Oil, Iraq and Afghanistan Wars and Israel

[ecivon]

Regardless of 9-11 and the jetliner attacks, what isn't in dispute is that the US had designs on Afghanistan and Iraq long before 9-11, during the Clinton administration and the subsequent attack against the Taliban and the hunt for Bin Laden served to promote those agendas.

It is known that some of the largest oil and gas fields left in that region lie underneath Afghanistan and up in the bordering countries of Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan. Chevron and UNOCAL held leases in Afghanistan and the bordering regions and were planning pipelines to move those products into India and down to deep water ports but were having extreme difficulties as the Chinese and Russians were trying hard to get access to the fields diverted from US interests. Consider that Hamid Karzai, installed and backed by the US government is a former UNOCAL consultant, the same for Zalmay Khalilzad, assigned as Special Envoy to Afghanistan. Condoleeza Rice was also on the board of directors of Chevron and was sought for the post of National Security Advisor.

That whole region from Israel and Turkey across to Armenia and the Caspian Sea to Baku, Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan is embroiled in a power struggle between the US, Russia and China. What gives the US a distinct advantage is that a jewish businessman has total control of a significant portion of the untapped reserves under the Caspian and underground onshore. Two primary pipelines have been planned and possibly the expansion of a third if things work out. One would run west across to Turkey to exit at Ceyhan, eliminating the need to traverse the tricky Bosphorus Straits which will be further restricted by environmental treaty. A terminus at Ceyhan would also reduce the pipeline transit fees and give the tankers much increased profits. The second pipeline would travel from Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan across Afghanistan to deep water port on the southern Afghanistan coast for far eastern markets of US oil companies. The third pipeline, the Mosul-Haifa pipeline, would cut across Syria and Iraq from the Caspian and end at the Israeli port of Haifa.

The US has been heavily involved in the politics of the region simply for oil. No other reason. The US could have given a crap less about Saddam Hussein with the exception that he needed to be removed to carry out the US control of these oil fields and the needed pipelines to get the product to market.

Many experts believe that the only interest the US has in Afghanistan is oil motivated. Only people with oil backgrounds have been installed in power in the country. The same with Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan, both countries with radical Islamic and ruthless dictator rulers whom the US has been supplying with billions in unchecked aid.

Turkey has a long standing feud with the northern Kurds of Iraq, but doesn't do a thing as the US sends substantial aid to both Turkey and to the Kurds. It has been known that Israeli operatives have been in the Kurdish region advising and supplying the Kurds. The US has also been sending substantial aid to Armenia to protect right of passage for potential pipeline routes.

Though Israel is an emerging player in the oil enterprises in the entire region bacause of its political connections in Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan, but also because of its pipeline terminus at Haifa.

The US has to protect the Israelis against the Palestinians as Israel is an important access cog in the entire region for access and development of the fields in the Caspian region, but also for transport through its Mosul-Haifa pipeline. Then too, it is thought that substantial gas fields lie just off the Gaza Strip. which the Israeli government will never yield to the Palestinians under the guise of security needs.

The entire scheme, throughout the entire region, is all about oil and nothing more. Americans are being killed for nothing more than a grand scheme to protect US oil interests.

[RA]

The whole post is idiotic. Where should we strike back then?

[eliteforce]

I don't think it's a 'grand scheme to protect oil interests'..there are natural resources in the region and corporations are there to develop them but there are better ways to access them than to seek political control.. the conflict is squarely about attempting to further Israels interests and to destroy regimes that are hostile to Israel.. for example Iraq was in the middle of three big states that are hostile to Israel and the biggest one Iran has developed and arms industry that is pretty dangerous, especially in the area of missile/rockets..so they think that they can kind of scam and american puppet regime in the middle of the three but ofcource the underestimated the resolve of the Iraqi guerrilla resistence and now they are going to wind up weakening themselves, causing great damage to the Iraqi population and infrastructure and increasing anti-Israeli sentiment in the region..and the whole attempt was futile because Iran has continued to send rockets/weapons to Leb.Syria and the IDF can handle any conventional weapons threats..and is already in a state of mutual assured destruction vs. it's adversarys missiles.

