Constitution- Bill of Rights...

[thegodfather]

Just thought that you should all be familiar with this document. I think it may enhance some debates we have in this forum and possibly people will re-evaluate their position on certain topics of discussion.
__________________________________________________ _______________

Bill of Rights
Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.


Amendment II

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.


Amendment III

No soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.


Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.


Amendment V

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.


Amendment VI

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.


Amendment VII

In suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury, shall be otherwise reexamined in any court of the United States, than according to the rules of the common law.


Amendment VIII

Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.


Amendment IX

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.


Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

[Pooks]

... and u can begin with the Federalists for starting to screw the bill of rights up.. and Yes George Washington was a Federalist..

Federalist party ended up going out of business cause it sided with signing a PEACE DEAL with the British in 1812..

Republicans beleived we could defeat the much stronger British in 1812.. but the Federalists, believed it was foolish, and were about to sign a behind the Republican backs peace deal.. when the U.S defeated a much bigger British army in New Orleans..

that major victory ended the war, with the United States as the victors.. and it made the Federalists looks so stupid, they had to scrap the whole party..

unfortunately, the federalists emerged under a new name called "Democrats" and went even further screw up the bill of rights, by seizing State, and citizen rights,...and giving more power and oversight to the federal government.

[LawMan018]

... and u can begin with the Federalists for starting to screw the bill of rights up.. and Yes George Washington was a Federalist..

Federalist party ended up going out of business cause it sided with signing a PEACE DEAL with the British in 1812..

Republicans beleived we could defeat the much stronger British in 1812.. but the Federalists, believed it was foolish, and were about to sign a behind the Republican backs peace deal.. when the U.S defeated a much bigger British army in New Orleans..

that major victory ended the war, with the United States as the victors.. and it made the Federalists looks so stupid, they had to scrap the whole party..

unfortunately, the federalists emerged under a new name called "Democrats"

compared to a leader who has made his entire country look stupid, I think the Republicans take the cake...

[Pooks]

compared to a leader who has made his entire country look stupid, I think the Republicans take the cake...

U must had not watched the news lately,, cause we';re kicking some serious ass right now in the Middle-east.

Iran is pacified.
Iraq is just about under control, with the Kurds, sunnis, and shi'ites actually working together.
Syria has STFU'd

Isreal and Palestine are doing alright too, setting the stage for future peace deals.

The doom and Gloomers and full of BS and stuck in spring/early summer of 2007 thinking. Things have changed as more time has passed.. now we got a clearer image of what is happening there than well anytime before.

[thegodfather]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGPwXYAmZzQ

[Pooks]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGPwXYAmZzQ

I loved Keith, when he was on SportsCenter, but when it comes to his MSNBC job he's a complete one-sided moron. Every clip of his is like watching vocabulary diarhea coming out of a donkey's ass.

Can anyone actually listen to this whole clip. without blowing their brains out?


I was really hoping it was gonna be some good Ron Paul clip hehe luv those

[Panzerfaust]

I don't recognize those 'Bill of Rights". What are those?




I am sure there will be some post who will say they have never heard of most of them.

[Logan13]

I don't recognize those 'Bill of Rights". What are those?




I am sure there will be some post who will say they have never heard of most of them.

Which of those Rights have you personally been deprived of?

[SMCengineer]

^^^
Amendment II

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.



Logan, Your finally back! I love it.

[Logan13]

^^^
Amendment II

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.



Logan, Your finally back! I love it.

But seriously, which of these rights have any of us in here been personally deprived of?

[SMCengineer]

^^Dude we've gone over this already and you had no reasonable response the first time I presented it to you, yet you continue to believe that no one is ever personally violated. Maybe you missed most of Operation Raw Deal. You see no rights that were violated in that little debacle? I don't mean against the dealers themselves. You have a right to privacy in your emails although you like that to think that because the US is looking for "the bad guys" it's ok to if they come upon other information as well.

Plus, you think it's easy to get a gun in NY?

