To Investigate Video of Soldiers Urinating on Corpses

[DSM4Life]

http://www.tmz.com/2012/01/11/u-s-ma.../#.Tw71a2_OUsI


Do we say to ourselves who cares because of what they do to corpses or are we suppose to be better than the taliban?

[Gsxr84]

wow thats interesting never seen that before, i personally feel its wrong to commit that act

[domeyeahaigh]

Yep amazing this should be front page news. This is despicable.

Imagine if it were Afghani soldiers, in the United States --> Urinating on the corpses of our troops..?

Would we expect, the Afghanis to expect, that we were going to kick some ass in retaliation?

Well yeah that wouldn't even be a thought.

It is time to stop these wars, it is not good for our troops, it is not good for world diplomacy..Ron Paul 2012!!

[V-ROID]

I didn't watch the video but if some guys were killing my family or buddies I would piss on their corpse too.

[pikenat]

I didn't watch the video but if some guys were killing my family or buddies I would piss on their corpse too.

If the insurgents had taken out a couple of their buddies before the soliders could take them out, I could see why they would piss on there corpses "in the moment". Not condoning it but I could see why depending on the circumstance.

[Shol'va]

Yeah the taliban at least respect our dead soldiers by dragging them down the road behind their cars, beheading them, gutting them and leaving them on the side of the road. But still we are better than this, the whizzing on the dead. Hope it isn't so. But it's a bad war as if there are good ones. War is hell and bad things happen when guys are pushed beyond their limits.

[jimmyinkedup]

I would think its pretty normal to dehumanize those you kill - makes it easier to do so. Not saying its right- just pointing that out.
This is a pretty "personal" conflict. I think in other wars , even ones with horrible atrocities like ww2, many times at the end both sides ended up seeing the regular soldiers on the other side as the same as them. Its virtually impossible to view terrorists in this regard.
Honestly it is disgusting behavior - but I wont lose any sleep over it or probably even give it another thought after this. People that will make this a huge issue arent the ones putting theirs lives on the line daily and seeing their best friends blown to bits by an IED , or treated in similar manner after they are killed. Until they have done that imo they have little right to say a damn thing.

[awms]

This is so wrong no matter what way you try to twist it! I dont care if an afghan shit on your mom its still wrong to do! America is supposed to be civilized nation! The worlds "leader" but America is fast fading as the world power and loosing respect around the world!

America wonders why most other countries hate them???? its not that hard to figure out! lol

[Sgt. Hartman]

^^^^You don't have a clue.

[ddp2727]

With all due respect to your opinion on this matter, America is fading as the world power leader but it is due to the fact that we don't demolish nations like we used to, in order to win in all regards. Instead we freat around with the political correctness game, and allow gorilla warfare to actually work against us because we worry about rebuilding their nations, instead of settling the issue with just war.

Jimmy well spoken by the way my thoughts exactly on the issue.

[DSM4Life]

I think that we train men/boys to despise the enemy. Train their brains to not show emotion or an ounce of hesitation but to kill on a moments notice. So then why is it when they become exactly what they have been trained to do that people get all bent out of shape? I understand its not their fault but it still needs to be dealt with.

That's just my civilian thoughts on it.

[slfmade]

This is so wrong no matter what way you try to twist it! I dont care if an afghan shit on your mom its still wrong to do! America is supposed to be civilized nation! The worlds "leader" but America is fast fading as the world power and loosing respect around the world!

America wonders why most other countries hate them???? its not that hard to figure out! lol

If somebody; afgan or not, shit on my mom I would do more than piss on their corpse. I'm not sure what, but it would be bad.

P.S. Did this remind anybody else of R Kelly?.......Just sayin

[baseline_9]

Is it disrespectful - Yes

Do I care - No

[jimmyinkedup]

This is so wrong no matter what way you try to twist it! I dont care if an afghan shit on your mom its still wrong to do! America is supposed to be civilized nation! The worlds "leader" but America is fast fading as the world power and loosing respect around the world!