[RA]

I don't think it's a 'grand scheme to protect oil interests'..there are natural resources in the region and corporations are there to develop them but there are better ways to access them than to seek political control.. the conflict is squarely about attempting to further Israels interests and to destroy regimes that are hostile to Israel.. for example Iraq was in the middle of three big states that are hostile to Israel and the biggest one Iran has developed and arms industry that is pretty dangerous, especially in the area of missile/rockets..so they think that they can kind of scam and american puppet regime in the middle of the three but ofcource the underestimated the resolve of the Iraqi guerrilla resistence and now they are going to wind up weakening themselves, causing great damage to the Iraqi population and infrastructure and increasing anti-Israeli sentiment in the region..and the whole attempt was futile because Iran has continued to send rockets/weapons to Leb.Syria and the IDF can handle any conventional weapons threats..and is already in a state of mutual assured destruction vs. it's adversarys missiles.

Your one of those guys that wears an armadillo helmet so the cia cant read your thoughts, arent you

[singern]

I don't think it's a 'grand scheme to protect oil interests'..there are natural resources in the region and corporations are there to develop them but there are better ways to access them than to seek political control.. the conflict is squarely about attempting to further Israels interests and to destroy regimes that are hostile to Israel.. for example Iraq was in the middle of three big states that are hostile to Israel and the biggest one Iran has developed and arms industry that is pretty dangerous, especially in the area of missile/rockets..so they think that they can kind of scam and american puppet regime in the middle of the three but ofcource the underestimated the resolve of the Iraqi guerrilla resistence and now they are going to wind up weakening themselves, causing great damage to the Iraqi population and infrastructure and increasing anti-Israeli sentiment in the region..and the whole attempt was futile because Iran has continued to send rockets/weapons to Leb.Syria and the IDF can handle any conventional weapons threats..and is already in a state of mutual assured destruction vs. it's adversarys missiles.

I take it from the flavor of all your posts, that you and Ahmenajad are in complete agreement that Israel should be eliminated and all Jews must be wiped out. I am curious how Shiia killing sunis killing shiia killing Kurds Arabs killing christians....has anything to do with Israel, or is it just a standard method of denial meant to give you a warm and fuzzy about a culture where cutting off innocent peoples heads gets a soccer team named after you......

.

[Phreak101]

I take it from the flavor of all your posts, that you and Ahmenajad are in complete agreement that Israel should be eliminated and all Jews must be wiped out. I am curious how Shiia killing sunis killing shiia killing Kurds Arabs killing christians....has anything to do with Israel, or is it just a standard method of denial meant to give you a warm and fuzzy about a culture where cutting off innocent peoples heads gets a soccer team named after you......
.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I very rarely laugh out loud at my computer but that one made me scream...

[singern]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I very rarely laugh out loud at my computer but that one made me scream...

As laughable as it seems, it was a legitimate question.
Cheers mate.

[ecivon]

The whole post is idiotic. Where should we strike back then?

What I'm referring to is the significant part oil has played into invading Afghanistan and Iraq. Hunting and going after Bin Laden is one thing, invading the entire country of Afghanistan is another issue. What was the motivation and justification?

The same thing with Iraq. Saddam Hussein was a murderous tyrant. He was not a threat to the American people. He was a threat to US oil interests in the region.

[ecivon]

I don't think it's a 'grand scheme to protect oil interests'..there are natural resources in the region and corporations are there to develop them but there are better ways to access them than to seek political control.. the conflict is squarely about attempting to further Israels interests and to destroy regimes that are hostile to Israel.. for example Iraq was in the middle of three big states that are hostile to Israel and the biggest one Iran has developed and arms industry that is pretty dangerous, especially in the area of missile/rockets..so they think that they can kind of scam and american puppet regime in the middle of the three but ofcource the underestimated the resolve of the Iraqi guerrilla resistence and now they are going to wind up weakening themselves, causing great damage to the Iraqi population and infrastructure and increasing anti-Israeli sentiment in the region..and the whole attempt was futile because Iran has continued to send rockets/weapons to Leb.Syria and the IDF can handle any conventional weapons threats..and is already in a state of mutual assured destruction vs. it's adversarys missiles.