[Logan13]

^^Dude we've gone over this already and you had no reasonable response the first time I presented it to you, yet you continue to believe that no one is ever personally violated. Maybe you missed most of Operation Raw Deal. You see no rights that were violated in that little debacle? I don't mean against the dealers themselves. You have a right to privacy in your emails although you like that to think that because the US is looking for "the bad guys" it's ok to if they come upon other information as well.

Plus, you think it's easy to get a gun in NY?

Operation Raw Deal stemmed from over seas.
Your belief that there are victims, yet you have just not heard of any is no better position. You give me a name, and then we can discuss it. Until there is a victim, there is no "crime" against our rights.

[soccer#3]

good post godfather. know and excersize ur rights

[thegodfather]

But seriously, which of these rights have any of us in here been personally deprived of?

Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.



That applies to information. 350,000,000 Americans have been deprived of their 4th Amendment right. When telecom companies are in bed with the NSA and hanging over every single piece of electronic communication that goes on WITHIN our borders, that is a clear violation of said Constitutional right. Every single one of us has been a victim if the NSA's "sniffing" software has had a chance to scan our electronic transmission for "keywords" without a warrant or due process. NO WARRANT=NO LISTENING/SNIFFING.

How is this such a hard concept to grasp? You're e-mail is your "letter," and you address it to one recipient. When I e-mail someone, it is usually to one person, if I felt the NSA needed to see it, I'd probably include them in the To: line as well. It's no different than if the NSA were to start opening all the mail we send through the post office. Hell, maybe thats even what needs to happen for you people to start actually giving a shit about your rights.

[hardgainer12]

Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.



That applies to information. 350,000,000 Americans have been deprived of their 4th Amendment right. When telecom companies are in bed with the NSA and hanging over every single piece of electronic communication that goes on WITHIN our borders, that is a clear violation of said Constitutional right. Every single one of us has been a victim if the NSA's "sniffing" software has had a chance to scan our electronic transmission for "keywords" without a warrant or due process. NO WARRANT=NO LISTENING/SNIFFING.

How is this such a hard concept to grasp? You're e-mail is your "letter," and you address it to one recipient. When I e-mail someone, it is usually to one person, if I felt the NSA needed to see it, I'd probably include them in the To: line as well. It's no different than if the NSA were to start opening all the mail we send through the post office. Hell, maybe thats even what needs to happen for you people to start actually giving a shit about your rights.

i lived in an area for 4 months KNOWING for a fact that every phone call or text message i sent or recieved was being monitered. i still lived my life normal. why are you constantly posting up and complaining about this. id rather my government search for the enemy than sit around and hope nothing happens.

[Pooks]

Media and lawyers are tight, and the lawyers are twisted, and make money in twisted ways..

bottom line, without putting any effort into this post.. the American public is so brainwwashed... that its like a giant turd slowly flowing towards the moon in a cartboard box.. that don't make any sense and thats fine with me.. I hate doing school work on a friday blah

[thegodfather]

i lived in an area for 4 months KNOWING for a fact that every phone call or text message i sent or recieved was being monitered. i still lived my life normal. why are you constantly posting up and complaining about this. id rather my government search for the enemy than sit around and hope nothing happens.

Lol...I almost cant even respond seriously to a post like this. Why am I constantly posting up about this... Because it is in inalienable right that you have. You do not just give it up at will. "He who sacrafices liberty for security recieves NEITHER"-Benjamin Franklin. It is a completely false sense of security, and it makes everyone a suspect. These are the tactics of the Stassi police, the Guistappo, not a purported free society. Those amendments RESTRAIN government, ensuring your rights. The government does not GIVE you your rights. It has no authority to GRANT you those rights, they inalienable, that means you are BORN with them.

Jesus christ...You people need to go sign up at community college and take Intro to Politics or something. The level of ignorance in regard to your civil rights and WHY they are there, and what kind of activity they prevent from happening is ****ing sickening to be quite honest. I feel like I'm talking to myself or something.

[brjrj0000]

im with you godfather

[bigt10]

Pooks your right but ron paul put it different.

Our dollar is falling to the shit we cant keep fighting over seas trying to keep a world empire.

