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  1. #1
    Mr Bill's Avatar
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    Trt side effects?

    I have been on 10g of Androgel for 3 months and 5g before that for a total of 6 months of TRT. I think I am having side effects now and I would like to know what can cause them. I am starting to get a little bit of acne on my shoulders not bad yet and I would like to keep it that way. What causes the acne and what can you do to clear up the problem? My nipples are bothering me they are sensitive and always hard. I thought it was just irritation from all the Androgel so I have been careful not to get the Androgel on the area but I still have the problem. My estridol was 28 at my last BW in February so that seems to be OK or can it shoot up in a couple of weeks?

  2. #2
    zaggahamma's Avatar
    zaggahamma is offline Mr. Moderation
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    get the estro checked why guess?...mine went up on multiple packs of androgel ...how have u felt the last 6 months otherwise?

  3. #3
    GotNoBlueMilk is offline Knowledgeable Member
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    I am one of those that converts T to E2 easily. To make matters worse, I am very sensitive to E2. If get sore nipples and brain fog when my E2 reaches 30! Like jpkman said, get the E2 checked. The solution is either go back to 5g or get an AI if you are feeling better at 10g.

  4. #4
    sirupate is offline Member
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    Some acne and oiler skin is a fairly common side-effect of any T therapy.

  5. #5
    Mr Bill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jpkman View Post
    get the estro checked why guess?...mine went up on multiple packs of androgel...how have u felt the last 6 months otherwise?

    I was feeling OK at 10g for awhile but lately I feel like I am slipping backwards.
    Does your estro still go up on injections or was that just on the Ardrogel?

  6. #6
    Mr Bill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GotNoBlueMilk View Post
    I am one of those that converts T to E2 easily. To make matters worse, I am very sensitive to E2. If get sore nipples and brain fog when my E2 reaches 30! Like jpkman said, get the E2 checked. The solution is either go back to 5g or get an AI if you are feeling better at 10g.

    I sent an email to the doc to see if I can get tested again. When I was on 5g of Androgel it was just enough to shut down my natural production of T. I am wondering if I would do better on injections?

  7. #7
    GotNoBlueMilk is offline Knowledgeable Member
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    estro goes up regardless of the type of test replacement. If you feel as though you are back slidding, it is probably because of increased estro levels. it's a common issue.

  8. #8
    zaggahamma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Bill View Post
    I was feeling OK at 10g for awhile but lately I feel like I am slipping backwards.
    Does your estro still go up on injections or was that just on the Ardrogel?
    like gotnobluemilk said...it can still go up on any form yes....let us know how he responds to the email

  9. #9
    sirupate is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Bill View Post
    I was feeling OK at 10g for awhile but lately I feel like I am slipping backwards.
    Does your estro still go up on injections or was that just on the Ardrogel?
    I felt great on 10gms. of androgel for several months, then the effect seemed less noticable, like I was slipping backwards. It was the same when I was put on 5gms. gel initially. I am unsure if this initial feeling of almost..euphoria, is a phenomonon of the gel, or all test. therapy. My test. levels also seemed pretty variable when on the gel...that is, we never achieved a consistent level over the months I was using it. Again, I don't know if this is a function of my body or a characteristic of the gel. I think some of the guys here had similar experiences with the gel though.

    The estradiol levels can also be affected by other things such as body fat, liver function and alcohol, but I'd guess exogenous testosterone is the biggest driver.

    Jeff

  10. #10
    Mr Bill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirupate View Post
    I felt great on 10gms. of androgel for several months, then the effect seemed less noticable, like I was slipping backwards. It was the same when I was put on 5gms. gel initially. I am unsure if this initial feeling of almost..euphoria, is a phenomonon of the gel, or all test. therapy. My test. levels also seemed pretty variable when on the gel...that is, we never achieved a consistent level over the months I was using it. Again, I don't know if this is a function of my body or a characteristic of the gel. I think some of the guys here had similar experiences with the gel though.

    The estradiol levels can also be affected by other things such as body fat, liver function and alcohol, but I'd guess exogenous testosterone is the biggest driver.

