sale of F16 fighter jets 2 Iraq

[deliverance]

WASHINGTON, Sep. 5, 2008 (Reuters) — The Iraqi government has asked for information about buying 36 F-16 fighter aircraft built by Lockheed Martin Corp, the U.S. Defense Department said on Friday.
The F-16, made by Lockheed Martin Corp, in an undated photo. The Iraqi government is seeking to buy 36 advanced F-16 fighters from the U.S., American military officials familiar with the request told the Wall Street Journal. REUTERS/Lockheed Martin Corp/HanThe request, received August 27, is being reviewed "in the normal course of business" as part of the U.S. government-to-government arms sale process, said Air Force Lt. Col. Patrick Ryder, a Pentagon spokesman.

Updated F-16s are among the world's most advanced multirole fighters and a powerful symbol of military ties to the United States.

Iraq's interest in the fighter jet, reported first by The Wall Street Journal, could spark concerns among neighbors worried about advanced arms in the hands of a country still facing major internal challenges.

U.S. reviews of possible arms sale can take a year or more. They involve the departments of State and Defense as well as Congress and weigh power balances, technology security and other thorny issues. If a contract were ultimately signed, deliveries could take another year or more, depending on the model in question.

The Pentagon did not specify which F-16 version Iraq was eyeing, nor whether it was new or refurbished. A Lockheed spokesman referred questions to the Pentagon.

F-16C/D Block 50/52 models are now being produced for Poland, Israel, Greece and Pakistan. The United Arab Emirates was the maiden customer for the Block 60 version, the most sophisticated F-16 produced to date.

More than 4,400 F-16s have been delivered worldwide, according to Bethesda, Maryland-based Lockheed Martin. Morocco this year became the 25th and latest overseas buyer with a deal for 24 new Block 50/52 models and related gear said by the Pentagon to be worth as much as $2.4 billion.

Iraq's request for pricing and availability data might not necessarily lead to a sale. Sometimes governments seek such information for planning purposes only, the Pentagon's Ryder said.

Flush with billions of dollars from oil sales, Iraq is emerging as the biggest client for a wide range of U.S. weapons -- a shot in the arm for defense contractors such as Lockheed, Boeing Co, Northrop Grumman Corp, General Dynamics Corp and Raytheon Co.

Among other systems, Iraq is seeking more than 400 armored vehicles plus six C-130 transport planes built by Lockheed, the Pentagon's No. 1 supplier.

On July 30, the Pentagon notified Congress that Iraq also was seeking to buy 24 Textron Inc Bell Armed 407 or 24 Boeing AH-6 helicopters along with 565 120mm mortars, 665 81mm mortars, 200 AGM-114M Hellfire missiles and other arms that could be worth $2.4 billion.

Baghdad and Washington are working on a long-term security pact that calls for U.S. military forces to quit Iraq's cities by next summer as a step toward a broader withdrawal from the country that U.S.-led forces invaded in 2003 to topple President Saddam Hussein.

F-16s would let Iraqi forces conduct airstrikes of their own on insurgent positions rather than relying on U.S. forces to do so, as is now the case.

Overseas sales have kept Lockheed's F-16 production line open after the U.S. military shifted to more advanced fighters, including the radar-evading F-22 also built by Lockheed.

"The program is healthy and full of activity, with firm production through 2012 and a strong likelihood of new orders that will extend the line for several more years," John Larson, vice president for Lockheed's F-16 programs, told reporters in July at the Farnborough Air Show outside London.

(Editing by Lisa Von Ahn, John Wallace, Phil Berlowitz)


why would we as a nation even consider this...the last time we sold are shit to them they used it on us and here we are again thinking or as put "REVIEWING IT"....what the hell is our government thinking seriously.......not only do they want our fighter jets but other weapons as well from us...i say no they have enough money to build and make their own weapons let them figure it out!!!! any other opinions???


http://www.newsdaily.com/stories/wbt...-fighters-usa/

[*ANABOLIC SUPERMAN*]

I say give it them. Make sure its the made in china versions though.

[deliverance]

[deliverance]

why give it to them...then they share the wealth with iran, pakistan, and who else...the talaban...al queda, enough of our troops die every year without them having them...how many more will die because of the greed and capitolism that lyes within our government...this is were i am getting at...

[*ANABOLIC SUPERMAN*]

why give it to them...then they share the wealth with iran, pakistan, and who else...the talaban...al queda, enough of our troops die every year without them having them...how many more will die because of the greed and capitolism that lyes within our government...this is were i am getting at...