When the gov goes to war AMERICA IS NOT PROFITING.

What is profiting is our banks, oil companies, war companies.

Basically the people of this country are paying for this war effort and are being ****ined robbed of their money.

The citizens of this country have nothing to gain from this and our paying a bill so that wall street can earn money over seas.

Bring the ****in troops home from around the world, stop policing the world, defend our own nation.

In case you havent noticed ron pauls 3 biggest supporters are the army, navy, and air force.

Anyways thats a really poor statement to say were benefiting finnacially. At as ron paul said the poor and middle class are being robbed and they are paying the higher prices. We are at war with the world, run away inflation, the government keeps printing more money and the only people who are using it while its worth something are wallstreet.

Dont be silly AMERICA is not profiting from this war, only the banks, oil companies, big construction companies, war companies are PROFITING from a WAR payed by the PEOPLE so that WALL STREET is making MONEY of a war financed by the PEOPLE.

And in one of ron pauls video, just cause our overal numbers are well is a poor sign. anyone can be wealthy if they borrow money and dont have to pay it back. and a printing press is not a way to prosperity.

The funds are going from you to wallstreet.

[Pooks]

Pooks your right but ron paul put it different.

Our dollar is falling to the shit we cant keep fighting over seas trying to keep a world empire.

When the gov goes to war AMERICA IS NOT PROFITING.

What is profiting is our banks, oil companies, war companies.

Basically the people of this country are paying for this war effort and are being ****ined robbed of their money.

The citizens of this country have nothing to gain from this and our paying a bill so that wall street can earn money over seas.

Bring the ****in troops home from around the world, stop policing the world, defend our own nation.

In case you havent noticed ron pauls 3 biggest supporters are the army, navy, and air force.

Anyways thats a really poor statement to say were benefiting finnacially. At as ron paul said the poor and middle class are being robbed and they are paying the higher prices. We are at war with the world, run away inflation, the government keeps printing more money and the only people who are using it while its worth something are wallstreet.

Dont be silly AMERICA is not profiting from this war, only the banks, oil companies, big construction companies, war companies are PROFITING from a WAR payed by the PEOPLE so that WALL STREET is making MONEY of a war financed by the PEOPLE.

And in one of ron pauls video, just cause our overal numbers are well is a poor sign. anyone can be wealthy if they borrow money and dont have to pay it back. and a printing press is not a way to prosperity.

The funds are going from you to wallstreet.

Ok you also need to read Henry Hazlitt "Economics in one lesson" who is

1. a Liberitarian.
2. Austrian Economic legend.
3. One of Ron Paul's idols.

If wall street, banks, oil, and other american companies profit from the Iraqi war as you state...

than guess what!

WE PROFIT ALSO!
cause they pay us, they hire us.. the more these companies make, the more people they can hire, and the more branches and other building they can open up for business.. also they can offer you more line of credit for you to do the same!

WE PAY TAXES ----> TAXES TO GO PAY FOR WAR -------> THEY PAY U.S CONTRACTORS, OIL COMPANIES WHATEVER, US COMPANIES ====> MONEY COMES BACK INTO OUR ECONOMY --------> COMES BACK TO YOUR POCKET.

yes it is not as nice as... (the no war scenario, with a republican president)

(WE PAY VERY LITTLE TAXES -----> WE HAVE OUR MONEY TO SPEND OUR WAY -----> SMALL AND A BIG VARIETY OF BUSINESS PROSPERS FROM SHOE COMPANIES TO OTHER APPAREL TO FANCY CARS ETC -----> THOSE COMPANIES EXPAND AND HIRE MORE EMPLOYEES, OR OUR WAGES GO UP etc, and our money returns to us this way..