Contrary to what some people say Israel never encouraged the US to attack Iraq, but as they did, Israel encouraged and assisted the US in the ongoing campaign. Bush sent assistant Secretary of State Richard Armitage to Tel Aviv prior to invading Iraq and told the Israei's of the plan. In return for supporting the US by publicly claiming Iraq had WMD's, Israel was given unlimited access to the Pentagon, the CIA and the NSA. Israel was also given access to spy satellites and the US sent a ton of Patriot missile batteries and money to Israel in return.

The following is a policy analysis report from the petroleum industry:

[ecivon]

I don't think it's a 'grand scheme to protect oil interests'..there are natural resources in the region and corporations are there to develop them but there are better ways to access them than to seek political control.. the conflict is squarely about attempting to further Israels interests and to destroy regimes that are hostile to Israel.. for example Iraq was in the middle of three big states that are hostile to Israel and the biggest one Iran has developed and arms industry that is pretty dangerous, especially in the area of missile/rockets..so they think that they can kind of scam and american puppet regime in the middle of the three but ofcource the underestimated the resolve of the Iraqi guerrilla resistence and now they are going to wind up weakening themselves, causing great damage to the Iraqi population and infrastructure and increasing anti-Israeli sentiment in the region..and the whole attempt was futile because Iran has continued to send rockets/weapons to Leb.Syria and the IDF can handle any conventional weapons threats..and is already in a state of mutual assured destruction vs. it's adversarys missiles.

The link wouldn't post, here is the report:

Israel and the regional oil axes
Policy Analysis: Israel

01-10-06 The United States has always tried, for strategic reasons, to build gas pipelines, excluding Russia's participation, in order to prevent Europe from depending on Russian gas, which currently covers one third of its total needs of gas.

Given the presence of key oil and gas fields in the Caspian Sea States, the US government has supported a consortium of oil companies (called the BTC Pipeline Company) to build the Baku-Ceyhan oil pipeline and the trans-Caspian gas pipeline. The two projects led to a convergence of interests between Iran and Russia, due to their growing concern to see both Azerbaijan and Georgia in close cooperation with NATO.

This desire led the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe (OSCE) to decide in its meeting in Istanbul on November 1999 to go ahead with building an oil pipeline, linking the Caspian fields with the Mediterranean (Baku-Ceyhan). This was followed by another resolution calling for the establishment of a gas pipeline crossing through Turkmenistan to Baku and then to Turkey.

On July 13, 2006, the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan (BTC) pipeline, 1,760 km long, was inaugurated to transport more than 1 mm bpd of oil from oil fields in the Caspian Sea to the Mediterranean. The opening ceremony was attended by representatives of companies contributing to the financing of the pipeline as well as two Israeli representatives.

Israel imports from the pipeline about 20 % of its oil needs that is expected to increase from the Caspian Sea region in the future. In addition, Israel is playing a key strategic role in protecting the regions the pipeline passes through to outside Ceyhan. In other words, its role can be summed up in controlling the upper zone, east of the Mediterranean.

The Baku-Ceyhan oil pipeline, which is administered by the US-British oil giant, BP Company, has changed the geopolitical situation of the Eastern Mediterranean Zone that is associated with the corridor of the Caspian basin.

The pipeline, which carries the oil and gas of Central Asia to the Eastern Mediterranean under the protection of Israel's military, was primarily designed to weaken the role of Russia in Central Asia and isolate China from the oil sources in Central Asia. It also helps transport part of the supply when the processing sources in the Middle East are interrupted.