America wonders why most other countries hate them???? its not that hard to figure out! lol

Yeah the double standard that exists is asounding. Perhaps we should behave as all the super powers and dynasty empires before us and just do whatever the fck we want since we will be hated due to double standard bs and jealosy anyway. Perhaps if we see something we want we should just take it - eliminate anything or anyone in our way Perhaps we should stop the billions in government aid and US citizen raised charity we give to the coutries throughout the world only to have them stab us in the back. Funny how all that is forgotten but a few soldiers pissing on terrorists bodies makes us hated and evil. So easy to see the speck of dirt in someone elses eye - especially when 3/4 of the countries in the world would give their left nut to have the standard of living we do.
I say its about time we tell the majority of the world to fvck off and take care of ourselves. Its not like we are well liked anyway - why should we help anyone other than ourselves?
Germany has the holocoust on its back....
UK has aparthied and Ireland and Scotland ...
Russia , red china , Japan , Countries in Africa.... Do we really have to list them?
The Middle East - Goodness the world capitol of killing in the name of one god or another ... and greed for land...
Every nation has misgivings...only the US is foolish enough to continue to support those who hate us ....
Know why the Middle East hates us? Because we wont leave so they can exterminate those with differing religious beliefs in the name of their god and commit unspeakable atrocities in the process. Also we are impeding their inherent greed to take land - again in the name of some god but really hiding the human trait of greed.
Every day I give less and less a damn about how we are viewed by others and more of a damn about how we can make our own existence better...
Its not our job to set the international moral standard - although we have prob done more to do so in more ways than any other nation. Look where it got us - time for a change in our priorities.....


Bcak to this direct topic: If I had a brother killed in 9/11 - id piss on these terrorists dead bodies myself. These men are brothers in arms that have seen their brothers killed and bodies desecrated repeatedly. I could care less about this act and would shake any one of their hands when they return to the US and thank them for their service.

[xelnaga]

I refuse to pass judgement on these soldiers. War is not pretty and the humans that are in on do what they need to in order to cope. If a fellow solider or military official wants to condemn it - thats their business.

[Sgt. Hartman]

Yeah the double standard that exists is asounding. Perhaps we should behave as all the super powers and dynasty empires before us and just do whatever the fck we want since we will be hated due to double standard bs and jealosy anyway. Perhaps if we see something we want we should just take it - eliminate anything or anyone in our way Perhaps we should stop the billions in government aid and US citizen raised charity we give to the coutries throughout the world only to have them stab us in the back. Funny how all that is forgotten but a few soldiers pissing on terrorists bodies makes us hated and evil. So easy to see the speck of dirt in someone elses eye - especially when 3/4 of the countries in the world would give their left nut to have the standard of living we do.
I say its about time we tell the majority of the world to fvck off and take care of ourselves. Its not like we are well liked anyway - why should we help anyone other than ourselves?
Germany has the holocoust on its back....
UK has aparthied and Ireland and Scotland ...
Russia , red china , Japan , Countries in Africa.... Do we really have to list them?
The Middle East - Goodness the world capitol of killing in the name of one god or another ... and greed for land...
Every nation has misgivings...only the US is foolish enough to continue to support those who hate us ....
Know why the Middle East hates us? Because we wont leave so they can exterminate those with differing religious beliefs in the name of their god and commit unspeakable atrocities in the process. Also we are impeding their inherent greed to take land - again in the name of some god but really hiding the human trait of greed.
Every day I give less and less a damn about how we are viewed by others and more of a damn about how we can make our own existence better...
Its not our job to set the international moral standard - although we have prob done more to do so in more ways than any other nation. Look where it got us - time for a change in our priorities.....

Excellent post.

[Twin]

The only thing that would have made that video better would be the soldiers shitting on the Taliban scumbags.

[Corpsman]

One thing is for sure, the right or wrong of it will be decided by a bunch of bureaucrats who have probably never been on the field of battle. I would think I would have advised my Marines not to do it and certainly not to tape it.

[awms]

Man this world is a messed up place! we should hold our selfs to a higher standard! pissing on a dead body doesnt do anything other then give the taliban fuel to go blow more shit up...how can we make change in the world when we cant even act civilized ourselves?

