Firefighters: Anybody But Giuliani

[alphaman]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,257901,00.html

[DTBusta]

good, there isn't anything that great about the man. Remember right before 9/11, new yorkers , including me had enough with him. It was after, his"bringing New York" back together "patriotically" that got him such a great view from the nations media. New Yorkers were done with him after his affairs and shotty administratin procedures.Good to see your source is Fox News .com...a little more "fair & balanced" than usual...

[mcpeepants]

good job on calling Giuliani out. that guys been profiteering off his 9/11 fame and the media keeps acting like he's the return of Jesus Christ.

[alphaman]

good job on calling Giuliani out. that guys been profiteering off his 9/11 fame and the media keeps acting like he's the return of Jesus Christ.

I don't like him because he's being touted by many as a conservative, but he's liberal on all the major conservative issues -- abortion, gun control and same-sex marriage.

[Logan13]

Good to see your source is Fox News .com...a little more "fair & balanced" than usual...

It's just that you haven't been paying attention, or didn't want to pay attention because the truth would through off your view of the world.......
Fox, as a network, has shown a liking to the man, but news is still news.

[Logan13]

good, there isn't anything that great about the man. Remember right before 9/11, new yorkers , including me had enough with him. It was after, his"bringing New York" back together "patriotically" that got him such a great view from the nations media. New Yorkers were done with him after his affairs and shotty administratin procedures.Good to see your source is Fox News .com...a little more "fair & balanced" than usual...

"In the letter, the IAFF, whose president Harold Schaitberger is a longtime supporter of Democratic Sen. John Kerry"
Although this is news, when in the hell has ANY Union backed a GOP candidate guys? This is political, Gulliani is a Republican and Unions force their members to give money to the Democratic Committee via paycheck deductions. Guilliani is a threat to Hillary, and this is just one branch on her political tree that will be used to whip any viable threat down. All of the recent polls (albeit it is very early) show Guilliani beating all of the Democratic candidates, this is merely Hillary's response to these polls. This is yet another case where you must think and research beyond what you are told in the news, regardless of which source it comes from.

[alphaman]

"In the letter, the IAFF, whose president Harold Schaitberger is a longtime supporter of Democratic Sen. John Kerry"
Although this is news, when in the hell has ANY Union backed a GOP candidate guys? This is political, Gulliani is a Republican and Unions force their members to give money to the Democratic Committee via paycheck deductions. Guilliani is a threat to Hillary, and this is just one branch on her political tree that will be used to whip any viable threat down. All of the recent polls (albeit it is very early) show Guilliani beating all of the Democratic candidates, this is merely Hillary's response to these polls. This is yet another case where you must think and research beyond what you are told in the news, regardless of which source it comes from.

You're probably right about the ClintonMachine being responsible for this one. Especially snince the letter was never sent, but now it's in the news.

[Tock]

[I] when in the hell has ANY Union backed a GOP candidate guys?

Lots of times.
If you knew a bit more about history, you wouldn't have to ask.

Here are a few union-backed GOP candidates:

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05270/578357.stm
The union representing Pittsburgh firefighters has endorsed Republican Joe Weinroth's bid for mayor in a surprise break from labor's usual preference

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/p...-cvn-bush.html
September 1, 2004 - COLUMBUS, Ohio – President Bush drew the endorsement of a New York City firefighters union Wednesday, a reminder to voters of the Sept. 11 attacks that he has made a centerpiece of his re-election campaign.

http://www.workers.org/2005/us/letter-0728/
Jul 21, 2005 9:09 PM -- On July 13 the Executive Board of District Council 37, AFSCME, voted to endorse the re-election of Wall Street’s candidate for New York City mayor, billionaire Republican Michael Bloomberg. The endorsement was accomplished by the narrowest of margins: 13 Executive Board members voted yes, 12 voted no.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04250/374239.stm
The AFL-CIO's endorsement of Republican incumbent Arlen Specter last week ranks as the most important development so far in a contest that pits the senator against challenger Joe Hoeffel, who has now lost a traditional source of Democratic support.

http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstra...0In%20Politics
Vice President Bush today reached out for the support of organized labor's rank and file as the International Brotherhood of Teamsters became the first major labor union to endorse President Reagan for re-election. The endorsement came after the results of a mail survey in which 25,841 of the union's ...


http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/e1940.htm
In 1972, the Teamsters backed President Nixon, a Republican, but stayed neutral in 1976. It supported Ronald Reagan, another Republican, in 1980 and 1984, and endorsed Bush's father in 1988.

