VETS: Bulker Cycle Critique

[seriousmass]

What's up boys. Alright well this forum has been pretty dull recently.. so I thought I would post my next cycle for critique. Hopefully generate some convo. lol. Anyways, I'm planning on running it 1/2 way through August, and it will conclude at the end of December basically.

(Weeks 1 – 16) Di-Test @ 500mg EW
• 400mg/mL x 2 injections per week (0.6cc per injection)

(Weeks 1 – 4) Test-Prop @ 500mg EW
• 100mg/mL x 3 injections per week (1.65cc per injection)

(Weeks 3 – 14) NPP @ 450mg EW
• 100mg/mL x 3 injections per week (1.5cc per injection)

(Weeks 3 – 10) T-Bol @ 60 ED
• 10mg per pill x 6 pills per day

(Weeks 16 – 19 ) D-Drol → Prohormone
• 2 pills per day
• Milk-thistle 1000mg
• Hawthorne Berry 1000mg
• Policosinol- 20mg 2x ED

(Weeks 8 – 19) HCG @ 250iu x 2 = 500iu per week

PCT – Post Cycle Therapy:

(Weeks 19 – 24) Nolvadex @ 40/40/30/30/20
• 10mg / pill. (3 – 6 pills per day)

(Week 19 – 23) Clomid @ 100/50/50/50
• 50mg / pill (1 – 2 pills per day)

(Weeks 19 - 22 ) Proviron @ 50/50/50
• 25mg / pill (2 pills per day)

Any suggestions?

** please no stupid pictures / dumb comments like "that's a heavy cycle bro!" i'm looking for real advice, and would like to see if anyone has better ideas on how to stack these compounds **

Oh.. and this will be my 3rd cycle... 4 if you include an M1T cycle I did in high-school.

[JiGGaMaN]

is there any reason why you are running each compound at that specific time/duration?

[JiGGaMaN]

by looking this over, i would say it might be better just to do the thrice weekly test prop injections all the way through since you are doing NPP anyway. if i were to make any changes (not to say that the current set-up is terrible), it would look like this:

1-8 tbol 60mg/day
1-14 test prop 500mg/wk
1-14 NPP 450mg/wk
12-15 prohormone
16-19 pct (pct looks perfect the way you have it)

[Alphatier]

What's the reason for not injecting Prop ED?

I'm guessing because you're planing on injecting it together with NPP?

[JiGGaMaN]

What's the reason for not injecting Prop ED?

I'm guessing because you're planing on injecting it together with NPP?

you never know. it could be some really painful prop. if the prop isnt, the NPP will have some sting to it. i think eod would be acceptible.

[seriousmass]

is there any reason why you are running each compound at that specific time/duration?

a.) I like running longer test cycles. I find you can still make great gains 14 - 16 weeks into a cycle.

b.) I am going to stack the T-bol / NPP

c.) I want to start the NPP after I've been on test for a little while.

d.) I used D-drol (the PH) a year ago, while on a test-only cycle, and had great results with it. 12 pounds in 3 weeks. I think it'd be a nice way to conclude the cycle and enter PCT.

by looking this over, i would say it might be better just to do the thrice weekly test prop injections all the way through since you are doing NPP anyway. if i were to make any changes (not to say that the current set-up is terrible), it would look like this:

1-8 tbol 60mg/day
1-14 test prop 500mg/wk
1-14 NPP 450mg/wk
12-15 prohormone
16-19 pct (pct looks perfect the way you have it)

Jigga, Thanks for looking over my cycle bro. I appreciate it. Sorry for not explaining more clearly.

a.) I want to run the T-bol with the NPP. (I'm going to using the NPP to bulk, and I've heard T-bol is a fantastic stack with NPP... so thats why I'm running them basically at the same time (except my NPP will extend 4 weeks past the discontinuation of the T-bol.)

b.) I can't run the NPP the way you proposed because I only have enough (50mL) for 450mg for 11 weeks bro! lol.

c.) I don't want to run the prop all the way through the cycle. Right now I've got my hands on some Di-Test (200mg deconate & 200mg cyp) 400mg/mL. Basically I want to use the prop as a kickstart for the first 4 weeks to ensure that I have no libido issues once I commence the NPP (deca) at the beginning of week 4. Moreover, I want to use my T-400, instead of running prop all the way through, because generally it means MUCH less oil. (This is already a pretty big cycle, I don't think it's necessary to force myself into injecting like 11mL of gear per week!!) lol... you know what I mean??

