HGH Log for knee recovery

[Alta]

So I just started a round of HGH. I originally ordered it up to run in my next cycle, but last week I blew my knee up and figured what the hell, let's give this a go and see if it helps.

Me: 40YO, highly active, 15%BF, have done 2 test cycles. Planning #3 in May. Currently in the process of really dialing in my diet and training....I want to be well below 15% and injury free before I start another cycle.

I have had a ridiculous amount of injuries from 20 years of sports (mainly rugby and hockey). Constant joint pain, arthritis in ankles knees and elbows from torn ligaments/bursitis. Crooked arm and clavicle from fractures that manifest themselves in shoulder problems.

Last week I sprained my ACL and partially tore my miniscus. I have an appointment with a specialist next week to go over options.

Protocol:

Started 2iu Pharma grade HGH March 8th. Plan to run it the next 3 months 5 days on 2 off and see how I go. My knee injury is nothing new, I have done it a few times so I have a general idea how long rehab takes to get up and running again. Last time I did it was 2 weeks rehab EOD, and 2 weeks of my own "rehab" (weights and surfing).

Going to update this as I go along.

[Alta]

Physio day 2: Almost zero ROM. Still on crutches and eating advil like candy.

Hitting my knee with interferential and ultrasound every other day, ice and low dose DMSO with linament. My office smells like an old boys locker room at the tennis club.

[Proximal]

HGH will not help the meniscus heal. Maybe the ACL, but only if it is a mild sprain, and then that even seems doubtful. If you have them surgically repaired, it is possible the HGH can speed their recovery then. Good luck with the ortho visit.

[Alta]

This is a bit of a rant more than an update.

Knee is TOTALLY ruined. I can't put any weight on it at all, and I have no idea why. It feels worse than it ever has to be honest, and that's saying something.

I'm doing my best to stay somewhat active, but the crutches are exhausting! It's hard to keep a diet when I can't cook, and all I want to do is ice my knee and sit on the couch. I see a specialist next week, and I'm coming to terms with the fact surgery is on the horizon. This is pretty depressing and is going to put a wrench in my training plans for the upcoming summer.

I've only done 4 injections at 2iu of HGH. No idea if I'm feeling anything but I seem to be getting night sweats (might be a cold?) and CRAZY dreams. That could be the painkillers though.

Will update as I go.

[Proximal]

Alta, I know you had a lot of varied advice on your other thread, but ultimately you're going to be just fine.

1. How bad was the ACL tear - did it warrant repair, if so, longer, more extensive recovery/rehab, but excellent and full return to activities.
2. The meniscal tears can completely shut your knee down, so what you are experiencing is not out of the ordinary.
3. When you have meniscal surgery see if the doc wants to repair it - if so, more extensive recovery/ rehab and a history of possible failure (just ask Derrick Rose of the Bulls).
4. Removal of the damaged portion called a menisectomy is a fast recovery IF you have immediate surgery.
5. The longer you wait, the more negative changes occur:
a. Loss of ROM and tightness which rehab will have to address post surgery.
b. Progressive atrophy/weakness which rehab will have to address post -
surgery.
c. a+b = a longer & more difficult recovery to a typically easy surgery.

[thall1]

I have been battling a rotator cuff injury for about the last year. I'll take a couple weeks off and it seams to heal, and if I don't work too much upper body in a short period of time I'm decent. I also can't sleep on it. If I go really hard in the gym it will always bother me. It bothers me alot on chest day. So much much that my opposite side pec is out growing the other.
I have often wandered if some careful workout planning and some hgh would help this heal.

[Proximal]

I have been battling a rotator cuff injury for about the last year. I'll take a couple weeks off and it seams to heal, and if I don't work too much upper body in a short period of time I'm decent. I also can't sleep on it. If I go really hard in the gym it will always bother me. It bothers me alot on chest day. So much much that my opposite side pec is out growing the other.
I have often wandered if some careful workout planning and some hgh would help this heal.

Get an MRI to find the extent of your injury. If the cuff is already torn, the HGH won't repair it. If it is a RC tear,then it's between you and the ortho to determine if surgery is right/needed at that time. If you do have it repaired, theoretically the HGH should speed the recovery.

BTW, don't mess around with shoulder injuries, particularly if you are young - bite the bullet, get it fixed and then come back.

[bsh]

I was on crutches for about 6 months! It's no fun I will say... To this day my calf is bigger then the other one! Watch out being on those things and be care4 to injury

[Alta]

Alta, I know you had a lot of varied advice on your other thread, but ultimately you're going to be just fine.