BUT its STILL A LOT BETTER THAN THE WACK ASS DEMOCRAT WAY (during peacetime)

WE PAY BIG ASS TAX BILLS -----> MONEY GOES TO PAY ALL SORTS OF WACK ASS UNEFFICIENG GOVT AGENCIES ----> MONEY GETS REDISTRIBUTED TO THE POOR AND OTHER WELFARE SYSTEMS ----> WHO BUY GOODS ----> SUPPORT COMPANIES THAT HIRE US PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY WORK--> cycle repeats.. with a huge welfare system being supported by hard workign individuals, who never have enough money to start their own business or get nice things..

and if they're SUPPORT WACK ASS DYING INDUSTRIES, like the CAR INDUSTRY with TARRIFFS or farms with subsidies.. than we also making our workforce slowly obsolete.. and are being double taxed by needlessly expensive products..or maybe they'll support FULL EMPLOYMENT WITH MADE UP WACK ASS GOVT PROJECTS like building useless Damn.. this is all taking our tax money that we could be using to buy things we really need.. or corporate tax money they could be using to hire people, and sell things people actually need..

and this is just the tip of the iceberg with what is wrong about the democrat party system... and this is during peace time..

During war time.. the democrat party way.. woudl completely collapse like the Soviet Union and we'd be ****ED forever... its not even applicable we'd be so messed up.

[Panzerfaust]

i lived in an area for 4 months KNOWING for a fact that every phone call or text message i sent or recieved was being monitered. i still lived my life normal. why are you constantly posting up and complaining about this. id rather my government search for the enemy than sit around and hope nothing happens.

Bwahahahaah!

We have a catch folks!

[kruelgene]

Very stimulating….

[Panzerfaust]

Our taxes pay for the war?

Then why does the gov't borrow money from China to finance this war? Communist China is only our 2nd highest loaner with Japan being #1. Our "taxes" must not be enough huh?

Not a big deal, we are only in debt to China $250 Billion in 2005..no telling how much now. We were only $683 Billion ion debt to Japan in 2005...with alot of the private market stepping in to loan money. China loans in the majority are from their givernment.

[Panzerfaust]

I like this quote:

If the Chinese decide to cut back their investment, that decision could drive U.S. interest rates up. The Carnegie Endowment's Keidel isn't too worried about that either. "The force that manages U.S. interest rates is the Federal Reserve," he pointed out. "The U.S. Federal Reserve has enormous resources. What the Chinese might do can't really compete with what the Fed would do."

LOL! Of course that is nothing that the "Fed" would/could do. They control the ****ing printing presses. haha Making it sound liek the "Fed" is a friend of the US and could pull out the stops if needed. haha Sure, they would "bail" us out etc..but it won't be for ****ing free. haha

[SMCengineer]

Operation Raw Deal stemmed from over seas.
Your belief that there are victims, yet you have just not heard of any is no better position. You give me a name, and then we can discuss it. Until there is a victim, there is no "crime" against our rights.

My belief stems from the fact that my source was busted during operation raw deal and a few weeks later my hushmail account was breached (as we discussed) and a week later it was terminated. Now you can sit there and act like no ones rights are violated or brush it off and say "it was just a isolated incident", but don't act like rights aren't violated. I have a right to my privacy. Moreover, I have a right to put whatever the hell I want in my body, yet I am restricted by the government. I guess that's not a violation of my rights either, correct?

If you go to any supermarket and try to buy sudafed you'll find that you get id'ed because you have to be over 27 to buy it, but no one has a problem with that. We are gradually, in very small increments, moving towards a socialized society where the government knows what's better for you than you know, yet you and most other people suggest that the government doesn't violate any rights. Do you really think that when the goverment violates your rights that they do it maliciously? No, they're doing it because they think it's what will be better for society as whole, but the fact remains that they are violating your rights.

About the gun issue, I'm interested to know where you stand on it considering that it's one right that continuously gets violated yet no one seems to care or maybe you think they're allowed to to keep guns out of innocent civilians hands. Again, the government does this with good intentions at heart, but, let's face it, gun control is ineffective at lowering crime.

[StoneGRMI]

^^^
Amendment II

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.



Logan, Your finally back! I love it.

I wish I had bear arms. ROOOOAAAAAAARRRR!

[SMCengineer]

^^That would be cool actually.

