TRT causing balls to shrink up

**needmassx3** · 12-04-2009, 03:39 PM

I am currently taking 100 mg test c every week and 50 mg of clomid eod. (prescribed by my anti aging doc) However, I have been having trouble getting erections and my tesicles have really shrunken up. My blood results were:

Testoserone: 1443 in a range of 184 - 1171. So a little high
SHBG: 23 in a range of 13 - 71 so a little low
Free Androgen index : 217 range 30 - 95 Very high
Estradiol: 40 range 13 - 54 High but still in range

I went to speak with my doc a few weeks ago and asked him what I should do. He told me to get saw palmetto and zinc and see how that works for me. Honestly, the first week or so it actually did help quite a bit. My balls were hanging low, easy erections etc. However, it did not last. My balls are now even smaller than before and its really starting to worry me. (I even increased the clomid to see if that would help with no luck). I did some research and came across proviron , would that help with my balls or just erections? Could the doc prescribe that to me? Pretty desperate here thanks for your help

**tboney** · 12-04-2009, 03:44 PM

Hey bro, you need to discuss hcg with your doc. Also, I would not be taking clomid during my cycle. If your estrogen is high you need to be on an AI during your trt. What is your age? Hows your blood pressure? Any prostate issues? Thyroid issues?

**redz** · 12-04-2009, 03:45 PM

Definitely get some HCG .

**tboney** · 12-04-2009, 03:46 PM

With test levels that healthy I think there is something else going on. It could be estro? Could be psychological!

**EZ E** · 12-04-2009, 03:46 PM

This brings up a question for you guys on longterm TRT. Do you just accept that your balls will shrink and not worry about it or do you always use HCG ?

**yungone501** · 12-04-2009, 03:51 PM

Originally Posted by needmassx3

I am currently taking 100 mg test c every week and 50 mg of clomid eod. (prescribed by my anti aging doc) However, I have been having trouble getting erections and my tesicles have really shrunken up. My blood results were:

Clomid and test? Never heard of it.

**needmassx3** · 12-04-2009, 03:53 PM

Originally Posted by tboney

Hey bro, you need to discuss hcg with your doc. Also, I would not be taking clomid during my cycle. If your estrogen is high you need to be on an AI during your trt. What is your age? Hows your blood pressure? Any prostate issues? Thyroid issues?

I have taken hcg b4 but it didn't really help so he switched me to clomid. I still have quite a bit of HCG but I think its bad to take clomid and hcg at the same time.? not sure about that though. I could stop taking the clomid and start the hcg up in 2 weeks. Blood pressure and prostate are normal, very healthy heart. Im 27, 6' 4'' 240 lbs with 12% bf. Im strong as an ox but my libido has crashed.

**needmassx3** · 12-04-2009, 03:54 PM

Originally Posted by yungone501

Clomid and test? Never heard of it.

Well thats what my doctor prescribed. I also thought that taking clomid while on is useless and is proving so. Would you recomend proviron ?

**yungone501** · 12-04-2009, 04:01 PM

Originally Posted by needmassx3

Well thats what my doctor prescribed. I also thought that taking clomid while on is useless and is proving so. Would you recomend proviron?

Would love to know his logic behind this. Personally, Ive heard Proviron is good for the sex drive but it negatively impacts your HPTA, not that you should worry. You should ask the vets, I recommend Swifto.

**needmassx3** · 12-04-2009, 04:27 PM

Should I start the hcg now and stop clomid or wait till clomid leaves my system?

**needmassx3** · 12-04-2009, 04:36 PM

After reading one of swiftos post, does anyone recomend Naltrexone?

**yungone501** · 12-04-2009, 05:50 PM

You should just PM him and wait for his response tomorrow. PCT is his thang.

**Spyke** · 12-04-2009, 10:15 PM

Dude for standard hrt clomid is really strange. Plus 100mg is a pretty low dose. I think that a more reasonable program would be 150-175mg test cyp, plus arimidex and the standard hcg program......

