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Thread: Twin Experiments --- Part One

  1. #41
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    It's also the total opposite of solitude.

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    typically 50 males and 50 females in the meditation hall.......... however they've run courses as large as a thousand people in an Indian prison.

    Check out "Dhamma brothers" or "doing time, doing vipassana" on youtube, both documentaries of courses held in prisons.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    This isn't something you have experienced before. The strict routine, the chanting, the diet, the evening discourses... you certainly have not experienced this before.
    I don't really how to fully explain this.

    I cannot really experience anything as for the moment my emotions are kinda "flattened out".

    Not sure you will understand this point, but I can stay with a particular person, and not feel I'm with him/her. I can go to some extraordinary place, but actually It's not like I'm there.

    I can do every sort of experience, but it will have absolutely no meaning for me as "I'm not there" emotionally speaking.

    The aforementioned problem with serotonergic compounds is that they worsen this, whilst enhancing cathecolamines improves it.

    It started with low t/hypothyroidism about three yrs ago and I can say proper treatment brought significant natural (ie. not with the help of psychotropics) improvement, but still I don't feel like before. I deploy stimulants in order to feel somewhat normal, or reminiscent of so, not to get high or forget about life issues.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bizzarro View Post
    I cannot really experience anything as for the moment my emotions are kinda "flattened out".

    Not sure you will understand this point, but I can stay with a particular person, and not feel I'm with him/her. I can go to some extraordinary place, but actually It's not like I'm there.

    I can do every sort of experience, but it will have absolutely no meaning for me as "I'm not there" emotionally speaking.
    There's two ways of describing that. The way a psychiatrist would describe it, and the way an addiction counsellor would describe it.

    Psychiatrists typically haven't had that turbulent of a life... high grades finishing school, did well in university, high-paying job. Of course I'm not saying that this applies to all of them, but it tends to hold true.

    Addiction counsellors have been to hell and back. The most successful addiction counsellors have probably been police officers, firemen, paramedics. A lot of them would have been alcoholics and had fucked up childhoods.

    What you have described isn't a big deal to an addiction counsellor. He'd just say that you're able to leave your body. People who've been through a few highly traumatic experiences develop the ability to leave their body if it all becomes too much... they can keep their cool in the most fucked up situations. I remember describing to my counsellor the time I was held at gunpoint in a robbery and he simply summarised with "you were able to leave your body by then" and moved on. It's a survival skill.

    A psychiatrist would call it dissociation, and they tend to see it as a bad thing (you might say pathological) rather than seeing it as a survival skill. If you spend a lot of your time dissociated -- and it seems to me like you do, from what you've described -- then you've probably got some pretty heavy trauma buried beneath the surface of your mind.

    Go and do a Vipassana course and all that stuff comes up to the surface. It will be absolute fucking hell at some points but you'll experience total bliss by the end of the 10-day course.

    The aforementioned problem with serotonergic compounds is that they worsen this, whilst enhancing cathecolamines improves it.
    I'm not big on looking for a medical solution to an emotional problem.

    It started with low t/hypothyroidism about three yrs ago and I can say proper treatment brought significant natural (ie. not with the help of psychotropics) improvement, but still I don't feel like before. I deploy stimulants in order to feel somewhat normal, or reminiscent of so, not to get high or forget about life issues.
    That tends to end in tears.

    As I said, you need to a Vipassana course.

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    Forgot to mention I predict a suicide from what you wrote.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    A psychiatrist would call it dissociation, and they tend to see it as a bad thing (you might say pathological) rather than seeing it as a survival skill. If you spend a lot of your time dissociated -- and it seems to me like you do, from what you've described -- then you've probably got some pretty heavy trauma buried beneath the surface of your mind.
    Nope, it's way different from dissociation - a psychiatrist would name it derealization/depersonalization disorder, because it fits the diagnostic criteria, but I know it's something different, and shared by some ppl w/hypothyroidism too, however in a milder way.

    From how I understand it, it's mostly a neurological issue. I just happen to got it harsher I guess because of concomitant low t, then malnutrition, and probably just a bunch of biologic factors, including familiarity with major depression.


    Anyway... we are pretty much talking about the past as I have succeeded in improving symptoms.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    Forgot to mention I predict a suicide from what you wrote.
    Actually I attempted suicide at 17, due to boredom.

    That was another era, I'm a completely different person now. I can say I beat the shit out of depression.

    Don't worry about me, I'm more stable than you can imagine. All the deeds I went through shaped me into a pretty sturdy mo-fo. I'm not thinking of going that route anytime soon, even if sometimes the thought is somewhat relieving.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bizzarro View Post
    Nope, it's way different from dissociation - a psychiatrist would name it derealization/depersonalization disorder, because it fits the diagnostic criteria, but I know it's something different, and shared by some ppl w/hypothyroidism too, however in a milder way.
    I wouldn't be so sure about that. I've experienced depersonalisation... it can be very unnerving, like you aren't even in your own body.... almost like that scene from Men In Black where they have the body on the table and open the head to see an alien inside.