America was not built on these kind of disgusting acts...of course though people will find ways to justify it and thats the sad part!

[songdog]

This is so wrong no matter what way you try to twist it! I dont care if an afghan shit on your mom its still wrong to do! America is supposed to be civilized nation! The worlds "leader" but America is fast fading as the world power and loosing respect around the world!

America wonders why most other countries hate them???? its not that hard to figure out! lol

Other countries hate us beacuse or goverment sticks its nose where it doest belong.We have groups of women here in the states who cry over womens rights in the Arab countries.That is their regelion leave them alone.Unless YOU want to go over there and fight.We no longer have the draft system here so the same guys get to go back time after time.These men and women watch the friends get killed everyday.So if by pissing on some dead Taliban who were trying to kill them.Makes them feel better I say go for it.You want to go after someone.Go after the prick who videoed it or better yet join the miltary and lets see wat you can do.Until that day comes.You have no right to judge our miltary men and women.

[gixxerboy1]

great posts jimmy

[JohnnyVegas]

Killing people is an emotional, hateful thing. Urinating on someone that tried to kill you is really just spiking the football - a little "f*ck you" when it is all done and you are the survivor. Gloating can be understood when the stakes are so high.

Plus, talking about "disrespect" after killing someone seems silly. Soldiers in high-risk situations who are trained and expected to kill and destroy things need to be given some wiggle room on manners.

[gixxerboy1]

So its ok to shoot them in the head but not pee on them?

[awms]

Other countries hate us beacuse or goverment sticks its nose where it doest belong.We have groups of women here in the states who cry over womens rights in the Arab countries.That is their regelion leave them alone.Unless YOU want to go over there and fight.We no longer have the draft system here so the same guys get to go back time after time.These men and women watch the friends get killed everyday.So if by pissing on some dead Taliban who were trying to kill them.Makes them feel better I say go for it.You want to go after someone.Go after the prick who videoed it or better yet join the miltary and lets see wat you can do.Until that day comes.You have no right to judge our miltary men and women.

I have the utmost respect for anyone who puts their life on the line for my and your freedom BUT* being a solider does not excuse you from the law, it does not mean you can run around doing what ever you would like...Again being a solider is among one of the most honourable careers in the world but you still have to follow the law of the land.

One of my best friends is a solider and I asked him what he thinks about this? He told me he thinks its horrible! although he can see mabey why they did what they did it still is not ok. He also told me that he he chose to be a solider, no one held a gun to his head and made him take the oath....he wanted to do it and understood that there are responsibilities that come the job and he held him self to a higher standard to a taliban member. He also told me half these guys have never gone to school in their life, told me there almost like brain washed neanderthals with guns lol He said he does not condon the acts these guys commit but honestly most of them dont know any better because they are un educated and have been told their whole life the the western world is evil...but he did go to school, went to university, and now is in the army so again he hold him self to a high standard.

[jasc]

It's all 1 big joke. These guys are trained killers who risk their lives daily for our worthless goverment. Yes, it may not be tasteful to piss on a corpse and yes, those guys are dumbasses for video taping, but this is war! Pissing on a corpse is pretty mild compared to what those animals over there do to our soldiers.
Our gov't has their head so far up their own ass that they can't see the obvious. The media/gov't officials will chastise and punish these soldiers just to make a buck and/or make themselves look better.
Other countries don't hate us because of a little urination, they hate us because we stick our noses in everyone's business and try to police the world because of our hidden agenda. We don't help these foreign countries, we do just enough to look out for our own interests.
Would u like a country that invaded your home, destroyed your city, and killed your friends/family because they had an interest in your oil?

America is falling as a super-power because our priorities are sh*t. Instead of investing in our own country and correcting our own problems, we waste hundreds of billions of dollars per year pursuing unneccesary military blunders. We are trillions of dollars in debt, have the worst unemployment rate in decades, and a vast amount of people/public entities that are in serious need. Yet we spend millions/billions of dollars rebuilding schools/buildings in nations we invade. Explain to me how it makes sense to give all this foreign aid when we have have our own needs. Why build a school in iraq when we are closing inner city schools in many major city's due to lack of funding? Why send food n medical supplies across the world when we have people starving here or being denied basic medical services?

