Little help with my bloodwork?

[pat80flh]

Howdy all. I am a 53 year old man, 5'10" 175lbs. Been a vegan for 3 years, before that I was around 240. It has come to my attention that my testosterone is low, and I am starting replacement therapy, self prescribed. I don't have my old bloodwork, but 3 years ago free T measured 2.5, the more weight I lost the higher it got, 5.2, now at 9.03, let me give you latest blood work:
total testosterone 426 ng/dl
free test. 9.03 ng/dl
percent free test. 2.12%


estradiol, total 24.7 pg/ml
DHEA sulfate 100.0 ug/dl
lutenizing hormone 8.3 mIU/ml

So if I'm reading the stickies correctly, everything is in line; LH on the high end of the scale, test. "normal" . These tests were taken 10 days ago, five days ago I began using a cream, 5%. I'm using .75 ml daily. Label says 50mg/ml, so I'm applying 37.5mg daily. The cream I'm reading is not ideal, but it was fairly easy to get. I am not a bodybuilder, my goal is to burn off stored fat and toxins. I have been doing some resistance training the last 2 months. I eat an extremely low fat, high carb, zero sugar diet. I try to eat just enough to keep me going. Any suggestions as to any supplements I'm missing, or advice on what type of exersize, how often etc appreciated.

[zaggahamma]

please provide the absorbtion rate of this gel/cream...i am unfamiliar with the measurements yhou are describing..also the ranges that came with your bloodwork results might help....it appears your total test level was decent but needed help freeing it up and sounds like you have been with diet and exercise alone...
are you going to have an endless supply of this cream you are aqcuiring...if you continue dosing it your 400 test level will be in the past..

any high intensity res training is good for the goal u mention..

bump

[flatscat]

what jp said about the absorption rate because it appears to me on the surface you are headed for lower t numbers after your natty production has ceased, AND... it will cease.

How are you feeling now?

[pat80flh]

OK. I am unable to come up with any absorption rate in the literature. It's an Australian product, Androforte 5, (there is a 3% version also). It's a 50 ml tube which contains 2500 miligrams of testosterone . Recomended dose is between .50 - 1.0 ml per day. A 1.0 ml dose delivers 50 mgs of testosterone, according to the package. I'm taking .75 per day, which would be 37.5 milligrams per day at 100% absortion. You probably don't get 100%, Maybe 80%? I am also applying it directly to the scrotum, per instructions.


JPK asked for the ranges with the blood work so here it is:

Reading // Range // Units

Percent free test. 2.12 ------- 1.50-4.20 ------- %

Free test. 9.03 ------- 5.0-21.0 --------ng/dl

Total test. 426 ---------193-740 -------- ng/dl

Total Estradiol 24.7 ------- 7.6 - 42.6 -------pg/ml

DHEA Sulfate 100.0 ------ 44.3 -331.0 ---- ug/dl

Luteinizing hormone 8.3 -------- 1.7- 8.6 --------- mIU/ml

Flatscat, I feel OK, I get tired by the end of the day, but I am carrying quite a heavy load, I turn wrenches in a fast paced commission only dealership, so I'm humping all day. Divorce figured into this deal, so I'm living in a foreclosure I bought and trying to rehab it, and I had to move my mother in when she got cancer. I'm the picture of health really, blood pressure, cholesterol, all cured by diet. I never get sick, colds or flu. There is a fight going on in my nether regions, I have a cancerous tumor of the prostate, which I am attempting to contain, retard or outright fix. I am hoping hormone balancing will tip the scales in my favor. There is no pain, urinary functions are normal, libido fell off the charts about a year ago, but I'm single anyways now. I'm in better health now than I've ever been.

Natty? Not familiar with that term,,,,,,

[zaggahamma]

natty means natural...

..if you are getting 30mg everyday plus you have a nice dose of test going...

in my past knowledge, a tumor present would mean a no no for adding test to the picture..but if your doctor says ok then i guess thats in the past..

about supplements...mulit's are usually recommended..alot of guys supp with big doses of vitamin D and zinc, fish oil, etc.

sounds like your doing well with all thats going on..

oh back to the lh...it is probably your fsh that is low (your testes is to blame for not making enough T) i never concern myself with why i just fix it..

what else?

if my diet was spot on as yours i'd prolly be 10% bf

best of luck

[flatscat]

JP, he is self prescribing. I can not say anything at this point other than you need to stop immediately and visit with your doc.