    Jeff
    I never got to the euphoria feeling part. My highest T count has been 680 total. Have you switched over to injections and if so how has it changed the way you feel coming from the Androgel?

  11. #11
    sirupate is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Bill View Post
    I never got to the euphoria feeling part. My highest T count has been 680 total. Have you switched over to injections and if so how has it changed the way you feel coming from the Androgel?
    I switched over to injecting beginning last week. The dose the doctor wrote is 200mg. test. cyp. every 2 weeks. I had hoped to feel something "extra" a few days after the initial dose, but didn't really notice much. My injection dosage is higher than my highest gel dosage in terms of mg. of testosterone getting into my body. I'll just have to see how this goes. I visit the doctor in about 5 weeks and will probably ask to inject weekly to level out the swings. Depending on my BW, he may adjust the total dosage too.

    The euphoria I mentioned I mainly associate with increased libido, though my gym workouts were better and my mood was somewhat elevated too. Just after the initial dose, and on the elevated dose of gel, I would have chased a tailpipe down the street to try and get my d_ck in it....well...an exageration, but not by much. That feeling faded after several months at each dose.

    Jeff

  12. #12
    tonyinnh is offline Junior Member
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    from what i read on here,, it takes about 3 months before you really start to feel something, or see major changes starting... just sharing what i read.. no expert here..

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    Quote Originally Posted by sirupate View Post
    I switched over to injecting beginning last week. The dose the doctor wrote is 200mg. test. cyp. every 2 weeks. I had hoped to feel something "extra" a few days after the initial dose, but didn't really notice much. My injection dosage is higher than my highest gel dosage in terms of mg. of testosterone getting into my body. I'll just have to see how this goes. I visit the doctor in about 5 weeks and will probably ask to inject weekly to level out the swings. Depending on my BW, he may adjust the total dosage too.

    The euphoria I mentioned I mainly associate with increased libido, though my gym workouts were better and my mood was somewhat elevated too. Just after the initial dose, and on the elevated dose of gel, I would have chased a tailpipe down the street to try and get my d_ck in it....well...an exageration, but not by much. That feeling faded after several months at each dose.

    Jeff
    What were your E2 levels on your last BW and prior to the injection protocol? I only ask as you state a decline in libido over time - a classic symptom of increased E2 if not managed correctly. In my opinion you'd be best served to inject 100 mg ever week instead of 200 mg every two weeks...peaks and valleys... Did your MD recommend any hCG or an AI with this protocol? If not, watch levels closely. Also, keep an eye on your testes as atrophy is common side and if you want kids, want to re-start or don't want your junk to look like a 5 year old you will want to consider hCG.
    Last edited by steroid.com 1; 03-12-2011 at 01:09 AM.

  14. #14
    Mr Bill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jpkman View Post
    like gotnobluemilk said...it can still go up on any form yes....let us know how he responds to the email

    He is sending me for new labs on Monday

  15. #15
    tcat3107 is offline New Member
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    Ok I have a question for everyone. I am on 100 mg of cyp. IM/week and hcg 250 iu every 4 days SQ. Can my TRT affect my wife's hormones?

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    Quote Originally Posted by tcat3107 View Post
    Ok I have a question for everyone. I am on 100 mg of cyp. IM/week and hcg 250 iu every 4 days SQ. Can my TRT affect my wife's hormones?
    Seriously?

    NO.

  17. #17
    Mr Bill's Avatar
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    Still waiting for my lab reports

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by gdevine View Post
    Seriously?

    NO.
    with you chasing her 'round da house prolly her adrenaline

  19. #19
    Mr Bill's Avatar
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    Angry What to do now???

    Well the Doctors office called today and said evereything is OK keep on the same dose of Synthroid and Androgel WTF??

    RBC 5.82 High x10E6/ul 4.10 -5.60

    TSH 2.100 uIU/ml .450 -4.500

    Thyroxine (T4) 8.4 ug/dl 4.5 -12.0

    T3 Uptake 34 24 -34

    Free Thyroxine 2.9 1.2 -4.9

    T (Total) 492 ng/dl 350 - 1030

    Free T 1.7 1.5 - 3.2

    Free T Serum 84 pg/ml 52 - 280

    Estradiol Serum MS 39 pg/ml 8.0 - 35

    I told him when I asked for more labs that I felt like I was sliding backwards, my results show it and he says I'm OK. What to do now? At what point does the RBC number become an issue?

