How do people live on minimum wage?

AD · 04-12-2014, 06:54 PM

Originally Posted by canesfan804

Funny part is the high end Nike's (Jordans) were $120 a pair when I was growing up and they were made here. Now the make them in China or wherever and the cost $250 a pair. Im all for a man making profit but damn do they need to cut production cost AND raise prices? I know they can but just seems a bit greedy to me.

as long as people are still buying...

**Black** · 04-12-2014, 06:54 PM

Originally Posted by canesfan804

Funny part is the high end Nike's (Jordans) were $120 a pair when I was growing up and they were made here. Now the make them in China or wherever and the cost $250 a pair. Im all for a man making profit but damn do they need to cut production cost AND raise prices? I know they can but just seems a bit greedy to me.

Bingo! Greed and power. Its how this country was founded. It knows nothing else.

**Dpyle** · 04-12-2014, 08:39 PM

Originally Posted by AD

not your favorite anymore, i imagine?

For the moment they still are. I managed to find one pair of the Chinese made boots in my size on sale this past week. The leather on the American made ones just feels lower quality and it's about half the thickness of the old ones. May still try a pair of American made, but I'm a little iffy based on my first impression of them.

**Rwy** · 04-13-2014, 09:50 AM

Originally Posted by Dpyle

Well they could do what my favorite work boot company did recently. Move production back to the US and use lower quality materials to offset labor costs.

Unfortunately this is anti american corporate way in todays times

**Rwy** · 04-13-2014, 09:55 AM

Originally Posted by Euroholic

Usa is not even in top 20. Australia is in top 10

I guess when you average in the rest of the USA we aren't. I live in NYC so we are the highest taxed in the US hands down. I have to pay state,city, federal income taxes. We also have the highest sales tax. Our property taxes are probably the worst in the US and we pay mortgage tax, mansion tax for properties over a million. Lots of tax

**Rwy** · 04-13-2014, 09:56 AM

Originally Posted by Times Roman

Mate,
Social security was never designed nor meant to be the sole financial means of supporting one's self during retirement. It is a social safety net that is intended to help prevent some from destitution, homelessness, and starvation. The underlying principles were spawned after the great depression, a time where people were desperate, and the public outcry was for government to do "something". This is the dawn of socialism in our country. Over time, the amounts of the benefits have gone up, yet the number of workers supporting recipients of SS benefits has gone down with the graying of America. Even worse, retirees now rely heavily on SS benefits as their primary means of support. Today, for every dollar a worker earns, 15% is taxed and sent to the SSA.

Now, let's look at "minimum Wage". Our country has went through a lot since the industrialization of America. We have seen 7 day work weeks, 14 hour days, and ten year old children working in coal mines, assembly lines, and in "Laundry Services". Being paid starvation wages, the companies had all the control, and the workers were desperate, feeling as if they had no choice. Minimum Wage laws were enacted to help prevent some of these abuses during a time where the government began to define standard work days and weeks. It was a blight for many to see workers living in shanties, unable to provide even the most basic of necessities, beyond meager shelters, food, and water. The government began to affect changes, slowly changing the hearts and minds of it's voters. The taxes that automatically came out of the workers checks to support these government programs seemed painless as it doesn't come directly out of your wallet. They get theirs before you get yours.

But that isn't the realities of today. In our era, the unemployment rate is relatively low. People enjoy a wide variety of services and benefits by working for employers. Community colleges are fairly inexpensive. There are tech schools and a variety of other institutions set up that directly or indirectly effect unemployment rates.

Ultimately, the workers of today have a lot more control over what happens to them. Have you noticed that some individuals are never satisfied with their status, and work their tails off to self improve? And there are those that can't hardly wait for the end of their shift so they can go home and have a cold one and kick back.

At Walmart, my impression is that the overwhelming percentage of employees fall into the latter category as opposed to the former.

And the Walmart employee profile seems to fit as the profile of the individual most likely to benefit from a minimum wage pay raise.

My point is this. Minimum wage was never designed as the wage you will receive over the course of your progressive career. it is meant as a stop gap to prevent some of the abuses of the past. it is not intended nor designed to provide you a comfortable lifestyle. This is, after all, a capitalistic society as well as a socialistic society. If you want more than minimum wage, be prepared to earn it.

This and reverse mortgage.

**drakie** · 04-13-2014, 01:44 PM

I think most people just move back with their parents these days to save on rent and other costs involved with renting an apartment. Annoying yes, but if you are spare in cash.

