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Thread: TRT for a little over 6 months...

  1. #1
    Chrisp83TRT's Avatar
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    TRT for a little over 6 months...

    Hey everyone ! Iíll keep it pretty short and simple hah. Iím 34 years old and found out a while ago I had ďlow normalĒ testosterone and to not be worried or conceded but with tons of reading and research, itís common for a doctor to tell someone this while it been something that effects many guys my age and even younger. Fortunately I read An article about a guys journey on TRT and it changed my life from there. So now Iím with a low t doctor and everything seems to be going pretty smooth. Basically where I stand with my dosaging is
    Test Cypionate 70-75mg twice a week ( every 3.5 days ) sat morning and Tuesday night
    Hcg 500ui twice a week ( every time I inject test )
    AI - 0.125 twice a week ( every time with hcg and test injection )
    I guess my main question is when would be the best time and day to get bloods taken for my doctor and me to see reasonable numbers to work with?

    On a side note... my test from the low t doctor is costing me a ton so I went and did tons of research and ordered some GP cyp 250 . I wonít say where I got it from since I know that is against rules here which is completely understandable. My next question is I am thinking about doing my first cycle and not pushing it anymore then just upping my test. What is everyoneís advice or suggestions as far as protocol
    How much test a week
    How much AI I will need
    How much hcg should I be taking
    How long should I do the cycle
    How would I go about PCT back into TRT ...

    Once again Thank you all for any advice/suggestions and experiences. I know everyone here is very helpful.
    Have a good one everyone !!

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    GearHeaded is offline BANNED
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    HCG and AI are probably not really needed and over kill for only 150mg of test per week.. for someone thats doing a cycle and then going back to natural production of test, HCG is super beneficial. but thats not you brother. your on TRT, your never going to produce natty test ever again. thus hcg is not needed on a weekly basis for the rest of your life.
    personally , me being on TRT (well if you call running gram of gear year round as TRT) I just blast HCG 2x per year, not to help with natty recovery, but just to get the additional testicular benefits out of it. but its really unnecessary to be on it year round.

    and also, you shouldn't be taking an AI just for the hell of it, see where 150mg a week of test puts you and then get blood work to determine if you need an AI or not. I surely wouldn't need an AI on that low a dose of test, and I wouldn't want to take cancer drugs just for the heck of it.


    regarding a cycle. sure you could just bump up your dosage of Test for awhile and that could be your cycle.. no pct needed, you simply go back to your 150mg dose when your done. however, I think you'd be better off leaving your TRT dose where its at and not bumping your Test up for a cycle and instead run another more anabolic yet cleaner and side effect free drug then Test. just keep your test at 150mg and for your cycle add in say 600mg of EQ, or 600mg of Mast or Primo. run that for 12 weeks with your TRT dose of test, then when done just stay on your TRT. and if you use a clean drug like Primo or Mast, you won't need to take an AI either, as they don't convert to estrogen, just the opposite they actually blunt estrogen.

    what are your goals for wanting to run a cycle ? what are your stats and training history ?

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    Youthful55guy is offline Knowledgeable Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisp83TRT View Post
    Hey everyone ! I’ll keep it pretty short and simple hah. I’m 34 years old and found out a while ago I had “low normal” testosterone and to not be worried or conceded but with tons of reading and research, it’s common for a doctor to tell someone this while it been something that effects many guys my age and even younger. Fortunately I read An article about a guys journey on TRT and it changed my life from there. So now I’m with a low t doctor and everything seems to be going pretty smooth. Basically where I stand with my dosaging is
    Test Cypionate 70-75mg twice a week ( every 3.5 days ) sat morning and Tuesday night
    Hcg 500ui twice a week ( every time I inject test )
    AI - 0.125 twice a week ( every time with hcg and test injection )
    I guess my main question is when would be the best time and day to get bloods taken for my doctor and me to see reasonable numbers to work with?

    On a side note... my test from the low t doctor is costing me a ton so I went and did tons of research and ordered some GP cyp 250 . I won’t say where I got it from since I know that is against rules here which is completely understandable. My next question is I am thinking about doing my first cycle and not pushing it anymore then just upping my test. What is everyone’s advice or suggestions as far as protocol
    How much test a week
    How much AI I will need
    How much hcg should I be taking
    How long should I do the cycle
    How would I go about PCT back into TRT ...