It also aims to isolate Iran, in addition to placing Israel as a new strong player in the global energy market through the new alliance between Azerbaijan, Georgia, Turkey and Israel. Israel is now part of the British-American military axis that serves the interests of giant Western oil companies operating in the Middle East and Central Asia. Part of the oil transported via this line goes to Israel.

Israel aims not only to obtain part of the Caspian Sea oil for the purpose of consumption, but also considers playing a key role in re-exporting the Caspian Sea oil to the Asian markets through its port on the Red Sea. This is reinforced by the coordination and the ongoing negotiations between Turkey and Israel over linking the Ceyhan Port in Turkey with the port of Ashkelon in Israel. This link is to be achieved by creating projects for the transport of oil, natural gas, water and electricity through four undersea pipelines, bypassing Syrian and Lebanese territories.

The Baku oil is transported to the port of Ashkelon, India and the Far East through the Red Sea. There is a military cooperation agreement between Tel Aviv and Ankara that supports supplying Israel with water from the Tigris-Euphrates basin in Anatolia. It is a long-term strategic objective of minimizing Syria, Iraq and maximizing the influence of Israel on them.

Reports have indicated that secret negotiations are underway between Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert and Russian President Vladimir Putin through Olmert's multi-billionaire friend, Benny Steinmetz, in order to secure natural gas equipment for Israel through a pipeline under the Mediterranean linking Turkey with Israel.

The Russian gas will be transported through the Russia-Turkey pipeline, which was established by Russia two years ago, across the Black Sea in order to increase Russian leverage in Turkey. President Putin seeks to gain some influence in Israel in order to counterbalance the unilateral US power over Israel's policy.

Energy is no longer a pure national issue in the world today. It is difficult today for a State to contain the difficulties caused by energy alone in a world where policy has become increasingly managed in the form of battles over energy sources that do not rule out the use of force. There are many documents confirming the readiness of the US to use military force in a war, or several wars, for oil.

The invasion of Iraq, for example, has turned the Middle East, which has international economic importance, into a US military protectorate. The goal of US policy is to prevent the southern region (the Middle East, India, Iran, Pakistan and countries South of Russia) from submitting to only one player. It also aims to prevent these countries from working together under any form (alliances) to remove the US from its bases located on the southern coasts. The region is described as combining political chaos and rich energy sources and looks forward to regional hegemony.

To achieve full US sovereignty over the region, the US is striving by all means to prevent Russia, China, India and Japan from taking control over the South. This is hegemonic behaviour: the more the State becomes stronger militarily, economically and politically, the more it expands its geopolitical influence and involvement beyond its immediate neighbours.

[RA]

What I'm referring to is the significant part oil has played into invading Afghanistan and Iraq. Hunting and going after Bin Laden is one thing, invading the entire country of Afghanistan is another issue. What was the motivation and justification?

The same thing with Iraq. Saddam Hussein was a murderous tyrant. He was not a threat to the American people. He was a threat to US oil interests in the region.

Bin Laden and Co basically ran Afghanistan. What do you think we should do? I realize the whole pipeline issue, Ive heard it before, but we had to go there.

[ecivon]

Bin Laden and Co basically ran Afghanistan. What do you think we should do? I realize the whole pipeline issue, Ive heard it before, but we had to go there.

We had to go there to blast the crap out of the whole country? It was known that Bin Laden was in the mountains between Afghanistan and Pakistan and spent much more time in and out of Pakistan. Why didn't we bomb Pakistan? So in the guise of going after Bin Laden we bomb all of Afghanistan knowing he was in the mountains? We bombed Afghanistan to eliminate the Taliban who would have been an obstacle to the US putting in permanent bases and developing pipelines and deep water terminals. The Taliban came to the US, prior to the bombing campaign starting and offered Bin Laden and the US refused. Why? Because the Taliban needed eliminating as well.