What's the reason for not injecting Prop ED?

I'm guessing because you're planing on injecting it together with NPP?

Yup, you got it. I want to cut the prop with the NPP. Because honestly they're both going to hurt like a b*tch. Might as well do it all at once, and get it over with. haha... Also, I've shot prop before, and found not difference in gains from injecting ED to EOD.

[Alphatier]

^^ Sounds alright to me.

EOD is fine, and reallt it's whatever works for you.

If results are the same than why not EOD.

NPP is always something that I wanted to try.

[seriousmass]

^^ Sounds alright to me.

EOD is fine, and reallt it's whatever works for you.

If results are the same than why not EOD.

NPP is always something that I wanted to try.

Word. Yah thanks bro. This is going to be my first go with NPP too. Quick gains / Little water retention / Not leaving you shut down for long / Joints feel amazing / No 4 - 5 week wait for the ester to kick in.... IMO it's MUCH better then deca.

[Phate]

if this is a bulker, why not run drol or dbol to start the cycle, and then again towards the end and drop the tbol

[chuckt12345]

or why not ask his age and real cycle exp

[Dancer]

What your current stats?

How many years have your been lifting?

What was used during your last cycle and what were your results?


What is your goal(s) bulk or cut?

what does your diet look like?

[seriousmass]

or why not ask his age and real cycle exp

Read the bottom of my first post genius.

Age: 21

Will be 22 mid-cycle. Thanks mom.

[Dancer]

Phate and chuck, I think we are all on the same brain waive or somethin'...lol

[chuckt12345]

you really need me to call you out again serious?? i thought you would of learned

[seriousmass]

if this is a bulker, why not run drol or dbol to start the cycle, and then again towards the end and drop the tbol

I'm using the prop as a kickstart. No need for d-bol / drol.

As I've said before, I'm stacking the T-bol with the NPP. I do not want to use the T-bol as a kick-start or backload to this cycle.

[Phate]

or why not ask his age and real cycle exp

his stats are in his profile and i know his body type and such from a while ago(he posted pics), he's a little small to be cycling IMO but as he already started there is not much we can do but advise

[Phate]

I'm using the prop as a kickstart. No need for d-bol / drol.

As I've said before, I'm stacking the T-bol with the NPP. I do not want to use the T-bol as a kick-start or backload to this cycle.

i understand that, just saying that i think drol and dbol would work better for a bulking cycle than tbol (no personal experience of course) but i didn't mean using them as a kickstart

[seriousmass]

What your current stats?
I'm pretty sure they're in my profile bro!

How many years have your been lifting?
4 years.

What was used during your last cycle and what were your results?
test-p / halo = gained 16 pounds. retained 11.

What is your goal(s) bulk or cut?
Read the title of my thread bro.

what does your diet look like?
we can review this later.. I'm asking for cycle advise right now bro.

you really need me to call you out again serious?? i thought you would of learned

Get out of my thread if you're not going to be helpful bro. And what the f*ck is that? some sort of threat you f*cking tool. What the f*ck bad advise have I ever given? please enlighten me.

his stats are in his profile and i know his body type and such from a while ago(he posted pics), he's a little small to be cycling IMO but as he already started there is not much we can do but advise

6'2 @ 196 @ 11% BF isn't too bad bro...

[chuckt12345]

well stop lyin about what you have run before,, i mean shit, all anyone has to do is read your threads to realize you just BS about what youve done,, im finished with this guy.

[seriousmass]

i understand that, just saying that i think drol and dbol would work better for a bulking cycle than tbol (no personal experience of course) but i didn't mean using them as a kickstart

Oh, my bad man. Misinterpreted.

My reasoning: T-Bol will put on lean muscle... and provide some strength. Whereas, d-bol is mostly water retention. I'll consider it though.. Thanks.

[Dancer]

So right now you are 196 not 170 right?