    Once again Thank you all for any advice/suggestions and experiences. I know everyone here is very helpful.
    Have a good one everyone !!
    You should always test just prior to the next scheduled injection. Since the interval is equal between injections on your protocol, it does not matter which injection you choose. You might want to consider an every 3 day protocol, it makes timing a lot easier (in my opinion) since you do not have to deal with the AM/PM scheduling of injections. Just E3D at the same time (I do first thing in the AM). I would conduct your first set of labs after 6 weeks to allow you hormones to come to a new equilibrium. It simply takes that long, so don't rush it.

    Your T dose is on the high but reasonable side. You're first set of labs should probably come back on the high side for T. I generally don't recommend starting so high, as it is difficult to cut back if you have side-effect issues. Most likely you will always be battling high hemoglobin and high DHT at that dose. Since you are using low dose anastrozole (AI), your E should probably be OK and you can easily adjust that dose.

    I'd also push your doc to write a script for T rather than obtaining it through him/her. However, many of the low T docs will not do this, as they make their money off of selling you overpriced meds, which I believe is unethical. Prescription T-cyp is dirt cheep in the USA, even without insurance (I pay $154 per year). You might want to consider starting a search for a hormone friendly primary care doc to take over your program. Yes, you can obtain it relatively inexpensively on the black market, but I'd always be concerned about quality of the product and the fact that it's illegal to import and possess.

    Your HCG dose is a bit high compared to what most people do, but it's about the same as mine. I like the higher dose because I like the idea of having fully functional testicles and mine are small to begin with, so the thought of them getting even smaller is not very appealing. Also, I'm not price sensitive, so I can easily afford the higher dose of this costly med.

    I'm curious how you dose such a small amount of anastrozole (AI). I can't see cutting that small 1mg tablet into 1/8 pieces. Is this a compounded med? Or are you using the eye dropper (vodka) method. The latter is what I do to administer 0.25mg per week in small daily doses. Works great and is very inexpensive.

    As far as your cycling question. My basic advice is not to do it. The whole idea behind TRT is to strive for consistency and cycling for hormone augmentation is contrary to this. I don't provide advice on this simply because I have no experience to draw from. I'm not judgmental about it, I just don't advise it.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    HCG and AI are probably not really needed and over kill for only 150mg of test per week.. for someone thats doing a cycle and then going back to natural production of test, HCG is super beneficial. but thats not you brother. your on TRT, your never going to produce natty test ever again. thus hcg is not needed on a weekly basis for the rest of your life.
    personally , me being on TRT (well if you call running gram of gear year round as TRT) I just blast HCG 2x per year, not to help with natty recovery, but just to get the additional testicular benefits out of it. but its really unnecessary to be on it year round.

    and also, you shouldn't be taking an AI just for the hell of it, see where 150mg a week of test puts you and then get blood work to determine if you need an AI or not. I surely wouldn't need an AI on that low a dose of test, and I wouldn't want to take cancer drugs just for the heck of it.


    regarding a cycle. sure you could just bump up your dosage of Test for awhile and that could be your cycle.. no pct needed, you simply go back to your 150mg dose when your done. however, I think you'd be better off leaving your TRT dose where its at and not bumping your Test up for a cycle and instead run another more anabolic yet cleaner and side effect free drug then Test. just keep your test at 150mg and for your cycle add in say 600mg of EQ, or 600mg of Mast or Primo. run that for 12 weeks with your TRT dose of test, then when done just stay on your TRT. and if you use a clean drug like Primo or Mast, you won't need to take an AI either, as they don't convert to estrogen, just the opposite they actually blunt estrogen.

    what are your goals for wanting to run a cycle ? what are your stats and training history ?
    Why wouldnt you want your testicles working year round?