Rant over

[JohnnyVegas]

So its ok to shoot them in the head but not pee on them?

Damn, that is what I said...but took ten times longer to say it.

[jimmyinkedup]

Man this world is a messed up place! we should hold our selfs to a higher standard! pissing on a dead body doesnt do anything other then give the taliban fuel to go blow more shit up... The taliban doesnt need justification for their actions - they never have. This incident will have no impact on what they have done or will continue to do - they are terrorists - they will do what terrorists do. I think we should find out the ultimate atrocity that will prevent the muslim terrorists from entering their version of heaven and commit that act on every single dead one we kill. If they wanna kill in the name of religion - lets hit them where supposedly it will really hurt
how can we make change in the world when we cant even act civilized ourselves? Who said it is our responsibility to "make change in the world" 90 % of our problems in and outside of this country are a direct result of this distorted , self assuming ideal. When will we learn you cannot force or legislate morality to illicit positive change? Looking for true moral and ethical behavior in a war is like looking for an ice cream cone in the sahara desert

America was not built on these kind of disgusting acts...of course though people will find ways to justify it and thats the sad part! Lets be honest here - America as we know it was built on the exploitation , elimination , and imprisionment of the Native Americans. The priciples that foiunded this country were obviously quickly cast aside. In all honestly to think the actions of our founding fathers were strictly based on moral principles and not greed to a certain extent is pretty naieve.

See Bold - a dose of reality IMO.
I make no apologies for anything we have done - but I dont view our history through rose colored glasses either. I dont have any delusions of grandiosity as far as our role in the world as far as morals or ethics - who the hell are we to impose them anyway? I care about the US - I dont give a damn about the Middle East - If the taliban attacks us as they did we should rain hell and terror down upon them to the extent that the rest of the world would think twice about lifting a finger before atacking the US in any form. You can say what you want as far as ideals and morals but id rather the taliban fear the hell out of us than respect us for our moral character.
Its time we do whats best for us here and now - in the real world. Setting a moral example or trying too has not worked - its time to rethink our priorities , responsibilities and consequently our actions.
I understand we will probably agree to disagree - but I think we should be honest and see things for what they are and have been in the real world. Not in some highly spiritual , karma, do good and good will happen fairlytail. In this world of greed , hatered , anger , violence and so on to think that we as a country are so important and influential that we could change the basic human nature of man (that has killed and eploited one another from the beginning of time) is simply an egomoniacal fairlytail IMO.

[evander87]

The only thing I have to say about this and incidents like Abu Grab is DON'T FRICKING RECORD OR PHOTOGRAPH THE ACT!!!!

While I personally find it distasteful for what these soldiers did I wont condemn them for doing it. I don't have all the info to make a sound judgement. HOWEVER I say for the love of GOD don't make any evidence that could be used against you later.

Oh and BTW if it was a bunch of "terrorists" pissing on our dead soldiers you bet your ass I'd be angry and wanting justice.

[Hoggage_54]

Plenty of worse videos out there of both sides doing awful things... Weird how focused they are on this incident, which is very minor to some of the videos I've seen.

[Shol'va]

I know America and Americans are supposed to rise above all the BS but remember 9-1-1 when all those innocent Americans and People from All the world over lost their lives in the most horrid of ways, so a little urinating on the enemy is no big deal. The problem is we have no business in the first place even being over there. We cannot change the way these people are or think. They have been this way since dirt. All we have done is waste trillions of American taxpaying dollars and bankrupted our economy, exactly what the enemy has wanted from day one. As I have said in the past, if this were the 1940's-1950's, congress and the senate as well as the rest of the elected officials would have been arrested for treason for allowing this great nation to be needlessly put into jeopardy. Will common sense ever return to Washington and in time to reverse this trend...I hope so.

[Nooomoto]

Dead hadj got pissed on...boohoo.