1. How bad was the ACL tear - did it warrant repair, if so, longer, more extensive recovery/rehab, but excellent and full return to activities.
2. The meniscal tears can completely shut your knee down, so what you are experiencing is not out of the ordinary.
3. When you have meniscal surgery see if the doc wants to repair it - if so, more extensive recovery/ rehab and a history of possible failure (just ask Derrick Rose of the Bulls).
4. Removal of the damaged portion called a menisectomy is a fast recovery IF you have immediate surgery.
5. The longer you wait, the more negative changes occur:
a. Loss of ROM and tightness which rehab will have to address post surgery.
b. Progressive atrophy/weakness which rehab will have to address post -
surgery.
c. a+b = a longer & more difficult recovery to a typically easy surgery.

Tear was diagnosed as mild (likely a sprain) but I only have maybe 50% ligament left in the first place. I can't really tell the extent of it until I get all the swelling out, which is coming along. THis morning I have around 30% ROM and can put weight on it (down to 1 crutch not 2!) so there is some progress. Now my ankle is messed up from walking like a gimp, and THAT is affecting me. No worries though, been through this before.

Thanks for the info though, it gives me a little more to look into.

Also getting weird sides right now. Headache, night sweats and blurry vision (tracers like you get on clomid). I'm hoping these subside quickly and I don't have to lower my dose (currently at 2iu 5 days on 2 days off). I'm sleeping like the dead though, which is really, really nice. I'm a heavy sleeper to begin with though.

Going to hit the gym this aft and do some shoulders/arms, maybe some light circles on a bike to see if I can open my knee joint up.

[Alta]

Well I don't know what to say here. Last week I couldn't put any weight whatsoever on my knee, and after a round of painkillers and ice all last week I went backcountry skiing over the weekend. It was nowhere near 100%, but as long as I stuck to less technical lines I seemed ok. It's stiff today but not too bad. Still can't really do much in the gym, but it's definitely improving.

Energy levels are fine, and really no noticeable difference in anything so far except libido. I have no idea if it's all in my head or what, but all I think about all day and all night is women. It's more intense now than when I was on cycle, which is really weird. I fear I may wear my wife out if I run test alongside the growth!

[oldnsedentary]

Meniscus will not repair itself. The surgery is not bad at all. They just remove the torn flap. You usually miss only two days of work.

[Alta]

Just finishing up week 3. Cleaned up the diet the last 2 weeks and have actually got to the gym for some decent workouts. Knee is still stiff but improving. No idea if I'm getting any results from the growth, but I'm sure it's still early.

I'm travelling today and can't take the GH with me, so I doubled my dosage to 4iu this AM to finish up the vial.

Heading skiing again this weekend. Heavy snowfall warning so I'm like a crackhead on a $20 bill. No way am I missing a late season dump.

[Proximal]

Heading skiing again this weekend. Heavy snowfall warning so I'm like a crackhead on a $20 bill. No way am I missing a late season dump.

Got to admit, I admire your tenacity & hope you are doing well and check in when you get back.

[Alta]

Yeah I think I pushed it a little too far.

Went skiing, and then hit the gym every day last week. Did a workout Friday that was a run, single arm dumbell snatches and skipping. Knee swelled up again, although at this time it was at the end of my quad muscle? Weird.

Gonna dial it back this week I think.

[Proximal]

Best of luck Alta, I hope your knee ends up better than Zoolander 2

[ray_ray86]

Hey Proximal,
Hoping you might be able to give some advise. I have a fully torn acl and needing to have it surgically repaired. Do you think Deca Durabolin will help the healing process or is HGH the only option?

[Proximal]

I've read posts by many members that hgh helped them post surgery. I personally would be careful with a cycle, because during initial phases of rehab, it's not all about strength and size, and muscular recovery is not that critical, plus not really sure if the deca is going to do anything for the surgically repaired ACL itself. Good luck with the surgery!

[bacchus100]

hi mate. i'm in a similar situation as you. bit of a dodgy knee. this is about week 8 on gh, 2iu per day mon - fri. definitly helped a lot. even feeling like i wanna shag everything about. i'm 37 and always been really active. trying to ease back into leg work. some days I can get my squats upto 100, other days, like today, not so well. I've been using deca as well, 1mg per week for last 4 weeks. now i used 2mg last and from this week to week 16 i'll take 3mg per week. all joints feel so much better. i was getting sore shoulders and elbows, but they feel great now. recovery is much better.
In first couple of weeks of gh, i had some similar sides, little head ache and a few welts for a few days, but they all went.
gh and deca all take about 8-10 weeks to start getting any affects, so I've read. I plan on staying on gh for good. it's a bit expensive but still affordable. worth it when you start becoming an old bugger

[Alta]

Thought I would update this.