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    Quote Originally Posted by hollowedzeus View Post
    Why wouldnt you want your testicles working year round?
    I'm 40 years old (I've got 4 kids), I took my first injection of AAS when I was 17. I've been on gear for the last 10 years straight. TRT for me is a gram of gear. my testicles don't need to work brother .

    why should I be on HCG year round.. add it up over all these years. I'd of spent thousands and thousands of $ on HCG just to keep my testicles "working" , I'd rather spend that money on HGH and Tren

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    Beyond the cosmetic aspects of having normal sized testicles, it's been my observation that if you administer TRT without HCG , your ejaculate volume begins to decline over time. I've read this in a number of posts, so I'm not the only one. I've also noticed that there's a direct correlation to the amount of pre-ejaculate that I produce and the amount of HCG I use. Not all guys, secrete enough pre-ejaculate for it to be noticeable, but I do. There's published histology data the I read somewhere that says that the seminal vesicles (which produce about 50-60% of the volume of the ejaculate) are lined with both androgen (T/DHT) receptors and LH receptors and that both are needed for proper functioning of the gland. I'm assuming that the prostate, which produces about 25-30% of the ejaculate, functions similarly but I've not seen histological confirmation of this. The Cowper's gland only produces a small amount of the ejaculate but the bulk of the pre-ejaculate, so from my observations, I believe it also has LH receptors.

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    Before I respond, I want to say thanks a bunch dude for getting back to me so quickly, really nice of you . I feel you guys on here are better then my low t doctor haha. It does seem like he has my best interestes, but he has me on all this stuff for whatever reason.
    Crazy enough, I went vegan to avoid as much cancer .. didn’t know AI has those agents. Thanks for the heads up.

    You said promo or mast has little to no sides esp in the estrogen area. Does Running EQ has the same sides or does it effect things differently ?

    To be very honest ...more for the of a buff solid big look . ( sorry to sound corny ) definitely want to increase in size while staying as lean as possible. Right now I’m 5’7 and around 156 pounds . I believe I’m around 15% BF . My training right now is 5 days a week with some cardio .
    Monday - back and chest
    Tuesday - arms
    Weds - legs ( hams and quads )
    Thursday - back and chest
    Friday - arms
    All to a 5-15 rep range . I’m no expect or pro and never would consider myself. I’m always willing to learn.
    If anything I’m saying sounds. Out of wack or silly ... feel free to let me have it lol

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    Before I respond, I want to say thanks a bunch dude for getting back to me so quickly, really nice of you . I feel you guys on here are better then my low t doctor haha. It does seem like he has my best interestes, but he has me on all this stuff for whatever reason.
    Crazy enough, I went vegan to avoid as much cancer .. didnít know AI has those agents. Thanks for the heads up.

    You said promo or mast has little to no sides esp in the estrogen area. Does Running EQ has the same sides or does it effect things differently ?

    To be very honest ...more for the of a buff solid big look . ( sorry to sound corny ) definitely want to increase in size while staying as lean as possible. Right now Iím 5í7 and around 156 pounds . I believe Iím around 15% BF . My training right now is 5 days a week with some cardio .
    Monday - back and chest
    Tuesday - arms
    Weds - legs ( hams and quads )
    Thursday - back and chest
    Friday - arms
    All to a 5-15 rep range . Iím no expect or pro and never would consider myself. Iím always willing to learn.
    If anything Iím saying sounds. Out of wack or silly ... feel free to let me have it lol

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    Thanks for the reply man, I appreciate it a bunch. In a nutshell , my low t doc is charging me 120 for basically a 3 month supply of teat ( hence the ordering from int. ) I would totally do domestic if I could find a doctor that is awesome here but it’s so hard to find one that doesn’t want to rob me . I also have small testes so I can completely relate with you.
    He prescribed the AI in a pill form and suggests I take that does twice a week with my test and hcg . My last bloods , it showed that my estradiol sensitive was on the low side, so I think that’s why he has me on this dose. And for the cycle answer . I respect your opinion and I understand what you mean

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    GearHeaded is offline BANNED
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    just to clarify, by saying 'cancer drug' I was not implying that an AI was a cancer causing drug, but that it was a drug developed to treat breast cancer.

    Primo and Mast do not aromatize, i.e., convert to estrogen in the body like testosterone does. They also don't convert to DHT. They also don't cause water retention. Also mast blunts both prolactin receptors and estrogen receptors in the body (helping block both gyno and impotence for example).. so not only are they fairly side effect free, they actually help prevent side effects

    as for EQ. best way to think of that is essential a 'clean' version of Testoerone. its basically test without the ability to convert to DHT and far less ability to convert to estrogen.

    having said that, don't think as estrogen as a bad thing. its beneficial especially if growth is your number goal, as estgeon helps build muscle, increase IGF, blood flow, satttelite cell proliferation , etc.. we just don't want too much estrogen where we can get sides like gyno.


    if you had low T to being with, then getting your TRT dialed in by itself will definitely help you put on some muscle. I'd advise to take things slow and see how things progress

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    seems odd he is selling you an AI, if your Estrogen was low on your blood test. As testosterone levels rise, estrogen levels are supposed to go up with it. the ratio is important, not suppressing your E levels with drugs just for the heck of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    just to clarify, by saying 'cancer drug' I was not implying that an AI was a cancer causing drug, but that it was a drug developed to treat breast cancer.