Look for a new doc.......the clinics have alway been a really shitty way to do HRT IMO.... I doubt that any MD even reviews your charts for real, just gives it the old rubber stamp

**kingofthedt** · 12-04-2009, 11:04 PM

Will someone chime in on his question...is shrinkage inevitable on TRT? Then, if you do shrink, is it reversible? Thanks.

**needmassx3** · 12-05-2009, 09:41 AM

Bump

**hankdiesel** · 12-05-2009, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by Spyke

Dude for standard hrt clomid is really strange. Plus 100mg is a pretty low dose. I think that a more reasonable program would be 150-175mg test cyp, plus arimidex and the standard hcg program......

Look for a new doc.......the clinics have alway been a really shitty way to do HRT IMO.... I doubt that any MD even reviews your charts for real, just gives it the old rubber stamp

His test levels are pretty high. The issue here is not that he is not taking enough test.

**Vettester** · 12-05-2009, 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by kingofthedt

Will someone chime in on his question...is shrinkage inevitable on TRT? Then, if you do shrink, is it reversible? Thanks.

My doctor states that HCG will revitalize the testicular issues. I just got through posting an HCG protocol that I did in November, which brought up a lot of debate about how it was administered, as for my doctor had me stop my Test shots, wait two weeks, then do a 10 day mega blast of HCG. In my case, I'll be changing it up from hereon and I will using HCG in conjuction with my HRT, just small doses without stopping my HRT routine.

IMO, there is a very good chance that testicular atrophy will occur if one is on HRT. And yes, IMO, it can be reversed if HCG is included in the program.

**THORSZ** · 12-05-2009, 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by kingofthedt

Will someone chime in on his question...is shrinkage inevitable on TRT? Then, if you do shrink, is it reversible? Thanks.

Yeah it is normal. Mine shrink a little at 100MG EW and get smaller as I increase the dose. It is reversible. Doesn't bother me a bit. Actually makes other parts look bigger. Lol
I would get an AI for your estogen and that will probably fix he erection thing. Drop the clomid and don't sweat the nuts.

**needmassx3** · 12-05-2009, 04:45 PM

can i start hcg right now or should i wait until clomid is out of the system

**zaggahamma** · 12-05-2009, 04:50 PM

yes the balls should shrink inevitably and most people i've heard of that added the hcg have reversed that and very few ppl have had any negative to say of adding it either...sorry dont know about the clomid

**needmassx3** · 12-05-2009, 04:56 PM

And Ive read alot of different amounts for the HCG , how much/ how frequent should i inject?

**needmassx3** · 12-06-2009, 08:20 PM

BUMP. Could my ed be from high prolactin levels? Anyone???

**needmassx3** · 12-06-2009, 08:21 PM

Ive started HCG 500 ius eod for 2 days, then 250 ius eod after that. I'll post my progress but Im starting to think my ed could be from High prolactin because my androgen levels were so high. Any thoughts?? And Ive ordered arimidex and will be working that in as soon as it gets to my door.

**ZonaDave** · 12-07-2009, 01:21 AM

Originally Posted by needmassx3

Ive started HCG 500 ius eod for 2 days, then 250 ius eod after that. I'll post my progress but Im starting to think my ed could be from High prolactin because my androgen levels were so high. Any thoughts?? And Ive ordered arimidex and will be working that in as soon as it gets to my door.

most guys do well on 250iu EOD. do you have latest blood results with ranges? curious about your E2 level but prolactin can also be an issue.

**needmassx3** · 12-07-2009, 02:07 AM

Originally Posted by ZonaDave

most guys do well on 250iu EOD. do you have latest blood results with ranges? curious about your E2 level but prolactin can also be an issue.

I dont have prolactin levels, but the more I read the more I think that could be the problem. Since starting the HCG I have noticed my balls get a little bigger so that is a good sign. Still having trouble getting a real solid erection though it is a little better. Im hopefully going to get some cabergoline and see if that makes a difference with the prolactin symptoms.