[jasc]

I know America and Americans are supposed to rise above all the BS but remember 9-1-1 when all those innocent Americans and People from All the world over lost their lives in the most horrid of ways, so a little urinating on the enemy is no big deal. The problem is we have no business in the first place even being over there. We cannot change the way these people are or think. They have been this way since dirt. All we have done is waste trillions of American taxpaying dollars and bankrupted our economy, exactly what the enemy has wanted from day one. As I have said in the past, if this were the 1940's-1950's, congress and the senate as well as the rest of the elected officials would have been arrested for treason for allowing this great nation to be needlessly put into jeopardy. Will common sense ever return to Washington and in time to reverse this trend...I hope so.

Common sense will never return, atleast not until we kick all those old fvcks n career politicians out of office. It has since been replaced with political correctness, greed, and the inability of our goverment to function in modern times.

[thegodfather]

The sentiment expressed in this thread, is the reason we're in the places we are at overseas.

Members of the Taliban ARE NOT TERRORISTS!

Jesus christ. The pervasive ignorance that permeates this discussion is disgusting. First off, 'terrorism' is a TACTIC OF WAR. You can no less wage a war on "flanking maneuvers" than you can on 'terrorism.' That aside, what we consider terrorists in the traditional sense, are those extremist groups, who deliberately target innocent civilians in foreign countries, for the purpose of instilling 'terror' and 'fear' into the civilian population.

The Taliban, are a political/military organization that are fighting for the control of the country of Afghanistan. They don't hate Americans because we are "free and prosperous," or any of that other bullshit. They hate us because we invaded their country, because we drop bombs on their homes, and we kill their women and children in the crossfire. We had every right to invade Afghanistan and to topple their regime, as they were giving safe haven to an enemy of the United States of America. However, after we failed to kill/capture Osama Bin Laden, we should have left that country, staying there for TEN YEARS was the mistake.

The people currently shooting at ISAF/Coalition forces are not terrorists, they are ENEMY COMBATANTS. They are not engaging in terrorism, they are using well recognized and documented GUERILLA WARFARE tactics. These tactics are used and employed when a smaller, ill equipped force faces a superior force both in numbers and in technologically advanced weaponry. We know exactly why the AAF (Anti-Afghan Forces) are attacking ISAF/Coalition forces, it is because they do not want a US controlled puppet government running their country, and why should they?

Most of us here in America lack one critical skill, we lack the ability to try and view things from the perspective of our enemies. Then, when someone with enough critical thinking skills to do so does, we call them unpatriotic, tell them to leave the country, etc, and so forth. Ask yourselves what you would do, if a foreign country like Russia or China invaded the US, because the government here was harboring terrorists who committed acts against one of those countries. Now, you may not even agree with your government doing that, but now China or Russia is dropping bombs on your homes, setting up bases in your neighborhoods, or in you counties, and friends, cousins, uncles, aunts, moms, fathers, grandfathers, etc, were getting killed by bombs, bullets, and mortars fired from those bases. It seems to me pretty obvious, that whether or not you had any feelings towards the INITIAL reason that these countries invaded, that you would probably take up arms against the occupying force and fight them, because you want them out of your country, REGARDLESS of their reasons for coming, however justified they might have been.

So please, moving forward, do some research on the conflicts you're going to comment on. The Taliban forces are not terrorists, they're enemy combatants. It may sound like a game of semantics, but definitionally these things are very important, because under the Geneva convention, enemy combatants have rights, and must be treated in a certain way. What you guys ought to be more upset about, are the politicians who sit comfortably in their chairs in Washington, in their vacation homes in the Hamptons, in their stately Annapolis homes, at their thousand dollar a plate fundraiser dinners, in their limosouines, and beat the drum for war, while they send the children of the middle class and lower class's off to die in wars that do not serve the national security interests of the United States. Many of you people blindly support these wars of aggression, where we invade and tell SOVEREIGN nations how to run their affairs. Wars that do nothing to further the national security interests of the United States, but in fact do more to codify and widen the breadth of support for terrorist organizations who want to kill Americans. All anyone has to do is pick up the Constitution, where it clearly outlines the times we are authorized to goto war. Politicians sit up on the hill, and make straw man arguments about invading a dictatorship like Iraq, so that we "fight them over there, so we dont have to fight them over here." They present Americans with LIES and false intelligence, and yet you people blindly support these liars, sending your kids to die in far away lands, while these politicians beat the war drums and send the lower socioeconomic classes off to die so that they can tell other countries and other peoples how to run their lives.