    Primo and Mast do not aromatize, i.e., convert to estrogen in the body like testosterone does. They also don't convert to DHT. They also don't cause water retention. Also mast blunts both prolactin receptors and estrogen receptors in the body (helping block both gyno and impotence for example).. so not only are they fairly side effect free, they actually help prevent side effects

    as for EQ. best way to think of that is essential a 'clean' version of Testoerone. its basically test without the ability to convert to DHT and far less ability to convert to estrogen.

    having said that, don't think as estrogen as a bad thing. its beneficial especially if growth is your number goal, as estgeon helps build muscle, increase IGF, blood flow, satttelite cell proliferation , etc.. we just don't want too much estrogen where we can get sides like gyno.


    if you had low T to being with, then getting your TRT dialed in by itself will definitely help you put on some muscle. I'd advise to take things slow and see how things progress
    That definitely answered my question hah . Thanks man. Really appreciate it

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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    just to clarify, by saying 'cancer drug' I was not implying that an AI was a cancer causing drug, but that it was a drug developed to treat breast cancer.

    Primo and Mast do not aromatize, i.e., convert to estrogen in the body like testosterone does. They also don't convert to DHT. They also don't cause water retention. Also mast blunts both prolactin receptors and estrogen receptors in the body (helping block both gyno and impotence for example).. so not only are they fairly side effect free, they actually help prevent side effects

    as for EQ. best way to think of that is essential a 'clean' version of Testoerone. its basically test without the ability to convert to DHT and far less ability to convert to estrogen.

    having said that, don't think as estrogen as a bad thing. its beneficial especially if growth is your number goal, as estgeon helps build muscle, increase IGF, blood flow, satttelite cell proliferation , etc.. we just don't want too much estrogen where we can get sides like gyno.


    if you had low T to being with, then getting your TRT dialed in by itself will definitely help you put on some muscle. I'd advise to take things slow and see how things progress
    If I were to take primo or mast , would I be splitting that dose twice a week or once a week ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisp83TRT View Post
    If I were to take primo or mast , would I be splitting that dose twice a week or once a week ?
    depends on the ester. but if you went with long ester and ran say 600mg . then you'd do like 300mg on Monday and 300mg on Friday. if you went with a short ester then you'd run like 175mg every other day.
    long esters are the best option for the most part though

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    Youthful55guy is offline Knowledgeable Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisp83TRT View Post
    Thanks for the reply man, I appreciate it a bunch. In a nutshell , my low t doc is charging me 120 for basically a 3 month supply of teat ( hence the ordering from int. ) I would totally do domestic if I could find a doctor that is awesome here but it’s so hard to find one that doesn’t want to rob me . I also have small testes so I can completely relate with you.
    He prescribed the AI in a pill form and suggests I take that does twice a week with my test and hcg. My last bloods , it showed that my estradiol sensitive was on the low side, so I think that’s why he has me on this dose. And for the cycle answer . I respect your opinion and I understand what you mean
    You should not be concerned with using anastrozol (the most common AI) because it was developed as a 'cancer' drug. Yes, women with breast cancer do take the drug in rather high dosages compared to men taking it for TRT purposes. The drug is used to lower E levels in women to help slow down growth of these hormone sensitive tumors (not unlike prostate tumors, which are also E sensitive). In this respect, it is in no way related to traditional chemotherapeutic drugs and carry none of the side-effects of those drugs.

    However, you should be concerned if it is driving your E levels below range. Guys need E too for both normal libido and erections. It's one of the ironies of mother nature that guys need a 'female" hormone to get and stay hard, but you do. Many guys are so paranoid of this hormone and drive it into the ground, only to end up with a bad case of ED. Even when you run at the high end of the range, your chances of developing gynecomastia is slim to none unless you combine it with progesterone or a synthetic androgen with progestin-like activity (there are several). Bodybuilders typically blame it on the E, not knowing that when they stack synthetic hormones on top of T, they have a much greater chance of developing gyno than running straight T (without without an AI). My advice is to adjust the AI dose to keep your E mid to upper range 75% of the normal range and let it go too low.
    hollowedzeus and Mr.BB like this.