Because unfortunately money makes the world go round. The government care more about money than they do about troops thats what this war is all about in the first place so this latest news doesnt shock me in the slightest.

[deliverance]

i agree with you about the money making the world go round...but take for instance when we bailed afgahnistan from russia wiping their country out in the 80's we bailed them out gave them weapons...knowledge...power, were did t land us...fu** the money bro for real...20 years later they attack NY for what...to prove what...same with saddam...bailed his ass out from iran taking over...gave him weapons...kowledge...and power to back it...where did we end up...out here fighting against our own shit....i think it is kind of perverbial...when will we learn..if it is about the money..then we just need to say iraq is now part of the u.s. and we own it...not play games like this...in the end we loose the most...money wise and stability wise within our country...my opinon of course

[Diary of a Mad-man]

Because unfortunately money makes the world go round. The government care more about money than they do about troops thats what this war is all about in the first place so this latest news doesnt shock me in the slightest.

Yeah man, cuz we got SO MUCH MONEY from invading Afghana-shit-hole and Iraq!!! We are rollin' in the dogh baby! Thats why we did it!

[*ANABOLIC SUPERMAN*]

Yeah man, cuz we got SO MUCH MONEY from invading Afghana-shit-hole and Iraq!!! We are rollin' in the dogh baby! Thats why we did it!

Is this sarcarstic?

[*ANABOLIC SUPERMAN*]

i agree with you about the money making the world go round...but take for instance when we bailed afgahnistan from russia wiping their country out in the 80's we bailed them out gave them weapons...knowledge...power, were did t land us...fu** the money bro for real...20 years later they attack NY for what...to prove what...same with saddam...bailed his ass out from iran taking over...gave him weapons...kowledge...and power to back it...where did we end up...out here fighting against our own shit....i think it is kind of perverbial...when will we learn..if it is about the money..then we just need to say iraq is now part of the u.s. and we own it...not play games like this...in the end we loose the most...money wise and stability wise within our country...my opinon of course

I agree stability wise but as for money i feel the war was about oil and they will be making a shedload. The reasons they helped out saddam was for reasons beneficial to usa at the time the government didnt help them out fom the goodness of their hearts there are many specualtions and i could be here all day saying what i think they are but i think i will just say instead this is all my opinion as it'll save me a lot of time instead.

[deliverance]

i agree with you superman...on speculation just i have experianced first hand on what this war is about so from my stand point our gov as usual thinks they ar doing something that is going to be benificial to the u.s. and in the end we get bent over the table..the whole country does...when we are done jacking up iraq we will rebuild it...spend money billions of dollars on there economy and in the end...this is stricktly my opinion only

[JiGGaMaN]

i agree with you about the money making the world go round...but take for instance when we bailed afgahnistan from russia wiping their country out in the 80's we bailed them out gave them weapons...knowledge...power, were did t land us...fu** the money bro for real...20 years later they attack NY for what...to prove what...same with saddam...bailed his ass out from iran taking over...gave him weapons...kowledge...and power to back it...where did we end up...out here fighting against our own shit....i think it is kind of perverbial...when will we learn..if it is about the money..then we just need to say iraq is now part of the u.s. and we own it...not play games like this...in the end we loose the most...money wise and stability wise within our country...my opinon of course

i dont agree with a single point you made. Selling high end items like that abroad is really important for the economy. Besides its not like they would be able or willing to attack the U.S. with 36 F-16's.

[Mulciber]

why would we as a nation even consider this...the last time we sold are shit to them they used it on us and here we are again thinking or as put "REVIEWING IT"....what the hell is our government thinking seriously.......not only do they want our fighter jets but other weapons as well from us...i say no they have enough money to build and make their own weapons let them figure it out!!!! any other opinions???


http://www.newsdaily.com/stories/wbt...-fighters-usa/

hit the nail on the head right there

[thegodfather]

Give it to them. They are a sovereign country which deserves the right to defend their borders from foreign invaders, like us.

[MuscleScience]

Its either they buy our old outdated fighters or they buy top of the line front line fighters from Russia or China. They have no problem selling their more advanced fighters for cheaper than our crappy old f-16's

[Panzerfaust]

Give it to them. They are a sovereign country which deserves the right to defend their borders from foreign invaders, like us.

They are not sovereign now and never will they ever be a sovereign nation again. They will forever be America's puppet and do the bidding of the American gov't.

Technically they are under brutal dictatorship of Washington but just not out in the open, the ideas and policies will all be made behind the curtain thus giving the world the illusion that Iraq can now stand on its on two feet and be a democratic nation.