[seriousmass]

well stop lyin about what you have run before,, i mean shit, all anyone has to do is read your threads to realize you just BS about what youve done,, im finished with this guy.

First cycle: Test-E / Winstrol (discontinued during use) / D-drol

Second cycle: Test-P / Halo

**3rd** was M1T's in highschool. As I already stated at the top of my thread.

[seriousmass]

So right now you are 196 not 170 right?

lol! yah bro. 196 as of yesterday morning... basically the plan is to get to 190 with 9.5% BF before the cycle... and then who knows.. bulk up to 210 perhaps at my peak? lol.

[seriousmass]

Okkk.... now that all that is done.

Can I actually get some insight into my proposed cycle.

Anyone? 23 posts and basically 2 actual suggestions..

[Dancer]

Cause your stats make no sense based on what you posted... you last cycle you posted you gained 16 pounds and retained 11 pounds... at the time of your last cycle when you registered dec 2008 you were 170 pounds or so your first threads suggest on the board....

If you can't provide straight answers you are not gonna get straight advice

[Reed]

I think we are all basing are opinions of you off the pics we saw in your log last time. You know you were a bean pole from the pics about 2-3 months ago, I doubt being off cycle you progressed.

You did not even make any progress during that cycle with the pics which means your diet and training are severely lacking. Everyone in the thread agreed.

We would like to help you w/ diet and training so you avoid having to run higher and longer dosed cycles for minimal results, thats all anyone is trying to do. Not down you but help you get it together, don't take it like everyone is against cause we're not......


I'd say with your cycle just run one test if you're not going to inject the prop properly in order to frontload, use the oral to kickstart and maybe at the end. It'd be best if you'd inject the NPP ed or eod for more stable blood levels and run it from the beginning then end it two weeks before you stop the cycle of course

[seriousmass]

Cause your stats make no sense based on what you posted... you last cycle you posted you gained 16 pounds and retained 11 pounds... at the time of your last cycle when you registered dec 2008 you were 170 pounds or so your first threads suggest on the board....

If you can't provide straight answers you are not gonna get straight advice

Oh God. Here we go.

Alright. You want to hear how it happened.

Cycle #1 - January - April... PCT

Cycle # 2 - April - June

Essentially, I got my bloodwork done after PCT from first cycle. Total / Free-T were basically back to normal range. I then proceeded to jump on the next cycle.

I am not a liar. I just did not want newbies to read that and think it was a smart choice, and do it themselves.

Keep reading all my posts if you want bro, you'll eventually figure it out.

[chuckt12345]

awesome

[seriousmass]

I'd say with your cycle just run one test if you're not going to inject the prop properly in order to frontload, use the oral to kickstart and maybe at the end. It'd be best if you'd inject the NPP ed or eod for more stable blood levels and run it from the beginning then end it two weeks before you stop the cycle of course

Well, if you guys want some new opinions on my appearance I'd be down to upload some pictures??? I know I was small when I began cycling. I'm not particularly proud of it..

I don't understand what you're talking about "not injecting the prop properly"... I am. Many people use prop to kick-start / backload their cycles. my cyp / deconate esters will take until week 5 - 6 to kick in... so as a matter of fact even with the prop till week 4 I will still only have around 500 - 600mg in my bloodstream.

I am injecting the NPP eod..???

Explain how running NPP from week 1 - 11 is better then weeks 3 - 14 please.

[InsaneInTheMembrane]

Well, if you guys want some new opinions on my appearance I'd be down to upload some pictures??? I know I was small when I began cycling. I'm not particularly proud of it..

please do

cheers

[Reed]

Well, if you guys want some new opinions on my appearance I'd be down to upload some pictures??? I know I was small when I began cycling. I'm not particularly proud of it..

I don't understand what you're talking about "not injecting the prop properly"... I am. Many people use prop to kick-start / backload their cycles. my cyp / deconate esters will take until week 5 - 6 to kick in... so as a matter of fact even with the prop till week 4 I will still only have around 500 - 600mg in my bloodstream.

I am injecting the NPP eod..???

Explain how running NPP from week 1 - 11 is better then weeks 3 - 14 please.

I guess I got confused seeing 3x a week opposed to ed or eod., I was thinking e3d for some reason.

