My Workout/Diet/Cycle Critique Please!!!!

[XxElitexX]

Alright, started my thread on members pics and now I have moved to this to give you all a better idea of what exactly is going on.

I am in the gym 4-6 times a week. This is a basic layout of my workout pattern.
Day 1: Chest/Abs
Day 2: Shoulders/Triceps
Day 3:Back/Biceps
Day4: Legs/Cardio/Abs

Sometimes I will throw in rest days in between the workout pattern but after my legs/cardio/abs I will normally take one day off, as you already know, recovery is amazing while on cycle.

Chest
Flat Bench Dumbell- 15,12,12,10
Incline Dumbell- 15,12,12,10
Cable Upward Flye-20,15,12,12
Seated Machine Flye- 15,12,10,8
Dumbell Incline-12 reps w/ heavy weight then 50% weight for another 12(superset)

Abs
15 total sets of Cable Crunch, EZ ball crunch, seated crunch, leg raises.....12-40 reps.

Shoulders
Standing Dumbell Raise- 15,12,12,10
Bent Over Lateral Raise- 20,15,12,12
Arnold Press- 12,10,10,8
Standing Lateral Raise-12,12,10,10

Triceps
Dips-30,25,25,25,20
Tricep Pressdown(V-Bar)-15,12,10,10
Standing Reg. Bar Pressdown- 15,12,12,10
Skull Crushers- 12,12,12,10

Back
Pullups- 25,15,15,12
Close Grip Pulldown-12,12,12,10
Seated Close Grip or Wide Grip Row- 15,12,12,10
Wide Grip Lat Pulldown-15,15,12,12

Biceps
Straight Bar Curls-12,10,10,8
EZ Bar Curl-12,12,10,8
Standing Apple Curl-10,10,10,8
Concentration or Preacher Curl- 15,12,12,10

Legs
Hack Squat or Leg Press-15,15,15,12,12,10
Calf Raise- 15,15,15,12

Cardio
45 minutes at low speed

DIET
Breakfast-Grape Nuts w/ splenda and protein shake
Mid Morning- Protein Bar of Can of Tuna
Lunch- Chicken Breast or Fish
Before WO- Protein Bar and Gatorade
PWO- Chicken Breast or Fish
PPWO- Tuna or Shake or Bar
Before Bed- 6-8 Egg Whites and scoop of PB

CYCLE
1-8 Test Prop 100mg EOD
1-8 Letro 1mg ED
Clomid Therapy


Stats...19 YRS OLD, 168ibs, 6-8% BF, 305ib Bench Press, 5 yrs training experience.

[AandF6969]

Are you trying to cut or bulk?

[XxElitexX]

The objective of this cycle is to put on 10-15 ibs of lean muscle. And to keep mostly all of it after PCT.

[AandF6969]

I think your calories are way too low. Can't build muscle if the raw materials aren't there to begin with.

You should deadlift on back day and do real squats on leg day. And no hamstring exercise? That's just asking for problems.

Cardio after lifting isn't a good idea, ESPECIALLY when trying to gain muscle. You should have a PWO shake containing dextrose and protein in a 2:1 ratio within 20 minutes of your last set... if you drink it inbetween workout and cardio, your cardio is ineffective, and if you wait till after cardio you're missing your "anabolic window of opportunity" when your muscles will soak up the protein and dextrose like a sponge.

I think your reps are way too high for bulking also. Try to stick to 6-8 reps (excluding a warm-up set) or maybe even 4-6 depending on how heavy you like to go.

[*Narkissos*]

Got your PM..here's my assessment:

Alright, started my thread on members pics and now I have moved to this to give you all a better idea of what exactly is going on.

I am in the gym 4-6 times a week. This is a basic layout of my workout pattern.
Day 1: Chest/Abs
Day 2: Shoulders/Triceps
Day 3:Back/Biceps
Day4: Legs/Cardio/Abs

seeing that you're doing these on consecutive days... i'd suggest you change the arrangement to:

Day 1: Chest/Biceps
Day 2: Legs/Cardio/
Day 2: Shoulders/Triceps
Day 3:Back/Abs

I chose this arrangement because in the one you proposed, shoulders are getting worked two days consecutively (indirect work with chest and direct work with shoulders)

[XxElitexX]

Awesome, sounds good! Also I thought I would say the parts i really wanted to bring out and that IMO are lagging..
BACK
DELTS
LEGS
UPPER CHEST
WHat do you guys think?

