therapy when it wasn't necessary. If you end up needing it then so be it, but at least you'll go into it with a clear conscience.

[redz]

I agree you want to get this sorted out properly the clomid may be an avenue but you need to get this figured out with a doctor after the appropriate blood work.

[geezuschrist]

Don't mess with the creams or gels they're a waste of time and money