[zaggahamma]

always nice if a good doctor is on board

[pat80flh]

I am self prescribing. I have talked to doctors at length. My primary care physician is not interested in prescribing it. She is afraid. She is however developing an open mind, as my efforts so far have mightily impessed her. She has told me that my case has really opened her eyes. Prostate cancer is the province of urologists, normal cancer doctors refuse to talk to me. I have yet to meet a doctor face to face who believes cancer can be cured. My urologist, who is department the head at a major teaching hospital, refused to even discuss it. "What are you waiting for, your prostate should be in a jar on my shelf yesterday."

That is not acceptable.

It has been 3 years since the diagnosis. Please note I had NO symptoms, no problems, no ED. Just a "turning 50 physical". In retrospect, I did have some urinary frequency problems, which I attributed to too much coffee. That is long gone. The first year I managed to drive the PSA from an initial 9.9 down to 5.2. Then came the divorce, new home, job change, etc. I went back to drinking to deal with the stress, still ate as a vegan, but poor food choices. It took 2 years to reestablish my life, and I watched as my weight and PSA levels slowly climbed back up. In Feb. PSA was 14.2 and weight was up to 195. I quit drinking for good, started a lifting regimen. Late April, weight was down to 175, PSA 10.9. There is no longer a palpable tumor during a digital rectal exam.

Let me draw a comparison. Most doctors, when confronted by a patient with high blood pressure, will give a speech about diet and exersize, and if nothing has changed in 6 months, write a prescription. Most average people have no desire to make the changes necessary to fix their blood pressure. I didn't. And writing a scrip is so much easier. Every urologist I have talked to(there have been 4) says the same thing. Surgery. Quick, recovery in 8 weeks. 7 in 10 chance of spending the rest of your life cancer free. Possible loss of sexual function, possible loss of bladder control. After the initial diagnosis, I signed up for surgery. My second urologist ordered a bone scan, in his words,"If it has already migrated to your bones, game over." The scans came back, and lesions showed on the ribs. After 6 more months of testing his prognosis was this, "We can't tell if the lesions are cancer or not. We may as well do the surgery, at least we'll be doing SOMETHING." Sorry, but if I was going to die from bone cancer, it would be with my manhood intact. And by that point I was already doing something.

So it has been three years. As of the first of this year, I have my life somewhat in order, I have put myself in a position to concentrate on my health. I consider myself my own doctor. I judge the effectiveness of what I am doing by how I feel. I have slowed, if not stopped, the growth of the cancer. And I see absolutely nothing wrong with trying some TRT for 90 days or so, and seeing how I feel, and what effect it will have on my PSA readings. I think the risk is minimal, and the rewards may be great. And I believe that the "no testosterone for men with prostate cancer" comes from the old school, when men with ADVANCED cases were given T, it enlarged the prostate and increased urinary tract difficulties. Check the thread here titled "Prostate", lots of good new info there.

Here's a little irony for you, I found out last week that a paperwork snafu at my new employer has left me without medical coverage. Currently I am without health care coverage, and may be until January. And then there will be a "pre-existing condition." We shall see.

If I don't cure cancer it will not be for lack of trying.

[zaggahamma]

man best of luck

keep us posted

[GotNoBlueMilk]

Weren't pre-existing conditions banned by Obama and his socialistic, insurance centered, approach to health?

One question, did you ever have a biopsy done on your prostate or was the tumor + PSA the only testing and cancer assumed?

FYI, my dad had his protate out years ago, based on the old school of thought that if PSA gets over a certain number you yank the thing. After they yanked it they confirmed there was no cancer. Go figure!

My TRT doc, in our initial consulation, just shook his head when I gave this bit of family health history. The doc said that TRT would have probably saved my dad's prostate and avoided a surgery.

[zaggahamma]

this is why i dont trust doctors

[pat80flh]

"Weren't pre-existing conditions banned by Obama and his socialistic, insurance centered, approach to health?"

I guess we'll see. Since I am basically ignoring medical advice anyway, I might as well not have coverage. Actually, advances in medicine are tremendous, there are great diagnistic tools available, and if I were to pile up my bike, and my guts are hanging out, hell yeah get me to emergency.

"One question, did you ever have a biopsy done on your prostate or was the tumor + PSA the only testing and cancer assumed?"

Biopsy was performed. Cancer positive, Gleason score of 6 on a scale of 1-10, 10 being most severe. That's another story, my first urologist was lucky to have lived through that procedure. Sadistic, arrogant, little bastard better hope he never runs into me in a dark alley.


"FYI, my dad had his protate out years ago, based on the old school of thought that if PSA gets over a certain number you yank
the thing. After they yanked it they confirmed there was no cancer. Go figure!"