[AandF6969]

Try the diet again and we'll critique it. www.fitday.com is an excellent nutritional resource with calories/protein/fat/carbs of pretty much any food you can think of.

[*Narkissos*]

Chest
Flat Bench Dumbell- 15,12,12,10
Incline Dumbell- 15,12,12,10
Cable Upward Flye-20,15,12,12
Seated Machine Flye- 15,12,10,8
Dumbell Incline-12 reps w/ heavy weight then 50% weight for another 12(superset)

Abs
15 total sets of Cable Crunch, EZ ball crunch, seated crunch, leg raises.....12-40 reps.

Shoulders
Standing Dumbell Raise- 15,12,12,10
Bent Over Lateral Raise- 20,15,12,12
Arnold Press- 12,10,10,8
Standing Lateral Raise-12,12,10,10

Triceps
Dips-30,25,25,25,20
Tricep Pressdown(V-Bar)-15,12,10,10
Standing Reg. Bar Pressdown- 15,12,12,10
Skull Crushers- 12,12,12,10

Back
Pullups- 25,15,15,12
Close Grip Pulldown-12,12,12,10
Seated Close Grip or Wide Grip Row- 15,12,12,10
Wide Grip Lat Pulldown-15,15,12,12

Biceps
Straight Bar Curls-12,10,10,8
EZ Bar Curl-12,12,10,8
Standing Apple Curl-10,10,10,8
Concentration or Preacher Curl- 15,12,12,10

Legs
Hack Squat or Leg Press-15,15,15,12,12,10
Calf Raise- 15,15,15,12

Cardio
45 minutes at low speed

I'd cut down on the number of exercises somewhat...to 2 or 3 per major bodypart.

Chest:
Flat Dumbell
Incline Barbell
Incline Fly

Back:
Chins (staple)
Bent barbell Row
Deadlift
Pull-down to front

Shoulders:
Lateral Raise
Bent Lateral
Barbell Press to front

Traps:
Up right row/Shrug (behind)

Legs:
Squat
Leg-curl

Calves:
Seated Calf raises

Bicep:
Seated Dumbell curl
Preacher bench dumbell curl

Triceps:
SKull crushers
Triceps press down

In your proposed routine you're doing too many movements IMO.. and a few movements that more or less the same as a previous movement in the same routine.IMO that's akin to flogging a dead horse.

[Odin]

I can easly see many flaws in the workout. Number 1 your working out to many times a week for bulking. Next your doing Chest,shoulder, and back 3 days in a row. Remember that you hit the front shoulders on chest day, then nail your hole shoulder the next day, then finally hit the back of your shoulders on your back day. Through shoulders in with chest, then hit legs the next day then do back. You'll end up f*ckin your shoulders up with all that pressure on your shoulders that many days in a row. Also why do so many rep's in the warm up's. Do a search on Doggcrapp workout schedule and give that a try. Here is an example of a chest, shoulder, and tricept workout I do.

I first drink 1/2 a gallon of water and take 4 L-Argintine pills a half hour before workout. Then during workout I wear sweat pants, a tight nylon shirt and a tight sweater, and a stalking hat. With all the water and clothes it makes my muscles really warm and hydrated, plus i can warm up less"to save energy" and take longer between set's and still stay warmed up.
Incline bench press
135x15 4 minutes
185x6 4 minutes
225x2 7 minutes
315x8 30 seconds
315x2 and hold the negitive till I cannot move it and stretch my chest hard.

10 minute break to catch breath, and still stay warm with all the clothes also drink another 1/4 of a gallon. Ok since my front delt's are worked some with the chest and the rear delt's will be nailed pretty good with my back workout I will concentrate mostly on the side delt's. I am already warmed up so I will just do one set of standing dumbell raised out to the side. 45 pounds dumbell's for 10 reps then 30 seconds later 35 pound dumbell's for 6 more. take another 10 minute break and nail tricep's with skull crushers, 1 set 165x8 then 30 seconds later for 2 more. Right after workout I eat a banana wait 10 minutes and drink a 60 grams whey protein malt, then 30 minutes later a hotdish with plenty of carb's and calories to restore glucose levels, then finally go to sleep.

[*Narkissos*]

Cardio after lifting isn't a good idea, ESPECIALLY when trying to gain muscle.