[Tock]

[I]Unions force their members to give money to the Democratic Committee via paycheck deductions.

And corporations force their shareholders to participate in Republican contributions when they make $$$ donations to the GOP. That costs the shareholders $$$ in reduced profits. Are you going to complain about this as well, or just about Union contributions?

IMHO, both the unions AND all corporations should be prohibited from making political contributions.

[DTBusta]

You got it Tock. People here in NY...were sick of Drooliani and his lies the day before 9/11. That if you remember is when the media swept in and called the man a hero. For what..did he save lives. Last I heard he failed at alot on 9/11, he was responsible for the ineffectiveness of the system. But just like Bush and the intelligence they blamed it on the system. Somebody has to be responsible and the elected official during the "attack or procedure" should be. In this case the fireman are stepping up because Guiliani is worthless. "Bad Intelligence, Bad!"


Also what about the breathing of the air after 9/11. I remember watching hours of concern all for him and the epa lady to step up to the mic to say it was safe to breathe the air. How wrong were they!

[Logan13]

Lots of times.
If you knew a bit more about history, you wouldn't have to ask.

Here are a few union-backed GOP candidates:

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/05270/578357.stm
The union representing Pittsburgh firefighters has endorsed Republican Joe Weinroth's bid for mayor in a surprise break from labor's usual preference

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/p...-cvn-bush.html
September 1, 2004 - COLUMBUS, Ohio – President Bush drew the endorsement of a New York City firefighters union Wednesday, a reminder to voters of the Sept. 11 attacks that he has made a centerpiece of his re-election campaign.

http://www.workers.org/2005/us/letter-0728/
Jul 21, 2005 9:09 PM -- On July 13 the Executive Board of District Council 37, AFSCME, voted to endorse the re-election of Wall Street’s candidate for New York City mayor, billionaire Republican Michael Bloomberg. The endorsement was accomplished by the narrowest of margins: 13 Executive Board members voted yes, 12 voted no.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/04250/374239.stm
The AFL-CIO's endorsement of Republican incumbent Arlen Specter last week ranks as the most important development so far in a contest that pits the senator against challenger Joe Hoeffel, who has now lost a traditional source of Democratic support.

http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstra...0In%20Politics
Vice President Bush today reached out for the support of organized labor's rank and file as the International Brotherhood of Teamsters became the first major labor union to endorse President Reagan for re-election. The endorsement came after the results of a mail survey in which 25,841 of the union's ...


http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/e1940.htm
In 1972, the Teamsters backed President Nixon, a Republican, but stayed neutral in 1976. It supported Ronald Reagan, another Republican, in 1980 and 1984, and endorsed Bush's father in 1988.

WOW, you sight 6 examples for Republicans against the thousands that have gone for the Democrats. Of course some union money is going to go to a few Republicans, most organisations do this in varying degrees on both sides of the aisles(i.e.Rubert Murdoch gives to the Hillary Clinton campaign). To state that Unions do not overwhelmingly go for the Democratic party is just naive, and it shows that you just wish to argue about anything. You do the same thing when you post about a few religious figures that have been caught up in scandel, out of the millions of religious Americans. You just get more amuzing every week Tock, the more that you wring your hands the more that I smile. Check your historical facts before you throw your bullshit my way.
http://www.opensecrets.org/industries/indus.asp?Ind=P
From 1990 - 2006 Labor Unions donated $583,124,705 to politicians:
$538,994,577 went to Democrats (92%)
$44,130,128 went to Republicans (8%)

"It's so simple to be wise. Just think of something stupid to say and then don't say it." ---Sam Levenson

[Logan13]

And corporations force their shareholders to participate in Republican contributions when they make $$$ donations to the GOP. That costs the shareholders $$$ in reduced profits. Are you going to complain about this as well, or just about Union contributions?
Funny, I am a share holder of a few companies, and I get to cast my vote on political donations......... Like you actually care about any shareholders profits Tock. Again, anything to argue.........

IMHO, both the unions AND all corporations should be prohibited from making political contributions.

Yes, they should be prohibited.