At least the Elite have gotten smart enough to know it is much easier to control a nation from behind the curtain than in front of it for the masses to see.

Same goes for America...


There is no doubt in my mind that the US will be fully supplying the Iraqi military for decades to come, and we already are if I am correct right?

[JiGGaMaN]

They are not sovereign now and never will they ever be a sovereign nation again. They will forever be America's puppet and do the bidding of the American gov't.

I'm sure the british thought the same about U.S.A, canada, India etc.

[deliverance]

the point gentlemen is not us getting rid of our f16's to a nation that is diar need of protectioon, nor is it based off of money...the point at hand would be the fact that we supply them not only with our planes and mass weapons so the articles say only for them to turn their back on us like the other countries we have supplied and helped out in the middle east for their own benefit to try and make a point like saddam did...we befriended him helped him and ran iraq through the back end of the curtian until he said freak it, now billions of dollars later we are in the hole again finiacialy and stuck in another crap hole...so we sell them the goods make out on the front end finacially but in the end spend more money than we made selling the weapons when we go back to war with them...and this time they have weapons that will be able to take down our planes our americans....not saying they will win by any means at all...but when is enough...enough...when america falls it will fall from the inside for the simple fact that we are to concerned with what goes on with every other country and helping every other country out instead of putting that money back into our own society.,,,

[MuscleScience]

the point gentlemen is not us getting rid of our f16's to a nation that is diar need of protectioon, nor is it based off of money...the point at hand would be the fact that we supply them not only with our planes and mass weapons so the articles say only for them to turn their back on us like the other countries we have supplied and helped out in the middle east for their own benefit to try and make a point like saddam did...we befriended him helped him and ran iraq through the back end of the curtian until he said freak it, now billions of dollars later we are in the hole again finiacialy and stuck in another crap hole...so we sell them the goods make out on the front end finacially but in the end spend more money than we made selling the weapons when we go back to war with them...and this time they have weapons that will be able to take down our planes our americans....not saying they will win by any means at all...but when is enough...enough...when america falls it will fall from the inside for the simple fact that we are to concerned with what goes on with every other country and helping every other country out instead of putting that money back into our own society.,,,

But what you fail to relies is that we can control their foreign policy. All we have to do is threaten to cut off there supply of parts and we can effectively ground their entire f-16 fleet in a matter of months. Same with other military equipment. They do not have the ability to mass produce enough parts to maintain there inventory.

Remember when Iran got a shipment of f-15's from us only to have their government fall shortly there after. We shut off our supply of parts to them and those F-15's never saw any action after that.

[thegodfather]

the point gentlemen is not us getting rid of our f16's to a nation that is diar need of protectioon, nor is it based off of money...the point at hand would be the fact that we supply them not only with our planes and mass weapons so the articles say only for them to turn their back on us like the other countries we have supplied and helped out in the middle east for their own benefit to try and make a point like saddam did...we befriended him helped him and ran iraq through the back end of the curtian until he said freak it, now billions of dollars later we are in the hole again finiacialy and stuck in another crap hole...so we sell them the goods make out on the front end finacially but in the end spend more money than we made selling the weapons when we go back to war with them...and this time they have weapons that will be able to take down our planes our americans....not saying they will win by any means at all...but when is enough...enough...when america falls it will fall from the inside for the simple fact that we are to concerned with what goes on with every other country and helping every other country out instead of putting that money back into our own society.,,,

Sounds like you just advocated a Non-Interventionist foreign policy...+1

[deliverance]

[QUOTE=MuscleScience;4198898]But what you fail to relies is that we can control their foreign policy. All we have to do is threaten to cut off there supply of parts and we can effectively ground their entire f-16 fleet in a matter of months. Same with other military equipment. They do not have the ability to mass produce enough parts to maintain there inventory.

Remember when Iran got a shipment of f-15's from us only to have their government fall shortly there after. We shut off our supply of parts to them and those F-15's never saw any action after that.[/QUO

that fact is all to true...but remember we were not in need of oil the way we are now in those days...so we cut them off from parts and we get cut off for oil...which is the worse of the two....then without the oil necessary for the people and for our own gov. military iran sneeks in the back door and takes iraq....now we have more of an issue with tw countries instead of one....remember MONEY is the key factor here for the U.S. we are a greedy nation capitalists at heart this is what runs our nation....