If anyone here is naive enough to think that we invade countries because they are controlled by dictators, or because they treat women horribly, or some other such nonsense, then I have beachfront property to sell you in South Dakota. There are 190 contries in the world today, and roughly 50% are still currently living under some form of a totalitarian dictatorship. Perhaps you guys think we ought to go a few trillion dollars more into debt and 'liberate' those people as well?

[jimmyinkedup]

The sentiment expressed in this thread, is the reason we're in the places we are at overseas.

Members of the Taliban ARE NOT TERRORISTS!

Jesus christ. The pervasive ignorance that permeates this discussion is disgusting. First off, 'terrorism' is a TACTIC OF WAR. You can no less wage a war on "flanking maneuvers" than you can on 'terrorism.' That aside, what we consider terrorists in the traditional sense, are those extremist groups, who deliberately target innocent civilians in foreign countries, for the purpose of instilling 'terror' and 'fear' into the civilian population.

The Taliban, are a political/military organization that are fighting for the control of the country of Afghanistan. They don't hate Americans because we are "free and prosperous," or any of that other bullshit. They hate us because we invaded their country, because we drop bombs on their homes, and we kill their women and children in the crossfire. We had every right to invade Afghanistan and to topple their regime, as they were giving safe haven to an enemy of the United States of America. However, after we failed to kill/capture Osama Bin Laden, we should have left that country, staying there for TEN YEARS was the mistake.

The people currently shooting at ISAF/Coalition forces are not terrorists, they are ENEMY COMBATANTS. They are not engaging in terrorism, they are using well recognized and documented GUERILLA WARFARE tactics. These tactics are used and employed when a smaller, ill equipped force faces a superior force both in numbers and in technologically advanced weaponry. We know exactly why the AAF (Anti-Afghan Forces) are attacking ISAF/Coalition forces, it is because they do not want a US controlled puppet government running their country, and why should they?

Most of us here in America lack one critical skill, we lack the ability to try and view things from the perspective of our enemies. Then, when someone with enough critical thinking skills to do so does, we call them unpatriotic, tell them to leave the country, etc, and so forth. Ask yourselves what you would do, if a foreign country like Russia or China invaded the US, because the government here was harboring terrorists who committed acts against one of those countries. Now, you may not even agree with your government doing that, but now China or Russia is dropping bombs on your homes, setting up bases in your neighborhoods, or in you counties, and friends, cousins, uncles, aunts, moms, fathers, grandfathers, etc, were getting killed by bombs, bullets, and mortars fired from those bases. It seems to me pretty obvious, that whether or not you had any feelings towards the INITIAL reason that these countries invaded, that you would probably take up arms against the occupying force and fight them, because you want them out of your country, REGARDLESS of their reasons for coming, however justified they might have been.

So please, moving forward, do some research on the conflicts you're going to comment on. The Taliban forces are not terrorists, they're enemy combatants. It may sound like a game of semantics, but definitionally these things are very important, because under the Geneva convention, enemy combatants have rights, and must be treated in a certain way. What you guys ought to be more upset about, are the politicians who sit comfortably in their chairs in Washington, in their vacation homes in the Hamptons, in their stately Annapolis homes, at their thousand dollar a plate fundraiser dinners, in their limosouines, and beat the drum for war, while they send the children of the middle class and lower class's off to die in wars that do not serve the national security interests of the United States. Many of you people blindly support these wars of aggression, where we invade and tell SOVEREIGN nations how to run their affairs. Wars that do nothing to further the national security interests of the United States, but in fact do more to codify and widen the breadth of support for terrorist organizations who want to kill Americans. All anyone has to do is pick up the Constitution, where it clearly outlines the times we are authorized to goto war. Politicians sit up on the hill, and make straw man arguments about invading a dictatorship like Iraq, so that we "fight them over there, so we dont have to fight them over here." They present Americans with LIES and false intelligence, and yet you people blindly support these liars, sending your kids to die in far away lands, while these politicians beat the war drums and send the lower socioeconomic classes off to die so that they can tell other countries and other peoples how to run their lives.