No surgery for me. I went into a specialist, and they said they don't operate until the knee is totally blown out. Seeing as my MCL is gone, my ACL is 50% and my PCL is sort of ok all they will do is wait until I tear everything. Whatever.

The HGH I don't think is doing anything for my knee, but it's helping in other areas. I had my cholesterol tested and it's down, which is nice. I have genetically high levels (my dad has it, my bro has it) so to see that drop is a welcome side effect.

Shoulder pain is gone.

Recovery seems a bit better. I ran a 5k test in 23 minutes which is where I was in my early 30's. No idea if that is HGH related but I felt good! I felt a little heavy on the feet, but that's a respectable time.

I did up my dosage to 5iu to see what happens, and the next day I started getting jaw pain and wrist pain. Ran it down to 3.3 iu and all is well.

I did start a cycle of test (500mg/WK) a few weeks back, and I'm growing while leaning out. I do a lot of cardio which I'm trying to balance with heavy weights, and I'm liking the results so far.

However, I'm getting CRAZY back pumps. Granted I'm in the middle of a very heavy squat cycle, but every time I do high volumes of cleans, squats, or even wind sprints my back pump is insane. I have to lay down with my legs pulled to my chest to alleviate it. Anyone have any idea what that might be from? It's SUPER annoying.

Also curious how deca helps out joints? My knees are in constant agony when I get into a deep squat. They get pretty sore when I run as well, which sucks because I love running.

[Marc Hugo]

Deca (nandrolone decanoate) helps knees by increasing the synthesis of collagen type II in a roughly dose-dependent manner. Typically 100mg per week will increase collagen formation by 200-250% from available reserves of glucosamine sulfate and chondroitin sulfate. It will retard the turnover of sulphur in general and inhibit the binding of 5-lipoxegenase on articular soft tissue. All these activities accelerate the deposition of new articular cartilage where it is worn or damaged. Bear in mind that nandrolone will increase prolactin and therefore there are considerations to be made when contemplating using it.

Marc

[Proximal]

Thought I would update this.

No surgery for me. I went into a specialist, and they said they don't operate until the knee is totally blown out. Seeing as my MCL is gone, my ACL is 50% and my PCL is sort of ok all they will do is wait until I tear everything. Whatever.

From a previous post I wrote that I hoped this would turn out better than Zoolander 2 - it's not & it won't.

Over 30 years as a P.T. - you are looking at a disaster. The advice from your specialist is close to being malpractice. The laxity in your joint taxes/wears all other structures considerably. You are taking what should be a very simple fix by today's standards and turning it into a cluster fvck.

GET A NEW SPECIALIST AND GET THIS FIXED.

[Marc Hugo]

I agree unreservedly with Proximal. Refusing to repair fixable structural damage to a plane until it actually crashes would be regarded as a bad call in most circles. This "surgeons" professional opinion seems more than questionable. That said, running a 5km test is asking for trouble. If you want to have your body perform like a Ferrari, then don't treat it like a lawn mower. It's a fair analogy but not a perfect one, as your body is not a machine. I realise Canada is on National Health but I'm sure you can work out something better.

[Alta]

Thanks fellas. I'm going to go in for a new referral. Surgery is weird in Canada, you have to go through a GP who then sends you to a specialist who then determines if you should have surgery or not. This takes a few months, and then the waitlist for surgery is another 6 months. Knee surgery can take up to a year.

My knees aren't giving me too much problem in the meantime. Sore but manageable as long as I don't do something stupid like play a rugby game lol. It's mainly this effin back pump that is killing me.

[Alta]

So here's a question.

Anyone get any weird kind of "rush" after their injection?

I usually take it on an empty stomach, and I don't really notice anything at all. Yesterday my schedule was all f'd up, so I couldn't take it until an hour after a pretty big meal. Almost immediately I felt......weird. Like butterflies in the chest, and weird almost anxiety like symptoms. Was it the growth doing something to my blood sugar? Anything to be alarmed with?

This stuff is absolutely awesome otherwise. It's been a few months now, and my waist size has dropped significantly, while maintaining (even gaining) weight (keep in mind I'm on 500mg test e per week). It would very much appear that HGH, test, a clean diet and high exercise levels yield some pretty amazing results. Why isn't this stuff legal? lol