I personally notice a difference when injecting short esters eod as opposed to ed. I like to stick to ed just to avoid those differences.

This is merely my suggestion on how to run the NPP, if you want to start it later and wait for the stronger compound to come into play later during the cycle then do so. You could run it 1-14.

Also running the oral up to PCT might be a good idea while you wait for the test to clear so you can avoid that depressing feeling some get from the androgens not clearing the system fast enough, so think maybe put that more toward the end of the cycle.

Again suggestions take it or leave it.

And if you'd like me to help you with a diet then let me know and maybe take a look at your training as well. I'll do what I can for you

[seriousmass]

please do

cheers

Alright bro, girlfriend will be back at 5pm from work. I'll bump the thread with new pics then.

Hopefully THEN, I can get some f*cking basic help with this cycle. my god.

[Phate]

I guess I got confused seeing 3x a week opposed to ed or eod., I was thinking e3d for some reason.

I personally notice a difference when injecting short esters eod as opposed to ed. I like to stick to ed just to avoid those differences.

This is merely my suggestion on how to run the NPP, if you want to start it later and wait for the stronger compound to come into play later during the cycle then do so. You could run it 1-14.

Also running the oral up to PCT might be a good idea while you wait for the test to clear so you can avoid that depressing feeling some get from the androgens not clearing the system fast enough, so think maybe put that more toward the end of the cycle.

Again suggestions take it or leave it.

And if you'd like me to help you with a diet then let me know and maybe take a look at your training as well. I'll do what I can for you

oh pick me pick me, lol

seriously though seriousmass, i would take him up on that offer

[Reed]

Let Phate do the diet and I can do the training

[Dancer]

Again suggestions take it or leave it.

And if you'd like me to help you with a diet then let me know and maybe take a look at your training as well. I'll do what I can for you

Please do... I think first comes the basics then the aas...

Its a waist to use the aas when the basics are not talked about and worked out first...

[seriousmass]

I guess I got confused seeing 3x a week opposed to ed or eod., I was thinking e3d for some reason.

That's fine.

I personally notice a difference when injecting short esters eod as opposed to ed. I like to stick to ed just to avoid those differences.

Already ran prop before. No difference in gains from EOD to ED... imo.. but thanks.

This is merely my suggestion on how to run the NPP, if you want to start it later and wait for the stronger compound to come into play later during the cycle then do so. You could run it 1-14.

I'm going to wait until week 3 or 4 for the NPP... want the test to be essentially kicked in before adding this particular compound

Also running the oral up to PCT might be a good idea while you wait for the test to clear so you can avoid that depressing feeling some get from the androgens not clearing the system fast enough, so think maybe put that more toward the end of the cycle.

Umm... I already am bro... D-drol.. up until PCT..

Again suggestions take it or leave it.

And if you'd like me to help you with a diet then let me know and maybe take a look at your training as well. I'll do what I can for you
In another thread bro; I'm looking for critiquing right now.

Thannnks buddy.

[seriousmass]

Let Phate do the diet and I can do the training

haha... actually.. my diet is pretty consistent and generally well planned out. I'm sure Phate can attest to that, I'm pretty sure we've tweaked it before in the past.

Regarding the training... maybe in a couple of months bro. Right now I'm focusing on just maintaining my gains. I'm off for the next 2 months or so... and I'm going to experiment a little with HIIT training... and some low-weight perfect form workouts.

But umm thanks.

[Phate]

haha... actually.. my diet is pretty consistent and generally well planned out. I'm sure Phate can attest to that, I'm pretty sure we've tweaked it before in the past.

Regarding the training... maybe in a couple of months bro. Right now I'm focusing on just maintaining my gains. I'm off for the next 2 months or so... and I'm going to experiment a little with HIIT training... and some low-weight perfect form workouts.

But umm thanks.

i don't remember tweeking it

[seriousmass]

i don't remember tweeking it

My bad bro, I just looked at my old threads, lol.. it was 4everfit who helped tweek it.

[seriousmass]

I've gotta leave the office for the day. I'll bump this thread later on tonight with some updated pictures though..

Anyone who can provide suggestions on the cycle please comment!!

Thanks in advance