**lovbyts** · 04-13-2014, 09:36 PM

You know in most other countries it's normal to live with your parents off and one when you are in your 20s, 30 and after retirement. Our country does do better and most people saving or having enough to support themselves through retirement but with little to nothing left at the end. If more families helped out and stayed together there would be a lot more to pass down the generations and build them up.

I tried to get my mom to move in with me the last 10 years before she passed away to make it easier for everyone but she just wouldst move so I had to maintain 2 houses for years until the end.

The problem with most kids who move back home are once they are there they dont do much to help out. Most... not all. I think it's a good idea to charge them rent when they are at home. I paid rent since I was 17? Maybe 16 until I moved out. My parents didnt want me to move out. They even turned the spare family room into a bedroom with my own bathroom/shower and talked about putting my own entry door if I wanted to stay in my mid 20s. I guess I wasnt to bad of a kid.

**Shol'va** · 04-18-2014, 10:20 AM

Well I hate to do the blame game here but.....
This goes back over ten years imo and it has to do with a lot of elected officials who have sold this country out to of course China! Not to mention the greedy companies and corporations dead set against any and all unions. by shutting down factory after factory in the states and moving all the jobs to china this was a no brainer union busting opportunity. Starve the middle class American people so that if and when the time was right these companies could slowly return to the states without any influence of the once powerful unions and able to set up shop offering half and more the wages they used to offer all without benefits as well. Sweet sweet deal huh? That is unless you are one of those out of work or who lost your job when the factory went over seas. This is a pretty simplistic over view but you all get the jist of it. Don't believe me then research yourselves who all and how many companies have left the states and or closed factories here and gone to set up shop in wonderful Red Square China. Funny how all our live we were told that China and Communism was bad and now we are deep in bed with the sobs. And it gets worse. Now word is that even our military depends on parts from China to keep our top secret weapons going on the ships. How's that for irony. Kind of makes one wonder has America lost it's ever loving mind?

**Times Roman** · 04-18-2014, 10:32 AM

Originally Posted by Rwy

This and reverse mortgage.

actually, I think the reverse mortgage, as it exists today, is a good thing. It allows our seniors to stay in their homes, and are also provided an income. when final affairs are settled, the mortgage company is no longer allowed to keep all the equity. instead, they get a predefined amount, and the rest goes to the estate.

**Rwy** · 04-18-2014, 04:37 PM

Originally Posted by Times Roman

actually, I think the reverse mortgage, as it exists today, is a good thing. It allows our seniors to stay in their homes, and are also provided an income. when final affairs are settled, the mortgage company is no longer allowed to keep all the equity. instead, they get a predefined amount, and the rest goes to the estate.

Thats what I do for a living. I have been doing it for the past 8 years. I saw the collapse of sub prime coming and switched to that side of the business. It was the best choice I have ever made. The senior community are so loyal and genuine. I have clients from years ago that I speak with til this day. Just good people that didn't plan well but have equity.

**Euroholic** · 04-19-2014, 08:19 PM

Originally Posted by Shol'va

Well I hate to do the blame game here but.....
This goes back over ten years imo and it has to do with a lot of elected officials who have sold this country out to of course China! Not to mention the greedy companies and corporations dead set against any and all unions. by shutting down factory after factory in the states and moving all the jobs to china this was a no brainer union busting opportunity. Starve the middle class American people so that if and when the time was right these companies could slowly return to the states without any influence of the once powerful unions and able to set up shop offering half and more the wages they used to offer all without benefits as well. Sweet sweet deal huh? That is unless you are one of those out of work or who lost your job when the factory went over seas. This is a pretty simplistic over view but you all get the jist of it. Don't believe me then research yourselves who all and how many companies have left the states and or closed factories here and gone to set up shop in wonderful Red Square China. Funny how all our live we were told that China and Communism was bad and now we are deep in bed with the sobs. And it gets worse. Now word is that even our military depends on parts from China to keep our top secret weapons going on the ships. How's that for irony. Kind of makes one wonder has America lost it's ever loving mind?

Free market capitalism allows you to do what ever you want. Nationalism and capitalism do not go hand in hand.

**Chicagotarsier** · 04-21-2014, 12:41 AM

Have any of you considered the conditions that require minimum wage are a form of slavery?

One lesson learned form the USA is you do not want to OWN your workforce...you want to pick and choose and not deal with it when you do not need it. You are all just experiencing slavery.

The Four things that made my income more powerful....

1. Garden. Grew my own veggies, 10 hours a week gave me an all year vegetable supply. I estimated that is about 4-7K USD back in my pocket...I give to three other families and they save the same amount. This is the number one thing I see that has changed since the 60s.