[Logan13]

You got it Tock. People here in NY...were sick of Drooliani and his lies the day before 9/11. That if you remember is when the media swept in and called the man a hero. For what..did he save lives. Last I heard he failed at alot on 9/11, he was responsible for the ineffectiveness of the system. But just like Bush and the intelligence they blamed it on the system. Somebody has to be responsible and the elected official during the "attack or procedure" should be. In this case the fireman are stepping up because Guiliani is worthless. "Bad Intelligence, Bad!"


Also what about the breathing of the air after 9/11. I remember watching hours of concern all for him and the epa lady to step up to the mic to say it was safe to breathe the air. How wrong were they!

Seriously, do you go through alot of keyboards? I mean with all of your drooling........

[Tock]

WOW, you sight 6 examples for Republicans against the thousands that have gone for the Democrats.

No, I did not sight anything. I cited several examples, and if you think I'm gonna cite every instance of unions supporting Republican candidates, think again. Your rant implied that Unions never support Republicans, my cites have demonstrated otherwise.

It wasn't difficult coming up with this list, and if you knew anything about American history, you'd know that Unions have supported lots of Republicans.

[juicedOUTbrain]

Logans actually partially correct this time...No, unions dont generally support republicans because the primary goal of the GOP is to keep the cheap labor around for their corporate overlords...

That being said, you would think the 1st responders and those most effected by 9-11, not to mention the predisposition of civil service workers to lean republican would support the republican party for their percieved domination of the "war on terror"...Political or not, the fact that many NYC firefighters dont support his run for president says a lot, bottomline...

[Logan13]

No, I did not sight anything. I cited several examples, and if you think I'm gonna cite every instance of unions supporting Republican candidates, think again. Your rant implied that Unions never support Republicans, my cites have demonstrated otherwise.

It wasn't difficult coming up with this list, and if you knew anything about American history, you'd know that Unions have supported lots of Republicans.

92% vs. 8% is a rather convincing stat to support my statement. Next time you wish to be condescending, at least try to be right.......

[Logan13]

Logans actually partially correct this time...No, unions dont generally support republicans because the primary goal of the GOP is to keep the cheap labor around for their corporate overlords...

That being said, you would think the 1st responders and those most effected by 9-11, not to mention the predisposition of civil service workers to lean republican would support the republican party for their percieved domination of the "war on terror"...Political or not, the fact that many NYC firefighters dont support his run for president says a lot, bottomline...

Logan is correct most of the time, and always has facts to back up his statements. There is nothing partially correct about my post........
Facts carry weight, your emotional ties and feelings do not.

[Tock]

92% vs. 8% is a rather convincing stat to support my statement. Next time you wish to be condescending, at least try to be right.......

Well, you asked:

" . . . when in the hell has ANY Union backed a GOP candidate . . ."

I provided several examples of unions backing Republicans. What more do you want? Egg in your beer?

[DTBusta]

Logan wow your the equivalent to Bill Oreilly, you talk alot... Guiliani new after the 93 attack not to put his base there, they spent even more money just to do it after the "terrorists" said they hit the towers till they came down. This man did nothing more than get rid of "window washers"...newyorkers were sick of him like I said the day before 9/11...the end of story. He wasn't a great mayor like they want him to look. What are you going to say Logan the firefighters are liberal and their union doesn't support Republicans, fine thats valid. Hes still cheated on his wives twice! Oh one doesn't have to do with the other. Yes it does, its the same candidate. Shi* on him all I want, he was my mayor, and the links Tock provided pretty clearly unions supporting Republicans. And by the way maybe they don't support them because unions actually give their workers high pay and a voice.

[DTBusta]

Logans actually partially correct this time...No, unions dont generally support republicans because the primary goal of the GOP is to keep the cheap labor around for their corporate overlords...

That being said, you would think the 1st responders and those most effected by 9-11, not to mention the predisposition of civil service workers to lean republican would support the republican party for their percieved domination of the "war on terror"...Political or not, the fact that many NYC firefighters dont support his run for president says a lot, bottomline...

Unions support Republicans, maybe one should look into why they generally vote dem. Lets remember these are working people with high paying jobs paying for their families. If it were for the republican backed corporations than they'd be sitting on the street corner begging for a job that some scum bag corporate overloard "logan" would look down at them and say what he wanted, and no voice for the "non-union" employee. The fact is the firefighters have very legitimate stances on why they dont support him. He didn't do anything that great on 9/11 like I said. They state having his security office in the trade center as one of his pitfalls.