[MuscleScience]

[QUOTE=deliverance;4198949]

But what you fail to relies is that we can control their foreign policy. All we have to do is threaten to cut off there supply of parts and we can effectively ground their entire f-16 fleet in a matter of months. Same with other military equipment. They do not have the ability to mass produce enough parts to maintain there inventory.

Remember when Iran got a shipment of f-15's from us only to have their government fall shortly there after. We shut off our supply of parts to them and those F-15's never saw any action after that.[/QUO

that fact is all to true...but remember we were not in need of oil the way we are now in those days...so we cut them off from parts and we get cut off for oil...which is the worse of the two....then without the oil necessary for the people and for our own gov. military iran sneeks in the back door and takes iraq....now we have more of an issue with tw countries instead of one....remember MONEY is the key factor here for the U.S. we are a greedy nation capitalists at heart this is what runs our nation....

All to true, but the inherent properties of being a capitalist society is what has made us the Greatest Power in the World today.

[deliverance]

yes we are a great power taht only few in this world can stack up too...but but in being this postion has costed us to much....we dont own america but we run it...china owns us...for we own them more money than can be counted...when we fall it is from the inside...so were does it stop and we as a people stand up and say take care of our country and **** the world...feed our people...shelter our homeless...stop welfare for all the lazies in america and give our country a better health care system...you know a dime a day could fix america...not iraq, iraq, africa, and so on....these problems have been going on for centries...when di we stop thinking about america as a whole and started worry more about what goes on outside of our own?

[MuscleScience]

yes we are a great power taht only few in this world can stack up too...but but in being this postion has costed us to much....we dont own america but we run it...china owns us...for we own them more money than can be counted...when we fall it is from the inside...so were does it stop and we as a people stand up and say take care of our country and **** the world...feed our people...shelter our homeless...stop welfare for all the lazies in america and give our country a better health care system...you know a dime a day could fix america...not iraq, iraq, africa, and so on....these problems have been going on for centries...when di we stop thinking about america as a whole and started worry more about what goes on outside of our own?

There are no simple answers my friend, guys like you and me and others worry about how we are going to survive. It seems that if you feel like the constitution should be followed and adhered to, that your some kind of anarchist against the government.

I feel that if we just got back to following what the constitution the way it was set forth. Most if not all of our problems would resolve themselves virtually overnight. Now of course I do not mean literally, but our founding fathers laid a plan. They defeated the greatest power the world had ever seen at that point in time. They defeated all the enemies from with in. They defeated politics, and greed and personal egos to create a document that was great in its writing and intent.

Our founders were great great men/women of their day (relative to that time period). We have just as great of men/women today if we would only listen.

[Panzerfaust]

yes we are a great power taht only few in this world can stack up too...but but in being this postion has costed us to much....we dont own america but we run it...china owns us...for we own them more money than can be counted...when we fall it is from the inside...so were does it stop and we as a people stand up and say take care of our country and **** the world...feed our people...shelter our homeless...stop welfare for all the lazies in america and give our country a better health care system...you know a dime a day could fix america...not iraq, iraq, africa, and so on....these problems have been going on for centries...when di we stop thinking about america as a whole and started worry more about what goes on outside of our own?

Wow...someone has been doing some reasearch without the help of FOXNEWS and CNN. Amen!

[deliverance]

There are no simple answers my friend, guys like you and me and others worry about how we are going to survive. It seems that if you feel like the constitution should be followed and adhered to, that your some kind of anarchist against the government.

I feel that if we just got back to following what the constitution the way it was set forth. Most if not all of our problems would resolve themselves virtually overnight. Now of course I do not mean literally, but our founding fathers laid a plan. They defeated the greatest power the world had ever seen at that point in time. They defeated all the enemies from with in. They defeated politics, and greed and personal egos to create a document that was great in its writing and intent.

Our founders were great great men/women of their day (relative to that time period). We have just as great of men/women today if we would only listen.

having great men lead this country has never been our problem...followin rules and regulations within themselves has...this seems to be our governments problem...free speech is basically out the window when they removed GOD from schools....not be able to discpline our children without the worry of the gov. coming to take our kids away and put us in jail for laying hands on them...no matter which way we turn it just seems to me that little by little they take and nothing is given back but heartache and greif...and war seems to be the way this nation is headed for we stick our nose in evryones buisness but our own...and the things we do stick our nose in with our own country are the things that founded this country...changing the rules to benifit the politicians and the rich forgetting the poor and the middle class is and will still be the actual true founders of this great nation...we have steared far away from this one simple fact...and in the end the words that will be muttered by millions of americans is......GOD HELP US ALL