2. Personal Business. Do something that makes you money at home. Even if it is just 100 a week. I sold chicken eggs from my coop ..and the chickens were fed from my garden. Then I discovered my talent for baking and it all parlayed into 250 USD profit a week from baking 10 hours a week (for fun).

3. Get the hell out of the big cities. In Chicago my rent was almost 2200 a month. I bought a house and land for 3 years rent (in a less populated area) and never looked back. 27K saved a year (taxes negligible on the island I live)

4. Smart transportation. For 3000 USD I converted a Prius into a "Charge and go" car that gets 105 miles without needing recharging or using gas. 2000 USD for solar panels and the required inverter. I save around 10K USD a year off of this myself. I allow my friend to use it for trips to town when needed so 20K a year saved. Since moving to a tropical island my yearly miles are around 20,000 and have not spent one penny on gas (F you big oil)

So basically I removed 54K + expenses and added 13K or so income. My Personal Business expanded into multiple stores and life is good..not working for the man and just doing my own thing. Four small changes and a lot of work did this for me.

Healthcare, supplements, and medicines are and will always be a thorn in my arse. No real solution for that. Of my expenditures it accounts for 73%... but that is a worthwhile investment in my opinion. Much more worthwhile than the BS socialist taxes on gasoline or sales tax.

I have posted here in Beijing with my girlfriend and her company pays all her rent and such so no expenses and that is a lucky thing I do not take for granted.

**Chicagotarsier** · 04-21-2014, 12:47 AM

I can only speak for MY businesses. My move was ultimately due to certain minorities in the USA and the risk involved with hiring..or not...these people that are pretty much worthless but if you tell them so you are in a world of hurt. Taxes were a consideration but not the top one. Having to put up with that market segment of Americans that have brought Detroit to its knees and now destroying Chicago....not going to do it. No desire to try when there are workforces around the world that will do the work...not cause issues and risk..and have pride in their work.

Affirmative Action destroyed the USA from my point of view. The rest is just "smear the guy with the ball" pile on concept to me.

Originally Posted by Shol'va

Well I hate to do the blame game here but.....
This goes back over ten years imo and it has to do with a lot of elected officials who have sold this country out to of course China! Not to mention the greedy companies and corporations dead set against any and all unions. by shutting down factory after factory in the states and moving all the jobs to china this was a no brainer union busting opportunity. Starve the middle class American people so that if and when the time was right these companies could slowly return to the states without any influence of the once powerful unions and able to set up shop offering half and more the wages they used to offer all without benefits as well. Sweet sweet deal huh? That is unless you are one of those out of work or who lost your job when the factory went over seas. This is a pretty simplistic over view but you all get the jist of it. Don't believe me then research yourselves who all and how many companies have left the states and or closed factories here and gone to set up shop in wonderful Red Square China. Funny how all our live we were told that China and Communism was bad and now we are deep in bed with the sobs. And it gets worse. Now word is that even our military depends on parts from China to keep our top secret weapons going on the ships. How's that for irony. Kind of makes one wonder has America lost it's ever loving mind?

**lovbyts** · 04-21-2014, 12:49 AM

^^^ and all that is what the government is trying to force everyone the opposite direction.

If you get caught selling anything without a license they take it all. They are pushing everyone closer and closer to the city to control growth.

It can all still be done but not nearly as easily as 20-30 years ago. We live in the suburbs but I have a greenhouse I'm putting up in the back yard and will start utilizing it soon.

The car idea is interesting and will look into it more but it's tough giving up raw HP. lol

Another 10+ years and I will be doing the same, moving to a more tropical location, not in the US.

**Chicagotarsier** · 04-21-2014, 03:11 AM

^^^^^^

I still have my 5.0 S speed Mustang GT 1991 and 1969 442 4-speed 455 when the no HP blues hit haha!

I remember my pops saying to me..

Son i will only apologize to you for one thing in life. That is moving out here in the middle of the country so far from a city and reducing your chances for success. Man how things have changed. When young it was escape the farm...now cannot get back fast enough lol.

**wicked442** · 04-21-2014, 07:46 AM

Originally Posted by Chicagotarsier

^^^^^^ I still have my 5.0 S speed Mustang GT 1991 and 1969 442 4-speed 455 when the no HP blues hit haha! I remember my pops saying to me.. Son i will only apologize to you for one thing in life. That is moving out here in the middle of the country so far from a city and reducing your chances for success. Man how things have changed. When young it was escape the farm...now cannot get back fast enough lol.

I would love to see pics of that olds. I have a 1972 442 bigblock. I have owned since i was 11 yrs old and a 1957 chevy 150 couple.