If anyone here is naive enough to think that we invade countries because they are controlled by dictators, or because they treat women horribly, or some other such nonsense, then I have beachfront property to sell you in South Dakota. There are 190 contries in the world today, and roughly 50% are still currently living under some form of a totalitarian dictatorship. Perhaps you guys think we ought to go a few trillion dollars more into debt and 'liberate' those people as well?

You group together posts in a broad generalization and make assumptions as to individual peoples opinions on several issues based on semantics and the views others have expressed.
Do I think the Taliban are terrirists? Well was 911 a product of military action conducted by enemy combatants? Lets be for real. By your very definion of terrorists they in fact clearly are. Is this some different taliban or do you subscribe to some tin foil hat theory that 9/11 was staged by our government?
These enemy combatants have no regard for the "rules of war" (whatever the hell they are??)

Should we be there ? - No not imo. f them and the entire middle east as well as the vast majority of other parts of the world where we are as well imo...

Is our gov corrupt and propaghanda driven - hell yes.

Do I give a fvck that the guy with no real choice who has seen friends killed and mutilated by these "enemy combatants" pisses on their dead - not one god damn bit!

Do i appreciate the fact these soldiers would die for our country and freedom - regardless of whether or not their presence in the middle east is "right" or not? Damn right i do and id shake their hands and thank them for it any day of the week.

I pretty clearly stated that the supposed role of the worlds moral watchdog is bvllshit. Of course this morality card is a mirage for alterior motives. I say screw it and dont hide behind anything - do what we need to do for our country - inside and out - poitically (clean house) or militarily.

[Nooomoto]

The people currently shooting at ISAF/Coalition forces are not terrorists, they are ENEMY COMBATANTS. They are not engaging in terrorism, they are using well recognized and documented GUERILLA WARFARE tactics. These tactics are used and employed when a smaller, ill equipped force faces a superior force both in numbers and in technologically advanced weaponry. We know exactly why the AAF (Anti-Afghan Forces) are attacking ISAF/Coalition forces, it is because they do not want a US controlled puppet government running their country, and why should they?

So which one of the 8 people that died at the vegetable market in uruzgan back in august when it was bombed by the Taliban had superior force in numbers and technologically advanced weaponry?

At least they aren't terrorists...

[tcw]

This is typical behavior in War.

In primitive days (like we aren't still primitive), the winning tribes would rape the women from the losing side...in front of the fallen tribe. Then they would execute the losers in front of the women they just raped.

They would then take the women (and weaker older males) and use them all as slaves...

All true!

[JD250]

thegodfather......with all due respect.....that was the most arrogant, condescending, semantic and assumption laden post I've read in a long time, you aren't the only one here who has the ability to think critically, in fact I would say that most here have no misgivings about our politicians and Govt., that post was offensive!

On the original subject........if you haven't shot at an enemy and been shot at or watched your buddies die in the dirt this week then you don't have what it takes to stand in judgment of those men, they don't need our condemnation and opinions of how they should be held to a higher standard, they were trained to kill the enemy, that's what they did, I applaud them.

[thegodfather]

You group together posts in a broad generalization and make assumptions as to individual peoples opinions on several issues based on semantics and the views others have expressed.
Do I think the Taliban are terrirists? Well was 911 a product of military action conducted by enemy combatants? Lets be for real. By your very definion of terrorists they in fact clearly are. Is this some different taliban or do you subscribe to some tin foil hat theory that 9/11 was staged by our government?
These enemy combatants have no regard for the "rules of war" (whatever the hell they are??)

Should we be there ? - No not imo. f them and the entire middle east as well as the vast majority of other parts of the world where we are as well imo...

Is our gov corrupt and propaghanda driven - hell yes.

Do I give a fvck that the guy with no real choice who has seen friends killed and mutilated by these "enemy combatants" pisses on their dead - not one god damn bit!

Do i appreciate the fact these soldiers would die for our country and freedom - regardless of whether or not their presence in the middle east is "right" or not? Damn right i do and id shake their hands and thank them for it any day of the week.