I think your reps are way too high for bulking also. Try to stick to 6-8 reps

Good advice overall.. but some points i don't agree with 100% bro...

Can we take it to the PMs?

No diss or anything... just to bump heads cus i know you're cool straight tru

[AandF6969]

Can we take it to the PMs?

For sure bro, hit me up

[XxElitexX]

How does this sound?
Chest:
Flat Dumbell 6-10 reps at 3 sets
Incline Barbell 6-10 reps at 3 sets
Incline Fly 8-12 reps at 4 sets

Back:
Pullups 12-25 reps at 3 sets
Bent barbell Row 6-8 reps at 3 sets
Deadlift 6-8 reps at 3 sets
Pull-down to front 6-10 reps at 3 sets

Shoulders:
Lateral Raise 6-10 reps at 3 sets
Bent Lateral 6-12 reps at 4 sets
Dumbell Press to front 6-10 reps at 4 sets


Traps:
Up right row/Shrug 6-12 reps at 6 sets

Legs:
Squat 8-12 reps at 4 sets
Leg-curl 8-12 reps at 4 sets

Calves:
Seated Calf raises 8-12 reps at 4 sets

Bicep:
Seated Dumbell curl 6-10 reps at 4 sets
Preacher bench dumbell curl 6-8 reps at 4 sets

Triceps:
SKull crushers 6-10 reps at 4 sets
Triceps press down 6-10 reps at 4 sets

This doesnt seem like enough sets to me, set me straight please....did it seem like i was overtraining or doing too many movements????Oh yeah and how long rest between these sets? It seems like i would be done in like 30 minutes with my normal rest periods. Thank you.

[XxElitexX]

Bump!

[jaffry20]

Bump!

Good luck Elite with ur cycle. I my self am going to be starting my first cycle soon, but am 5'8, 190 goal is 215. I have also been trainingsince 14, but never started actually lifting crazy till 16, so ive been lifting hard for goin on 5 yrs. Just remember to eat, I found since being a member here that eating is the key, no questions asked. Ill hopefully be starting my cycle next monday, ill be posting pics through out. Just fukin give'r bro and eat eat eat. It's easy to get over 3500 calories a day, just get up that much earlier and start eating, I try to have 3 lean meals done by 12 noon, just gotta get up and start eating, Happy growing bro, Later.

[XxElitexX]

Bump!!!!

[Odin]

You only really need 1 working set if you have enough intesity. Also if your doing 3 set's of 25 in pullup's before bent row'w, how much intesity will you have saved over to go all out? Enough to were you will be able to and 10 pound more every week?

[XxElitexX]

I guess i just dont understand. It doesnt seem like I would be working hard even though i bust my a$$ for a couple sets and leave the gym after 30 minutes.

[Odin]

I guess i just dont understand. It doesnt seem like I would be working hard even though i bust my a$$ for a couple sets and leave the gym after 30 minutes.

Well that's what Dorian Yates did, and a lot of the bro's on here do. Remember if you work out this way your able to hit that same muscle again in like 3-4 days, and your muscles would not be able to workout and recover with the other approach. Overtraining will not make you bigger. Give it a try for a couple of week's and 10pounds on every core lift every week.

[XxElitexX]

I will try that and keep you posted. I trust you guys. Peaceout!

[jgg1221]

165lbs and 305lb bench press, thats good for that weight. how tall are you?


also might wanna consider taking some form of casein based protein before you go to bed
its easy to get a whey/casein mix... the casein will give a great anti-catabolic effect

some creatine ethyl ester wouldnt hurt either

[XxElitexX]

Someone pm'ed me asked why I dont use shakes and i work in a supplement store. haha, well thats a good question, but I am allergic to whey...yeah i know it really is a tragedy but i get the worst squirts and nausea from it. It makes it even harder to reach my goals without protein shakes with the ease of use, but i have a foreman grill and I grill up all kinds of meats in the backroom hehe. I do use bars that dont have whey but mostly I half to rely on lean meats. I know I am not the only person that has it, believe me...one my buddies cant take it either.

[BeerBaron]

Someone pm'ed me asked why I dont use shakes and i work in a supplement store. haha, well thats a good question, but I am allergic to whey...yeah i know it really is a tragedy but i get the worst squirts and nausea from it. It makes it even harder to reach my goals without protein shakes with the ease of use, but i have a foreman grill and I grill up all kinds of meats in the backroom hehe. I do use bars that dont have whey but mostly I half to rely on lean meats. I know I am not the only person that has it, believe me...one my buddies cant take it either.