    Dissociation isn't frightening or unnerving, it's just a numbness.

    If somebody comes into the living room waving a gun and you're not afraid, something's wrong.

    If you walk down the road and see someone torturing a puppy and you're not upset, something's wrong.

    If you look out over the grand canyon as the sun rises and you're not overwhelmed, something's wrong.

    I think it's far more likely that your medical symptoms are either psychosomatic, or secondary to your emotional trauma.

    Vipassana. Ten days.
    Last edited by KimboHalfSlice; 09-17-2016 at 10:33 AM. Reason: typo

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    Quote Originally Posted by bizzarro View Post
    Actually I attempted suicide at 17, due to boredom.
    Dissociation. I injected myself with vodka 2 years ago.

    Don't worry about me, I'm more stable than you can imagine. All the deeds I went through shaped me into a pretty sturdy mo-fo. I'm not thinking of going that route anytime soon, even if sometimes the thought is somewhat relieving.
    You sound very stable. Not balanced though. If you don't see what's wrong with your final sentence there, then something's wrong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    You sound very stable. Not balanced though. If you don't see what's wrong with your final sentence there, then something's wrong.
    It' just a fantasy, the sort of when you dream of impossible stuff, like flying. Nothing more. I'm not leaving this place anytime soon mate, not by my hand. I got shit to do. Ambitions, dreams.

    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    Dissociation.
    Hypoemotionality explains it all.

    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    I wouldn't be so sure about that. I've experienced depersonalisation... it can be very unnerving, like you aren't even in your own body.... almost like that scene from Men In Black where they have the body on the table and open the head to see an alien inside.

    Dissociation isn't frightening or unnerving, it's just a numbness.

    If something comes into the living room waving a gun and you're not afraid, something's wrong.

    If you want down the road and see someone torturing a puppy and you're not upset, something's wrong.

    If you look out over the grand canyon as the sun rises and you're not overwhelmed, something's wrong.

    I think it's far more likely that your medical symptoms are either psychosomatic, or secondary to your emotional trauma.

    That's what I meant. I know how a professional would diagnose me with (might even try out of curiosity some day), but I also know he would be wrong.

    I lived pretty much an outer peaceful life. No emotional or physical trauma.

    I don't recall I spoke to you of medical symptoms, and it's an unnecessary deviation.

    I still get upset from shit in life, though in a milder way than normal. Sometimes I just have to make an effort for it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bizzarro View Post
    It' just a fantasy, the sort of when you dream of impossible stuff, like flying. Nothing more. I'm not leaving this place anytime soon mate, not by my hand. I got shit to do. Ambitions, dreams.
    If you think like that, something's wrong.



    Hypoemotionality explains it all.
    We can sit here all day coming up with funky ways of saying "I have issues".


    That's what I meant. I know how a professional would diagnose me with (might even try out of curiosity some day), but I also know he would be wrong.
    Psychiatrists aren't the only kind of professional. An addiction counsellor would shrug it off and say "you're able to leave your body". It's a big deal to psychiatrists. It's not a big deal to addiction counsellors.

    I lived pretty much an outer peaceful life. No emotional or physical trauma.
    You're leaving out your repressed memories.

    I don't recall I spoke to you of medical symptoms, and it's an unnecessary deviation.
    agreed

    I still get upset from shit in life, though in a milder way than normal. Sometimes I just have to make an effort for it.
    Vipassana Meditation before we find you hanging from the school goal posts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    You sound very stable. Not balanced though. If you don't see what's wrong with your final sentence there, then something's wrong.
    Besides, to fully clarify my position on this point, I can add I don't see anything wrong with suicide. Different value of life, I think.

    Nowadays ppl seems too attached to life. I don't want to end my life bedded for yrs with some tubing into my body. I dunno if you get what I mean.

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    Could I ask you to do me one small favour

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    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    If you think like that, something's wrong.
    Noted...

    We can sit here all day coming up with funky ways of saying "I have issues".
    I do.

    Psychiatrists aren't the only kind of professional. An addiction counsellor would shrug it off and say "you're able to leave your body". It's a big deal to psychiatrists. It's not a big deal to addiction counsellors.
    I'm like that 24/24. Dissociation doesn't presents that way. It brought extreme sufferance to me so yes it's a very very BAD problem.


    But again, I found my way out of it (for the most part).

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    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    Could I ask you to do me one small favour
    Of course. As long as isn't the vipassana thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bizzarro View Post
    Of course. As long as isn't the vipassana thing.
    Get a black permanent marker and write KIMBO across your chest before you kill yourself

    I can get your police and autopsy report for 750 Euro and I'll post the photo's here so I can toot my horn and be like "Told all of you back in 2016 that this was gonna happen"

    I'll put you up on LiveLeak too

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    Wasn't expecting anything that weird.