[thegodfather]

My belief stems from the fact that my source was busted during operation raw deal and a few weeks later my hushmail account was breached (as we discussed) and a week later it was terminated. Now you can sit there and act like no ones rights are violated or brush it off and say "it was just a isolated incident", but don't act like rights aren't violated. I have a right to my privacy. Moreover, I have a right to put whatever the hell I want in my body, yet I am restricted by the government. I guess that's not a violation of my rights either, correct?

If you go to any supermarket and try to buy sudafed you'll find that you get id'ed because you have to be over 27 to buy it, but no one has a problem with that. We are gradually, in very small increments, moving towards a socialized society where the government knows what's better for you than you know, yet you and most other people suggest that the government doesn't violate any rights. Do you really think that when the goverment violates your rights that they do it maliciously? No, they're doing it because they think it's what will be better for society as whole, but the fact remains that they are violating your rights.

About the gun issue, I'm interested to know where you stand on it considering that it's one right that continuously gets violated yet no one seems to care or maybe you think they're allowed to to keep guns out of innocent civilians hands. Again, the government does this with good intentions at heart, but, let's face it, gun control is ineffective at lowering crime.

I agree whole heartedly with your post. Except with regards to your Hushmail account being terminated. Its quite clear how the DEA obtained the warrants they did, because of the open sourcing going on on SSB, a blundering idiot could have figured out where half of those sources lived. They were in violation of the laws of the land, I dont agree with them, but the fact remains.

I fully support the idea of being able to put whatever substance you want into your body. And there is no Constitutional provision to legislate such behavior.

[rockinred]

My belief stems from the fact that my source was busted during operation raw deal and a few weeks later my hushmail account was breached (as we discussed) and a week later it was terminated. Now you can sit there and act like no ones rights are violated or brush it off and say "it was just a isolated incident", but don't act like rights aren't violated. I have a right to my privacy. Moreover, I have a right to put whatever the hell I want in my body, yet I am restricted by the government. I guess that's not a violation of my rights either, correct?

If you go to any supermarket and try to buy sudafed you'll find that you get id'ed because you have to be over 27 to buy it, but no one has a problem with that. We are gradually, in very small increments, moving towards a socialized society where the government knows what's better for you than you know, yet you and most other people suggest that the government doesn't violate any rights. Do you really think that when the goverment violates your rights that they do it maliciously? No, they're doing it because they think it's what will be better for society as whole, but the fact remains that they are violating your rights.

About the gun issue, I'm interested to know where you stand on it considering that it's one right that continuously gets violated yet no one seems to care or maybe you think they're allowed to to keep guns out of innocent civilians hands. Again, the government does this with good intentions at heart, but, let's face it, gun control is ineffective at lowering crime.

good post... I have to agree with the majority of it.. I am really hurt that the government bans steroid ....what's next? I got one! let's make a law that limits the amount of food intake because too much can be bad for your health and change your body's structure. Nah, that would never fly...let's throw in that heavy over weight people are more "depressed"....yes, now we have a case... kind of like adding the whole "roid rage ".lol... i know there is more to that, but they are also similar in a lot of ways.

Maybe I should look to the government to enact a law that will protect me from myself??? lol

Ok, just wanted to ramble on with you... btw, I am not against the government in all areas or anything like that, but I am a little touchy with some of these that go over the line.

[Pooks]

Our taxes pay for the war?

Then why does the gov't borrow money from China to finance this war? Communist China is only our 2nd highest loaner with Japan being #1. Our "taxes" must not be enough huh?

Not a big deal, we are only in debt to China $250 Billion in 2005..no telling how much now. We were only $683 Billion ion debt to Japan in 2005...with alot of the private market stepping in to loan money. China loans in the majority are from their givernment.

Thats not borrowed money..
That is invested money.. THAT IS OUR MONEY... if the the United States filed bankrupcy, the chinese would be last on the list to regain any of their investment.. just as investors are when a stock they invest in, goes bunk.. in other words, they won't ever get it back,, unless the United States prospers..