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    BTW, Gearhead does bring up a good point too about IGF. I completely forgot to mention in my previous post. You need normal E levels to produce GH releasing hormone in the brain. This short lived hormone travels to the pituitary to stimulate the release of GH, which in turn stimulates the liver to secrete IGF-1, which is a very important hormone in muscle, and especially joint recovery.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Youthful55guy View Post
    You should not be concerned with using anastrozol (the most common AI) because it was developed as a 'cancer' drug. Yes, women with breast cancer do take the drug in rather high dosages compared to men taking it for TRT purposes. The drug is used to lower E levels in women to help slow down growth of these hormone sensitive tumors (not unlike prostate tumors, which are also E sensitive). In this respect, it is in no way related to traditional chemotherapeutic drugs and carry none of the side-effects of those drugs.

    However, you should be concerned if it is driving your E levels below range. Guys need E too for both normal libido and erections. It's one of the ironies of mother nature that guys need a 'female" hormone to get and stay hard, but you do. Many guys are so paranoid of this hormone and drive it into the ground, only to end up with a bad case of ED. Even when you run at the high end of the range, your chances of developing gynecomastia is slim to none unless you combine it with progesterone or a synthetic androgen with progestin-like activity (there are several). Bodybuilders typically blame it on the E, not knowing that when they stack synthetic hormones on top of T, they have a much greater chance of developing gyno than running straight T (without without an AI). My advice is to adjust the AI dose to keep your E mid to upper range 75% of the normal range and let it go too low.

    Thanks man . Appreciate it !

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    depends on the ester. but if you went with long ester and ran say 600mg . then you'd do like 300mg on Monday and 300mg on Friday. if you went with a short ester then you'd run like 175mg every other day.
    long esters are the best option for the most part though
    I see primo is quite expensive. I see Tren e ( being he longer ester ) is an alternative and quite cheaper. is it just as effective for long time gains after the cycle ? What are your thoughts man? Sorry to bother you. I’m pretty new to all this stuff

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisp83TRT View Post
    I see primo is quite expensive. I see Tren e ( being he longer ester ) is an alternative and quite cheaper. is it just as effective for long time gains after the cycle ? What are your thoughts man? Sorry to bother you. I’m pretty new to all this stuff
    Tren is one of the harshest compounds bodybuilders run. your health markers and blood work will go to shit in a few weeks. don't mess with Tren unless your experienced with AAS use and are a hardcore gym rat or bodybuilder, imo.

    Primo is expensive because its the cleanest and most side effect free drug there is. Other options that are similar but more affordable are going to be Masteron and EQ. as for Orals , VAR and Tbol. all very effective with few side effects and lots of potential benefits in place of blasting a high dose of Test.
    the other option is Deca , which is a drug that would probably put the most size on you. Some people don't consider Deca a beginner drug, but if you don't make the mistake of blasting a whole bunch of Test with it then there is very little side effects and its easy to manage

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    Tren is one of the harshest compounds bodybuilders run. your health markers and blood work will go to shit in a few weeks. don't mess with Tren unless your experienced with AAS use and are a hardcore gym rat or bodybuilder, imo.

    Primo is expensive because its the cleanest and most side effect free drug there is. Other options that are similar but more affordable are going to be Masteron and EQ. as for Orals , VAR and Tbol. all very effective with few side effects and lots of potential benefits in place of blasting a high dose of Test.
    the other option is Deca, which is a drug that would probably put the most size on you. Some people don't consider Deca a beginner drug, but if you don't make the mistake of blasting a whole bunch of Test with it then there is very little side effects and its easy to manage
    Thanks for all your advice man. Iím going to order some mast. 200 ( 150 enth and 50 prop ) I wonít jump into it right away but when I do . When should I inject . I do my test shot on Saturday morning and Tuesday night ( 70-75 each time ) and I guess should I avoid my AI since mast and primo basically donít increase? If Iím being a pain in the Anal canal, my apologies haha.

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