[RA]

We had to go there to blast the crap out of the whole country? It was known that Bin Laden was in the mountains between Afghanistan and Pakistan and spent much more time in and out of Pakistan. Why didn't we bomb Pakistan? So in the guise of going after Bin Laden we bomb all of Afghanistan knowing he was in the mountains? We bombed Afghanistan to eliminate the Taliban who would have been an obstacle to the US putting in permanent bases and developing pipelines and deep water terminals. The Taliban came to the US, prior to the bombing campaign starting and offered Bin Laden and the US refused. Why? Because the Taliban needed eliminating as well.

We didnt go and blast the crap out of the whole country and he wasnt hiding up there until after we showed up. You libs see oil under every republican rock

[ecivon]

I take it from the flavor of all your posts, that you and Ahmenajad are in complete agreement that Israel should be eliminated and all Jews must be wiped out. I am curious how Shiia killing sunis killing shiia killing Kurds Arabs killing christians....has anything to do with Israel, or is it just a standard method of denial meant to give you a warm and fuzzy about a culture where cutting off innocent peoples heads gets a soccer team named after you......

.

Where did you get all of this crap? I never made a connection with anything you just posted. I made a well known observation, though known almost exclusively outside of the US as the US media is slanted and biased, about oil and several countries including Israel. The fact stands, Israel is an emerging player in the development and transportation of oil in the expanded middle east region, from the Mediterranean across the Balkans. Fact of the matter is Benny Steinmetz and a yound guy (jewish) from Germany are very powerful, rich and influential and have the Russians to invest heavily in helping Israel transport oil through the Haifa pipeline to an extremely large co-owned with Russia refinery.

And about all of these others doing all the killing, what about all the killing not only the Israeli government sponsors, but the settlers do as well? Israel is not innocent, Israel is not above reproach, Israel is culpable.

I don't have a thing against Israel existing, I've got a big thing against zionism, racism, oppression and wanton and reckless destruction.

[ecivon]

We didnt go and blast the crap out of the whole country and he wasnt hiding up there until after we showed up. You libs see oil under every republican rock

I strongly suggest you go bone up a bit on the US campaign in Afghanistan to see what actually took place. The mountain region is precisely where he holed up in Afghanistan and travelled freely back and forth into Pakistan under the protection of the Pakistani ISI.

And I am far from being a liberal -- which is laughable.

[singern]

Where did you get all of this crap? I never made a connection with anything you just posted. I made a well known observation, though known almost exclusively outside of the US as the US media is slanted and biased, about oil and several countries including Israel. The fact stands, Israel is an emerging player in the development and transportation of oil in the expanded middle east region, from the Mediterranean across the Balkans. Fact of the matter is Benny Steinmetz and a yound guy (jewish) from Germany are very powerful, rich and influential and have the Russians to invest heavily in helping Israel transport oil through the Haifa pipeline to an extremely large co-owned with Russia refinery.

And about all of these others doing all the killing, what about all the killing not only the Israeli government sponsors, but the settlers do as well? Israel is not innocent, Israel is not above reproach, Israel is culpable.

I don't have a thing against Israel existing, I've got a big thing against zionism, racism, oppression and wanton and reckless destruction.

You replied to a post that was addressed to Eliteforce, If you read his post Im sure you will understand my reply to him.

[ecivon]

You replied to a post that was addressed to Eliteforce, If you read his post Im sure you will understand my reply to him.

My apologies Bro ... the fact that I thought it was directed at me from you caught me by surprise. I do not have a problem with Israel, or jews, any more than I do any extremists from any other country and its peoples.

[RA]

I dont know where your evidence is that we "blasted the crap out of afghanistan"

[singern]

My apologies Bro ... the fact that I thought it was directed at me from you caught me by surprise. I do not have a problem with Israel, or jews, any more than I do any extremists from any other country and its peoples.

No worries

[ecivon]

No worries

Singern ... Do you go back and forth between Chicago and Israel? Spent some time in Chicago and liked it. Went there for some training, stayed on Wacker Drive across the river from the Tribune Building.