[Logan13]

Unions support Republicans, maybe one should look into why they generally vote dem. Lets remember these are working people with high paying jobs paying for their families. If it were for the republican backed corporations than they'd be sitting on the street corner begging for a job that some scum bag corporate overloard "logan" would look down at them and say what he wanted, and no voice for the "non-union" employee. The fact is the firefighters have very legitimate stances on why they dont support him. He didn't do anything that great on 9/11 like I said. They state having his security office in the trade center as one of his pitfalls.

My dad was in the local pipefitters union for 19 years, don't tell me about unions.

[Logan13]

Logan wow your the equivalent to Bill Oreilly, you talk alot... Guiliani new after the 93 attack not to put his base there, they spent even more money just to do it after the "terrorists" said they hit the towers till they came down. This man did nothing more than get rid of "window washers"...newyorkers were sick of him like I said the day before 9/11...the end of story. He wasn't a great mayor like they want him to look. What are you going to say Logan the firefighters are liberal and their union doesn't support Republicans, fine thats valid. Hes still cheated on his wives twice! Oh one doesn't have to do with the other. Yes it does, its the same candidate. Shi* on him all I want, he was my mayor, and the links Tock provided pretty clearly unions supporting Republicans. And by the way maybe they don't support them because unions actually give their workers high pay and a voice.

the difference between you and I is that I actually have a point to my posts....you just piece together individual rants.
92% for Democrats over a 16 year period is rather overwhelming, to deny this just makes you look foolish...again.

[DTBusta]

yeah wow Logan, because it actually makes sense for your dad tos upport dems, it betters his chance of having a continuing career, a solid one at that. Don't use Faux's approach and character assasinate me, thats the easy part, any one can try to make someone else look like an ass. My father is currently in a union and rebuilding the trade centers, or whats left, believe me I know just as much as you on many of these subjects, I also own a business, and understand many republican points of views, none is groundbreaking when you repeat them..Im not attacking you, so don't return it to me...wow both our fathers were in the unions, you shouldn't play stupid or the republican card and try to back a reason why unions dont support republicans when it is a completey justified reason. On top of that you are protecting Guiliani, the man has nothing special about him. Just the way Hillary repulses many republicans and anyone for that matter, Guiliani does the same...what is that when h talks anyway, he spits or something...hes cheated on two different wives, so what is he conservative on? the budget, because than he will beable to contrast himself from Bush, but until then I can;t see how these hypocritical evangelicals could back this man more than Mcain, when he has in fact adultered many times. It just proves the republican party has abandoned everything it "thought" it stood for. Now we know for a fact that Gingrich cheated on his wife the same exact time he was pushing Clinton to be impeached. It just proves these republicans, and yes your party is very very very corrupt and misleading...none less than the dems...and Im not a dem so don't come back and say something irrelevant...

[alphaman]

yeah wow Logan, because it actually makes sense for your dad tos upport dems, it betters his chance of having a continuing career, a solid one at that. Don't use Faux's approach and character assasinate me, thats the easy part, any one can try to make someone else look like an ass. My father is currently in a union and rebuilding the trade centers, or whats left, believe me I know just as much as you on many of these subjects, I also own a business, and understand many republican points of views, none is groundbreaking when you repeat them..Im not attacking you, so don't return it to me...wow both our fathers were in the unions, you shouldn't play stupid or the republican card and try to back a reason why unions dont support republicans when it is a completey justified reason. On top of that you are protecting Guiliani, the man has nothing special about him. Just the way Hillary repulses many republicans and anyone for that matter, Guiliani does the same...what is that when h talks anyway, he spits or something...hes cheated on two different wives, so what is he conservative on? the budget, because than he will beable to contrast himself from Bush, but until then I can;t see how these hypocritical evangelicals could back this man more than Mcain, when he has in fact adultered many times. It just proves the republican party has abandoned everything it "thought" it stood for. Now we know for a fact that Gingrich cheated on his wife the same exact time he was pushing Clinton to be impeached. It just proves these republicans, and yes your party is very very very corrupt and misleading...none less than the dems...and Im not a dem so don't come back and say something irrelevant...

Wow, what a mess. Giuliani won't backed by any genuine evangelicals, or genuine conservatives, for that matter.