so how many of you are going to man up and admit you started gear at a bf over 20%

[jamyjamjr]

Never even been close to 20%, fatties!

lmao

[sloth9]

Ooh ooh ooh pick me pick me teacher uh me pick me! I did I started at 235lbs got to 250lbs and said hey guess what they were right, so I stopped pct'ed and then went straight to clen it made me lose so much weight

[smokeyd]

i started over 20 and a lot of people do, you think strength athlets like powerlifters have to be 10% to run gear, hell no, this is a steroid site not a damn bodybuilding only site, every one just parrots that you need to be under certain body fat. I know it would help things out but damn this shit isnt good for you in the first place.

[BuffedGuy]

This is probably a dumb question, but how is it riskier at a higher BF? Doesn't testosterone increase lean muscle mass? Or is the risk due to extra aromatization since fat cells will do that?

[jamyjamjr]

This is probably a dumb question, but how is it riskier at a higher BF? Doesn't testosterone increase lean muscle mass? Or is the risk due to extra aromatization since fat cells will do that?

not dumb at all.. bf contains estrogen/estrogen like hormones that can raise estrogen levels.. im not on my reg comp right now, or i'd post up the article....

but to spoon feed it, people who have higher bf levels run the risk of higher estrogen levels, cholesterol levels, blood pressure, etc.... it makes it more unhealthy and more dangerous to do gear.. this is why people say 15 percent

[smokeyd]

f um steroids changed my life, i was a fat kid with no freinds and glasses before and no girlfirends and now im a "jacked fatty" with all the hoes and i stoped wearing my glasses. mom still gets onto me for that though

[roserose]

I didn't. But I've never had that much body fat.

[BuffedGuy]

not dumb at all.. bf contains estrogen/estrogen like hormones that can raise estrogen levels.. im not on my reg comp right now, or i'd post up the article....

but to spoon feed it, people who have higher bf levels run the risk of higher estrogen levels, cholesterol levels, blood pressure, etc.... it makes it more unhealthy and more dangerous to do gear.. this is why people say 15 percent

OK cool. Thanks. So I guess it is the aromatization factor. Interesting. One would think then that a low dose would help though, but perhaps supraphysiological doses are not good for the reason you said.

[jamyjamjr]

OK cool. Thanks. So I guess it is the aromatization factor. Interesting. One would think then that a low dose would help though, but perhaps supraphysiological doses are not good for the reason you said.

yea, there can be ways to make it safer at higher bf levels, but it's still more dangerous then doing it at a lower bf level..

well i can see what your saying, it was my logic to it too...

every 1lb of muscle u put on takes 70kcal a day to maintain.. put on 20lbs, and your burning an extra 1400kcal, helps with the weight loss.. but not worth the possible perminant sides

[BuffedGuy]

yea, there can be ways to make it safer at higher bf levels, but it's still more dangerous then doing it at a lower bf level..

well i can see what your saying, it was my logic to it too...

every 1lb of muscle u put on takes 70kcal a day to maintain.. put on 20lbs, and your burning an extra 1400kcal, helps with the weight loss.. but not worth the possible perminant sides

The underlined part is exactly what I was thinking. I was reading SmokeTheDays's diet, and I couldn't help but think that even though it was "clean", if a normal person like me ate that many calories, I'd get fat as heck. His extra muscle bulk burns off all those calories.

By permanent side effects, you mean like gynecomastia , LDL, etc?

[Chode Logan]

Smokey speaks the truth.

[jkproperties]

I think lots of people are clueless about their bf%
I for 1 was completely shocked when my bf was measured by my personal trainer.
When i used the hand held gadget it said 8%
When i used the computer(measures blood pressure, weight, BF and a lot of other things) at the gym it would say I was between 13 and 15%

Then my trainer used a caliper and said I was between 18 and 20% the percentage was fairly low all over exept the back of my waist and top of my back. this pushed my bf up heavily.

when i posted a picture yesterday it was estimated between 20 -25%

[dehydromethandrotren]

I have always been near 20% and gained about 30-40lbs within 4-5 years

[dehydromethandrotren]

dave palumbo told me personally for what its worth, bodyfat has no effect directly on steroids themselves.

I was always concerned about the estrogre receptors in fat cells, but they have androgen receptors as well and androgen receptors ar increased with the more hormones you use.

[Lightsout2184]

i just started my third cycle and im probably around 20 or a little more. my excuse i got gutted which resulted in long term weight gain. i know i should wait but i miss my size

[ohmygoodness]

not dumb at all.. bf contains estrogen/estrogen like hormones that can raise estrogen levels.. im not on my reg comp right now, or i'd post up the article....

but to spoon feed it, people who have higher bf levels run the risk of higher estrogen levels, cholesterol levels, blood pressure, etc.... it makes it more unhealthy and more dangerous to do gear.. this is why people say 15 percent

Excellent well said. In my case I was so fat @ one time & a few other factors my Dr put me on trt. So I guess I only applied lifestyle changes n some beta 2 blockers & some t3 which I think was really a t4. It was all for good. Also when your learner the results are easier to see.

[MASTER]

I often end up close to 20% by the end of my bulking phase, I don't really see the problem to be honest.