Wouldn't mind taking a trip to Israel -- I could use a few cold beers and some good laughs, but the authorities might have a different idea. I'm certain the IDF would flag me. I have some old family connections in Akko, we call it Acre, in the north. It's really old.

I've got to go away for awhile, I came here to get something and got sidetracked, but now have to go take care of some things. Really shouldn't have posted here but couldn't resist -- I wish I could give you my name, we could get into some 'spirited' debates, but it's all good. Take care and Peace to you and yours.

[singern]

Singern ... Do you go back and forth between Chicago and Israel? Spent some time in Chicago and liked it. Went there for some training, stayed on Wacker Drive across the river from the Tribune Building.

Wouldn't mind taking a trip to Israel -- I could use a few cold beers and some good laughs, but the authorities might have a different idea. I'm certain the IDF would flag me. I have some old family connections in Akko, we call it Acre, in the north. It's really old.

I've got to go away for awhile, I came here to get something and got sidetracked, but now have to go take care of some things. Really shouldn't have posted here but couldn't resist -- I wish I could give you my name, we could get into some 'spirited' debates, but it's all good. Take care and Peace to you and yours.

I moved with the family back home to Israel in August of this year. But for my business I commute back to Chicago every couple weeks. Your always welcome to visit. Safe travels.

[eliteforce]

well I don't know how the hell you got that from my post!

>I take it from the flavor of all your posts, that you and Ahmenajad are in >complete agreement that Israel should be eliminated and all Jews must be >wiped out.

There is nothing to that effect in my post and not even Ahmenajad said all Jews should be wiped out, he just thinks Israel should be eliminated, but I never said Israel should be eliminated or Jews wiped out, in other posts I've just said Israel should withdraw to the 1967 borders and I consider it a racist aphartied state-mostly because of the settlements in the wb.

You replied to a post that was addressed to Eliteforce, If you read his post Im sure you will understand my reply to him.

[Logan13]

Just so that we are all on the same page:
Afghanistan does NOT have any oil. I found it laughable that when the US first went to Afghanistan, all of these libs were crying that we just wanted their oil.......ignorance is maddening!!

[Kärnfysikern]

Just so that we are all on the same page:
Afghanistan does NOT have any oil. I found it laughable that when the US first went to Afghanistan, all of these libs were crying that we just wanted their oil.......ignorance is maddening!!

Did anyone realy object to the war in afghanistan?

[ecivon]

Just so that we are all on the same page:
Afghanistan does NOT have any oil. I found it laughable that when the US first went to Afghanistan, all of these libs were crying that we just wanted their oil.......ignorance is maddening!!

Department of Energy: Afghanistan Fact Sheet:

http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/cabs/afghan.html

Seriously, what you need to do is research and know your facts before you start making unsubstantiated statements. It makes you look foolish.

The other issue with Afghanistan is as a major right of way for transporting oil and gas reserves from adjoining/adjacent areas.

[mcpeepants]

Did anyone realy object to the war in afghanistan?

I did

[Logan13]

Did anyone realy object to the war in afghanistan?

there are some who object to any war. Funny thing though is that they seem to be some of the first to use violence in making their point known.

[Logan13]

Department of Energy: Afghanistan Fact Sheet:

http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/cabs/afghan.html

Seriously, what you need to do is research and know your facts before you start making unsubstantiated statements. It makes you look foolish.

The other issue with Afghanistan is as a major right of way for transporting oil and gas reserves from adjoining/adjacent areas.

I see pipelines. Next you will probably try to spin that NATO is in Afghanistan because they want to take over their opium industry.....

[Kärnfysikern]

there are some who object to any war. Funny thing though is that they seem to be some of the first to use violence in making their point known.

Kind of like the anti facist movement in sweden that is suposed to be for peace but there entire objective is to go and have big fights with nazi's

To bad stupidity is such a comon trait.

[Bigen12]

Your one of those guys that wears an armadillo helmet so the cia cant read your thoughts, arent you

[RA]

I cant believe you found a pic of him