Don't sound like an alergic reaction to me. Some people get squirts from protein, and god knows it can make me sick to my stomach too. I got muscle milk instead, and let me tell you, that **** tastes good. You said you're in school, so am I, and I know with a busy college life style between bangin chicks and homework, sometimes shakes are the only thing I have time for. Plus the the make adding protein to a carb meal quick and easy.

Aside from that, I don't see forearms in your work out anywhere. Behind the back reverse wrist curls, and barbell wrist curls off the end of a bench.

[*Narkissos*]

How does this sound?
Chest:
Flat Dumbell 6-10 reps at 3 sets
Incline Barbell 6-10 reps at 3 sets
Incline Fly 8-12 reps at 4 sets

Back:
Pullups 12-25 reps at 3 sets
Bent barbell Row 6-8 reps at 3 sets
Deadlift 6-8 reps at 3 sets
Pull-down to front 6-10 reps at 3 sets

Shoulders:
Lateral Raise 6-10 reps at 3 sets
Bent Lateral 6-12 reps at 4 sets
Dumbell Press to front 6-10 reps at 4 sets


Traps:
Up right row/Shrug 6-12 reps at 6 sets

Legs:
Squat 8-12 reps at 4 sets
Leg-curl 8-12 reps at 4 sets

Calves:
Seated Calf raises 8-12 reps at 4 sets

Bicep:
Seated Dumbell curl 6-10 reps at 4 sets
Preacher bench dumbell curl 6-8 reps at 4 sets

Triceps:
SKull crushers 6-10 reps at 4 sets
Triceps press down 6-10 reps at 4 sets

This doesnt seem like enough sets to me, set me straight please....did it seem like i was overtraining or doing too many movements????Oh yeah and how long rest between these sets? It seems like i would be done in like 30 minutes with my normal rest periods. Thank you.

Doesn't sound too bad...looks pretty much like my routine..only thing my sets are bumped up to 5-6 sets per movement..volume working better with my body-type.AND my reps are higher (but so are my poundages... i do a lot of drop sets to keep me in my required 12-15+ rep range).

[SHRED]

DIET
Breakfast-Grape Nuts w/ splenda and protein shake
Mid Morning- Protein Bar of Can of Tuna
Lunch- Chicken Breast or Fish
Before WO- Protein Bar and Gatorade
PWO- Chicken Breast or Fish
PPWO- Tuna or Shake or Bar
Before Bed- 6-8 Egg Whites and scoop of PB

Where are your fat offerings? I only see one and its before bed.

[TheJuicer]

You should go over to the diet forum and get some advise from Swolecat...he set me straight on my diet...I never cut before...he set it up for me and man....I'm down 3lbs. in a week and it doesnt even feel like a diet....I'm not hungry ...but Swolecat could def. help you get swole...and also with you training....it needs work..

I'd do: 4 sets of Squats 12-15 reps
3 sets of Leg Press 12-15 reps
3 sets of Leg Curl 10-12 reps
I hit calves first and do
3 sets of Standing Calves really squeezing at the top
3 sets of Seated Calves """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
On other thing I saw was that you want to bring out you upper chest..then do incline work first...And I alway on shoulders do my press exercise first..DB,Bar,or Smith press...then hit the lat. raises...Just remember that more in your workout isnt always better...intensity is...IMO!!

[Jantzen4k]

Doesn't sound too bad...looks pretty much like my routine..only thing my sets are bumped up to 5-6 sets per movement..volume working better with my body-type.AND my reps are higher (but so are my poundages... i do a lot of drop sets to keep me in my required 12-15+ rep range).

yeah

[taiboxa]

Never Do Cardio On Leg Day Never Ever Ever Ever Ever!

[TheGame826]

Never Do Cardio On Leg Day Never Ever Ever Ever Ever!

I disagree always do cardio on leg day. Lactic acid builds up like crazy, only way to get rid of it is from oxygen. Cardio gets the blood flowing, blood carries oxygen.

I dont see what disadvantages there could be from doing alittle cardio. Either be stiff and sore as hell the next day or do some cardio and feel good.

Please let me know if there are any disadvantages though....