I pretty clearly stated that the supposed role of the worlds moral watchdog is bvllshit. Of course this morality card is a mirage for alterior motives. I say screw it and dont hide behind anything - do what we need to do for our country - inside and out - poitically (clean house) or militarily.

I didn't quote any member specifically, because I wasn't calling out anyones posts in particular, I was simply addressing some of the sentiment expressed.

I'm not really sure where you took away from my post that I even remotely give any credibility to any of the 9/11 conspiracy theories? 9/11 was not carried out by members of the Taliban, it was executed by members of Al-Qaeda led by Osama Bin Laden. The Taliban's complicitness in those acts really ended at providing Al-Qaeda with a sanctuary state to train and conduct their affairs. We toppled the Taliban regime for refusing to hand over Osama Bin Laden at the request of our government, and I believe we were completley justified in invading the country to deny Al-Qaeda a sanctuary, and to kill/capture Osama Bin Laden. However, simply because the Taliban provided a sanctuary for Al-Qaeda, does not make the Taliban and every member of the organization a terrorist organization. Almost every single one of the 19 hijackers were Saudi Arabians, one of our biggest allies, but that doesn't mean the country of Saudi Arabia gave material support to Al-Qaeda, although there is a lot of evidence that Saudi Arabia allows the funds of terrorists to be siphoned around its various banks.

My point really is that we should not be engaged in nation building, and in many of the other activities that the neo-cons have involved us in, and which the current administration has continued to do. I'd also like to say, that I dont think 4 Marines pissing on some dead enemy combatants should make national news. We have soldiers doing 15 month deployments, multiple tours, and some of these politicians want to crucify these men for doing things that while some people may fund untenable, but their job is to do things, horrible things, that we've trained them to do, and that most of the people critiscizing them dont have the courage to do. So I think that until those people wishing to crucify those Marines join up and go do a tour, they ought to STFU. That doesn't change my view points on the actual war itself, but I will aways support our soldiers, despite the fact that our politicians like to use the men and women of the lower socioeconomic classes in our country to do their bidding. I think you'd find that we agree on more points than we disagree on.

[thegodfather]

thegodfather......with all due respect.....that was the most arrogant, condescending, semantic and assumption laden post I've read in a long time, you aren't the only one here who has the ability to think critically, in fact I would say that most here have no misgivings about our politicians and Govt., that post was offensive!

On the original subject........if you haven't shot at an enemy and been shot at or watched your buddies die in the dirt this week then you don't have what it takes to stand in judgment of those men, they don't need our condemnation and opinions of how they should be held to a higher standard, they were trained to kill the enemy, that's what they did, I applaud them.

I re-read my post, and I don't find one single word where I said a single negative thing about the troops or what they did to those dead fighters, and in my most recent post, you'll see that I supported their actions. So, not a single word of judgement from my end, if you can find some in that post, feel free to point it out. I think in fact, you are kind of making my point, in that the politicians like to stand in judgement of those soldiers, yet they would never put themselves or their children in harms way in the name of the many operations for 'freedom' that they vote for.

Furthermore, there was no condescension in the post, by simply stating that people ought to do research on a conflict before they comment on it. I really think you may be confusing my frustration and anger, with condescension and arrogance. I am frustrated and angry that the men and women of our middle and lower classes are being sacrificed at the whims of political elites in Washington, and then when they vent their own frustrations on the bodies of a few dead enemy combatants,it makes national f**king news, and they are lynched by the liberal media.

[JD250]

My bad, the second part of my post wasn't directed at you at all, you in fact DIDN'T say anything bad about those soldiers, I was addressing you in the first paragraph and you are probably correct, you and I may see this stuff exactly the same, sometimes the written word is tough to interpret and I have a son in law who has done 3 tours in that shit hole as a medic and I've sat and listened to the stories so I'm always apprehensive when people pretend to know what it's like and pass judgement on soldiers.......I was a little agitated before I even got to your post. I agree with you, the whole beauracratic scene is one big lie and it frustrates the hell out of me and many others too.