  20. #20
    GotNoBlueMilk is offline Knowledgeable Member
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    Your T levels look like my baseline and I got a script for 100mg/week of Test C. The gel isn't cutting it. Find a new doctor if he isn't helping you. Your E2 @ 39 could be causing you issues. I would really be having issues at 39. I get sore nips at 28 E2.
    Last edited by GotNoBlueMilk; 03-23-2011 at 03:16 PM.

  21. #21
    Mr Bill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GotNoBlueMilk View Post
    Your T levels look like my baseline and I got a script for 100mg/week of Test C. The gel isn't cutting it. Find a new doctor if he isn't helping you. Your E2 @ 39 could be causing you issues. I would really be having issues at 39. I get sore nips at 28 E2.
    I sent over an email asking about the E2 # and if we can do anything to bring it down. It looks like I will have to search for a new doc.

  22. #22
    sirupate is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Bill View Post
    I sent over an email asking about the E2 # and if we can do anything to bring it down. It looks like I will have to search for a new doc.
    It seems that some doctors are content to get you into the normal range of T, rather than alleviate symptoms you might be experiencing. It might be best to find another doctor. I know that my GP is very ill informed about TRT...good thing my endo is at least OK in that regard.

    Your RBC shows high. If that continues, or has been the case for a while, you may want to try to donate blood periodically to bring the RBC down. You'll feel better if you do. TRT can raise RBC.

    Jeff

  23. #23
    GotNoBlueMilk is offline Knowledgeable Member
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    Sirupate: My RBC has not changed, yet (90 days), but I am curious as to what symptom change you experience when you domate blood after your RBC goes high.

  24. #24
    sirupate is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by GotNoBlueMilk View Post
    Sirupate: My RBC has not changed, yet (90 days), but I am curious as to what symptom change you experience when you domate blood after your RBC goes high.
    Guys here have talked about having more energy, better exercise capacity and lower blood pressure when they stay in normal range as compared to being above range. I don't think that everyone who supplements testoterone ends up with a high RBC count, but some do. The high RBC can also be caused by other things too.

    Jeff

  25. #25
    sirupate is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by gdevine View Post
    What were your E2 levels on your last BW and prior to the injection protocol? I only ask as you state a decline in libido over time - a classic symptom of increased E2 if not managed correctly. In my opinion you'd be best served to inject 100 mg ever week instead of 200 mg every two weeks...peaks and valleys... Did your MD recommend any hCG or an AI with this protocol? If not, watch levels closely. Also, keep an eye on your testes as atrophy is common side and if you want kids, want to re-start or don't want your junk to look like a 5 year old you will want to consider hCG.
    Just saw that you were asking me some questions...my doctor has never tested for E2. I need to ask him why. My doctor put me on the E2W dosing to begin with and I intend to ask about more frequent injections when I visit for follow-up in a few weeks. Just felt the need to play along with his wishes first time around when injecting. I do, however, feel the swing in levels about day 8 or 9 and it doesn't feel good.

    We've never discussed hCG or an AI...he hasn't seemed curious about estradiol levels. As to children...I've had my two and no longer care, unless someday I end up with a rich 25 year old who wants kids...lol. But, hCG may also be a good topic at the next visit too.

    Jeff

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    Quote Originally Posted by sirupate View Post
    Just saw that you were asking me some questions...my doctor has never tested for E2. I need to ask him why. My doctor put me on the E2W dosing to begin with and I intend to ask about more frequent injections when I visit for follow-up in a few weeks. Just felt the need to play along with his wishes first time around when injecting. I do, however, feel the swing in levels about day 8 or 9 and it doesn't feel good.

    We've never discussed hCG or an AI...he hasn't seemed curious about estradiol levels. As to children...I've had my two and no longer care, unless someday I end up with a rich 25 year old who wants kids...lol. But, hCG may also be a good topic at the next visit too.