To so casually emasculate a man is bordering on criminal. I have found that it's run like a business. Surgeries equal money in the till.

[zaggahamma]

"Weren't pre-existing conditions banned by Obama and his socialistic, insurance centered, approach to health?"

I guess we'll see. Since I am basically ignoring medical advice anyway, I might as well not have coverage. Actually, advances in medicine are tremendous, there are great diagnistic tools available, and if I were to pile up my bike, and my guts are hanging out, hell yeah get me to emergency.

"One question, did you ever have a biopsy done on your prostate or was the tumor + PSA the only testing and cancer assumed?"

Biopsy was performed. Cancer positive, Gleason score of 6 on a scale of 1-10, 10 being most severe. That's another story, my first urologist was lucky to have lived through that procedure. Sadistic, arrogant, little bastard better hope he never runs into me in a dark alley.


"FYI, my dad had his protate out years ago, based on the old school of thought that if PSA gets over a certain number you yank
the thing. After they yanked it they confirmed there was no cancer. Go figure!"

To so casually emasculate a man is bordering on criminal. I have found that it's run like a business. Surgeries equal money in the till.

this is what i have come to believe as well

[elainep8]

I am self prescribing. I have talked to doctors at length. My primary care physician is not interested in prescribing it. She is afraid. She is however developing an open mind, as my efforts so far have mightily impessed her. She has told me that my case has really opened her eyes. Prostate cancer is the province of urologists, normal cancer doctors refuse to talk to me. I have yet to meet a doctor face to face who believes cancer can be cured. My urologist, who is department the head at a major teaching hospital, refused to even discuss it. "What are you waiting for, your prostate should be in a jar on my shelf yesterday."

That is not acceptable.

It has been 3 years since the diagnosis. Please note I had NO symptoms, no problems, no ED. Just a "turning 50 physical". In retrospect, I did have some urinary frequency problems, which I attributed to too much coffee. That is long gone. The first year I managed to drive the PSA from an initial 9.9 down to 5.2. Then came the divorce, new home, job change, etc. I went back to drinking to deal with the stress, still ate as a vegan, but poor food choices. It took 2 years to reestablish my life, and I watched as my weight and PSA levels slowly climbed back up. In Feb. PSA was 14.2 and weight was up to 195. I quit drinking for good, started a lifting regimen. Late April, weight was down to 175, PSA 10.9. There is no longer a palpable tumor during a digital rectal exam.

Let me draw a comparison. Most doctors, when confronted by a patient with high blood pressure, will give a speech about diet and exersize, and if nothing has changed in 6 months, write a prescription. Most average people have no desire to make the changes necessary to fix their blood pressure. I didn't. And writing a scrip is so much easier. Every urologist I have talked to(there have been 4) says the same thing. Surgery. Quick, recovery in 8 weeks. 7 in 10 chance of spending the rest of your life cancer free. Possible loss of sexual function, possible loss of bladder control. After the initial diagnosis, I signed up for surgery. My second urologist ordered a bone scan, in his words,"If it has already migrated to your bones, game over." The scans came back, and lesions showed on the ribs. After 6 more months of testing his prognosis was this, "We can't tell if the lesions are cancer or not. We may as well do the surgery, at least we'll be doing SOMETHING." Sorry, but if I was going to die from bone cancer, it would be with my manhood intact. And by that point I was already doing something.

So it has been three years. As of the first of this year, I have my life somewhat in order, I have put myself in a position to concentrate on my health. I consider myself my own doctor. I judge the effectiveness of what I am doing by how I feel. I have slowed, if not stopped, the growth of the cancer. And I see absolutely nothing wrong with trying some TRT for 90 days or so, and seeing how I feel, and what effect it will have on my PSA readings. I think the risk is minimal, and the rewards may be great. And I believe that the "no testosterone for men with prostate cancer" comes from the old school, when men with ADVANCED cases were given T, it enlarged the prostate and increased urinary tract difficulties. Check the thread here titled "Prostate", lots of good new info there.

Here's a little irony for you, I found out last week that a paperwork snafu at my new employer has left me without medical coverage. Currently I am without health care coverage, and may be until January. And then there will be a "pre-existing condition." We shall see.

If I don't cure cancer it will not be for lack of trying.

My brother used ProCure in Oklahoma City, and it cured his PC without surgery. If you decide to go after the cancer (and I do believe that PC is caused by not enough T, not too much T or else every 21-year-old male would have it), you should give them a call. They have ways -- grants and stuff -- to treat you even if you don't have insurance.

It looks like you have your head screwed on straight.

Good luck,

-e

[zaggahamma]

Pretty much forgot about this thread