BORROWED = INVESTED.. because IMPORTS have to equal EXPORTS..
but our IMPORTS from CHINA are way beyond any manufactured export from the United States that means..

that the chinese are left with the UNITED STATES DOLLAR..

they have two choices 1. HORDE THE U.S DOLLARS. (bad idea because of inflation)

or 2. re-invest those DOLLARS back into the UNITED STATES.. and into our economy..

and they choose option 2.

IF THEY EVER DECIDE TO RETAKE THEIR INVESTMENT..
their only options woould be
1. GO BACK INTO U.S DOLLAR FORM.. would SKYROCKET THE VALUE OF THE DOLLAR!!!

or 2. buy some U.S PRODUCTS... which they refuse to do now cause they are too expensive..

this is a whole champter in Henry Hazlitt's book also..

the higher the IMPORT vs. actual good EXPORT ratio is.. the wealthier the nation..

so its actually good thing..

the 'borrowed' term is a wack spin on 'invested'.... and its being tossed out there obviously by people with an agenda against the current administration.

[SMCengineer]

Maybe I should look to the government to enact a law that will protect me from myself??? lol

You mean to say more laws to protect you from yourself.

[bigt10]

well pooks you make some interesting points, im not sure what to say.

but we cant change the fact we should be at war with the world spending all the peoples tax money and borrowing money to finance a world empire trying to police the world ( all the other places we have troops, building bases over seas, etc)

What we should really do is defend our own nation. Make a bases along mexico so these illegal immigrants stop coming up here, and insure they dont receive any of our healthcare, education, and when born dont become citizens.

The government is bankrupting us, the dollar keeps falling worth 4 cents in real money, the printing press is not the answer. and we need to start spending less.

the only one with a real solution is ron paul that wont change.

[Logan13]

My belief stems from the fact that my source was busted during operation raw deal and a few weeks later my hushmail account was breached (as we discussed) and a week later it was terminated. Now you can sit there and act like no ones rights are violated or brush it off and say "it was just a isolated incident", but don't act like rights aren't violated. I have a right to my privacy. Moreover, I have a right to put whatever the hell I want in my body, yet I am restricted by the government. I guess that's not a violation of my rights either, correct?

If you go to any supermarket and try to buy sudafed you'll find that you get id'ed because you have to be over 27 to buy it, but no one has a problem with that. We are gradually, in very small increments, moving towards a socialized society where the government knows what's better for you than you know, yet you and most other people suggest that the government doesn't violate any rights. Do you really think that when the goverment violates your rights that they do it maliciously? No, they're doing it because they think it's what will be better for society as whole, but the fact remains that they are violating your rights.

About the gun issue, I'm interested to know where you stand on it considering that it's one right that continuously gets violated yet no one seems to care or maybe you think they're allowed to to keep guns out of innocent civilians hands. Again, the government does this with good intentions at heart, but, let's face it, gun control is ineffective at lowering crime.

So your friend was breaking the law, and his email messages that were sent overseas were confiscated. Boo-hoo. If he wasn't breaking the law, there would be no issue.

[Logan13]

Thats not borrowed money..
That is invested money.. THAT IS OUR MONEY... if the the United States filed bankrupcy, the chinese would be last on the list to regain any of their investment.. just as investors are when a stock they invest in, goes bunk.. in other words, they won't ever get it back,, unless the United States prospers..

BORROWED = INVESTED.. because IMPORTS have to equal EXPORTS..
but our IMPORTS from CHINA are way beyond any manufactured export from the United States that means..

that the chinese are left with the UNITED STATES DOLLAR..

they have two choices 1. HORDE THE U.S DOLLARS. (bad idea because of inflation)

or 2. re-invest those DOLLARS back into the UNITED STATES.. and into our economy..

and they choose option 2.

IF THEY EVER DECIDE TO RETAKE THEIR INVESTMENT..
their only options woould be
1. GO BACK INTO U.S DOLLAR FORM.. would SKYROCKET THE VALUE OF THE DOLLAR!!!

or 2. buy some U.S PRODUCTS... which they refuse to do now cause they are too expensive..

this is a whole champter in Henry Hazlitt's book also..

the higher the IMPORT vs. actual good EXPORT ratio is.. the wealthier the nation..

so its actually good thing..

the 'borrowed' term is a wack spin on 'invested'.... and its being tossed out there obviously by people with an agenda against the current administration.