**Spyke** · 12-07-2009, 07:21 AM

Since I have been back on the board, I have noticed that guys are doing 250iu of hcg every other day....... The danger with hcg has always been the chance that it could desensitize the cells in the testes that actually produce test..... so the idea has always been to use just enough to prevent shrinkage and no more.... the old 250iu 2 days before you inject and 250iu the day before always worked fine for everyone.... so I wonder why some docs changed it

**needmassx3** · 12-10-2009, 02:48 PM

Ok so I just wanted to give an update on my situation, the hcg I've been taking has been working really well. Ive been off the clomid and Im taking 250 ius of hcg and .5 mg adex eod. I feel 10x better only a few days of switching and my balls are returning to normal. Thanks for the help guys, Ive also ordered some cabergoline just in case.

**tboney** · 12-10-2009, 03:16 PM

Glad to here it bro! But why do you think you need caber? Are you taking a 19 nor???

**needmassx3** · 12-10-2009, 03:31 PM

Originally Posted by tboney

Glad to here it bro! But why do you think you need caber? Are you taking a 19 nor???

I ordered it because I suspected my prolactin levls were high and it only set me back $40. Its more of a precautionary thing than anything

**zaggahamma** · 12-10-2009, 08:29 PM

is there any harm to running caber like this...as a precautionary measure? needmass...wut has the caber done for your?

**needmassx3** · 12-11-2009, 09:51 AM

Originally Posted by jpkman

is there any harm to running caber like this...as a precautionary measure? needmass...wut has the caber done for your?

Im not going to run it if I dont need to, I just want to have it on hand in case I have ED problems again. If I do I'll take .5 2x a week and see if it balances me out. As of rightnow though, I wont be taking it.

**needmassx3** · 12-17-2009, 12:00 PM

So I'm back with another update, Im not sure what is going on with my body. After starting the hcg and adex my body seemed to return to normal. For about a week my balls were back and I could get erections. However, I am back to the same problem that I had before. Balls are starting to shrink up again and i cant get erections. I am considering coming off hrt completely because of this. I dont have any recent bloodwork except for the results I posted above. I am taking 250 iu hcg eod and .5 adex ed w/ 100 mg test c a week. Anyone have any suggestions?

**tboney** · 12-17-2009, 12:26 PM

Bro, you need to get some blood work done to find out what might be going on. Also get your thyroid, bp, and blood sugar checked.

**subnet** · 12-17-2009, 08:49 PM

.5 adex every day - I know you want to knock your E2 level down but isn't a more typical dosage .25 E3d or so? Perhaps that's it (guessing)?

**zaggahamma** · 12-17-2009, 09:13 PM

Originally Posted by subnet

.5 adex every day - I know you want to knock your E2 level down but isn't a more typical dosage .25 E3d or so? Perhaps that's it (guessing)?

its all individual...yes thats a typical(.25 eod) but....all individual....

but come to think of it...has anyone had a higher dose of arimidex for a long time???????

anyone???

**needmassx3** · 12-18-2009, 04:16 PM

Originally Posted by subnet

.5 adex every day - I know you want to knock your E2 level down but isn't a more typical dosage .25 E3d or so? Perhaps that's it (guessing)?

Yeah I was thinking the same thing, maybe my e2 dropped too low. I will cut back and see if I notice a difference

**kingofthedt** · 12-31-2009, 04:49 AM

I am starting my week 4 of 100 mg Test Cyp per week and I can tell you that your balls most definitely do shrink. Not dramatically but enough that I can notice it.

**needmassx3** · 01-04-2010, 02:12 AM

k well I'm still not having much luck with my ed issues. What are the blood tests I should get done to identify the problem?

**zaggahamma** · 01-04-2010, 09:45 PM

Originally Posted by needmassx3

k well I'm still not having much luck with my ed issues. What are the blood tests I should get done to identify the problem?

problems/health issues cant always be found in blood...could be an injury and/or phsycological....but i would check everything lipids, hormones, glucose, psa, liver, white/red bloodcells, vitamin b (a-z actually)....sorry, refresh...has this problem just came about or b4 TRT?