    In the case, I'll make sure no one finds my body then LOL.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bizzarro View Post
    Wasn't expecting anything that weird.
    If you're allowed be nonchalant about this then I'm allowed be nonchalant about this.

    In the case, I'll make sure no one finds my body then LOL.
    It's people like you who muck up the statistics. But if you are gonna do it then don't walk in front of a truck or a train...... and don't jump over a motorway bridge, there could be a mother and three kids in that car below you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bizzarro View Post
    I deploy stimulants in order to feel somewhat normal, or reminiscent of so, not to get high or forget about life issues.
    Oh I forgot to address this part.

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    Suicide is a very selfish act in most cases.

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    Quote Originally Posted by marcus300 View Post
    Suicide is a very selfish act in most cases.
    I always thought that was just something people said to enrage people who are suicidal

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    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    I always thought that was just something people said to enrage people who are suicidal
    No not at all.

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    Most suicides are actually just eager for attention, they crave help.

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    I've always wondered about the "planned" vs "split-second decision thing".

    My uncle was found after having hanged himself. He had made himself a sandwich and it was sitting on the table but he hadn't taken a bite out of it. I've always thought that it was something small that just sent him over the edge.... like he went to put salt on the sandwich and there was no salt, or he went to pour himself a glass of milk and there was no milk left..... something small like that and that was it, decision made.

    Then there's the people who plan it out.

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    This got really interesting...... brain scans and all......

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    Indeed.

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    If you won't do Vipassana then do an aerial body suspension..... metal hooks through the skin at your shoulder blades

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    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    If you won't do Vipassana then do an aerial body suspension..... metal hooks through the skin at your shoulder blades
    That reminds me a pic I saw once, of a dude hanging by its balls.

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    That's certainly peculiar. I'm gonna do it at the shoulder blades.

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    Why don't you practice healthy activities instead? Like helping others? Or dogs. I love dogs.

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    Dude wtf are you guys talking about....lol
    hammerheart and Livinlean like this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marsoc View Post
    Dude wtf are you guys talking about....lol
    Only the crazies can understand each other.....
    thisAngelBites likes this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bizzarro View Post
    Why don't you practice healthy activities instead? Like helping others? Or dogs. I love dogs.
    I'm getting a doggy-kitten. You get a baby kitten but you pretend it's a dog, you put a collar on it and walk it around on a lead. If you get them young enough you can take them for walks into adulthood. I had a baby kitten before a few years ago but never tried to dogify it.

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    I hope your able to take care of a pet.
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    The girl who had half her brain removed.......

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MKNsI5CWoU

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    Your point being?

    Most ppl don't even use that half anyway.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bizzarro View Post
    Your point being?

    Most ppl don't even use that half anyway.
    My point being that you shouldn't be trying to use your almond-sized ventricle that's slightly bigger than your other almond-sized ventricle as an excuse to rationalise or justify your substance abuse.

    I forgot to mention that I think you're a drug addict.

  38. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    My point being that you shouldn't be trying to use your almond-sized ventricle that's slightly bigger than your other almond-sized ventricle as an excuse to rationalise or justify your substance abuse.

    I forgot to mention that I think you're a drug addict.

    You what?

    I never meant that! And when I speak of stimulants I mean supplements (l-tyrosine, mucuna), coffee and maybe some eugeroics without addictive/rewarding properties (selegiline, modafinil), and DA agonists (like caber).

    I don't even stay on them all the time, just occasional use, more as an experiment than anything.

    I never did any street drugs and I stay the f*ck away from them don't even try to compare what I do to your story of substance abuse.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bizzarro View Post
    I never did any street drugs and I stay the f*ck away from them don't even try to compare what I do to your story of substance abuse.
    It's a spectrum.

    Where you procure the drug isn't relevant. I used to have a mate who said "If it comes from the ground, it's sound" to try rationalise and justify his cannabis use. Pretty sure he was in denial about the origins of opium.

    The liquid methadone I was taking came from a pharmaceutical lab -- it's prescribed to heroin addicts in Ireland.

    If you look forward to your cup of coffee in the morning then something's wrong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KimboHalfSlice View Post
    It's a spectrum.

    Where you procure the drug isn't relevant. I used to have a mate who said "If it comes from the ground, it's sound" to try rationalise and justify his cannabis use. Pretty sure he was in denial about the origins of opium.

    The liquid methadone I was taking came from a pharmaceutical lab -- it's prescribed to heroin addicts in Ireland.

    If you look forward to your cup of coffee in the morning then something's wrong.

    Lol your right but no way you can compare regular abuse/addiction to DRUGS to occasional use of prescription meds. I don't even experience addiction. I started smoking at 13 and quitted it later without problems. I get absolutely NO PLEASURE/REWARD from anything, do you understand that?


    Something's wrong? Definitely is and I've admitted that... again, what's your point?

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