I find it hilarious that none of these tin foil helmet soldiers ever respond after they have their uninformed perceptions shot down with actual facts. They just move on to the next thread, re-stating that which they know to be wrong. I guess it would be nice if we could bend the truth to fit our own personal hysterias.......

[thegodfather]

So your friend was breaking the law, and his email messages that were sent overseas were confiscated. Boo-hoo. If he wasn't breaking the law, there would be no issue.

I agree with this, but only if the DEA confiscated these things with warrants from US courts. What I would have a serious problem with, is if the Patriot Act with the warrantless wiretapping and what not, started to take down drug dealers and other criminals under that bill. I would object to this because it was intended for 'terrorists', and not to extend policing powers for other crimes. In that case, I would say many people would start to be personally affected. Of course we also have no way of knowing if such methods were used or not, since there is essentially no oversight.


Also, I would appreciate you not try to classify me as a "tinfoil hat," as I always back up what I say with evidence, and I rarely speak on Economics, because I do not have a degree in economics, and its an area that I know significantly less about than I do about Constitutional law. So, as most of my posts are geared towards Constitutional law and rights, I always articulate my posts with constitutional interpretations and how certain laws or practices by the government are in contraindictation with the Constitution. And honestly, the name calling thing is mostly used when you are looking to discredit a persons opinion. I would preferr you stick to your previous method of providing evidence to discredit peoples opinions rather than reducing your arguments to name calling.... Thanks

[SMCengineer]

So your friend was breaking the law, and his email messages that were sent overseas were confiscated. Boo-hoo. If he wasn't breaking the law, there would be no issue.

Address the rest of the post.

[rockinred]

I can talk Economics...I am fairly decent, but it looks like it would be with Pooks, which btw, what he stated isn't necessarily all facts either... my reference in this post was to constitutional rights related to steroids ... not interested in talking about the U.S. dollar. but i can if Logan is referring to me as having a tin foil helmet?

[SMCengineer]

I can talk Economics...I am fairly decent, but it looks like it would be with Pooks, which btw, what he stated isn't necessary all facts either... my reference in this post was to constitutional rights related to steroids ... not interested in talking about the U.S. dollar. but i can if Logan is referring to me as having a tin foil helmet?

He's referring to anyone who challenges his righteousness or anyone that callenges the fact that the US can do no wrong.

[rockinred]

He's referring to anyone who challenges his righteousness or anyone that callenges the fact that the US can do no wrong.

I can be patriotic too, but I am not going to act blind to everything and anything. Maybe when I was 18 years old I was kind of like that... but I call that youth. heck, i have fought for this country on 3 different deployments...that doesn't mean I am going to say yes sir the rest of my life.. like i said onto your post i am not all against anything.. just have an opinion that I hope I at least educated myself on before i conclude it.

[Pooks]

I can be patriotic too, but I am not going to act blind to everything and anything. Maybe when I was 18 years old I was kind of like that... but I call that youth. heck, i have fought for this country on 3 different deployments...that doesn't mean I am going to say yes sir the rest of my life.. like i said onto your post i am not all against anything.. just have an opinion that I hope I at least educated myself on before i conclude it.

Sure u can ask the democrats to legalize Steroids , and they will probably say YES! WE CAN HELP U!.. just to win your vote.

The democrats remind me of XERXES in the movie 300.
when he offers Sparta anything it wants, all Sparta has to do is bow down to him.

The democrats offer promises left and right, to anyone with a sad story. They tell them, they were wronged by others, and that they can fix all their problems and etc.. they just don't mention the cost of it all.. or they just the "wealthy".. but they don't say its the people who cut your your paycheck every week.. or it even might be you, cause u actually make money and file taxes.

in the end all it does is enslave the nation to a system of heavy taxation, and systematically bleed us into the exact type of indebted slavery and eventual poverty that Ron Paul warns us about.