    Jeff
    Remember, once you start with T you go into HPTA shut down. This means the receptors on your leydig cells are not receiving LH from your pituitary gland. As a result, you testes will continue to shrink which leads to very small testes, a very tight sack, pain and no production of Pregnenolone the precursor to many of your other hormones.

    With a E2W protocol you are feeling the roller coaster rider which is not right in my opinion. The reason you're on TRT is to feel good...all the time! Plead to self inject and once a week.

    If you don't monitor E2 and levels increase it will cancel out any T that you are injecting and you'll be right back where you started from.

    Work with your doc, educate him if needed, and get on a protocol that works for you my friend.

    Good luck

  27. #27
    sirupate is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by gdevine View Post
    Remember, once you start with T you go into HPTA shut down. This means the receptors on your leydig cells are not receiving LH from your pituitary gland. As a result, you testes will continue to shrink which leads to very small testes, a very tight sack, pain and no production of Pregnenolone the precursor to many of your other hormones.

    With a E2W protocol you are feeling the roller coaster rider which is not right in my opinion. The reason you're on TRT is to feel good...all the time! Plead to self inject and once a week.

    If you don't monitor E2 and levels increase it will cancel out any T that you are injecting and you'll be right back where you started from.

    Work with your doc, educate him if needed, and get on a protocol that works for you my friend.

    Good luck
    Not a big deal, but I am self-injecting now. Only had two injections on his dosing protocol since the changeover from gel. He wants BW one week after my injection, to get the mid-range level, so am trying to at least follow his instructions for the first follow-up visit. Intend to ask about E10D or EW dosing at that time...in about 3 weeks. The mood change seemed pretty noticable to me at day 8 after injecting. I doubt the doctor will object to more frequent injections if that helps me to feel better. Not sure how he'll feel about hCG as he has been pretty conservative so far. As to E2, I imagine he believes he can infer that estradiol isn't a problem if free level is good relative to total level...but I might just be trying to read his mind on that.

    Jeff

  28. #28
    Mr Bill's Avatar
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    Doc says E2 is not high enough for Ai and he wants me off all T for a couple of weeks and then get new labs for base line T and E2.

    Will your body go back to making T when you just stop????

  29. #29
    zaggahamma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Bill View Post
    Doc says E2 is not high enough for Ai and he wants me off all T for a couple of weeks and then get new labs for base line T and E2.

    Will your body go back to making T when you just stop????
    it will make it to the best of its ability which is sub par and maybe less than before....the reason we're on TRT to begin with

  30. #30
    Mr Bill's Avatar
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    GP sent me to a uroligist and instead of pulling me off therapy he said to use 5g of testim instead of the 10g of androgel . This is the same as cutting the dose in half, right? He also is checking prolactin level. I think I have to find a clinic. Another side effect of TRT is a sore greasy ass from getting my prostate checked every time I go to a new doc ....LOL

  31. #31
    Mr Bill's Avatar
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    Well after 3 weeks on the Testim my nipps are better but my total test came back at 65 and I feel like shat! But I go in for my first shot of Test E in the A.M. Doc said he will let me self inject once we get dialed in. Hope the injections work.

  32. #32
    bengym2013 is offline New Member
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    Help with next step

    I have been on test cyp now for almost three years. I have never been on any anti est. and I have terrible back acne. I was told this is due to my hormone levels not being right or staying consistant. Is this true and if so what do I need to be on or what do I need to check on with my Dr?? I have even been taking accutain for a few months now to get rid of the acne but it has been great for everything but my back and it is still bad!! Help please!!

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by bengym2013 View Post
    I have been on test cyp now for almost three years. I have never been on any anti est. and I have terrible back acne. I was told this is due to my hormone levels not being right or staying consistant. Is this true and if so what do I need to be on or what do I need to check on with my Dr?? I have even been taking accutain for a few months now to get rid of the acne but it has been great for everything but my back and it is still bad!! Help please!!
    First and foremost, you are hijacking this thread...start you own.

    But, before you start...PLEASE read the stickies at the top of the forum and all subsequent links in them.

    When you are done with all of that, post your questions and you will get experienced and educated responses for the guys here bengym

    gd

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